what is gonna be peyton's legacy

[Le Neon]

Any yet all QBs are judged on wins/rings. Funny, huh? In the end winning is what matters. But like I said, Brady has some pretty gaudy stats too.

 

Rodgers has a long way to go to catch Favre. He may get there as long as he doesn't sign that 25 mil contract...

 

Gaudy, I guess.  They look pretty pale in comparison to Manning IMO.  

 

15,000+ yards and 100+TDs are a pretty significant difference for QBs who are roughly the same age.

 

They have roughly the same TD %, but Manning has done it for far longer.  Unless Peyton gets hit by a train this offseason and Brady plays 4 more years at a pretty high level without injury Brady won't come close.

 

Manning will probably play several more seasons, putting his numbers far out of reach of Brady.

[amfootball]

.....so? How is this relevant to your point? Are you saying Plunkett is better than Marino?

I am saying winning is what matters and what every player is judged on.

[Dustin]

I am saying winning is what matters and what every player is judged on.

 

Apparentely not seeing as how Dan Marino is in the HOF and Plunkett isn't.

[amfootball]

Gaudy, I guess.  They look pretty pale in comparison to Manning IMO.  

 

15,000+ yards and 100+TDs are a pretty significant difference for QBs who are roughly the same age.

 

They have roughly the same TD %, but Manning has done it for far longer.  Unless Peyton gets hit by a train this offseason and Brady plays 4 more years at a pretty high level without injury Brady won't come close.

 

Manning will probably play several more seasons, putting his numbers far out of reach of Brady.

Right because Manning has three full seasons on Brady. 1998 vs 2001. If brady ever gets the chane to recoup those seasons their numbers will be similar.

[amfootball]

Apparentely not seeing as how Dan Marino is in the HOF and Plunkett isn't.

yet you agreed that marino would trade in his stats and therby his hof status for a ring.

[Dustin]

yet you agreed that marino would trade in his stats and therby his hof status for a ring.

 

Yeah he probably would. But, that doesn't make Plunkett better, which was what you were saying.

[amfootball]

Yeah he probably would. But, that doesn't make Plunkett better, which was what you were saying.

when did I say Plukett was better? I said winning is what matters most.

[Dustin]

when did I say Plukett was better? I said winning is what matters most.

 

 

 Any yet all QBs are judged on wins/rings. Funny, huh? In the end winning is what matters.

[amfootball]

Right. Winning is what matters. I didn't say you could not get in the HoF. Plenty are there without rings.

[Dustin]

Right. Winning is what matters. I didn't say you could not get in the HoF. Plenty are there without rings.

 

Whatever. I'm tired of having this debate all of the time anyway.

[amfootball]

Whatever. I'm tired of having this debate all of the time anyway.

 

 

[jshipp23]

Here is a question...If you put Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, Joe Flacco, Eli Manning, Ben Rothlisberger...etc, etc, on the Colts team last year could they have gone 11-5?? The only 1 I think could have would have been Aaron Rodgers PERIOD....LUCK literally had 2 seconds or less to get rid of the ball before he got BLOWN UP everytime and had to take chances on throws in order for us to win which is why he had a lot of picks, and he still managed to pull out victories in the 4th after taking vicious hit after vicious hit, and it was only his rookie year! Manning, Brady, Flacco, Eli Manning, and Rothlisberger wouldn't have lasted the season with the line we had...That is what gives LUCK the POTENTIAL to be the G.O.A.T, his combination of Mobility, and toughness and the cerebral part which is on par with Manning...Accuracy will improve and interceptions will go down with even a marginal O-Line and it's a travesty he didn't win ROY...The O-Line we fielded last year was 1 of the worst I can ever remember seeing on any team and yet he didn't miss a snap..RG111 will not physically hold up and will be forgotten when Luck is winning multiple Super Bowls

[OlBlu]

you think of joe montana you think of 4 super bowls. you think john elway you think of captain comeback. generations from now will people think of peyton as the cerebral machine like qb that dissected defenses or will he be remembered for his playoff woes.

 

 

you think of joe montana you think of 4 super bowls. you think john elway you think of captain comeback. generations from now will people think of peyton as the cerebral machine like qb that dissected defenses or will he be remembered for his playoff woes.

 

Well, he is still building that legacy. He will eventually hold just about every QB record. He has won one superbowl so far and made it to another one. I think he is the favorite to get to one or two more. That said, Dan Marino was a great QB, one of the greatest of all time and he made one superbowl appearance in his career and lost. Does that mean his records are diminished? Of course not, Montana was a great QB on a great team. Was he better than Marino or Peyton? The answer is not and individually he was not as good as either of them. He had the good fortune of playing for a great team. He left the team and what happened? They won superbowls with another QB. All of that has to be considered. Is Peyton better than Johnny Unitas was? Who knows? You can't compare eras. Put Peyton in that era and his stats would not be as great as they are. Put Unitas in this era and no QB may have matched him. Simply put, Peyton Manning is one of the greatest QBs of all time and perhaps the very best of them all...... :dancing:

[OlBlu]

Here is a question...If you put Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, Joe Flacco, Eli Manning, Ben Rothlisberger...etc, etc, on the Colts team last year could they have gone 11-5?? The only 1 I think could have would have been Aaron Rodgers PERIOD....LUCK literally had 2 seconds or less to get rid of the ball before he got BLOWN UP everytime and had to take chances on throws in order for us to win which is why he had a lot of picks, and he still managed to pull out victories in the 4th after taking vicious hit after vicious hit, and it was only his rookie year! Manning, Brady, Flacco, Eli Manning, and Rothlisberger wouldn't have lasted the season with the line we had...That is what gives LUCK the POTENTIAL to be the G.O.A.T, his combination of Mobility, and toughness and the cerebral part which is on par with Manning...Accuracy will improve and interceptions will go down with even a marginal O-Line and it's a travesty he didn't win ROY...The O-Line we fielded last year was 1 of the worst I can ever remember seeing on any team and yet he didn't miss a snap..RG111 will not physically hold up and will be forgotten when Luck is winning multiple Super Bowls

 

You greatly overrate Luck based on one years performance and you denigrate many of the others you have mentioned. Luck does not deserve to even be mentioned in the same breath with the QBs you named and that includes RGIII. Luck may never even get to a Super Bowl. I expect a big thump when this team comes down to earth this year and do not win the lucky (pardon the pun) games they won last year. I will be surprised if the Colts are better than .500 this year but that is still very good with a young rebuilding team. I am glad you got make all of your apologies for Luck's horrible stats. "But" is always a Luck apologists favorite word.... :dancing:

[OlBlu]

Apparentely not seeing as how Dan Marino is in the HOF and Plunkett isn't.

 

That is because Marino was a HOF QB and Plunkett was not. Luck isn't either, yet.... He may get there but he has a long way to go.... :dancing:

[jshipp23]

You greatly overrate Luck based on one years performance and you denigrate many of the others you have mentioned. Luck does not deserve to even be mentioned in the same breath with the QBs you named and that includes RGIII. Luck may never even get to a Super Bowl. I expect a big thump when this team comes down to earth this year and do not win the lucky (pardon the pun) games they won last year. I will be surprised if the Colts are better than .500 this year but that is still very good with a young rebuilding team. I am glad you got make all of your apologies for Luck's horrible stats. "But" is always a Luck apologists favorite word.... :dancing:

Luck carried us on his back...RG111 is overrated and will not physically be able to hold up...By the time he is in his early 30's he will be washed up and busted up just like Michael Vick and Luck will be winning Super Bowls and MVP's guaranteed...I have never seen a ROOKIE AND i STRESS THE WORD ROOKIE do more with less and be as advanced as Luck..Seattle and Washington both had much stronger defenses and offensive lines than he did....

[Le Neon]

Right because Manning has three full seasons on Brady. 1998 vs 2001. If brady ever gets the chane to recoup those seasons their numbers will be similar.

 

But consistency is part of greatness.  It's not Peyton's fault he was a superior prospect out of college and got to start immediately.  He was great almost from the word go.  The same way Manning fans need to make excuses for some playoff issues, those who want to claim Brady is the greatest ever need to make excuses for why he doesn't match Mannings career statistics when they came into the league around the same time.  

 

Manning has consistently outperformed Brady as a passer over a longer period of time.

 

Brady has consistently had more playoff success then Manning.

 

Brady still has excellent statistics.

 

Manning still has 9 (for twenty) playoff wins, a superbowl MVP, and two superbowl appearances.  Which isn't too shabby historically.  Just worse then Brady and Montana.

 

The argument will never die, unless Brees wins 3 more Super Bowls.   :rulez:

[Qwiz]

But consistency is part of greatness.  It's not Peyton's fault he was a superior prospect out of college and got to start immediately.  He was great almost from the word go.  The same way Manning fans need to make excuses for some playoff issues, those who want to claim Brady is the greatest ever need to make excuses for why he doesn't match Mannings career statistics when they came into the league around the same time.  

 

Manning has consistently outperformed Brady as a passer over a longer period of time.

 

Brady has consistently had more playoff success then Manning.

 

Brady still has excellent statistics.

 

Manning still has 9 (for twenty) playoff wins, a superbowl MVP, and two superbowl appearances.  Which isn't too shabby historically.  Just worse then Brady and Montana.

 

The argument will never die, unless Brees wins 3 more Super Bowls.   :rulez:

I wouldn't bet 5 cents on that

[southwest1]

Look, I'm gonna be completely honest here. I have an incredible amount of respect for Peyton Manning. His regular season record is fantastic & his comeback wins against Tampa Bay & San Diego were legendary. QBs especially HOF ones are judged on post season performances, which, to my dismay, #18 has struggled with of late. I'm not gonna make excuses. To paraphrase Steelers HC Mike Tomlin "I don't live in that world."

I really wanna see Peyton be the 1st QB in NFL history to win 2 SBs with 2 different franchises, but I'm preparing myself for the reality that this might not happen. I haven't slammed the door shut on another Championship, but the door of SB opportunity here isn't as wide or as ajar as it once was. Plus, Peyton needs a reliable running game & decent pass blocking in order to win in the post season. In 2004, 2005, 2006, & 2009 Peyton could carry a team alone on his shoulders not anymore. This isn't any indictment against Peyton just that age & father time escape no NFL athlete.

If Peyton fails to win another ring, his legacy will be diminished & not as great as it could have been. He's still a 1st ballot HOF QB, but the record will show that expectations did not meet or exceed Playoff caliber clutch reality. Ironic really, considering that both Peyton & Wes Welker need each other to get that 1 missing piece of Championship hardware. Will they cross the finish line? I'm starting to have more doubt creep in than I did following the 2009 season anyway.

[CR91]

Well, he is still building that legacy. He will eventually hold just about every QB record. He has won one superbowl so far and made it to another one. I think he is the favorite to get to one or two more. That said, Dan Marino was a great QB, one of the greatest of all time and he made one superbowl appearance in his career and lost. Does that mean his records are diminished? Of course not, Montana was a great QB on a great team. Was he better than Marino or Peyton? The answer is not and individually he was not as good as either of them. He had the good fortune of playing for a great team. He left the team and what happened? They won superbowls with another QB. All of that has to be considered. Is Peyton better than Johnny Unitas was? Who knows? You can't compare eras. Put Peyton in that era and his stats would not be as great as they are. Put Unitas in this era and no QB may have matched him. Simply put, Peyton Manning is one of the greatest QBs of all time and perhaps the very best of them all...... :dancing:

I would take Joe cool any day. People forget he won superbowls without Jerry rice and when he did leave. The 49ers won one super Bowl

[MikeVander]

Hopefully his legacy will be noted by how much adversity he had to overcome. Polianism is tough to beat, and yet still went to the playoffs consistently. 

[OlBlu]

I would take Joe cool any day. People forget he won superbowls without Jerry rice and when he did leave. The 49ers won one super Bowl

 

Wrong. Montana left the 49ers in 1993. Rice was with them until 2001. The 49ers won the Super Bowl after Joe left with Steve Young at QB......... :dancing:

[CR91]

Wrong. Montana left the 49ers in 1993. Rice was with them until 2001. The 49ers won the Super Bowl after Joe left with Steve Young at QB......... :dancing:

What did I say was wrong. He did win super bowls without rice and I said they won one without him. Not multiple super bowls like you said

[OlBlu]

Luck carried us on his back...RG111 is overrated and will not physically be able to hold up...By the time he is in his early 30's he will be washed up and busted up just like Michael Vick and Luck will be winning Super Bowls and MVP's guaranteed...I have never seen a ROOKIE AND i STRESS THE WORD ROOKIE do more with less and be as advanced as Luck..Seattle and Washington both had much stronger defenses and offensive lines than he did....

 

Guaranteed? That is the sure sign of an out of control Luck fanatic. It is Luck who is the most overhyped player in NFL history, not RGIII. RGIII will make changes in his game and he will be around putting up great numbers for a long time. He is no more likely to get hurt than Luck who took the most hits of any QB last year. Luck may never win and MVP and he may never get to the Super Bowl much less win it. Look how long the Colts went without getting to the Super Bowl before Manning took them to the promised land. The end has the inevitable "but" and the usual excuses of an Andrew Luck apologists. Those excuses for terrible stats do not cut it with me. I guarantee that RGIII will win and MVP and a Super Bowl before Andrew Luck and so will Wilson in Seattle. Now that is complete silliness because there is no guarantee that any of them will ever be an MVP (although RGIII has the best chance) or get to a Super Bowl..... THUD, that is the sound of the Colts and Mr. Luck coming heavily down to earth this year...... :dancing:

[House]

But consistency is part of greatness. It's not Peyton's fault he was a superior prospect out of college and got to start immediately. He was great almost from the word go. The same way Manning fans need to make excuses for some playoff issues, those who want to claim Brady is the greatest ever need to make excuses for why he doesn't match Mannings career statistics when they came into the league around the same time.

Manning has consistently outperformed Brady as a passer over a longer period of time.

Brady has consistently had more playoff success then Manning.

Brady still has excellent statistics.

Manning still has 9 (for twenty) playoff wins, a superbowl MVP, and two superbowl appearances. Which isn't too shabby historically. Just worse then Brady and Montana.

The argument will never die, unless Brees wins 3 more Super Bowls. :rulez:

Careful. Your makin a lot of sense there.

We don't take too kindly to that round these parts.......

[OlBlu]

What did I say was wrong. He did win super bowls without rice and I said they won one without him. Not multiple super bowls like you said

 

I just pointed out that Rice was there for Montana's whole career in San Francisco. So, Montana never won a Super Bowl without him being on the team. I should have said "a" Super Bowl after Montana left.... :dancing:

[Dustin]

I just pointed out that Rice was there for Montana's whole career in San Francisco. So, Montana never won a Super Bowl without him being on the team. I should have said "a" Super Bowl after Montana left.... :dancing:

 

Wrong. Montana won 2 Super Bowls before Rice was drafted.

[CR91]

Wrong. Montana won 2 Super Bowls before Rice was drafted.

Thank you Dustin. Your right Joe won before rice was drafted

[OlBlu]

Wrong. Montana won 2 Super Bowls before Rice was drafted.

 

That is correct. I forgot when Rice was drafted. I thought you were talking about when Rice left. That 49er team was among the best of all time. Is there any doubt that Marinio, Manning or even Luck would have won with that team?  :dancing:

[OlBlu]

Wrong. Montana won 2 Super Bowls before Rice was drafted.

 

 

Yes, you are correct. Thank you..... :dancing:

[Dustin]

That is correct. I forgot when Rice was drafted. I thought you were talking about when Rice left. That 49er team was among the best of all time. Is there any doubt that Marinio, Manning or even Luck would have won with that team?  :dancing:

 

Marino would have won 6+ Super Bowls on those teams.

[amfootball]

That is correct. I forgot when Rice was drafted. I thought you were talking about when Rice left. That 49er team was among the best of all time. Is there any doubt that Marinio, Manning or even Luck would have won with that team?  :dancing:

Both Marino and Manning had similar great teams during their careers but neither got it done in the playoffs like Montana. Marino lost to the 85 Pats at home throwing two picks and never beat Kelly's Bills or Joe's niners in the SB. Manning lost to the Pats when he should have been winning his SBs. This revisionist history gets old. Montana made every player around him better including Rice.

[amfootball]

Marino would have won 6+ Super Bowls on those teams.

No he wouldn't.

[Dustin]

No he wouldn't.

 

He would have won at least 4.

[amfootball]

Here is a question...If you put Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Aaron Rodgers, Joe Flacco, Eli Manning, Ben Rothlisberger...etc, etc, on the Colts team last year could they have gone 11-5?? The only 1 I think could have would have been Aaron Rodgers PERIOD....LUCK literally had 2 seconds or less to get rid of the ball before he got BLOWN UP everytime and had to take chances on throws in order for us to win which is why he had a lot of picks, and he still managed to pull out victories in the 4th after taking vicious hit after vicious hit, and it was only his rookie year! Manning, Brady, Flacco, Eli Manning, and Rothlisberger wouldn't have lasted the season with the line we had...That is what gives LUCK the POTENTIAL to be the G.O.A.T, his combination of Mobility, and toughness and the cerebral part which is on par with Manning...Accuracy will improve and interceptions will go down with even a marginal O-Line and it's a travesty he didn't win ROY...The O-Line we fielded last year was 1 of the worst I can ever remember seeing on any team and yet he didn't miss a snap..RG111 will not physically hold up and will be forgotten when Luck is winning multiple Super Bowls

Brady won the SB with a worse team in '01 than Luck had last year...

[OlBlu]

Both Marino and Manning had similar great teams during their careers but neither got it done in the playoffs like Montana. Marino lost to the 85 Pats at home throwing two picks and never beat Kelly's Bills or Joe's niners in the SB. Manning lost to the Pats when he should have been winning his SBs. This revisionist history gets old. Montana made every player around him better including Rice.

 

Neither Marino or Manning ever played on teams equal to Montana's 49ers. In fact those may have been among the greatest teams of all time. I have never heard anyone say that the Colts or the Dolphins were anything like an all time great team. Marino could not get by the Bills because the Bills had a better team. Manning in those years lost to the Pats because the Pats were on another level from the Colts.... These Colts are not going to beat Houston becasuse Houston right now is a much better team..... :dancing:

[Dustin]

Brady won the SB with a worse team in '01 than Luck had last year...

 

He absolutely did not. Brady was a glorified game manager his first Super Bowl.

[OlBlu]

No he wouldn't.

 

Marinio would have won at least the same four that Montana did...... Montana on those Dolphins teams would not have won any super bowls either.... :dancing:

[amfootball]

Neither Marino or Manning ever played on teams equal to Montana's 49ers. In fact those may have been among the greatest teams of all time. I have never heard anyone say that the Colts or the Dolphins were anything like an all time great team. Marino could not get by the Bills because the Bills had a better team. Manning in those years lost to the Pats because the Pats were on another level from the Colts.... These Colts are not going to beat Houston becasuse Houston right now is a much better team..... :dancing:

Splitting hairs here. Marino's Dolphins were one of the best teams in 84 and 85 and also the early 90's. Manning's Colts were far superior to the Pats in 03, 04 and the Steelers in 05. Difference is Montana always beat the teams he was supposed to beat.

[OlBlu]

He absolutely did not. Brady was a glorified game manager his first Super Bowl.

 

NE was already winning Super Bowls when Brady took over the team....... They were lots better then than any of Manning's Colts teams...... :dancing: