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Scott Pennock

Linebacker Jenga

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Now that the rookie mini camp is up and the coaching staff shed a little light on where the rookies were lining up, where does that leave the incumbents?

 

I personally think that all drafted linebackers plus Moore make the roster as they are/were drafted/signed with the switch to the 4-3 in mind - as does Walker and Goode.

 

WILL - Leonard.....and who?

MIKE - Goode? and Franklin and Moore

                 Or

SAM - Walker? and M. Adams

 

The Rest of the Incumbents:

Morrison 

George 

T. Adams 

Ossai 

 

I think the rest are playing for the last spot amongst each other AND whomever ends up on the waiver wire.

 

Thoughts....?

 

 

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3 hours ago, Scott Pennock said:

Now that the rookie mini camp is up and the coaching staff shed a little light on where the rookies were lining up, where does that leave the incumbents?

 

I personally think that all drafted linebackers plus Moore make the roster as they are/were drafted/signed with the switch to the 4-3 in mind - as does Walker and Goode.

 

WILL - Leonard.....and who?

MIKE - Goode? and Franklin and Moore

                 Or

SAM - Walker? and M. Adams

 

The Rest of the Incumbents:

Morrison 

George 

T. Adams 

Ossai 

 

I think the rest are playing for the last spot amongst each other AND whomever ends up on the waiver wire.

 

Thoughts....?

 

 

 

Yeah, it’s really up in the air right now.  I though George played well last season.  Morrison has to be a great Sam if he has a chance to even make the team.  Walker supposedly slimmed down but I never was high on him.  

 

I think our rookies have a ton of potential but we won’t know anything until we see them in a real game.  I expect the D to be pretty vanilla until guys learn their roles.  

 

It is is going to be interesting, we really have no clue what that depth chart is going to look like.  

 

 

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I read the title and was like "who is Jenga and when did we sign him??" , lol.

 

Have no idea who is going where, but think that this will not be sorted out until the last pre-season game.  New coaches, new players,  and a new scheme...leads to a lot of tries with different combo's.  Camp will be fun to watch, for sure.

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Still the weakest and thinnest position on the team IMO, i think every linebacker we currently have is eligible for a spot on the 53.

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6 hours ago, Scott Pennock said:

Now that the rookie mini camp is up and the coaching staff shed a little light on where the rookies were lining up, where does that leave the incumbents?

 

I personally think that all drafted linebackers plus Moore make the roster as they are/were drafted/signed with the switch to the 4-3 in mind - as does Walker and Goode.

 

WILL - Leonard.....and who?

MIKE - Goode? and Franklin and Moore

                 Or

SAM - Walker? and M. Adams

 

The Rest of the Incumbents:

Morrison 

George 

T. Adams 

Ossai 

 

I think the rest are playing for the last spot amongst each other AND whomever ends up on the waiver wire.

 

Thoughts....?

 

 

 

Unless he makes a major jump/impact in camp I think Franklin is destined for the Practice Squad.

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I dont know much about Goode but I'm expecting Sam from reading up on his college profile and some other things. Coverage issues were pointed out so I'm not sure about Mike. Said to be physical though. I think maybe you can peg Walker, Adams, and Morrison as other candidates at that role(SAM). I think Walker and Adams are also in play at Mike. I think Skai Moore, Darius Leonard, and Jeremiah George are in play at Will. Moore at Mike and Leonard at Will in Nickel. Zaire Franklin I think can do Mike but I also feel he'd be a decent Will with some work. I'm still feeling him out.

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I dont think Morrison makes the final roster but who knows. We said that last year.

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I also wonder about Simon moving back to LB. DE has gotten very crowded and he’s been a LB by trade. Given how thin and inexperienced the LBs are,  I’d bet he gets a shot at the SAM. 

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4 hours ago, krunk said:

I dont think Morrison makes the final roster but who knows. We said that last year.

Too slow for a 4/3 defensive scheme.....gone.

Couple that with drafting 3 linebackers and

the writing is on the wall.

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15 hours ago, Scott Pennock said:

Now that the rookie mini camp is up and the coaching staff shed a little light on where the rookies were lining up, where does that leave the incumbents?

 

I personally think that all drafted linebackers plus Moore make the roster as they are/were drafted/signed with the switch to the 4-3 in mind - as does Walker and Goode.

 

WILL - Leonard.....and who?

MIKE - Goode? and Franklin and Moore

                 Or

SAM - Walker? and M. Adams

 

The Rest of the Incumbents:

Morrison 

George 

T. Adams 

Ossai 

 

I think the rest are playing for the last spot amongst each other AND whomever ends up on the waiver wire.

 

Thoughts....?

 

 

I don't know the way Ballard preaches competition id say none of these guys are safe.

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40 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

After 2 seasons of drafting and FA periods you'd think our LB corp would be better.

First draft was for Paganos 3/4 defense.   We are having to clear those types out who don't fit the 4/3.  Almost like starting over.

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From what I've seen of him on tape(2 games) I don't trust Franklin at MIKE. He might be better suited for WILL, IMO. Skai Moore and maybe Walker will probably be MIKE for now, unless we claim somebody else after the roster cuts. Walker can also play some SAM... Adams, Goode and Morrison if he stays are the others I expect to get snaps at SAM.

 

Leonard, Franklin and Moore(if he doesn't get the start at MIKE) would get snaps at WILL. 

 

In general I don't love our MIKE position at all. Skai might develop into a good MIKE, because he's got pretty good instincts and has great coverage skills, but he needs work in the run game. IMO we still are in desperate need of a starting quality MIKE. 

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1 hour ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

After 2 seasons of drafting and FA periods you'd think our LB corp would be better.

Lol... Another shot at Ballard, at least you are consistent.

 

There is also a strong chance that a few players from this rookie class step up at LB. In that case the LB corp will have improved, but, your narrative will be ruined...

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I have a feeling Ballard will be watching the waiver wire throughout pre season and when the big time cuts come. I can see a couple of LBs or other positions being signed. I believed him when he said he is looking for talent from every direction and it is a non stop effort.

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1 hour ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

After 2 seasons of drafting and FA periods you'd think our LB corp would be better.

 

Lol Is this a serious comment? Nah, you're just trying to get people fired up. 

 

70% of the roster has been turned over in the last 2 years. Almost 100% of the defense. You can only do so much. You can't fix every hole right away.

 

Also... you have NO clue if the answer isn't on the roster already. We haven't even played a game yet. Slow your hate train down.

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2 hours ago, LockeDown said:

First draft was for Paganos 3/4 defense.   We are having to clear those types out who don't fit the 4/3.  Almost like starting over.

I thought he knew he was switching to a 4-3. Which is why so many here liked him drafting Bashaam.

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1 hour ago, Buck Showalter said:

Lol... Another shot at Ballard, at least you are consistent.

 

There is also a strong chance that a few players from this rookie class step up at LB. In that case the LB corp will have improved, but, your narrative will be ruined...

Yeah and another shot at me for pointing out the obvious lol. Your veiw, or lack of perspective is also consistent. Haha

 

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3 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

After 2 seasons of drafting and FA periods you'd think our LB corp would be better.

I (may be in the minority) like the duality in the Grover Stewart, Anthony Walker and Basham draft picks. They will improve and show more in the systems they were used to playing in college.

 

As far as "better"......time will tell, but I trust that the 3 main front office guys that built Super Bowl teams in Chicago and Seattle (focused on defense) over my opinion or any other opinion on this board.

 

They drafted/signed these guys with a vision in their mind of how each of them would fit the scheme.

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3 hours ago, Hoose said:

I also wonder about Simon moving back to LB. DE has gotten very crowded and he’s been a LB by trade. Given how thin and inexperienced the LBs are,  I’d bet he gets a shot at the SAM. 

Agree with this, he should also be the veteren presence of that group. He is also a very solid player/person. So many of these guys seem cut from the same cloth, lean, fast, but unproven. At least we know what we have with Simon.

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1 hour ago, Legend of Luck said:

 

Lol Is this a serious comment? Nah, you're just trying to get people fired up. 

 

70% of the roster has been turned over in the last 2 years. Almost 100% of the defense. You can only do so much. You can't fix every hole right away.

 

Also... you have NO clue if the answer isn't on the roster already. We haven't even played a game yet. Slow your hate train down.

Lol

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Simon will be back at LB before the season is over, much like Rob Morris.

Morrison I can see him being cut after the pre-season; He's only 23, on a cheap rookie contract of $600,000 a year, and led the team in tackles...but it seems to be the consensus that he's already peaked.

 

6'1'' 250 lbs is too small for full-time at DE. Even Freeney was 266 lbs, but also WAY faster and quicker. Being smaller AND slower does not help one's cause in any sport.

 

 

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42 minutes ago, rock8591 said:

6'1'' 250 lbs is too small for full-time at DE. Even Freeney was 266 lbs, but also WAY faster and quicker. Being smaller AND slower does not help one's cause in any sport.

 

No, he is not too small. Mathis was 6.2" and 245 when drafted, and very similar body type to Simon.

 

Anyway, neither of our ends will play full time I think. Eberflus said he will heavily rotate our rushers to keep them fresh.

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2 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Yeah and another shot at me for pointing out the obvious lol. Your veiw, or lack of perspective is also consistent. Haha

 

Yes I maintain an optimistic perspective & view point that takes into consideration what Ballard has been preaching since day 1 on the job. Not sure how that is a "lack of perspective".

 

Your posts seem to suggest a fairly strong contempt for Ballards approach. To some, this could be viewed as a greater "lack of perspective", as your posts suggest you do not understand Ballard's approach, as you don't really offer specific critique, just contempt...

 

Ballard said in one of his earliest pressers that the turn around would not be an easy or quick fix. The current contempt towards Ballard seems to favor that quick fix approach, the route that Grigson took, which added to the decline of the roster & the current state of the franchise.

 

I am optimistic that strict adherence to a solid plan (which Ballard is exhibiting) coupled with a stronger coaching staff & stragedy will lead to a competitive team sooner than later...

 

I just refuse to see what empty criticism accomplishes.

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2 hours ago, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

Yeah and another shot at me for pointing out the obvious lol. Your veiw, or lack of perspective is also consistent. Haha

 

2

 

You talking about another poster's lack of perspective is very funny.

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There is a big opportunity for Walker to be a starter this year, despite not playing much at all last year.

 

I think our LB corps looks like:

 

SAM: Goode v Morrison for a starter spot with Adams as a developmental player.

MIKE: Walker starting with Moore or Franklin to get a roster spot. One will lose out (I think Franklin).

WILL: Leonard starts, George is the back up.

 

It's a pity we couldn't add more established talent, but Ballard couldn't fix everything. We need a few players to really step up to the next level, particularly Walker I think.

 

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I think Walker or Adams will end up with the starting Mike spot. I'm really cheering for Adams to be the beast I think he is but I can accept Ant Walker winning the job. I can see Skai Moore as well but I think he's going to end up being a WILL. Really like his instincts and coverage ability. I have to see him play more to get a feel for him against the run and playing in the middle so my thoughts may change about him playing MIKE if he does well. Right now I like his height, but the roster has him listed at 218 which I dont know if that is right or wrong. If he really is 218 I think he will need to add a couple pounds to play in the middle in the base defense on run downs. Which is why I suggested him at WILL on run downs and at Mike on passing downs.

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26 minutes ago, krunk said:

I think Walker or Adams will end up with the starting Mike spot. I'm really cheering for Adams to be the beast I think he is but I can accept Ant Walker winning the job. I can see Skai Moore as well but I think he's going to end up being a WILL. Really like his instincts and coverage ability. I have to see him play more to get a feel for him against the run and playing in the middle so my thoughts may change about him playing MIKE if he does well. Right now I like his height, but the roster has him listed at 218 which I dont know if that is right or wrong. If he really is 218 I think he will need to add a couple pounds to play in the middle in the base defense on run downs. Which is why I suggested him at WILL on run downs and at Mike on passing downs.

I know we talked about his listed weight at 218, but 226 at the combine and 230 at his pro day (most of which was probably junk weight), however, put him as the MIKE in the sub packages this year while Rusty Jones works on his diet, strength and conditioning to put the proper bulk on to start in year two!

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I like Skai Moore too but for WILL, does he have the athleticism to run with tight ends? I thought he tested not so good, could be wrong. I think I prefer him at MIKE with a bit more weight added to his long frame. He could be a very good prospect, mentioned his instincts and reading of the game look really good. Very hard to teach that. Walker's first year acclimating to the pros will stand to him.

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17 hours ago, Colt Overseas said:

I like Skai Moore too but for WILL, does he have the athleticism to run with tight ends? I thought he tested not so good, could be wrong. I think I prefer him at MIKE with a bit more weight added to his long frame. He could be a very good prospect, mentioned his instincts and reading of the game look really good. Very hard to teach that. Walker's first year acclimating to the pros will stand to him.

Moore can cover both RB's and TE's.  He has a natural safety look to him but can play LB.  I think he can sustain at MIKE if he adds muscle but looks to be geared more towards a WILL.  I think having him and Leonard out there on passing downs with a nickel allows us some good coverage ability.

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I do wish the Colts had better talent at LB overall...and at least one established player. But the focus on fast LBs (most of who can cover) is such a breath of fresh air.

 

 

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SAM is supposed to be on the field about 25% of the time, likely meaning the other two will be nearly 100%.

 

I think the plan is for Leonard to start at WILL and Walker at MIKE.  I could see Simon start at SAM then move to DE on passing downs, keeping Ballard true to his word that he's a DE.  But Goode could start at SAM also.

 

The other guys are backups and situational players.

 

I'd be surprised if any LBs from last year are on the final 53. 

 

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On 5/20/2018 at 10:15 AM, LJpalmbeacher2 said:

After 2 seasons of drafting and FA periods you'd think our LB corp would be better.

Not to mention gobs of free cap space.

 

Despite the criticism of your post by many, its actually consistent with the way many comments have been written over  the years about the Oline.

 

"Despite 4 previous years with the "Unlikeable Meanie", you'd think our oline would be better".  Nevermind that the meanie signed AC, drafted Mewhort and Kelly, drafted decent players like Good, Haeg, and Clark; drafted Holmes and Thornton, and signed Cherilous.  All reasonably decent players drafted or signed at proper value.

 

So by those standards, your statement about the LB position is consistent with others' statements about the oline. 

 

But since you're applying the not-glowingly-positive comment to the wrong GM, you get called out for being extreme. 

 

That's how dogma and narratives work.  It shifts the popular position off of center and over to one side so that any comment that is truly centrist appears extreme.

 

Not that I agree with either statement about the LBs or the Oline.  But if its said that way about one of the corps, it should be okay to say it about the other.

 

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2 hours ago, shastamasta said:

I do wish the Colts had better talent at LB overall...and at least one established player. But the focus on fast LBs (most of who can cover) is such a breath of fresh air.

 

 

They have talent at LB what are you saying and sam is only gonna play 25 snaps a game anyway we have darius Leonard Matthew adams Anthony walker etc 

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On 5/20/2018 at 2:19 PM, rock8591 said:

Simon will be back at LB before the season is over, much like Rob Morris.

Morrison I can see him being cut after the pre-season; He's only 23, on a cheap rookie contract of $600,000 a year, and led the team in tackles...but it seems to be the consensus that he's already peaked.

 

6'1'' 250 lbs is too small for full-time at DE. Even Freeney was 266 lbs, but also WAY faster and quicker. Being smaller AND slower does not help one's cause in any sport.

 

 

The bolded makes zero sense.. He's been playing as a SOLB since he's been in the league with the Ravens, Texans, and Colts. Outside of dropping into coverage, he's doing the same thing but instead of standing up, he'll have a hand on the ground. He'll be fine as a LDE in our scheme.

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1 minute ago, Indy1996 said:

They have talent at LB what are you saying and sam is only gonna play 25 snaps a game anyway we have darius Leonard Matthew adams Anthony walker etc 

 

Too soon to tell what they have. It's Leonard (who is only a rookie) and bunch of guys who were 5th-7th round picks or UDFAs. But I do like the athleticism.

 

I wouldn't be surprised to see Ballard bring in an established player at some point.

 

 

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On 5/20/2018 at 1:19 PM, rock8591 said:

Simon will be back at LB before the season is over, much like Rob Morris.

Morrison I can see him being cut after the pre-season; He's only 23, on a cheap rookie contract of $600,000 a year, and led the team in tackles...but it seems to be the consensus that he's already peaked.

 

6'1'' 250 lbs is too small for full-time at DE. Even Freeney was 266 lbs, but also WAY faster and quicker. Being smaller AND slower does not help one's cause in any sport.

 

 

To the bolded.  I don't understand the reference.  Morris played LB his entire career with the Colts.  He played MIKE for several years but moved to SAM for the Colts SB run in 2006.  People give credit for the defensive turnaround to Sanders and his presence made a difference but equally important was Morris moving to SAM.  It took him a couple of games to get the feel for the position but once he did, he solidified the run defense

 

To the italicized , I think that is one thing most people don't understand, the plan is to not have a "full time" DE.  I think they plan on having 5 or 6 guys rotating throughout the game.

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