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Winston Justice is a good RT


The Peytonator

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People are always complaining about Justice getting beat all the time, but it's honestly not true. Our interior line sucks, but Castonzo and especially Justice are both very good OTs.

I didn't know he was this efficient though....

https://www.profootb...ensive-tackles/

I have seen some breakdowns for sure, but if we have Castonzo, a healthy Reitz, "Shipley" or a HEALTHY Satele, McGlynn (Link has played better next to Shipley at guard than tackle) and Justice....and some continuity without injury we can succeed. :thmup:

We have all been very critical of our OL, but look at the league as a whole. We would be hard pressed to say that with all of the injuries this year.....there are not mor than 5 superior OLs. Even the good ones are getting spanked week in and week out....it is a league-wide OL mess....and holding could still be called on every play. OK....done with my :lecture: on the OL quality! Time to get ready for some :nfl: :coltsfb: football.......and get to .500! :td: Reggie Wayne.....I can hear it now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :blueshoe: :blueshoe: :blueshoe:

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I have seen some breakdowns for sure, but if we have Castonzo, a healthy Reitz, "Shipley" or a HEALTHY Satele, McGlynn (Link has played better next to Shipley at guard than tackle) and Justice....and some continuity without injury we can succeed. :thmup:

We have all been very critical of our OL, but look at the league as a whole. We would be hard pressed to say that with all of the injuries this year.....there are not mor than 5 superior OLs. Even the good ones are getting spanked week in and week out....it is a league-wide OL mess....and holding could still be called on every play. OK....done with my :lecture: on the OL quality! Time to get ready for some :nfl: :coltsfb: football.......and get to .500! :td: Reggie Wayne.....I can hear it now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :blueshoe: :blueshoe: :blueshoe:

agreed. get the top five healthy and able to practice together and watch what happens. plenty of talent there that needs time to work TOGETHER.

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Who were those ppl calling justice a bad tackle again? From the time this guy came into the Draft I wanted the Colts to get him... He gets shown up sometimes but the guy is a very good tackle

Your post is dead on the money! I see you got a change of the avatar there

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I'll admit, I was ready to give up on Justice after the Packers game. He got Luck hit (i'm guessing that play wasn't brought into the equation of the site's research that the OP linked because the Packers were penalized for roughing the passer), had numerous false starts and allowed pressures as well. I still don't think those numbers sound completely accurate but I was impressed with Justice in the Jets game. He held his own against Pace quite a few times without any help at all.

I'll give props where they are due, and hope he'll continue to build off the last game

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He didnt give up any pressures against the Jets. 2 pressures all year. his run blocking needs some work. but his pass blocking is pretty noticable on the field. most of the pressure comes right up the middle or the left side. People just love to get on Justice as a scapegoat because of what he has done in Philly and how we didnt have to give up anything to acquire him this offseason but the real pressures comes from Satele, Olsen, LinkenBach and Castonzo

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justice always had the physical tools to be an elite rt but it was more mental with him. it does help having a mobile qb like luck who already has more pocket awareness as a rookie then vick has as a 10 year veteran.

another problem in philly might have been he was protecting vick's blindside since vick is a lefty and has the pocket presence of ray charles.

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I'll admit, I was ready to give up on Justice after the Packers game. He got Luck hit (i'm guessing that play wasn't brought into the equation of the site's research that the OP linked because the Packers were penalized for roughing the passer), had numerous false starts and allowed pressures as well. I still don't think those numbers sound completely accurate but I was impressed with Justice in the Jets game. He held his own against Pace quite a few times without any help at all.

I'll give props where they are due, and hope he'll continue to build off the last game

and the reason they didn't take perry's hit into account was it was fleener's fault. he's been more than solid thus far...in pass protection anyway.

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People are always complaining about Justice getting beat all the time, but it's honestly not true. Our interior line sucks, but Castonzo and especially Justice are both very good OTs.

I didn't know he was this efficient though....

https://www.profootb...ensive-tackles/

Wow... interesting to see Gabe Carimi near the bottom of that list. That was one guy I was hoping we could get in the draft.

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He didnt give up any pressures against the Jets. 2 pressures all year. his run blocking needs some work. but his pass blocking is pretty noticable on the field. most of the pressure comes right up the middle or the left side. People just love to get on Justice as a scapegoat because of what he has done in Philly and how we didnt have to give up anything to acquire him this offseason but the real pressures comes from Satele, Olsen, LinkenBach and Castonzo

Exactly which goes back to something I have felt about us as fans for a long time. A lot of people made up their minds about justice before he ever stepped on a football field for the Colts and no amount of stats or proof is going to change their minds about him. He is one of those players that fans for the most part have decided they don't like so they ignore the good he does and over hype his mistakes. I don't think justice is a great tackle but he has been an upgrade over link and when factor in what we gave up to get him (something like 15 spots in the draft) its hard to say it wasn't a good move. The problem is the middle of the line. That's where our focus needs to be this offseason.
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and the reason they didn't take perry's hit into account was it was fleener's fault. he's been more than solid thus far...in pass protection anyway.

How was that Fleener's fault? If you're saying the play was designed for Fleener to take on the edge rusher one-on-one while Justice blocks the inside blitzer (who was a DB), Bruce Arians needs to be fired for such a stupid blocking concept. Fleener got his hands on both players, actually, while Justice blocked no one. Hard to see how you can blame that on Fleener without knowing exactly what the blocking assigments were. If you go back and look two plays before that one, even, Justice almost got Luck nailed there, too. He and Donald Brown went after the same inside blitzer, leaving Perry with a free path to Luck. Luck got rid of the ball in time but that was a pressure allowed by Justice. The extra blocker is never supposed to be matched up one-on-one with the primary pass rusher. That tells me Justice probably made the mental errors, not anyone else.

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How was that Fleener's fault? If you're saying the play was designed for Fleener to take on the edge rusher one-on-one while Justice blocks the inside blitzer (who was a DB), Bruce Arians needs to be fired for such a stupid blocking concept. Fleener got his hands on both players, actually, while Justice blocked no one. Hard to see how you can blame that on Fleener without knowing exactly what the blocking assigments were. If you go back and look two plays before that one, even, Justice almost got Luck nailed there, too. He and Donald Brown went after the same inside blitzer, leaving Perry with a free path to Luck. Luck got rid of the ball in time but that was a pressure allowed by Justice. The extra blocker is never supposed to be matched up one-on-one with the primary pass rusher. That tells me Justice probably made the mental errors, not anyone else.

Why does it make sense to you that a pass rusher who is located on the outside of the tight end, a pass rusher who is taking an outside rush should be blocked by a Tackle who is located on the inside of the tight end?

Wouldn't it make more sense for the Tight End to block the man he is sitting right next to? It makes total sense for Justice to have blocked a rusher who came to the spot he was already postioned at. Not someone who was not even in his vicinity.

Fleener blocked correctly the outside pass rusher, and then he went inside and blocked the man Justice was supposed to block. Just based on angles, Justice would not have had a way to pick up the man Fleener let go of.

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Allow me another perspective....

Justice has missed a game and a half.... he's got roughly 75 fewer pass play snaps than Castanzo.

Second, offensive line play is not defined by only by pass blocking. There is run blocking. And it's got to say something that we just don't run to the right very much.

So, while it's nice to see Justice's name at the top.... it's not a complete picture.

Let's revisit this at the end of the season, shall we?

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How was that Fleener's fault? If you're saying the play was designed for Fleener to take on the edge rusher one-on-one while Justice blocks the inside blitzer (who was a DB), Bruce Arians needs to be fired for such a stupid blocking concept. Fleener got his hands on both players, actually, while Justice blocked no one. Hard to see how you can blame that on Fleener without knowing exactly what the blocking assigments were. If you go back and look two plays before that one, even, Justice almost got Luck nailed there, too. He and Donald Brown went after the same inside blitzer, leaving Perry with a free path to Luck. Luck got rid of the ball in time but that was a pressure allowed by Justice. The extra blocker is never supposed to be matched up one-on-one with the primary pass rusher. That tells me Justice probably made the mental errors, not anyone else.

because an ex nfl lineman said it was clearly fleener's fault

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How was that Fleener's fault? If you're saying the play was designed for Fleener to take on the edge rusher one-on-one while Justice blocks the inside blitzer (who was a DB), Bruce Arians needs to be fired for such a stupid blocking concept. Fleener got his hands on both players, actually, while Justice blocked no one. Hard to see how you can blame that on Fleener without knowing exactly what the blocking assigments were. If you go back and look two plays before that one, even, Justice almost got Luck nailed there, too. He and Donald Brown went after the same inside blitzer, leaving Perry with a free path to Luck. Luck got rid of the ball in time but that was a pressure allowed by Justice. The extra blocker is never supposed to be matched up one-on-one with the primary pass rusher. That tells me Justice probably made the mental errors, not anyone else.

they ran a stunt, Fleener's initial man was the DB. but they ran the stunt that sent the DE to the outside and looped the DB inside. Suppose to be a sight adjustment when you see the stunt unfold and flip assignments which would leave Justice on the DB and fleener on Perry but Fleener doesn't adjust and still runs inside of Justice to try and block the DB that Justice seen the stunt and was in position to block the DB but when Fleener runs in front of Justice and leaves Perry its too late for Justice to try and recover for Fleener's mental mistake resulting in Luck picking up his mouthpiece off the turf

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Why does it make sense to you that a pass rusher who is located on the outside of the tight end, a pass rusher who is taking an outside rush should be blocked by a Tackle who is located on the inside of the tight end?

Wouldn't it make more sense for the Tight End to block the man he is sitting right next to?

Because you don't leave a receiving tight end one-on-one with one of the opposing team's top pass rushers, that's why. By the looks of it, Fleener was suppose to shade Perry wide to the outside to give Justice time to get in position. Justice was supposed to work inside-out. Fleener outside-in. Like I said, Fleener got his hands on both pass rushers while Justice looked lost.

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because an ex nfl lineman said it was clearly fleener's fault

And? Did this ex-linemen talk to Justice, Fleener and the coaches to come to that determination? I don't see how you're trying to completely exonerate Justice from any blame on that play. He literally blocked NO ONE and watched his QB get killed. It's conceivable that the line was outschemed by Greenbay, but the fact still remains that Justice didn't block anyone. He shares at least some of the blame in that play

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And? Did this ex-linemen talk to Justice, Fleener and the coaches to come to that determination? I don't see how you're trying to completely exonerate Justice from any blame on that play. He literally blocked NO ONE and watched his QB get killed. It's conceivable that the line was outschemed by Greenbay, but the fact still remains that Justice didn't block anyone. He shares at least some of the blame in that play

He didnt block anyone because Fleener got confused and tried to be superman and block two people by himself

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Because you don't leave a receiving tight end one-on-one with one of the opposing team's top pass rushers, that's why. By the looks of it, Fleener was suppose to shade Perry wide to the outside to give Justice time to get in position. Justice was supposed to work inside-out. Fleener outside-in. Like I said, Fleener got his hands on both pass rushers while Justice looked lost.

You are trying to call Nick Perry one of Green Bays top pass rushers? Are you sure about that?

Is it unusual to see a Tight End block a linebacker?

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compared to his teammate Anthony Castonzo who has given up 19 quarterback disruptions on his 247 pass blocks. Quite the discrepancy. Castonzo is far from the bottom, so this more an indication of how rock solid Justice has been and how important it is the Colts keep him healthy

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i have been surprised with Justice on pass play he has been beated more than those stat says i thrust my eyes but still he is doing a fine job. i have been pleasently surprised with him on pass protection however i was expecting him to be a mauler and he doesnt push anyone on the running game...in fact las week most of our runs were to the left.

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