A Kruger Rumor (edit: Kruger to the Browns)

[IndyD4U]

man 11 mil is way too much for a person that plays best in his contract year.

 

 and a situational player at that! Kruger is useless in run support.

[BrentMc11]

I like Avril and i like kruger but is the money theyre asking worth it when the draft is so full of the same type of players? take Jamie collins for instance, 6'3 and 250 and broad jumped over 11 feet and ran a 4.6 40. Thats a freak of nature.

Love Collins....bidding war does not seem like a word Grigs would use......for Kruger or Avril....I am sure Grigs has Collins on his radar.  There are guys at each position of need there....which way do we go?  The next few days....may give us a good indicator!!!

[Balzer40]

 

For what it's worth.

A source tells SI's Peter King he expects the Browns to sign either Paul Kruger or Cliff Avril "by Tuesday night."

King's "money" is on Avril, but it appears to be a true 50-50. Whomever the Browns miss out on could end up in Indianapolis. What's clear is that neither Avril nor Kruger will be returning to their old teams.

 

[BrentMc11]

 

For what it's worth.

HMMMM!  Here I go......Kruger to       9 million per.

 

[Balzer40]

HMMMM!  Here I go......Kruger to       9 million per.

 

 

 

Even though Kruger don't have much of a resume to fall back on, I still think I would take him over Avril. Avril just seems like a Freeney clone to me and I don't think he would be much of an upgrade. Kruger seems more versatile IMO, I have seen a couple of posters say that Kruger is worthless against the run, but I'm not sure if they are just repeating what each other said or if they have any evidence to back that claim up, because from what I've seen from Kruger, IMO he is pretty good against the run and would be better than Avril by a long shot IMO. I don't have evidence to support that either besides what I've seen with my own eyes.

[1959Colts]

One thing that stood out to me about Kruger.

He always plays with a fire. Much like JJ Watt in that regard.

[sultan5]

Love Collins....bidding war does not seem like a word Grigs would use......for Kruger or Avril....I am sure Grigs has Collins on his radar.  There are guys at each position of need there....which way do we go?  The next few days....may give us a good indicator!!!

 I Know !!! and i cant wait! we've never been this excited for free agency before because we've never had any money.Its crazy because when i watched the combine (religiously) ( i really have no idea how to spell that word), but IMO with the safeties  and linebackers, the 3rd and 4th rd rated players were every bit as good as the 1st rounders. i really want to use our #1 on Rhodes or Hunt, but i wouldnt be worried at all if they decide to trade down.

[CardiacColts]

Let's just go after the more affordable option. They will both be a significant upgrade at a big area of need; however, we need to be strategic in how we approach filling our other areas of need as well. 

[Jason_]

Even though Kruger don't have much of a resume to fall back on, I still think I would take him over Avril. Avril just seems like a Freeney clone to me and I don't think he would be much of an upgrade. Kruger seems more versatile IMO, I have seen a couple of posters say that Kruger is worthless against the run, but I'm not sure if they are just repeating what each other said or if they have any evidence to back that claim up, because from what I've seen from Kruger, IMO he is pretty good against the run and would be better than Avril by a long shot IMO. I don't have evidence to support that either besides what I've seen with my own eyes.

 

Well for what it's worth I agree with you.  I think people are getting this from the fact that Kruger was subbed out on many early downs in the SB and Upshaw came in.  So some people are taking this to mean that Kruger can't play vs. the run or else he'd have been in on those plays as well.  They're not taking into account that perhaps Upshaw is much better against the run than he is as a pass rusher at this early point in his career, so perhaps it's not that Kruger can't play vs. the run but rather that Upshaw isn't an effective pass rusher, so they play Upshaw on early downs and Kruger on passing downs in order to keep Kruger fresh for those times he'll be rushing the passer.  

 

From what I've seen with my own eyes I do think Kruger is at the very least above average if not good to very good against the run.  I do think he can be an every down player but will obviously need to be subbed out on occasion just to stay fresh which is why I hope that we take an OLB in the draft as well even if we are able to sign Kruger, Avril or one of the other FA's.  If we get one of the FA OLB's then I think our 3rd or 4th round pick should also be an OLB.  If we miss out on all of the FA OLB's (unlikely but possible) then I'd prefer our 1st round pick be an OLB and maybe even take another one in the 4th, 6th or 7th (unless we get a compensatory pick or 2).

 

[BrentMc11]

Even though Kruger don't have much of a resume to fall back on, I still think I would take him over Avril. Avril just seems like a Freeney clone to me and I don't think he would be much of an upgrade. Kruger seems more versatile IMO, I have seen a couple of posters say that Kruger is worthless against the run, but I'm not sure if they are just repeating what each other said or if they have any evidence to back that claim up, because from what I've seen from Kruger, IMO he is pretty good against the run and would be better than Avril by a long shot IMO. I don't have evidence to support that either besides what I've seen with my own eyes.

I need to sneak back later and like this.  

 

Bill Parcels wants Kruger over Ellerbe on the Ravens.......Polian wants Ellerbe over Kruger.....Two HOF credentials seeing things differently.  That is why we love this.  There is no exact science...and sometimes no method to the madness.

 

I for one have not seen a 270 pound LB move like Kruger does.  Extended play can only make you better, and as we saw in pre-season last year Pagano does not shy away from contact in practice!  Drill em Pags!    

 

I also agree with your Avril/Freeney comparison.  I for one would love to go into camp knowing all of my guys can play 3-4...with Kruger he is there.  Avril.....played OLB at Purdue....Kruger it is for me....between the 2.  

[BrentMc11]

One thing that stood out to me about Kruger.

He always plays with a fire. Much like JJ Watt in that regard.

^^^^^^^Agreed...always moving....a ton of raw energy!!  

[Jay Kirk]

Well we dont have much longer to find out do we? Cant wait !!!!!

[Balzer40]

I need to sneak back later and like this.  

 

Bill Parcels wants Kruger over Ellerbe on the Ravens.......Polian wants Ellerbe over Kruger.....Two HOF credentials seeing things differently.  That is why we love this.  There is no exact science...and sometimes no method to the madness.

 

I for one have not seen a 270 pound LB move like Kruger does.  Extended play can only make you better, and as we saw in pre-season last year Pagano does not shy away from contact in practice!  Drill em Pags!    

 

I also agree with your Avril/Freeney comparison.  I for one would love to go into camp knowing all of my guys can play 3-4...with Kruger he is there.  Avril.....played OLB at Purdue....Kruger it is for me....between the 2.  

 

 

Yep, I just used my last like too. Have to come back later and repay the favor.

[BrentMc11]

Well for what it's worth I agree with you.  I think people are getting this from the fact that Kruger was subbed out on many early downs in the SB and Upshaw came in.  So some people are taking this to mean that Kruger can't play vs. the run or else he'd have been in on those plays as well.  They're not taking into account that perhaps Upshaw is much better against the run than he is as a pass rusher at this early point in his career, so perhaps it's not that Kruger can't play vs. the run but rather that Upshaw isn't an effective pass rusher, so they play Upshaw on early downs and Kruger on passing downs in order to keep Kruger fresh for those times he'll be rushing the passer.  

 

From what I've seen with my own eyes I do think Kruger is at the very least above average if not good to very good against the run.  I do think he can be an every down player but will obviously need to be subbed out on occasion just to stay fresh which is why I hope that we take an OLB in the draft as well even if we are able to sign Kruger, Avril or one of the other FA's.  If we get one of the FA OLB's then I think our 3rd or 4th round pick should also be an OLB.  If we miss out on all of the FA OLB's (unlikely but possible) then I'd prefer our 1st round pick be an OLB and maybe even take another one in the 4th, 6th or 7th (unless we get a compensatory pick or 2).

 

Agreed....out of likes...well stated Jason!!

[Jay Kirk]

^^^^^^^Agreed...always moving....a ton of raw energy!!  

Exactly why we want him IMO Kruger that is

[sultan5]

I lke both Kruger and Avril and have "lobbied" for both of them on here in the past, but after the combine and seeing the linebackers and ends in there, i just dont see spending the money on Kruger or Avril. Theyre good IMO but there is just so much better talent in the later rds of the draft and with a coach like Pagano and Manusky, they can make a playmaker out of anybody it seems and we should  skip both Kruger and Avril and (reluctantly) stick with Hughes in his last year and load up on talent in the draft. because i wonder really, if these guys are any better than Hughes. We obviously know they are no Freeney in a 4-3,  but Kruger's motives for his (great) year is questionable, especially and obviously to his own team, the Ravens who are letting him go. I mean he had 9 sacks, right? Watt had 22 as a DT, and Von Miller had like 21 in the same position that kruger could only come up with 9, right?! I guess what im saying is this, Krugers big year wasnt even good enough to break into the better 50% of the league in his position. And people on here are talking about signing him to 9 and 11 million?! Really guys?!  I would be willing to bet the farm that, as deep as this draft is in defensive players, there is another Von Miller in there somewhere. But I would NOT spend Millions on Kruger.

[Superman]

 and a situational player at that! Kruger is useless in run support.

 

This is not true. Kruger is very good against the run.

[IndyD4U]

This is not true. Kruger is very good against the run.

 

Kruger only had 30 solo tackles. That's comparable to Hughes/Fokou. So your statement "Kruger is very good against the run" doesn't seem to be supported when looked at statistically.

 

I just don't know if Kruger has proven himself for the type of money that many are speculating he'll want. Given that this was a contract year, I don't buy into his hype.

[Superman]

Kruger only had 30 solo tackles. That's comparable to Hughes/Fokou. So your statement "Kruger is very good against the run" doesn't seem to be supported when looked at statistically.

 

I just don't know if Kruger has proven himself for the type of money that many are speculating he'll want. Given that this was a contract year, I don't buy into his hype.

 

Antonio Smith had 30 tackles and 7 sacks last season. Is he a poor run defender?

 

How much time have you spent watching Kruger play? Stats don't tell the story in most cases, particularly when it comes to run defense. He plays his angles well, he stands his ground on the outside, he gets good push, he can get off blocks, and he can pursue. Kruger is a solid run defender. He really is a complete player, and a great fit for Pagano's defense.

 

I understand and probably even share your concern about his value and impact moving forward. I'm not too worried about the whole "contract year" issue; I'm more thinking about his value. The entire Ravens defense flipped a switch last season. The fact that Kruger was a big part of that is a good thing, not a bad thing. He's still young, and had never been a full time player before last year. He went from being the primary pass rusher to being the #2 pass rusher when Suggs came back, and he performed well in that role. That's the role he'd play for the Colts. I think he's a great fit, and that's based on watching him play the past two seasons.

 

I was nervous about $8m/year, depending on the structure; I'm entirely turned off by $12m/year. As important as a good pass rusher is, I'd rather see us grab a secondary guy like Barnes or Barwin, add a pass rusher in the draft (which I expect us to do either way), and let that stable duke it out along with Hughes and Mathis. So long as we get better at nose and end, our pass rush would be okay. We don't need to pay superstar money to someone who isn't a superstar.

[ColtsFTW]

 

For what it's worth.

If Avril goes from Detroit to Cleveland hes just a glutton for punishment. lol

[Dark Superman]

I think Paul will be all about the money and the Browns will probably offer him $12 million a year.

[Superman]

I think Paul will be all about the money and the Browns will probably offer him $12 million a year.

There a few exceptions, but for the most part, free agents are all about the money.

[mahagga73]

No to Kruger. Let the Browns overpay.

The fact the Browns are a trainwreck in any kind of football way makes me wonder if this is a guy we can count on.

[BOTT]

I think Paul will be all about the money and the Browns will probably offer him $12 million a year.

Not sure where this $12 million per for Kruger is coming from.....well, other than his agent floating fantasy numbers out there

[a06cc]

I hope we fix the defensive line first. Tired of seeing guys gain 20-30 yard runs on us. We need a NT or DT before a OLB'er in my opinion. Can't help linebackers without solid play up front

[Kyle]

I hope we fix the defensive line first. Tired of seeing guys gain 20-30 yard runs on us. We need a NT or DT before a OLB'er in my opinion. Can't help linebackers without solid play up front

Chapman

[Jason_]

I hope we fix the defensive line first. Tired of seeing guys gain 20-30 yard runs on us. We need a NT or DT before a OLB'er in my opinion. Can't help linebackers without solid play up front

 

Most of those 20-30 yard runs came on the outsides where Freeney/Mathis were supposed to be setting the edge.  Bethea also had an off year and Zbi was inconsistent at best.  Point being, the majority of the busted runs that our defense gave up were not the fault of the DL.  That's not to say that the DL is perfect and doesn't need to be addressed, but they played far better than a lot of people give them credit for.

[Superman]

Most of those 20-30 yard runs came on the outsides where Freeney/Mathis were supposed to be setting the edge.  Bethea also had an off year and Zbi was inconsistent at best.  Point being, the majority of the busted runs that our defense gave up were not the fault of the DL.  That's not to say that the DL is perfect and doesn't need to be addressed, but they played far better than a lot of people give them credit for.

 

The line played two horrible games against the run: Jets and Chiefs. The rest of the time the run defense was so-so, aside from a couple really good games.

[Hans Moleman]

Our staff knows Kruger better than anyone else. I've got full confidence that however we handle it, it'll be the right call.

 

Also $12 million is just a number so the media has something to report. Guaranteed cash and contract structure are far more important in determining whether we overpaid or not- we just won't know that info until he signs. 

[Jason_]

The line played two horrible games against the run: Jets and Chiefs. The rest of the time the run defense was so-so, aside from a couple really good games.

 

Right, which is why I said that the DL definitely needs to be addressed.  They're certainly not perfect nor at the level that we'd want them to be, but they weren't as bad as some try to make them out to be, especially when taking into account the level of expectation of them going into the season.  Who knows how good they could have been too by the end of the year had we not suffered so many injuries on the DL.+

 

And for clarification, I'm referring mostly to the starters/primary guys in the rotation like AJ, Nevis, Redding, Moala and Matthews.  By the end of the year when we were down to Matthews as a starter and having to use guys like Geathers and Guy in primary roles, yeah they definitely dropped off significantly.

[deedub75]

Just heard he's going to the Browns for 5 years $40M. 

[Superman]

Just heard he's going to the Browns for 5 years $40M. 

 

CBS Sports says five years, $41m. Well below the rumored $12m/year, right in line with the previously reported $8m/year.

 

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-on-football/21861899/lb-paul-kruger-signs-with-browns-for-5-years-41-million