The Ghost

[csmopar]

Well we got a prime example last night of why TY is called the Ghost, he flat goes invisible at times.  He's a heck of a receiver but he's gotta step up game in and game out. Not sure if it's play calling or what, but it seems that if you look at the list couple years, the games TY goes invisible, we lose. He rarely ever puts back to back great games together.

 

so the question is, coaching/playcalling or is it the fact we have no consistent number 2 and the D can simply double team TY?

[KB]

They had him double teammed for a majority of the game. Thats what happens to top recievers from time to time. Part of the job. That was time for others to step up. While Hilton is double teammed everyone else had single man coverage. One of them should of gotten open/ caught the ball when its on the way.

[lollygagger8]

Unreal 

 

[csmopar]

1 hour ago, KB said:

They had him double teammed for a majority of the game. Thats what happens to top recievers from time to time. Part of the job. That was time for others to step up. While Hilton is double teammed everyone else had single man coverage. One of them should of gotten open/ caught the ball when its on the way.

like the wide open, uncontested TD pass that hit Moncrief in both hands and the dude drops it......again

[DaColts85]

19 minutes ago, csmopar said:

like the wide open, uncontested TD pass that hit Moncrief in both hands and the dude drops it......again

And the multiple times Doyle dropped or fumbled the ball away.  He needs to get back to playing like last year.  Looking to be another example of getting paid and looking like crap.  

[RollerColt]

He and the rest of the team completely failed John Simon last night.

[Defjamz26]

10 minutes ago, DaColts85 said:

And the multiple times Doyle dropped or fumbled the ball away.  He needs to get back to playing like last year.  Looking to be another example of getting paid and looking like crap.  

Not sure what's up with Doyle this year. Bunch of drops and fumbles. The team should step up when Hilton is double teamed.

[John Waylon]

He was in double coverage most all night. Teams are leaving Moncrief in one on one coverage and clamping down on Hilton. 

[pgt_rob]

4 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

Not sure what's up with Doyle this year. Bunch of drops and fumbles. The team should step up when Hilton is double teamed.

 

This is what I've never understood. When teams knock out our best receiver, nobody really steps up. 

[blackhawk375]

2 hours ago, KB said:

They had him double teammed for a majority of the game. Thats what happens to top recievers from time to time. Part of the job. That was time for others to step up. While Hilton is double teammed everyone else had single man coverage. One of them should of gotten open/ caught the ball when its on the way.

No, this isn't what happens to "top receivers" from time to time... The top guys find ways to get open even when they are double teamed.  Marvin Harrison was double teamed all the time.  He wasn't lazy with his routes and he didn't give up when the other teams double covered him.  Hilton just gives up and that's why he will always be just a good WR and not a great one.  The great ones find ways to beat the double team, not just put their head down and disappear.

[jchandler7]

TY has torched the Titans every year since entering the league. They finally found a way to lock him down. The rest of the receivers have to step up in games like this. A la Moncreif, Doyle, Aiken, RBs... Brissett played good ball,  his receivers just couldn't catch a cold in a snow storm. I don't know the exact number of dropped passes but it had to be top of the league. 

[HeSoColt]

Again... I do not understand why they do not move TY around. Get him in motion, get him moving. This coaching staff is completely clueless.

[King Colt]

1 hour ago, RollerColt said:

He and the rest of the team completely failed John Simon last night.

Simon is a gem. He should grow to be a prime time game changer.

[Buck Showalter]

2 hours ago, csmopar said:

like the wide open, uncontested TD pass that hit Moncrief in both hands and the dude drops it......again

Moncrief needed to pull that in for sure, however, JB was putting a lot of heat on some of those passes last night, not helping matters any. 

[aaron11]

moncrief gets shut down by average CBs one on one.  they double ty and we have no where to go except doyle

 

we cant afford bad games from doyle 

[throwing BBZ]

1 hour ago, aaron11 said:

moncrief gets shut down by average CBs one on one.  they double ty and we have no where to go except doyle

 

we cant afford bad games from doyle 

 

 Doyle clearly lacks speed, he is a dump off-relief valve TE.

 Aiken isn't fast or twitchy.
 Moncrief just isn't the guy.
 We could use a big, fast WR that demands the ball, and a speed TE. lol

[IinD]

Play calls are terrible. Put TY on any solid winning team and he easily gets 12-1500 yds.

 

I'm gonna be respectful and simply say, Chud....I'm over his style.

[will426]

It's in chud..even gruden called it he said if you put Hilton in these bunch formations to  get a free release he's going to burn you..chud decides to have him get bracketed on the outside by a ROOKIE  and a garbage safety  I didn't even see Hilton run deep one time and he's always beat the titans on the deep ball

[TheRustonRifle#7]

2 hours ago, Buck Showalter said:

Moncrief needed to pull that in for sure, however, JB was putting a lot of heat on some of those passes last night, not helping matters any. 

Yeah he needs to get it even if it was high and sailing.....some of these drops are bad passes but catchable.  Possibly they are too used to Luck putting it in their hands lol?

 

I have read where some are saying that Moncrief and Doyle needed to step it up because of TY being doubled (disappearing)?  They combined for 12 catches 117 yards and a TD (sans the dropped TD by Moncrief, plus fumble and other dropped passes by Doyle), compared to 1 catch for 19 yards for TY.

[OLD FAN MAN]

did he come back too soon from his last pop in the head

[Freenyfan102]

We need another WR a number 1 something that we used to have.... We don't have that other guy threat... We need a Reggie Wayne type of player and TY is not it. Moncrief sucks Aiken is a joke we need to draft a High-Value Number 1 receiver. Heck we could have gotten WR from the bear but look where he is at now.. Eagles tearing it up

[jvan1973]

He can't make the qb throw to him.   

[strt182]

In a sense if TY is pulling double coverage then he is doing HIS job. Yes it seems he disappeared but he was doing his job. This is a team effort sport others have to step up. I also blame Chud and his playcalling.

[B~Town]

9 hours ago, will426 said:

It's in chud..even gruden called it he said if you put Hilton in these bunch formations to  get a free release he's going to burn you..chud decides to have him get bracketed on the outside by a ROOKIE  and a garbage safety  I didn't even see Hilton run deep one time and he's always beat the titans on the deep ball

I agree we need to find more creative ways to get our playmakers the ball even with a young QB in a system that he hasn't mastered yet . 

 

Is there a stat on blanket coverage seems Hilton was owned by the DB shadowing him all night 

[VaAllDay757]

It's all in the playcalling....too many long routes not enough slants or comeback routes to gain an easy 10 yards when the defense plays off coverage

[will426]

2 hours ago, B~Town said:

I agree we need to find more creative ways to get our playmakers the ball even with a young QB in a system that he hasn't mastered yet . 

 

Is there a stat on blanket coverage seems Hilton was owned by the DB shadowing him all night 

Jackson the rookie was on him most of the night with safety help but the playcalls never were gonna help Hilton anyway 

[DaveA1102]

TY Hilton this year:

 

At Lucas Oil Stadium: "The Ghost"

 

Anywhere else: "A Ghost"

[DalTXColtsFan]

I don't even know what to say as a message body.

[coltsfeva]

He took away coverage on others: Moncrief, Aiken and Doyle. Unfortunately, Doyle had a bad game.

[Yoshinator]

16 minutes ago, coltsfeva said:

He took away coverage on others: Moncrief, Aiken and Doyle. Unfortunately, Doyle had a bad game.

So if he does great, then Hilton is just Hilton. If he has a dud game, he's just taking away coverage from other WRs? This isn't an oddity from Hilton, he's had plenty of these types of games where he's had very little production in his career. In fact, it's quite easy to take him out of a game if a HC really wants too. This is why I have a hard time calling Hilton an elite WR at times. He's either great or horrible, the definition of an inconsistent receiver.

[coltsfeva]

18 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

So if he does great, then Hilton is just Hilton. If he has a dud game, he's just taking away coverage from other WRs? This isn't an oddity from Hilton, he's had plenty of these types of games where he's had very little production in his career. In fact, it's quite easy to take him out of a game if a HC really wants too. This is why I have a hard time calling Hilton an elite WR at times. He's either great or horrible, the definition of an inconsistent receiver.

  That’s one way to look at it. But could it be those games where he didn’t do well, he was double teamed? Maybe some passes were off?

   I suppose every silver lining has a dark cloud if you look hard enough. I’m just glad he’s a Colt. Maybe he can be stopped on occasion but there are other games in which he is dynamic. How many wins has he had a big part in? Just saying....

[DougDew]

Hmmm.  So Doyle fumbles once so he has a bad game?  I thought he had a touchdown and a couple of first down receptions.  One drop I remember was a horrible throw, and the other was a good play by the DB who had a hand on it when he caught it.

 

BTW, I wouldn't say Moncrief had a bad game because he dropped a TD.  It happens.

 

As far as TY, he runs hot and cold.  Never quite good enough to beat a double team regularly.  Not easy to do, but doesn't seem to ever be able to do it.

[Yoshinator]

Just now, coltsfeva said:

  That’s one way to look at it. But could it be those games where he didn’t do well, he was double teamed? I suppose every silver lining has a dark cloud if you look hard enough. I’m just glad he’s a Colt. Maybe he can be stopped on occasion but there are other games in which he is dynamic. How many wins has he had a big part in? Just saying....

Sometimes he's double teamed, other times there are CB's that just can shut him down, and Adoree Jackson did just that on Monday night. Hilton is one of the best players on the team, possibly 2nd best behind Luck, but a lot of his production was from pure volume. He wins a bunch of games on offense, but he can't overcome a simple double team, like at all. He also can't take much physicality, so it's easy to abuse him if you are a large CB. I wish we would use the other WR's and TE's more, but they are bad for the most part, and Chud's playbook is based on the WR1 and TE1. That actually makes it easier to focus on Hilton and makes the team easier to stop as a whole.

[DaColts85]

TY pulls double teams which is what we need him to do.  With Luck, not a random backup, he is extremely reliable and Luck's main target.  He is also a victim of play calling that does not move him around at all.  He is able to sit out there and get doubled and washed out.  Brissett has showed potential but he has also showed in the second half when the pressure is on he gets flustered.  Moncrief could definitely play better but he has not been terrible since the Cards game.  In the 1st half our offense is clicking and we look great.  2nd half we become vanilla and easy to cover.

[Indy1996]

25 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Sometimes he's double teamed, other times there are CB's that just can shut him down, and Adoree Jackson did just that on Monday night. Hilton is one of the best players on the team, possibly 2nd best behind Luck, but a lot of his production was from pure volume. He wins a bunch of games on offense, but he can't overcome a simple double team, like at all. He also can't take much physicality, so it's easy to abuse him if you are a large CB. I wish we would use the other WR's and TE's more, but they are bad for the most part, and Chud's playbook is based on the WR1 and TE1. That actually makes it easier to focus on Hilton and makes the team easier to stop as a whole.

Js it wasnt adoore jackson on him it was logan ryan who was on ty

[coltsfeva]

25 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

Sometimes he's double teamed, other times there are CB's that just can shut him down, and Adoree Jackson did just that on Monday night. Hilton is one of the best players on the team, possibly 2nd best behind Luck, but a lot of his production was from pure volume. He wins a bunch of games on offense, but he can't overcome a simple double team, like at all. He also can't take much physicality, so it's easy to abuse him if you are a large CB. I wish we would use the other WR's and TE's more, but they are bad for the most part, and Chud's playbook is based on the WR1 and TE1. That actually makes it easier to focus on Hilton and makes the team easier to stop as a whole.

  I get what you’re saying and TY does have some physical limitations. 

  As far as getting other options involved, some of that comes down to experience with the QB and Brissett is not there yet.

[Yoshinator]

2 minutes ago, Indy1996 said:

Js it wasnt adoore jackson on him it was logan ryan who was on ty

Are you sure? I remember Adoree being on him. Could of been both. In any case, he still got shut down 1 on 1, regardless of how good Logan Ryan is.

[Yoshinator]

1 minute ago, coltsfeva said:

  I get what you’re saying and TY does have some physical limitations. 

  As far as getting other options involved, some of that comes down to experience with the QB and Brissett is not there yet.

He had a good rapport with Doyle early on, and then Doyle's play went to crap. That's 100% on Doyle. However, Moncrief has never really stepped up into being that solid #2 WR we wanted him to be either. This game in particular, Brissett did fine, it was the receivers and TE's who let him down. I honestly don't think Luck would have done much better Monday, just because the drops and turnovers would of still been there IMO.

[DaColts85]

3 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

He had a good rapport with Doyle early on, and then Doyle's play went to crap. That's 100% on Doyle. However, Moncrief has never really stepped up into being that solid #2 WR we wanted him to be either. This game in particular, Brissett did fine, it was the receivers and TE's who let him down. I honestly don't think Luck would have done much better Monday, just because the drops and turnovers would of still been there IMO.

Well if Luck would have been there, you would obviously hope for far better results.  Better accuracy and touch on passes can go a long way.  Plus, Luck can read a D better and has the ability to check out of plays and knows the playbook well enough to select other options and audibles.  Can't compare the two honestly.

[Blueblood23]

55 minutes ago, DougDew said:

Hmmm.  So Doyle fumbles once so he has a bad game?  I thought he had a touchdown and a couple of first down receptions.  One drop I remember was a horrible throw, and the other was a good play by the DB who had a hand on it when he caught it.

 

BTW, I wouldn't say Moncrief had a bad game because he dropped a TD.  It happens.

 

As far as TY, he runs hot and cold.  Never quite good enough to beat a double team regularly.  Not easy to do, but doesn't seem to ever be able to do it.

You seem like an apologist like Pagano on these players. If the excuses continue then the bad play will also and be expected rather than the exception.