dgambill

Because if one of our qbs doesn’t work out we can just move him to wr. He is faster then most of them anyways. Not sure what that says about our wr group.

Lots of good convo…I would really like to know how the Colts thinks this will benefit the team by keeping JT unless they think they can change his mind about staying. I get the postering and saying you will keep him unless you get proper compensation but now what is the plan. You really want an unhappy player around this young team and in the locker room. Work out a contract or trade him. Keeping him this year seems like both sides lose. Not sure how either side can claim they won.

Again I don’t see how you prove that…and if they have proof and they are hiding it then the Colts are as bad as he is because they knowingly misused the PUP. Could lose draft picks and get fined. If they have such proof it’s a double edged sword. The other teams in the league aren’t going to stand for a team to gain advantage by misusing the PUP. The Colts benefit by letting a guy holdout on the PUP and fill his position instead of making him active and losing a spot. I don’t see how that would be allowed If the Colts try to keep a healthy player on the PUP after they have passed the required time they themselves would be violating league rules. The league would take action on behalf of the the other teams. I’m not sure about Arbitration in courts although I would bet he could do that just like MLB players arbitrate for active years but he could go to the league basically and plead his case and like I said the Colts wouldn’t take the chance of getting in trouble with league office.

They can’t leave him on the PUP if he is healthy. That would go to arbitration and Taylor would win. You can’t just keep a guy on PUP to keep him from earning a tenured year.

Well…better than playing 17 under the bad contract. I’m sure that is what he will do. I’m also pretty sure the Colts might not even run him out there. Given his current mindset..I wouldn’t. I’d just let him stand on the sideline. How good is a guy going to be that doesn’t even want to play for you. Can he sit out practices all week then say he play on game days?? Would you still play a guy that does that. What if after every game he says how bad he hates the organization at the press conference. Point being he can be a cancer and ruin the locker room but still “play”. The Colts must think they can convince him to buy into the team again else why risk all that…just take the trade they got offered.

The Colts aren’t going to offer him anything. Why? Why go through all this if they wouldn’t do this to begin with. They wouldn’t negotiate before then why now? They could have offered him a raise this year before the season and said we will revisit after the season long term. They didn’t…they didn’t want to compromise before so I don’t see them now.

So nothing is stopping him from sitting out 6 weeks. Coming back to play a few weeks then saying I’m shutting it down to save my body for next year. His year will still count and the Colts will get only a couple game days. Sounds pretty good for Taylor if that’s me. Can’t imagine the Colts would then tag him next year to go through another year of that mess. They would trade him like he wants.

How do you prove he faked an injury. He says he has pain even if the scan shows he is fine. A player is injured if he says he is. If I say I have migraines from a concussion that won’t show up on a scan. It’s my word. If I feel pain in my ankle they don’t have to see it for it to really exist. They didn’t have to put him on the PUP. They could have activated him. Said he is too hurt to play and both sides could continue this charade. The Colts benefit from him being on rhe PUP more than Taylor does. It actually hurts Taylor’s value to be traded basically undermining teams offers since he can’t play for 4 weeks. The Colts purposely are playing his game. This way he gets to hold out and get paid and they free up the roster spot. The colts are hoping by not activating him and forcing him to hold out for real costing him game checks they will build goodwill and fix the fractured relationship. I don’t think so. I think he will come back and play begrudgingly and the Colts will let him walk after the year for a compensatory pick.

So he plays the necessary games (6) and then resumes his holdout. I think what is important is that if he wants…he only has to play 6 games to have his season count. Once he returns and is activated he can hold out at anytime. All the colts can do is take his salary. They can’t put him back on the PUP or IR because he isn’t hurt. I thought the article laid it out pretty clear the options…unless it is incorrect…which could be…it’s the athletic after all. I think it’s correct if he wants to have his year count he has to play at least 6 games. I would think the Colts would rather get something for him than get nothing out of him…but maybe principle is more important to Irsay than winning. Nothing wrong with that but right now we are going to force a guy that doesn’t want to play for the organization to sit out…hurt himself and hurt our teams chance to get better. The longer he sits out the less he is worth it to other teams to pay him but also for other teams to compensate us. It’s a no win for either side imo.

Of course…but if they want the best from Taylor and repair the situation then there are much more limited avenues…clearly that’s what they want or they would have traded him. Why keep a disgruntled player that hates your organization and doesn’t want to be there unless you want to fix the situation. They do…and so I doubt we see them going to such extremes.

Then he will activate and then hold out. Point being he doesn’t have to play until there are 8 weeks left. Meaning he will not hsce to lose pay the 6 weeks on the PUP.

I think this comes down to risk/reward for the Colts. Force him to play when he says he is in pain and injured even if they show his ankle is healed and risk him reinjuring it and being held liable or let a guy that doesn’t want to play and is saying he is in pain sit on the PUP. The money means nothing to the Colts. They don’t want to alienate him more…if your goal is to keep a player and not trade him (which is clearly the colts goal) then they will earn goodwill by not trying to play hard ball and continue this fight and let him sit out 4 games and then that’s when they may play hard ball.

https://theathletic.com/4733844/2023/08/01/indianapolis-colts-jonathan-taylor-holdout/?amp=1 This article explains it pretty simply…he only has to play/be eligible to play for 6 games. The Colts can ask for a roster exemption and refuse him two games upon return and limit him so he would need to come back with 8 weeks left to ensure he gets his year counted. It’s why Chris Jones has said he is holding out for 8 weeks. He is doing the same thing as Taylor but I guess no one on here hates him for it. This is what I think he does unless he gets traded.

It isn’t a good analogy imo. Taylor holding out doesn’t make him a bad guy…it’s just business. It isn’t like he went from stand up guy and all around good dude to a beating women, cursing out kids, and pushing down grannies. He is still a great dude…just doing what he feels he needs to do to get paid. No sin in that. Might not agree with it but he hasn’t done a single thing wrong.

Agreed…in fact it would be easier to hold out because he is making peanuts compared to a first or second rd back. What’s the point of playing if you’re only going to make say a half a million? Sit out til week 11 or whatever and then come in to work. His weekly paycheck would be like 50 grand. 4 million may not be much compared to 15 million JT wants but still sitting and losing paychecks that are worth a quarter of a million or whatever is significant.

Down here in south Florida the local guys say there is definitely interest…but a lot of pieces have to line up…ultimately however they don’t think they will meet Colts or JTs demands…not unless there isn’t some movement from those sides.

Says 4 here. https://www.profootballnetwork.com/nfl-pup-list-2023/# I’ll take your word for it. Seems weird as guys fail physicals all the time and it voids the trade and they are sent back. Never heard of passing the physical and then taking back the player.

Yes…would think Aug 29th is a major date to figure this all out with players on PUP would have to miss the first 4 games.

Gotcha. I was unaware of this. I didn’t like that they just let him go out on his own and seek a trade with any team. If they have already agreed on compensation first and now he can negotiate a salary that is different and I would be on board with that. If they just let him go shopping first I am saying I don’t like how this is being handled.

You only take a physical after a trade has been agreed upon. You can’t just make up a trade, force the player to take a physical, then pull the offer. The Colts know Taylor’s health status. The guise that he is hurt is just PR so as to avoid the optics of a player holding out or the Colts supposedly forcing a guy that says he is hurt to practice on it.

Agreed. I don’t like the way the Colts did this. The Colts can communicate what JT is seeking in a contract when making trade negotiations. If JT gets other teams to make him an offer even if the Colts don’t like their trade compensation it’s going to make the Colts look poor if they don’t want to pay what the player has already demonstrated his market value is. Again..not saying they have to…but how this reflects to other players and agents and how teams will use it against us can matter. Especially when it looks like we won’t pay our star player.

So you think no one will try to trade for Taylor and offer him a bigger contract? Possible but I doubt it’s because the owners care about the CBA. While the team is protected by the CBA, that doesn’t mean Taylor is breaking it by asking for a raise. The reason I didn’t like how all this was playing out was simply I think that this doesn’t play well with agents and players. The insensitive comments from Irsay and taking the position that you aren’t valuable enough to pay but you are too valuable to trade and the position of not seeming to want to negotiate your best players contract going into the last season while entirely within the right of the organization…might not have the same effect on agents and players in the league as it does with the other 31 owners.

Taylor doesn’t care what his trade value is…just his contract value. If a team is willing to pay him 15 million for a couple years even if the offer is only a 5th rd pick he takes that back to the Colts and if they won’t make the trade or match the contract then it looks like the Colts are low balling him and it makes the Colts look bad. Might not change anything at all but in the media it puts pressure on the organization to make a trade or pay the man what his market value is. Certainly can send a chilling effect for players who might worry about playing for the Colts and how we handle our contract extensions. Again it might not change anything at all but I think it was a mistake to let him seek a trade. Move him or not it’s likely the Colts are going to continue to get bad press and the organization look worse. That might not bother them but the teams reputation will certainly take a hit.

That’s too funny!!

This is spot on. It’s clear Irsay and Peyton haven’t mended all the fences. Irsay needs Peyton more than Peyton needs Irsay. To have the greatest Indianapolis Colt of all time be alienated from your team and your friends is horrible optics, horrible marketing, and horrible for business. Irsay fails in all these areas. It’s never wrong to ask for forgiveness, to make amends, to admit mistakes or try to do the right thing. Irsay is too proud to or just not capable of seeing that fans root for players…not owners. Jim just doesn’t get it…and probably never will. In his mind he is the greatest member of the Colts. As an owner you have an obligation to your fans and your franchise to be a steward. A leader. He has shown time and again he is not very good at that. He only continues to hurt Colts fans by alienating Peyton even more. I don’t blame Peyton for repping the Broncos. They’ve been nothing but a class organization and very loyal to him. Not only did they do everything to put a team around him but when he probably didn’t deserve it they gave him a second chance at the end and in return they all succeeded by trusting Peyton to trust his teammates to win. Ive not seen Peyton say a single thing about Irsay over the years but Irsay has a habit of making these little jabs towards Peyton. Maybe just once Peyton should make a list of the greatest owners in the league and put Kraft on it instead of Irsay.