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(Replacement Refs) Roger Goodell Can You Hear The NFL Players And Fans Now? (merge)


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Okay if the players and coaches are so upset about the refs how about they open up their pocket books and volunteer to take some money out of their pockets to pay the refs to have them back. That's what this debate is coming down too money. SO if they all think the game is in danger of becoming a joke and stuff like that then I say do something about it and tell Goodell you'll pay to cover the different in the dispute. I have a feeling if it comes down to hitting them in the pocket book they will be just fine with the replacement refs. If they think these guys stink they say that but I don't want to hear them talk about the integrity of the game because most of them don't care about they are seeing a chance to take a shot at a commissioner they don't like and doing it.

Like I said in an earlier post or directly quoted rather: "Here's a suggestion: fine Belichick $3 million and use the money to bridge the gap between the locked-out refs and the league. It's not even that the new guys are doing that bad a job, it's just that another week of hearing about the job they're doing is going to take the fun out of watching football."

Translation: Have each coach donate a small portion of their salaries to close the fiscal gaps between owners and refs. Call it the Save the Regular Zebras Charity for all I care. Just get the experienced referees back NOW!!!

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Like I said in an earlier post or directly quoted rather: "Here's a suggestion: fine Belichick $3 million and use the money to bridge the gap between the locked-out refs and the league. It's not even that the new guys are doing that bad a job, it's just that another week of hearing about the job they're doing is going to take the fun out of watching football."

Translation: Have each coach donate a small portion of their salaries to close the fiscal gaps between owners and refs. Call it the Save the Regular Zebras Charity for all I care. Just get the experienced referees back NOW!!!

Yeah I made the same joke last night about the Belichick fine. I wasn't so much going off what you said just what you said got me thinking about all the players I've heard talking about the integrity of the game lately and I just think it's horse hockey on their part. If they really meant it step up to the plate and be willing to take a pay cut to get the refs back. I really think it comes down to the players don't like Goodell and saw a chance to make him look bad and took it on that front. If they cared about things like the integrity of the game they would want the Saints players involved with bounty gate out of the league for life if the proof comes out that Goodell is right. It doesn't mean that they shouldn't want the regular refs back but if they do then step up to the plate and do something to help get them back.
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When players and coaches speak of the integrity of the game, what that really means is...These rookie zebras and their likelihood of missing calls or seeing calls that no one else sees are essentially going to get coaches and their staffs fired as a result of inexperience, incompetence, and a failure to grasp the speed and little nuances of this great game that will lead to missed Playoff opportunities.

And another thing, why should filthy rich owners expect coaches to take less money in take home pay to secure the services of a regular zebra crew anyway? I suppose you could make the argument that the idea is similar to when Saints HC Sean Payton brought in Gregg Williams to help New Orleans win a SB, but coaches don't hire refs the league does so asking coaches to hand over a percentage of their salary to pay for zebras isn't fair when you consider that coaches have no authority over them like a DB Coach, or Special Teams Coach either.

This is the owners problem not the 32 NFL coaches problem.

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When players and coaches speak of the integrity of the game, what that really means is...These rookie zebras and their likelihood of missing calls or seeing calls that no one else sees are essentially going to get coaches and their staffs fired as a result of inexperience, incompetence, and a failure to grasp the speed and little nuances of this great game that will lead to missed Playoff opportunities.

And another thing, why should filthy rich owners expect coaches to take less money in take home pay to secure the services of a regular zebra crew anyway? I suppose you could make the argument that the idea is similar to when Saints HC Sean Payton brought in Gregg Williams to help New Orleans win a SB, but coaches don't hire refs the league does so asking coaches to hand over a percentage of their salary to pay for zebras isn't fair when you consider that coaches have no authority over them like a DB Coach, or Special Teams Coach either.

This is the owners problem not the 32 NFL coaches problem.

Then don't complain about them like they didn't complain about the regular refs when they screwed up. What would they do then? Say things like you have to play threw it or it's a part of the game, or it is what it is and point out something else they didn't do well they could have done better that would have changed the out come of the game. If they are so upset about the refs not being there then step up to the plate and do something to help get them back. If they aren't willing to do that then I don't have much compassion for them when they complain about them.
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Then don't complain about them like they didn't complain about the regular refs when they screwed up. What would they do then? Say things like you have to play threw it or it's a part of the game, or it is what it is and point out something else they didn't do well they could have done better that would have changed the out come of the game. If they are so upset about the refs not being there then step up to the plate and do something to help get them back. If they aren't willing to do that then I don't have much compassion for them when they complain about them.

No one is saying that the regular refs don't make mistakes, people are saying that these replacement refs make too many. Mistakes are the one thing they are consistent at. The regular refs new so much more about the game and the players didn't get away with so much. They were also never intimidated.
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No one is saying that the regular refs don't make mistakes, people are saying that these replacement refs make too many. Mistakes are the one thing they are consistent at. The regular refs new so much more about the game and the players didn't get away with so much. They were also never intimidated.

Which is where I think the league has messed up they didn't nip the intimidation thing in the bud and let it go on too long. I think they need too and will start to crack down on it and as they do I think you will these guys be less intimidated because they will know the league has their back.
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Which is where I think the league has messed up they didn't nip the intimidation thing in the bud and let it go on too long. I think they need too and will start to crack down on it and as they do I think you will these guys be less intimidated because they will know the league has their back.

They are also scared of the home crowd. These refs are just bad man.
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Then don't complain about them like they didn't complain about the regular refs when they screwed up. What would they do then? Say things like you have to play threw it or it's a part of the game, or it is what it is and point out something else they didn't do well they could have done better that would have changed the out come of the game. If they are so upset about the refs not being there then step up to the plate and do something to help get them back. If they aren't willing to do that then I don't have much compassion for them when they complain about them.

I can appreciate your point GoColts8818, but really it is a question of jurisdictional domain and control. If you are hired by a major corporation or university for example and eventually get fired, aside from an attorney for an unlawful termination suit, you as an individual deal with the Dept. of Human Resources for redressing any grievances not your former boss directly. My point is: There is always a chain of command and bureaucracy to follow no matter what. It's not the coaches job to save the NFL's bacon. When your opponent is rolling down the hill and the snowball is growing larger and larger, you don't try to stop it. You let your opposition trip, stumble, and put it's foot in it's own mouth.

Do you think the owners bent over backward to ease the Collective Bargaining Agreement too? Yes, Robert Kraft, Jeff Saturday, and the Rooney family worked out a compromise to hammer out a 10 year deal for NFL solidarity that's true, but coaches can't influence league matters and owners can't tell the players what to do. That's why there are 2 unions: The Players Union and the NFL owners union.

At some point, 1 side will blink. I hope public outcry over poor officiating makes the owners blink first myself. Time will tell I guess. Bad game results should speed this process along quickly I hope.

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I can appreciate your point GoColts8818, but really it is a question of jurisdictional domain and control. If you are hired by a major corporation or university for example and eventually get fired, aside from an attorney for an unlawful termination suit, you as an individual deal with the Dept. of Human Resources for redressing any grievances not your former boss directly. My point is: There is always a chain of command and bureaucracy to follow no matter what. It's not the coaches job to save the NFL's bacon. When your opponent is rolling down the hill and the snowball is growing larger and larger, you don't try to stop it. You let your opposition trip, stumble, and put it's foot in it's own mouth.

Do you think the owners bent over backward to ease the Collective Bargaining Agreement too? Yes, Robert Kraft, Jeff Saturday, and the Rooney family worked out a compromise to hammer out a 10 year deal for NFL solidarity that's true, but coaches can't influence league matters and owners can't tell the players what to do. That's why there are 2 unions: The Players Union and the NFL owners union.

At some point, 1 side will blink. I hope public outcry over poor officiating makes the owners blink first myself. Time will tell I guess. Bad game results should speed this process along quickly I hope.

I don't really expect the players and coaches and pay to get them back. The point I am getting at is that I really don't think the players more so than the coaches care nearly as much as they are pretending too about the refs. My guess would be if Goodell came to them and said look we will end this thing but we need you guys to pay just a small percentage of your pay check so we can get the regular refs back the players would be all of the sudden be just fine with the replacement refs. They are seeing a chance to make a guy they don't like in Goodell look bad and are taking every chance to do it and I think that is what is driving a lot of them more than being upset about the regular officials not being there. I heard Jim Grey tonight on the radio broadcast talk about this and he brought up a good point if the players are truly concerned about player safety like they say they are because of the officials they should go on strike and refuse to play because it's not safe. He then got to what I was saying if it came down to them losing money out of their pocket he doesn't think the players would have near the problem they are saying they are having with the officials.
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Okay, we have all seen it, the Monday night ESPN game that robbed the GB Packers of a game winning interception and handed the SeaHawks a victory in the Pacific Northwest by zebra incompetence. How can 2 officials standing next to each other in the endzone get the call so wrong...1 says touchdown and the other says no catch?

HOF 49ers QB Steve Young said it best tonight. The NFL's revered reputation as an international sport is unraveling at it's seams and is becoming a joke when it comes to integrity.

http://espn.go.com/v...clip?id=8422593

Packers-Seahawks: Green Bay becomes first team 'officially' robbed by replacement refs

Article & Video, and when they even replay the video even before the catch attempt

1st

Golden tate clearly pushes away DB Bush to ground so Tate can even try & go up for it Thats offensive interferance as well

2nd

& Packers Jennings appears to get ball first and then brings ball secure against his chest, if anything tate appears helping him hold it there as he tries to wrestle it away

3rd

1 ref says catch, 1 says no but they give it as TD

Dont just watch initial catch but slow mo replay & seems clear , Video is short

http://aol.sportingn...y-replacement-r

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Packers-Seahawks: Green Bay becomes first team 'officially' robbed by replacement refs

Article & Video, and when they even replay the video even before the catch attempt

1st

Golden tate clearly pushes away DB Bush to ground so Tate can even try & go up for it Thats offensive interferance as well

2nd

& Packers Jennings appears to get ball first and then brings ball secure against his chest, if anything tate appears helping him hold it there as he tries to wrestle it away

3rd

1 ref says catch, 1 says no but they give it as TD

Dont just watch initial catch but slow mo replay & seems clear , Video is short

http://aol.sportingn...y-replacement-r

another Video and great explanation of simultaneous catch rule and why it wasnt one, also agree on push off by tate & why werent there any officials in end zone, they had to come in after to make the call

Finally why did upstairs review get it wrong

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000065986/article/golden-tate-denies-pushoff-on-seattle-seahawks-td

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Heard on the radio this morning that Kraft had told the other owners he PAY for the pension plans himself to get the refs back and was refused. It was on the radio and I had my kids in the car and I didnt ctach it all or even if it was said in jest by the station.. (My kids are loud little buggers lol)

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Packers-Seahawks: Green Bay becomes first team 'officially' robbed by replacement refs

Article & Video, and when they even replay the video even before the catch attempt

1st

Golden tate clearly pushes away DB Bush to ground so Tate can even try & go up for it Thats offensive interferance as well

2nd

& Packers Jennings appears to get ball first and then brings ball secure against his chest, if anything tate appears helping him hold it there as he tries to wrestle it away

3rd

1 ref says catch, 1 says no but they give it as TD

Dont just watch initial catch but slow mo replay & seems clear , Video is short

http://aol.sportingn...y-replacement-r

While number one is true the regular refs never called that when it happens. In fact Jerry Austin was on ESPN right after words and as a former ref said that was ignored by the refs they just would wait to see who got it. Clearly two and three are valid points but number one is piling on a bit IMO because it doesn't matter which group is out there they werent going to call the push off in that situaton.
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Skip and Stephen A. Smith from ESPN's "First Take" debate the FG goal kick in Sunday night's NBC game between the Ravens and the Patriots. Put a camera straight down on both field goal posts for verification purposes. I really like that idea. Personally, I still say the FG goal was wide right and the game should have gone into OT.

Once again, these replacement refs made a HUGE mistake IMO. Check out this radio podcast in the very first segment. A very good discussion here. :thmup:

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/play?id=8420185

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Okay enough already NFL Commissioner, if you repeatedly talk about protecting the shield, preserving the integrity of the game, and player safety from serious concussions and bodily harm; isn't it time to hammer out a deal with the regular zebras and why not make them a full time position while your at it too? NFL owners and players can legally negotiate for a pension program and a reasonable salary for their talents and expertise, but referees can't really? I thought the NFL was almost a 10 billion dollar industry annually enjoying a record height in publicity. Are you trying to plead that your lucrative business is broke and teetering on bankruptcy too? Nice try...Care to issue a retraction or clarification on that "player safety" motto Mr. Goodell?

The players are getting fed up with poor referee calls, no calls, and a stunning silence on the issue of player safety too. Just ask Baltimore Ravens LB Ray Lewis...

The NFL has issued it's own statement on the progress of the substitute referees, but no one else is satisfied with what they are actually witnessing themselves, especially the fans.

http://profootballta...ming-admirably/

Hall Of Fame 49ers QB Steve Young offered his opinion on the zebra situation too. Goodell on safety seems to be a modern day Marie Antoinette in Steve's eyes as well.

http://www.huffingto...m_hp_ref=sports

End this absurd charade now please Mr. Commissioner and please bring back the familiar zebras that we all know can call a much more accurate game safely and in a timely fashion--3 hours not 4 hours and an eternity.

Feel free to leave your thoughts accordingly. Thank you.

Godell isnt the owners...Its a labor dispute....he cant make the ref's union accept the owners offer

these refs are worse than the real ones but not by much

But that has NOTHING to do with the labor dispute....and it wont have anything to do with it...

Pretty much that simple..

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Andrew Brandt and Herm Edwards talk about replacement refs and the specifics of zebra pension plans and blown calls. Is there any middle ground here to get a deal done?

http://espn.go.com/n...ak-stalemate-nf

Not much..the refs and owners dont care about you...right now

They are talking milllions and millions of dollars for many years going forward...in pension obligations...They could not care less about

you and I whining one season about bad calls...

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Godell isnt the owners...Its a labor dispute....he cant make the ref's union accept the owners offer

these refs are worse than the real ones but not by much

But that has NOTHING to do with the labor dispute....and it wont have anything to do with it...

Pretty much that simple..

Roger Goodell works for the NFL owners. He does their bidding, their "dirty work." I completely disagree with everything you just said. This is a safety issue, which falls directly under Goodell's CBA authority and control in my view. As far as public relations are concerned, the reputation of the NFL is also in jeopardy as a result of poor officiating and the mass potential for bets and gambling glitches, which directly leads to corruption and a permanent dark cloud over this professional sport.

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Roger Goodell works for the NFL owners. He does their bidding, their "dirty work." I completely disagree with everything you just said. This is a safety issue, which falls directly under Goodell's CBA authority and control in my view. As far as public relations are concerned, the reputation of the NFL is also in jeopardy as a result of poor officiating and the mass potential for bets and gambling glitches, which directly leads to corruption and a permanent dark cloud over this professional sport.

You dont understand the situation...He works for the owners but he doesnt have the oweners money..

the owners have the owners money..The refs want that money. Its a labor dispute..just like steelworkers and teachers

try sitting down and taking you bosses money and giving it to his employees....and see how long you're employed.

Only people who are not thinking feel Roger Godell can stop the strike/walkout..

It does not mattre how many bad cals there are this year...

We'r e talking milions of dollars for many years to come. Neither sidecares about you or me.

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Salon reports that giving in to the referee's demands would cost the NFL $4,000 per game.

The fact that they keep humiliating themselves for so little money is really proof that this is more about ideology to them than anything else. That's why I don't think the owners will cave so easily.

Its not game pay, BAB, its pensions for life after your retire....

its an issue in union/management talks all over the country .

Its an issue bigger than the NFL....How much can you guarantee a retired working man for the rest of his life???

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Its not game pay, BAB, its pensions for life after your retire....

its an issue in union/management talks all over the country .

Its an issue bigger than the NFL....How much can you guarantee a retired working man for the rest of his life???

Yes, it is an issue of labor vs management.

I am not sure what this article factored in calculating $4,000 per game figure, but it's not like the referees are demanding to get pension now. They want to keep their pension.

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THE BIGGEST ISSUE with replacement refs so far is that they cannot distinguish between defensive holding and pass interference. EVERY penalty that is a defensive penalty on the defensive back seems to be a pass interference. That is a huge field position changer. 5 yard penalty vs 20 or 30 plus yard penalty.

So, all someone has to do is throw it up for grabs when it is 3rd and long and if there is any contact, chances are it is called on the defense, and it is ALWAYS PASS INTERFERENCE.

To me, that has been the singular biggest issue that is having an impact on games more often than not. Other penalties like holding penalties, you can overcome those a lot of times because you lose 10 yards at worst. With the PI calls, the sky is the limit.

The regular refs do not call holding if a play is on the other side of the ball since in all likelihood, it does not affect the play, and a lot of times, I agree with that.

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personally i am tired of the drama queens blowing this way out of proportion

What's blown out of proportion? The fact the refs have cost the game? The fact that people are ripping the NFL a new one for a joke of a statement defending what happened last night or the fact that most who are tired of this probably aren't looking at the situation as a whole and only from the "People are just whining" view?

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You dont understand the situation...He works for the owners but he doesnt have the owners money..

True the owners have the money and control the purse strings, but Roger Goodell is their #1 storm trooper/enforcer don't kid yourself.

the owners have the owners money..The refs want that money. Its a labor dispute..just like steelworkers and teachers

The referees don't want all the money and the NFL is enjoying record profits and broadcasting viewership. The NFL shield isn't broke okay. Sure, pension plans are part of the dispute and the zebras are demanding the moon right now, but that's how negotiations work. High ball your number initially and gradually work your way down to a reasonable deal where concessions are given on both sides.

try sitting down and taking you bosses money and giving it to his employees....and see how long you're employed.

It's about how the fans respond to the product on the field and whether they value experience and professional or not. Players, coaches, and zebras really have no say in this at all. The ball is in the fan's court now pure and simple. The fans have all the leverage here not the owners.

Only people who are not thinking feel Roger Godell can stop the strike/walkout..

I never said Goodell can stop these bad calls. Only the fans can do that with their money and what they choose not to buy. As far as Goodell is concerned, I merely pointed out the hypocrisy of his integrity vs safety position. A complete sham and farce IMO.

It does not matter how many bad cals there are this year...

Are you kidding me? Yes, it does who wins and loses now can decide Playoffs spots and Wildcard spots in November, which leads to staff and coach firing down the line. Can you imagine if a blown call leads to a Playoffs berth, a hot streak, and a SB victory? Far fetched I will admit, but not impossible either. NFL egg on their face? Hmmm....

We'r e talking milions of dollars for many years to come. Neither sidecares about you or me.

If a substandard product is put on the field, ticket sales go down, and people decide to not watch the NFL anymore in droves as a result of poor penalty calling on average, you had better believe the million owners will feel their wallets and bank accounts lighten. Even the rich notice when the accustomed revenue stops coming in like clockwork.

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even without the blown interception call, that Jennings did indeed catch for a touch back..the whole game last night was ridiculous. In the first qtr alone it was a flag on every play and it was tedious. I'm sure the NFL loves all the extra commercials they are getting in!!!!!!

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This portion of Craig Ferguson's CBS "Late Late Show" monologue with a comedy skit about a replacement referee make me laugh. haha

Craig is from the country of Scotland originally just in case you were wondering. The land of Soccer and Rugby etc.

http://youtu.be/Qa9XH54OHL4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TA2zEJNxm90&feature=share&list=ULTA2zEJNxm90

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The zebra lockout is officially over. The regular referees have now returned and this thread can be closed for good... :disco: :dancing: :headspin: YES!!!

This is the best quote I heard regarding an end to the stalemate stripes labor/safety dispute.

"The Green Bay Packers vs Seattle SeHawks game was the final FLAW that broke the replacement referee camel's back."

GreenBay-Seattle1.jpg

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Yes, I know the NFL referee lockout is officially over thank God, but I just saw this on Comedy Central's Stephen Colbert Show and it made me laugh. haha Enjoy everyone and be glad the madness is now over.

http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-collections/418868/time-for-pigskin/

http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-videos/419436/september-25-2012/sport-report---nfl-referee-lockout---replacement-refs---ratings

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