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Blue Horseshoe

Patriots Vs Chargers

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Chargers shot themselves in the foot.

Also our linebackers need to learn how to cover...our our db's going to get owned all day.

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The Patriots better get their defense turned around or they'll be one and done again in the playoffs. They're almost as bad as the Colts.

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The Patriots better get their defense turned around or they'll be one and done again in the playoffs. They're almost as bad as the Colts.

To quote myself: D forced dump offs to the RBs for 15 passes. Yeah Rivers was hoping for that. Keep it in front of them and wait for mistakes. Also if one looked close the D did make Rivers aware with a 4 man rush, hence the dumps. There was pressure despite lack of sacks.

yeah they got 3rd downs but where did it go from there? 10 drives and 7 netted 7 points. goal line stand? are you kidding me.

hmm..BB was happy with it.

lol..yeah we better get the defense turned around..its almost as bad as the colts lol.

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Chargers shot themselves in the foot.

Also our linebackers need to learn how to cover...our our db's going to get owned all day.

Both team's D looks suspect because both team's offenses are so stacked. Tough to contain that many weapons and QBs that know how to use them.

One of the big differences I saw on D was the Patriot O-line's ability to give Brady all the time in the world and his ability to escape when almost taken down. Our O-line was less capable of containing the pressure. Every other part of our D gets better if our pass rush & D line pressure steps up the game.

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So what part of "and we gave them the ball 4 times" was wrong - I believe that = 4 turnovers?

the "we should have won" part.

i bolded it.

no team "should" win turning the ball over 4 times.

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the "we should have won" part.

i bolded it.

no team "should" win turning the ball over 4 times.

You didn't make that clear. I agree. We shouldn't have turned it over. If we didn't, we walk away with the game. We made mistakes - you didn't. Pretty simple. AND if you read my post, I'm saying what you're saying.

Try being as gracious in victory as I'm being in defeat - or is that impossible for a Pats fan ;-) ?

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To quote myself: D forced dump offs to the RBs for 15 passes. Yeah Rivers was hoping for that. Keep it in front of them and wait for mistakes. Also if one looked close the D did make Rivers aware with a 4 man rush, hence the dumps. There was pressure despite lack of sacks.

yeah they got 3rd downs but where did it go from there? 10 drives and 7 netted 7 points. goal line stand? are you kidding me.

hmm..BB was happy with it.

lol..yeah we better get the defense turned around..its almost as bad as the colts lol.

Bro.. Your defense sucks!! The last two games the opposing offenses threw for over 400 yards. The Chargers cost themselves the game. If you think your defense won that game for you your just kidding yourself. Besides the goal line stand, witch the Chargers totally blew by the play call, your defense sucked. You won't beat any good team with that defense unless the defense improves dramatically. Your offense its crazy good right now. Your tight ends are beasts. But an elite offense won't win many playoff games. Just ask any Colts fan.

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Bro.. Your defense sucks!! The last two games the opposing offenses threw for over 400 yards. The Chargers cost themselves the game. If you think your defense won that game for you your just kidding yourself. Besides the goal line stand, witch the Chargers totally blew by the play call, your defense sucked. You won't beat any good team with that defense unless the defense improves dramatically. Your offense its crazy good right now. Your tight ends are beasts. But an elite offense won't win many playoff games. Just ask any Colts fan.

ooo yards..oh my. Game plan was keep it in front. Hello..yards?

Let me repeat..15 passes to check down RBs. FIFTEEN..that's over half the passes to check downs.

Gates ZERO catches. That's zero. He was taken out. (who beats you? yep..Gates)

2 catches from WRs.

Leaving only Vincent with a big day.

Knowing you'd get those results from a defense you wouldn't take it? maybe you wouldn't lol

Oh sorry..goal line defense didn't count. Yes bad play by the opponent. (sound familiar?)

Let me explain defensive football to you...it's just a little more than total yards.

Last but least..because of depth and rotation the question mark is the Pats tough enough this year was answered. That equates to outlasting your opponent into the 4th qtr.

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To quote myself: D forced dump offs to the RBs for 15 passes. Yeah Rivers was hoping for that. Keep it in front of them and wait for mistakes. Also if one looked close the D did make Rivers aware with a 4 man rush, hence the dumps. There was pressure despite lack of sacks.

yeah they got 3rd downs but where did it go from there? 10 drives and 7 netted 7 points. goal line stand? are you kidding me.

hmm..BB was happy with it.

lol..yeah we better get the defense turned around..its almost as bad as the colts lol.

yep dump off passes

thats why Vincent Jackson pretty much had a field day with McCourtney

Brady and the entire offense looks great but the defense looks very bad especially against the pass. They allowed Chad Henne to have a career day, 400+ yards and then Rivers just under 400 yards. They are also ranked 31st in defense. .How are the pats going to fair against a QB like Rodgers or Brees? We've seen time and time again that a QB alone cannot carry an entire team throughout the course of the season.

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The Patriots better get their defense turned around or they'll be one and done again in the playoffs. They're almost as bad as the Colts.

Amen to that P-money . . .

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yep dump off passes

thats why Vincent Jackson pretty much had a field day with McCourtney

Brady and the entire offense looks great but the defense looks very bad especially against the pass. They allowed Chad Henne to have a career day, 400+ yards and then Rivers just under 400 yards. They are also ranked 31st in defense. .How are the pats going to fair against a QB like Rodgers or Brees? We've seen time and time again that a QB alone cannot carry an entire team throughout the course of the season.

well you can't take away everything against a good team...correct??

So who do you decide on. Gates? he moves the chains.

They didn't run to well either.

So..Vincent got his yards. whoopdee doo.

lets put it this way. BB said he expected to win and did everthing he expected..offense,defense, ST.

He's not in the habit of saying his defense did well if it didn't. It did exactly what he expected. Think I'll take his word:)

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well you can't take away everything against a good team...correct??

So who do you decide on. Gates? he moves the chains.

They didn't run to well either.

So..Vincent got his yards. whoopdee doo.

lets put it this way. BB said he expected to win and did everthing he expected..offense,defense, ST.

He's not in the habit of saying his defense did well if it didn't. It did exactly what he expected. Think I'll take his word:)

i'm guessing BB knows what he's talking about.

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Shutting down the best TE in the game qualifies as a decent day. Also, I think if I were a coach I would be okay with a defense that allows the most yards in the league AND causes the most turnovers.

Oh, and wins.

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Wow, Pats D stinks? Wilfolk made an AMAZING INT to stop the chargers. Got pressure all day and caused another INT by pressure. (He short armed the throw.) The GOAL Line stand was amazing and was a 14 point swing. (and thats the 5TH turnover if you count that one they had 2 picks and 2 fumbles the chargers.) The D did an Ok job to much YAC (which is where VJ got most of his yards.)

And if this makes the Pats D awful then how bad is the charger defense? they couldnt even keep the pats from getting in range for a FG with 16 sec left in the half!

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Can't wait till the Pats play a good team. The Chargers always suck and beat themselves every year in the first few weeks of the season so don't count them as a good team. Any elite team will have a field day against your defense unless it improves dramatically. Even Mike and Mike were bashing on it this morning on XM. And they're Pats lovers. Go ahead and leave your blinders on. You'll eventually get blind sided by reality.

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To quote myself: D forced dump offs to the RBs for 15 passes. Yeah Rivers was hoping for that. Keep it in front of them and wait for mistakes. Also if one looked close the D did make Rivers aware with a 4 man rush, hence the dumps. There was pressure despite lack of sacks.

yeah they got 3rd downs but where did it go from there? 10 drives and 7 netted 7 points. goal line stand? are you kidding me.

hmm..BB was happy with it.

lol..yeah we better get the defense turned around..its almost as bad as the colts lol.

Sorry, I still completely disagree. I think that it'll improve, but here's the issue:

Where were the LBs covering those wide open RBs? Even when the Patriots run their screen plays or dumpoffs, most teams' LBs are right there.

I'm not sold on this defense whatsoever. They'll certainly improve, but it needs to be on various fronts. The safety play was atrocious with the one exception of Brown's INT. Barrett sucked, for crying out loud.

Just because SD gave up the ball (the fumble was COMPLETELY on the RB, who made that stupid move) does not mean our defense is great.

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Can't wait till the Pats play a good team. The Chargers always suck and beat themselves every year in the first few weeks of the season so don't count them as a good team. Any elite team will have a field day against your defense unless it improves dramatically. Even Mike and Mike were bashing on it this morning on XM. And they're Pats lovers. Go ahead and leave your blinders on. You'll eventually get blind sided by reality.

greeney is a jets fan.

and i listened to the whole show today, they really didn't have anything that awful to say about it.

and the chargers aren't a good team?? probly gonna win their division. that offense is potent, but not potent enough to beat the pats :flyingelvis:

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greeney is a jets fan.

and i listened to the whole show today, they really didn't have anything that awful to say about it.

and the chargers aren't a good team?? probly gonna win their division. that offense is potent, but not potent enough to beat the pats :flyingelvis:

I said they weren't a good team the first few weeks of the season, can't you read? They start out sucking every year and then get good. I'm not going to argue the obvious. Waste of my time

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Wow, Pats D stinks? Wilfolk made an AMAZING INT to stop the chargers. Got pressure all day and caused another INT by pressure. (He short armed the throw.) The GOAL Line stand was amazing and was a 14 point swing. (and thats the 5TH turnover if you count that one they had 2 picks and 2 fumbles the chargers.) The D did an Ok job to much YAC (which is where VJ got most of his yards.)

And if this makes the Pats D awful then how bad is the charger defense? they couldnt even keep the pats from getting in range for a FG with 16 sec left in the half!

I almost wanted to scream at that. What the heck were the Chargers doing to play so off Deion Branch on the sidelines?

Anyhow, you CAN'T turn the ball over 3 times in your opponent's territory (and fail on a goal line stand) and let precious points go to waste...

I'm already conceding defeat to 2-1 this week. Our secondary is going to be torn apart and there is no way Fitz can keep up with Brady. I don't see how our pass rush will get to Brady and nobody in our secondary is capable of covering New England's tight ends. So, my prediction? Bills extend their New England losing streak from 15 to 17 this season.

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I said they weren't a good team the first few weeks of the season, can't you read? They start out sucking every year and then get good. I'm not going to argue the obvious. Waste of my time

but the pats d is supposed to be elite by week 2??

making excuses for the chargers but none for the pats.

hater.

we all think the chargers will be elite by the end of the year. i also think the pats d will be much improved by years end.

"any elite team will have a field day against this d".

well phillip didn't. who left on the pats schedule is "elite"? eagles? maybe no vick. steelers? we always have their number it seems.

looks like they might not see another elite offense till the playoffs, and by then the defense will be much improved.

hater, hate on :flyingelvis:

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Sorry, I still completely disagree. I think that it'll improve, but here's the issue:

Where were the LBs covering those wide open RBs? Even when the Patriots run their screen plays or dumpoffs, most teams' LBs are right there.

I'm not sold on this defense whatsoever. They'll certainly improve, but it needs to be on various fronts. The safety play was atrocious with the one exception of Brown's INT. Barrett sucked, for crying out loud.

Just because SD gave up the ball (the fumble was COMPLETELY on the RB, who made that stupid move) does not mean our defense is great.

AH but.... if those RBs were catching balls because of check downs as opposed to designed plays..then LBs wouldn't be there. That's what you give up. LBs were playing deeper.

I'm not even counting the turnovers..although part of the BB defense is make the offense run more plays increasing chance of turnovers.

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I almost wanted to scream at that. What the heck were the Chargers doing to play so off Deion Branch on the sidelines?

Anyhow, you CAN'T turn the ball over 3 times in your opponent's territory (and fail on a goal line stand) and let precious points go to waste...

I'm already conceding defeat to 2-1 this week. Our secondary is going to be torn apart and there is no way Fitz can keep up with Brady. I don't see how our pass rush will get to Brady and nobody in our secondary is capable of covering New England's tight ends. So, my prediction? Bills extend their New England losing streak from 15 to 17 this season.

One would think but nothing is easy in this league.

I was watching the end of the Buffalo game and was ticked when they changed to the NE game..which was just commercials at that point.

I wanted to see the end there. I was rooting for them as a football purist. Plus as I told my friend..well better Raiders lose and get it out of their system. Buffalo will fall later in the season;-) Or we'll just beat them.

That had to be an exciting end game. I certainly was:)

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One would think but nothing is easy in this league.

I was watching the end of the Buffalo game and was ticked when they changed to the NE game..which was just commercials at that point.

I wanted to see the end there. I was rooting for them as a football purist. Plus as I told my friend..well better Raiders lose and get it out of their system. Buffalo will fall later in the season;-) Or we'll just beat them.

That had to be an exciting end game. I certainly was:)

You know, I was kind of happy that the Jets were blowing the Jags into oblivion. If not for that CBS never would've switched us from Jags-Jets to Raiders-Bills.

But they (WBZ, CBS out of Boston) had to change us due to NFL broadcasting rules. It's funny, because sometimes TV stations will push the buttons with that rule and wait for the absolute second to leave the game to bring you to another game. All they need to do is just be there before the ball is kicked off, not the introduction of the announcers, lol.

The second they switched I bolted to the nearest computer and threw up gamecenter and the Bills message board I live at to see what happened. :)

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but the pats d is supposed to be elite by week 2??

making excuses for the chargers but none for the pats.

hater.

we all think the chargers will be elite by the end of the year. i also think the pats d will be much improved by years end.

"any elite team will have a field day against this d".

well phillip didn't. who left on the pats schedule is "elite"? eagles? maybe no vick. steelers? we always have their number it seems.

looks like they might not see another elite offense till the playoffs, and by then the defense will be much improved.

hater, hate on :flyingelvis:

oh our defense is pretty bad if you stick it in Madden:) stats ya know;)

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Can't wait till the Pats play a good team. The Chargers always suck and beat themselves every year in the first few weeks of the season so don't count them as a good team. Any elite team will have a field day against your defense unless it improves dramatically. Even Mike and Mike were bashing on it this morning on XM. And they're Pats lovers. Go ahead and leave your blinders on. You'll eventually get blind sided by reality.

lol lol lol

ESPN HATES the Patriots. Sorry. Patriot fans certainly feel that they do, particularly considering how exaggerated and prolonged the lame SpyGate nonsense was by that network.

You DO know that Mike Greenberg is a Jets fan and hates the Patriots? Yes? The other Mike is traditionally ambivalent about the Patriots.

You do realize that the Chargers had the #1 defense AND #1 offense last year, yes?

Something tells me that you don't.

Tell me: what offense will the Patriots face this year that's better than the Chargers?

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You know, I was kind of happy that the Jets were blowing the Jags into oblivion. If not for that CBS never would've switched us from Jags-Jets to Raiders-Bills.

But they (WBZ, CBS out of Boston) had to change us due to NFL broadcasting rules. It's funny, because sometimes TV stations will push the buttons with that rule and wait for the absolute second to leave the game to bring you to another game. All they need to do is just be there before the ball is kicked off, not the introduction of the announcers, lol.

The second they switched I bolted to the nearest computer and threw up gamecenter and the Bills message board I live at to see what happened. :)

lol at Jets.

Its not even the announcers they switched to..it was the commercials before the announcers.

you're right..they'd run the other game right to the KO of the game they were switching too.

I mean there were only two freaking plays left to see when they switched the Buffalo game to NE. geez.

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Wow, Pats D stinks? Wilfolk made an AMAZING INT to stop the chargers. Got pressure all day and caused another INT by pressure. (He short armed the throw.) The GOAL Line stand was amazing and was a 14 point swing. (and thats the 5TH turnover if you count that one they had 2 picks and 2 fumbles the chargers.) The D did an Ok job to much YAC (which is where VJ got most of his yards.)

And if this makes the Pats D awful then how bad is the charger defense? they couldnt even keep the pats from getting in range for a FG with 16 sec left in the half!

Pressure all day?

REALLY?

Were we watching the same game?

Zero sacks until a strip sack at the very end.

Yes, the Brown INT was a result of pressure which caused Rivers to change his delivery angle. That was the only real time that they got pressure on Rivers.

What's sad, really, is that this defense is playing similar to the '09 defense. And we all know how bad that was.

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AH but.... if those RBs were catching balls because of check downs as opposed to designed plays..then LBs wouldn't be there. That's what you give up. LBs were playing deeper.

I'm not even counting the turnovers..although part of the BB defense is make the offense run more plays increasing chance of turnovers.

Wait wait wait.

Who were those LBs defending?

Please don't say Gates. Chung and other safeties covered him all game long. Not the LBs.

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Wait wait wait.

Who were those LBs defending?

Please don't say Gates. Chung and other safeties covered him all game long. Not the LBs.

[/quote

I still think they were playing back.

Now we're only in to two games but its going to be better than last year by more shear experience. They were athletic last year but were often out of position.

There was some great coverage in the game too but how do you stop a high ball to a high jump WR with the size of our DBs. You can't. Those are going to happen.

I don't why you can't accept checkdowns against an elite team..unless you want our defense to be a shut down.

And there was pressure. Sacks isn't everything. Zo thought the same thing.

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lol lol lol

ESPN HATES the Patriots. Sorry. Patriot fans certainly feel that they do, particularly considering how exaggerated and prolonged the lame SpyGate nonsense was by that network.

You DO know that Mike Greenberg is a Jets fan and hates the Patriots? Yes? The other Mike is traditionally ambivalent about the Patriots.

You do realize that the Chargers had the #1 defense AND #1 offense last year, yes?

Something tells me that you don't.

Tell me: what offense will the Patriots face this year that's better than the Chargers?

Least years stats mean nothing on this year bro. The Chargers always start out their season crappy. You didn't see the their best game. You jacks get all defensive when the first thing I stated was that if they don't fix their defense you'll be one and done in the playoffs. I'm far from a Patriots hater. I give them props all the time. The offense is playing lights out right now. Your tight ends are proving to be beasts. But your defense isn't even a top 25. Your secondary is horrible. Needs some major help.

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Least years stats mean nothing on this year bro. The Chargers always start out their season crappy. You didn't see the their best game. You jacks get all defensive when the first thing I stated was that if they don't fix their defense you'll be one and done in the playoffs. I'm far from a Patriots hater. I give them props all the time. The offense is playing lights out right now. Your tight ends are proving to be beasts. But your defense isn't even a top 25. Your secondary is horrible. Needs some major help.

I will certainly vouch you're not a patriot hater;)

And I am not looking at the game through patriot eyes..just as a football fan.

BB said it best when reporters asked about the defense. They've won 2 games haven't they.

SD is 1-1. I'm not buying into SD last year start bad etc therefore it must be true this season....as you've said you don't on the pats defense last year...infact that was more a fluke.

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It was a battle. Patriots had two (red-zone?) interceptions and a goal-line turnover on downs, yet the Chargers were still alive. Down by only six, in NE territory. Then Tolbert coughed up the football. After that there was no coming back.

It was a tall task going to NE for the home opener. I just wanted the Chargers to play mistake free-- and they didn't. Chargers will lick their wounds, and take it out on KC in Week 3.

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It was a battle. Patriots had two (red-zone?) interceptions and a goal-line turnover on downs, yet the Chargers were still alive. Down by only six, in NE territory. Then Tolbert coughed up the football. After that there was no coming back.

It was a tall task going to NE for the home opener. I just wanted the Chargers to play mistake free-- and they didn't. Chargers will lick their wounds, and take it out on KC in Week 3.

You have a good enough defense, which is more than enough to beat a Matt Cassel-led team. Besides, you better trounce on them (defensively especially) considering I have San Diego's defense on my fantasy team...

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From what the first two games looked like defensively, it seems as though the Pats are taking this approach. They will concede yards and plenty of first downs, while constantly looking at offensive patterns. By removing an option from the game entirely (Gates), they will monitor what the opposing offense will do without that option. Once they feel they see a pattern, they will pounce and try to take the ball away. This is a defense driven by turnovers. The terrible 3rd down conversion percentage is alarming, but I am not fussed about the strength of this defense. All game Rivers is checking down to open RBs because he can't throw to Gates, and those RBs are getting yards and first downs. Then, out of no where, Wilfork pounces on a pass and gets a turnover.

It is the football equivalent of a tennis player simply hitting the ball back to his/her opponent. This tactic won't get the player many winners, and therefore some might question the talent of the player. In the end, it won't matter how talented the player is, because the opponent will eventually beat themselves with costly mistakes and unforced errors.

And let's get one thing straight. Field goals WILL NOT beat this Patriots offense. So, the question I am asking to anyone worried about this defense is...What's the problem with an offense making it from their 20 to the Patriots' 20? It isn't their end zone, right? It isn't six points right? I think they will be just fine allowing 400+ to any QB in the league as long as they get some turnovers and stop them when it matters.

Pats defense so far.....

MIA: 2-14 3rd down efficiency. One interception. One fumble forced, but not recovered. 11 QB hits, 4 sacks, and 6 TFL. Oh, and MOST IMPORTANTLY 3 for 6 in the red zone.

SD: 10-12 3rd down. Two interceptions. Two fumbles forced and recovered. 4 QB hits, 2 sacks, 1 TFL. Oh, and MOST IMPORTANTLY 2 for 4 in the red zone.

So, by my count, they are 12-26 on third down, less than 50% efficiency for the offenses. 3 INT, 3 FFs with 2 recovered, 15 QB hits, 6 sacks, 7 TFL. Oh, and kinda importantly 5-10 in the red zone. Go ahead and make it to the 20. You'll only score half the time. Not worried.

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As a Pats fan I do have concerns about the defense at this point. It seems as though little has changed since last season, when they were not able to get key stops in big situations on a consistent basis. They were better on 3rd down against Miami, but horrible in that area against the Chargers.

Obviously there are some positives... five takeaways through two games, excellent work in the red zone, etc.

Specifically:

- Devin McCourty has not looked as sharp as he was as a rookie. He could still come around of course, but he's not playing the ball as well as he did last season.

- The injuries are piling up already. Wright is probably done for the year. Dowling's injury yesterday looked bad. Chung got dinged up as well.

Things are changing in the NFL, bigtime. Yesterday Cam Newton and the Carolina Panthers put up a boatload of yards on the defending NFL Champions. It's not about yards, it's about situational football... but I'm still not 100% sold on NE's defense at this point.

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ESPN hates the Patriots!! lol lol lol You serious?

Who at ESPN likes the Patriots?

ESPN has an East Coast bias, but if you think that they like the Patriots, I have a bridge to sell you...

They hate the Patriots. Why? Because NE refuses to deal with them. Prime example: ESPN wanted an ESPN Zone at Patriots' Place. Kraft laughed and brought in a CBS Sports complex.

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