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Dwight Freeney "not expected" back in Indy.


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At this point in his career I dont see him getting a big payday .. might as well sign for less and stay here!

 

While it may not be a "blockbuster" contract ... Some 4/3 team will give him a VERY lucrative contract hoping to get 2-3 years of pre-2011 Freeney.

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I remember this board full of "there is no way they keep Dwight and pay his final year. Guess how correct that was.

 

Rotoworld just throwing a dart, hoping it sticks and they get to say it first. Not such a grand prediction anyway.

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I expected Freeney to not come back but I did not expect Hughes to take the position full-time.  I know he had some bright spots last year but I don't think he's good enough.  I hope we can find someone to fill that spot but if Chuck believes he can take over full-time then I trust his judgement more than mines.  

 

Wasn't Hughes a stand up DE at TCU?

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Y'know, I think Freeney probably is gone.  However, I disagree that he was such a bad fit with the system.  The system had him playing the Suggs pass-rushing role, and very seldomly in coverage.  The problem with his production was that he was playing hurt most of the year.  He looked pretty good towards the end of the year when he finally got a little healthier.  That being said, he seems to prefer being in a 4-3, and at his age he's probably not worth a big contract at the new position.  I'm still holding out a little hope that he'll pull the Reggie Wayne and come back, but I fully expect him to move on to situational PR duty in a 4-3, where he's more comfortable.  I'd kind of like to see Alex Okafor get drafted to take his OLB spot...

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Per Rotoworld.

Impending free agent DE/OLB Dwight Freeney is not expected to re-sign with the Colts.

Freeney proved to be an extremely poor fit in Chuck Pagano's 3-4 scheme, compiling just five sacks and 24 tackles in 14 games. 2010 first-round pick Jerry Hughes will have a chance to run with the position full time next season. After 11 years with the Colts, Freeney is wearing down but still can help a team out of the 4-3 end spot as a situational rusher.

Thoughts?

The article supposes that Jerry Hughes will have a chance to run with this position. I'm not impressed very much with Jerry. He did nothing in the old 4-3. He didn't do much this year in the hybrid which I thought would be good for him. Im expecting Grigson understand that the OLB/DE in this defense are what makes it go. I expect that we are going to sign a FA to come in who has experience in this role.

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I expected Freeney to not come back but I did not expect Hughes to take the position full-time.  I know he had some bright spots last year but I don't think he's good enough.  I hope we can find someone to fill that spot but if Chuck believes he can take over full-time then I trust his judgement more than mines.  

 

Wasn't Hughes a stand up DE at TCU?

Yes I think he was. I hope the staff is looking at FA to bring in a player that Manusky, Pagano, Grigson knows can play that Rush end very well. It's critical to the defense and I hope that this position is top priority along with the OL.

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i saw a few posts saying that Jerry Hughes is'nt that good. i will agree that he is no Freeney but i think the move to linebacker has worked out better for him. not real sure how to explain it but he just seems to do better as a line back then he did as a lineman. 

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The article supposes that Jerry Hughes will have a chance to run with this position. I'm not impressed very much with Jerry. He did nothing in the old 4-3. He didn't do much this year in the hybrid which I thought would be good for him. Im expecting Grigson understand that the OLB/DE in this defense are what makes it go. I expect that we are going to sign a FA to come in who has experience in this role.

 

Jerry Hughes had a good year as a reserve pass rusher. I hope we can get someone better than him to start, but he did his job adequately this season.

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Wasn't Hughes a stand up DE at TCU?

 

Yes I think he was.

 

No, he wasn't. He was a traditional 4-3 end. Perhaps he rushed from a two-point stance on occasion, but he was a traditional, hand in the dirt end at TCU.

 

He was projected to the NFL as a pass rushing linebacker.

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No, he wasn't. He was a traditional 4-3 end. Perhaps he rushed from a two-point stance on occasion, but he was a traditional, hand in the dirt end at TCU.

 

He was projected to the NFL as a pass rushing linebacker.

I reviewed a youtube highlight clip of him at TCU. He was a hand on the ground guy but it appears to me that TCU ran a 3-4 and Hughes was like a 5 tech in that system. That being said I would still like to see better production from him at this level.

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The only part of that I didn't like was where they say Hughes would be given an opportunity to run with the job.  Hughes was better in the scheme but still doesn't quite give us what we need in terms of pass rush.   I'd rather bring in a more proven pass rusher for the scheme in Anthony Spenser. 

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The only part of that I didn't like was where they say Hughes would be given an opportunity to run with the job.  Hughes was better in the scheme but still doesn't quite give us what we need in terms of pass rush.   I'd rather bring in a more proven pass rusher for the scheme in Anthony Spenser. 

Paul Kruger...

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Wow. He just doesn't look like a first round 5 tech. Not sure what Polian was thinking. 

 

He's stiff and can't get low like Mathis or Freeney (3 years ago). 

 

I appreciate what Freeney did for the colts, but I'm not sad to see him go. I've watched his lack of effort and him moping off the field one too many times. 

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I reviewed a youtube highlight clip of him at TCU. He was a hand on the ground guy but it appears to me that TCU ran a 3-4 and Hughes was like a 5 tech in that system. That being said I would still like to see better production from him at this level.

That will likely come when he is not rotated in and out, He was never meant to start from day 1 in my opinion if you look at what Freeney's numbers were the year prior to Hughes being drafted as well as the year that Hughes was drafted, the big knock on Hughes coming into the draft was his strength, he has the size to play 3-4 OLB......My opinion, he is capable of double digit sacks as a 3-4 OLB but fits the Robert Mathis role of dropping back into a short zone while sometimes pass rushing, He produced 4 sacks and 41 tackles in 6 starts (starting a game while playing every defensive snap is key, unfair and ridiculous to judge what a guy can do being a rotational player). Im expecting similar numbers if he is a rotational player behind Mathis again

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Okay..... with $47 mil in cap we have our choice of F/A LB's and Ends:

 Cliff Avril: is my top choice. Played LB some in college and can move east n west with a quickness.

 Paul Kruger: Played in baltimore and actually started to shine along a Beast defense. student of Pagano.

 Conner Barwin: no way texans are letting him go, knowing we are in the market.

 Michael Johnson: 6'7 270 lbs, 12.5 sacks in 2012....this guy would really be ideal it seems for Colts system.

 

Draft:

(who might still be avail at pick #25)

 Dion Jordan: 6'7 and FAST (probably wont be avail.)

Ezekiel Ansah: Compared to Pierre paul

Chase Thomas: i watched tape on Thomas and he should have ALOT more sacks. dissruptive as hell but seems scared to draw penalty so he gives up at QB's feet. Ex-Cardinal. My pick.

Alex Akafor: awesome fight but more and more scouts saying hes way over-rated.

 

 

whatever kind of trade we can get for Jerry Hughes we need to take it. He's not the answer and if he was then he wouldve been in the line-up alot more than he was with Freeney injured so much. Also.....does anyone think Freney could play DE in 3-4? He is real strong and has a killer bull rush, his production wont be as much but it wasnt this year either. he seriuosly could move inside. we know he cant go east n west for nothin anymore. He jus wasnt built that way.

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Okay..... with $47 mil in cap we have our choice of F/A LB's and Ends:

 Cliff Avril: is my top choice. Played LB some in college and can move east n west with a quickness.

 Paul Kruger: Played in baltimore and actually started to shine along a Beast defense. student of Pagano.

 Conner Barwin: no way texans are letting him go, knowing we are in the market.

 Michael Johnson: 6'7 270 lbs, 12.5 sacks in 2012....this guy would really be ideal it seems for Colts system.

 

Draft:

(who might still be avail at pick #25)

 Dion Jordan: 6'7 and FAST (probably wont be avail.)

Ezekiel Ansah: Compared to Pierre paul

Chase Thomas: i watched tape on Thomas and he should have ALOT more sacks. dissruptive as hell but seems scared to draw penalty so he gives up at QB's feet. Ex-Cardinal. My pick.

Alex Akafor: awesome fight but more and more scouts saying hes way over-rated.

 

 

whatever kind of trade we can get for Jerry Hughes we need to take it. He's not the answer and if he was then he wouldve been in the line-up alot more than he was with Freeney injured so much. Also.....does anyone think Freney could play DE in 3-4? He is real strong and has a killer bull rush, his production wont be as much but it wasnt this year either. he seriuosly could move inside. we know he cant go east n west for nothin anymore. He jus wasnt built that way.

Freeney played in and started 14 games last year, he was never the same after Webb took out his ankle (arguably on purpose the more I watch it). we wont likely get anything for Hughes, maybe a 7th or 6th round pick, why would we let him go anyway? we are likely already losing Freeney

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Freeney played in and started 14 games last year, he was never the same after Webb took out his ankle (arguably on purpose the more I watch it). we wont likely get anything for Hughes, maybe a 7th or 6th round pick, why would we let him go anyway? we are likely already losing Freeney

 Freeney played in 14 games because he HAD to. he played injured because, unlike in the preseason, regular season games matter. and Hughes, although he gets close, doesnt ever finish the way freeney and mathis do, and if he did, then Freeney or Mathis wouldnt have to play injured. i mean, Hughes was a #1 draft pick for cryin' out loud. Heck i even remember one game where hughes was replaced by Fukou. who actually generated more pass rush than Hughes. besides, Hughes being a #1 pick means that we still have topay him #1 pick money even in his last year. rotational guys arent worth that.

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 Freeney played in 14 games because he HAD to. he played injured because, unlike in the preseason, regular season games matter. and Hughes, although he gets close, doesnt ever finish the way freeney and mathis do, and if he did, then Freeney or Mathis wouldnt have to play injured. i mean, Hughes was a #1 draft pick for cryin' out loud. Heck i even remember one game where hughes was replaced by Fukou. who actually generated more pass rush than Hughes. besides, Hughes being a #1 pick means that we still have topay him #1 pick money even in his last year. rotational guys arent worth that.

Dont remember him being replaced by Fokou, what game? your right Freeney had to, I can give you 14 million reasons why, Talk to Polian about his draft status, I agree however he has not lived up to his contract but he was never meant to right away, who would you go with Freeney or an unproven rookie at the time?

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I don't think Hughes is a complete bust. But he hasn't lived up to being a first round pick. Blame Polian I guess. I just see some things from Hughes that I just don't like and I can't really put my finger on it. Will he be ok if hes and every game starter? probably. But I don't see him as a double digit sack guy. I really don't. Hope I'm wrong. But I do like some of the other guys mentioned more than I like Hughes.... Avril, Barwin, Kruger I think all would be great to get and Hughes is a nice 3rd guy for the OLB rotatation. JMO

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I don't think Hughes is a complete bust. But he hasn't lived up to being a first round pick. Blame Polian I guess. I just see some things from Hughes that I just don't like and I can't really put my finger on it. Will he be ok if hes and every game starter? probably. But I don't see him as a double digit sack guy. I really don't. Hope I'm wrong. But I do like some of the other guys mentioned more than I like Hughes.... Avril, Barwin, Kruger I think all would be great to get and Hughes is a nice 3rd guy for the OLB rotatation. JMO

I agree, he's not a complete bust as a player. As a 1st pick, a disaster. He is most definitely not the answer though. He'll be gone this year or next. Another Polian scrub.

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I don't think Hughes is a complete bust. But he hasn't lived up to being a first round pick. Blame Polian I guess. I just see some things from Hughes that I just don't like and I can't really put my finger on it. Will he be ok if hes and every game starter? probably. But I don't see him as a double digit sack guy. I really don't. Hope I'm wrong. But I do like some of the other guys mentioned more than I like Hughes.... Avril, Barwin, Kruger I think all would be great to get and Hughes is a nice 3rd guy for the OLB rotatation. JMO

There is a big difference in Hughes and the other players you have named, those were always "the guy" at there position on there teams, Freeney or Mathis has always been "the guy" here in Indy, Limited and inconsistent snaps means limited production

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There is a big difference in Hughes and the other players you have named, those were always "the guy" at there position on there teams, Freeney or Mathis has always been "the guy" here in Indy, Limited and inconsistent snaps means limited production

So does not having the skill required to be "the guy". That's what I believe Hughes is. He does not have the skills that these other guys possess. That's my opinion. As i say, can he be a starter and be OK? Ya probably. But my point, going back to an earlier post, is that the OLB positions in this 3-4 hybrid are where you need "playmakers". I just don't believe that Hughes is a true playmaker. He does not possess, nor will he in my opinion, the pass rush techiniques that Mathis, Freeney, Avril, Barwin, Kruger possess. The guy just does not have it. Now, if we want to settle for average play at this position, which I don't because like I say its a critical position, then Hughes will be OK. My opinion is that his skills don't translate to the types of numbers these other guys would procuce. JMO

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I don't think Hughes is a complete bust. But he hasn't lived up to being a first round pick. Blame Polian I guess. I just see some things from Hughes that I just don't like and I can't really put my finger on it. Will he be ok if hes and every game starter? probably. But I don't see him as a double digit sack guy. I really don't. Hope I'm wrong. But I do like some of the other guys mentioned more than I like Hughes.... Avril, Barwin, Kruger I think all would be great to get and Hughes is a nice 3rd guy for the OLB rotatation. JMO

 

In my mind I blame Bill Polian for starters .  The man did very good for our Colts but in my mind he dropped the ball on defense .

 

This has been a pet peeve of mine Defense wins games  , Tom Moore &  Peyton Manning  were in place , Bringing in Tony Dungy was supposed to cure our defense with the tampa 2 , what a joke that was  .

 

Our 06 defense 32'nd in the regular season then turned it on in the playoffs , It was an amazing turnaround & IMHO the defense were the MVP of the SB .

 

To this very day I have not heard 1 reasonable answer for that turn of events , But of course theres my opinion - IMO  the coachs failed all year & the players themselves dug deep & started believing that they could get-R-done , They heard there critics & were embarassed  , I'v never heard any stories to the contrary & I would love 2 know what others thought of our SB run .

 

My point being it was clear watching Dwight Freeney play this year it was his last as a Colt - 4-3 yes in the 3-4 absolutely not in the run game he has always looked outta place IMO -

 

Dwight Freeney & Robert Mathis have been great but how much credit do the coachs deserve ??- The Eraser Bob Sanders did really good when healthy , But these bright spots have been few & far in between . The Defensive Coaching has let the team down year after year . Including 2012 .

 

Jerry Hughes a bust no, work in progress Yes  

 

Now with a healthy Chuck Pagano maybe DC Manusky can coach up some players so they may realize there potential if not for the coachs illness this years defense I gotta believe would have been much better . I'm more inclined to giving these new coachs another year to fix the defense & players like Hughes .

 

I do like the idea of going after Krueger & Barwin .

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I reviewed a youtube highlight clip of him at TCU. He was a hand on the ground guy but it appears to me that TCU ran a 3-4 and Hughes was like a 5 tech in that system. That being said I would still like to see better production from him at this level.

Hi Buddy..... TCU Guy right here. :sigh: I see you and a few others seem to have a misunderstanding of what TCU ran when Hughes was there.

TCU DID NOT run a 3-4 or a 4-3. TCU ran a 4-2-5

That's 4 Defensive Lineman

2 Linebackers

5 Defensive Backs

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I expected Freeney to not come back but I did not expect Hughes to take the position full-time. I know he had some bright spots last year but I don't think he's good enough. I hope we can find someone to fill that spot but if Chuck believes he can take over full-time then I trust his judgement more than mines.

Wasn't Hughes a stand up DE at TCU?

No, Hughes was a Hand in dirt DE at TCU.

Some plays they stood him up, but that was just a confusion thing cause we all knew he was still rushing the QB.

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Hi Buddy..... TCU Guy right here. :sigh: I see you and a few others seem to have a misunderstanding of what TCU ran when Hughes was there.

TCU DID NOT run a 3-4 or a 4-3. TCU ran a 4-2-5

That's 4 Defensive Lineman

2 Linebackers

5 Defensive Backs

Like I said. It was just a highlight reel from youtube. What I saw was 3 d linemen with their hand on the ground and typically 2 guys outside of them near the line of scrimmage. Hughes was mostly hand on the ground outside shade to the OT

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Jerry Hughes 41 tackles 4 sacks

Lawrence Guy 18 tackles 1 sack

Dwig Freeney 12 tackles 5 sacks

Hughes>Guy>Freeney

Hughes couldn't carry Freeney's shorts man. Freeney has every pass rush move in the book. I have yet to see Hughes do anything other than a speed move and bull rush. Yes, Freeney doesn't play the run. he doesnt defend the pass. But as a pure pass rusher Freeney is WAY more talented than Hughes in my opinion. Freeney has over 100 career sacks. Hughes is just a different player than Freeney. Freeney is a true speed rush DE in a 4-3. Hughes up to this point in his career hasn't had the number of snaps that Freeney has nor should he. My opinion is still that he is an average player to this point. Hope he proves me wrong.

 

Freeney, in my opinion, when he came into the league he had the fastest burst off the ball that I had ever seen anyone in football have. Probably the best spin move of any pass rusher in history.

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In my mind I blame Bill Polian for starters .  The man did very good for our Colts but in my mind he dropped the ball on defense .

 

This has been a pet peeve of mine Defense wins games  , Tom Moore &  Peyton Manning  were in place , Bringing in Tony Dungy was supposed to cure our defense with the tampa 2 , what a joke that was  .

 

Our 06 defense 32'nd in the regular season then turned it on in the playoffs , It was an amazing turnaround & IMHO the defense were the MVP of the SB .

 

To this very day I have not heard 1 reasonable answer for that turn of events , But of course theres my opinion - IMO  the coachs failed all year & the players themselves dug deep & started believing that they could get-R-done , They heard there critics & were embarassed  , I'v never heard any stories to the contrary & I would love 2 know what others thought of our SB run .

 

My point being it was clear watching Dwight Freeney play this year it was his last as a Colt - 4-3 yes in the 3-4 absolutely not in the run game he has always looked outta place IMO -

 

Dwight Freeney & Robert Mathis have been great but how much credit do the coachs deserve ??- The Eraser Bob Sanders did really good when healthy , But these bright spots have been few & far in between . The Defensive Coaching has let the team down year after year . Including 2012 .

 

Jerry Hughes a bust no, work in progress Yes  

 

Now with a healthy Chuck Pagano maybe DC Manusky can coach up some players so they may realize there potential if not for the coachs illness this years defense I gotta believe would have been much better . I'm more inclined to giving these new coachs another year to fix the defense & players like Hughes .

 

I do like the idea of going after Krueger & Barwin .

Here's my take on the failures of the defense and personnel over the years. I've said it over and over. Bill Polian could not draft Defensive Tackles and he struggled drafting Corners. Name 1 defesnive Tackle that Bill Polian drafted while he was here that you can say was a true difference maker? How about a corner? I'm not bashing Bill Polian. I think he did a great job in certain areas but everyone has a weakness and I think Bill didn't know how to evaluate those two positions.

 

Also, Kruger looks like to me he is really turning into a true difference maker. Maybe its just a flash in the pan. Or, maybe he's just reaching his potential and his next 5 years will be ultra productive?? I don't know but I do know that watching him late in this season he created all kinds of havoc time and time again. I havent seen that sort of play from Hughes.

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With the SB run, our defense was banged up.  I think that was the year Corey Simon and Booger was hurt.  In the playoffs we got Booger back but most importantly we got Bob Sanders back who basically played like a LB most times.  That is why our defense turned it around.

 

Similar to the Ravens this year.  The defense was not performing as well but in the playoffs it is a different story because they became healthy at the right time.

 

Dungy was trying to do something but I don't know how much BP was letting him.  BP seems like a very controlling guy to me and I don't think he was willing to let Dungy spend the money to build the type of defense he built in TB.  That's just my personal opinion.  To me, BP seemed like a guy who was going to give everything Peyton wanted first, and thought about everything else 2nd, and it showed.

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Y'know, I think Freeney probably is gone.  However, I disagree that he was such a bad fit with the system.  The system had him playing the Suggs pass-rushing role, and very seldomly in coverage.  The problem with his production was that he was playing hurt most of the year.  He looked pretty good towards the end of the year when he finally got a little healthier.  That being said, he seems to prefer being in a 4-3, and at his age he's probably not worth a big contract at the new position.  I'm still holding out a little hope that he'll pull the Reggie Wayne and come back, but I fully expect him to move on to situational PR duty in a 4-3, where he's more comfortable.  I'd kind of like to see Alex Okafor get drafted to take his OLB spot... This is 100% correct!!
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Jerry Hughes 41 tackles 4 sacks

Lawrence Guy 18 tackles 1 sack

Dwig Freeney 12 tackles 5 sacks

Hughes>Guy>Freeney

Oh no that Hughes guys a bust. Lol, people need to get a clue. For the record no he is not a bust, but I will say he shouldn't have been drafted where he was by the lune polian. But we just sat back and said in polian we trust as he drafted like a 5th grader year after year.

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