Patience...

[ColtsSouljah]

Just now, J@son said:

 

no, a 2 week advantage.  

 

This Sunday is week 6. If he's only doing real practicing now then it's a half week. The reports from last week said that what he was doing could have been done anyway.

[ColtsSouljah]

1 minute ago, J@son said:

 

but what if the opposite were true and he had fully healed and was ready to practice by week 2 or 3?

 

Then my choice (PUP) would have been the wrong one.

[Jason_]

Just now, ColtsSouljah said:

 

Then my choice (PUP) would have been the wrong one.

 

exactly, and THAT'S why they didn't put him on PUP.  Because they didn't know.  They were given estimates, likely from multiple doctors, that gave an idea on the timeframe that it should take.  The Colt brass based their decision about PUP and/or IR on the information from those doctors.  They obviously thought there was a chance he could return sooner and THAT is why they did not put him on PUP or IR.

[Jason_]

2 minutes ago, ColtsSouljah said:

 

This Sunday is week 6. If he's only doing real practicing now then it's a half week. The reports from last week said that what he was doing could have been done anyway.

 

What reports?

[ColtsSouljah]

Just now, J@son said:

 

What reports?

 

Did you watch the game Sunday? The announcers talked about it quite extensively.

[ColtsSouljah]

2 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

exactly, and THAT'S why they didn't put him on PUP.  Because they didn't know.  They were given estimates, likely from multiple doctors, that gave an idea on the timeframe that it should take.  The Colt brass based their decision about PUP and/or IR on the information from those doctors.  They obviously thought there was a chance he could return sooner and THAT is why they did not put him on PUP or IR.

 

Eh, I think that if it's just before week 1 and you have no idea when someone is going to be able to play again that's a pretty good indicator you should strongly consider the PUP.

[Jason_]

1 minute ago, ColtsSouljah said:

 

Did you watch the game Sunday? The announcers talked about it quite extensively.

 

the announcers were not at the practices during the week.  they are going off of hearsay. there are incorrect comments made during almost every game broadcast.  

[Jason_]

2 minutes ago, ColtsSouljah said:

 

Eh, I think that if it's just before week 1 and you have no idea when someone is going to be able to play again that's a pretty good indicator you should strongly consider the PUP.

 

this is what you're either not getting or refusing to get....they DID have an idea...just not a concrete date.  huge difference.

[jskinnz]

1 hour ago, ColtsSouljah said:

 

That would be good. So not going on the PUP is giving a half week advantage in timeline ;)

 

I am not sure what is so hard to understand about this.  Taking him off PUP game him a 2 week head start on when he would have been able to practice.  2 weeks is 2 games or 1/8th of the NFL season.  Don't you think it is a good idea to have your starting QB for an extra two games?  

[ColtsSouljah]

44 minutes ago, jskinnz said:

 

I am not sure what is so hard to understand about this.  Taking him off PUP game him a 2 week head start on when he would have been able to practice.  2 weeks is 2 games or 1/8th of the NFL season.  Don't you think it is a good idea to have your starting QB for an extra two games?  

 

You are assuming that during those two weeks he was doing practice that he otherwise could not have been.

The reports during Sunday's game said the only "practicing" he was doing last week was practicing that he could have been doing anywhere (and thus could have been doing while on the PUP list).
In other words, the practicing he was doing was not dependent upon being able to practice with the team. So, for last week's practice, it did not matter if he was off the PUP list or not according to the reports during Sunday's game.

[ColtsSouljah]

2 hours ago, J@son said:

 

the announcers were not at the practices during the week.  they are going off of hearsay. there are incorrect comments made during almost every game broadcast.  

 

They were going off the reports the Colts organization gave them, so unless the Colts organization lied to them, their reporting was accurate. 

[ColtsSouljah]

2 hours ago, J@son said:

 

this is what you're either not getting or refusing to get....they DID have an idea...just not a concrete date.  huge difference.

 

Ok, so when do they think Luck is coming back? What is the general idea of the Colts organization?

[Jason_]

Just now, ColtsSouljah said:

 

Ok, so when do they think Luck is coming back? What is the general idea of the Colts organization?

 

well, if you'd paid attention to their actions you would already know that.  they clearly felt he could be back and ready to practice prior to week 6.  That is why they did not put him on PUP or IR at the start of the season.  

[Jason_]

4 minutes ago, ColtsSouljah said:

 

They were going off the reports the Colts organization gave them, so unless the Colts organization lied to them, their reporting was accurate. 

 

highly unlikely the Colt organization outright lied..but they quite possibly, and probably did do their best to be as vague as possible or even deliberately misleading.  

[ColtsSouljah]

Just now, J@son said:

 

highly unlikely the Colt organization outright lied..but they quite possibly, and probably did do their best to be as vague as possible or even deliberately misleading.  

 

Fair enough. The footage they showed of Luck "practicing" did seem to confirm their point, though.

[Jason_]

Just now, ColtsSouljah said:

 

Fair enough. The footage they showed of Luck "practicing" did seem to confirm their point, though.

 

you mean the ~3 second video of Luck warming up?  lol

[ColtsSouljah]

2 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

well, if you'd paid attention to their actions you would already know that.  they clearly felt he could be back and ready to practice prior to week 6.  That is why they did not put him on PUP or IR at the start of the season.  

 

Fair point. And Luck did return to "regular" practice today (meaning doing things he could not have done if on the PUP) so I guess they did get him back just before week 6.

[ColtsSouljah]

Just now, J@son said:

 

you mean the ~3 second video of Luck warming up?  lol

 

No, and I don't mean to be argumentative, but I think you must have missed a chunk of the broadcast... this was an extensive segment during one of the 49ers drives.

[Jason_]

3 minutes ago, ColtsSouljah said:

 

No, and I don't mean to be argumentative, but I think you must have missed a chunk of the broadcast... this was an extensive segment during one of the 49ers drives.

 

I'll admit, I don't pay total attention to everything the broadcasters say because, as I said before, it's not at all uncommon for them to make dumb or even outright untrue statements during the game.  Having said that, here's an article from ESPN:

 

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20916032/andrew-luck-indianapolis-colts-practice-first-season

 

here's a critical excerpt:

 

Quote

Luck warmed up fellow quarterbacks Jacoby Brissett, Scott Tolzien and Phillip Walker before doing individual work with them and then some routes versus air throws with his receivers.

 

 

Now, here's an article explaining the Active/PUP, Reserve/PUP and IR rules:

 

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2017/9/3/16247956/nfl-roster-cuts-explaining-pup-nfi-ir-injury-designations

 

Quote

By rule, players on Reserve/PUP and Reserve/NFI are excluded from practicing and playing during the first six weeks of the regular season. They're allowed to do conditioning work with the trainers

 

And I acknowledge that is not from an official NFL site, but other sites corroborated this information. So, players on Reserve/PUP (which is what it's called when a player is on PUP during the regular season) they cannot work with other players..only the trainers.  Therefore, the work that ESPN reported he did during last week's practice could not have happened either until after week 6's games were over with.

[ColtsSouljah]

2 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

I'll admit, I don't pay total attention to everything the broadcasters say because, as I said before, it's not at all uncommon for them to make dumb or even outright untrue statements during the game.  Having said that, here's an article from ESPN:

 

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/20916032/andrew-luck-indianapolis-colts-practice-first-season

 

here's a critical excerpt:

 

 

 

Now, here's an article explaining the Active/PUP, Reserve/PUP and IR rules:

 

https://www.cincyjungle.com/2017/9/3/16247956/nfl-roster-cuts-explaining-pup-nfi-ir-injury-designations

 

 

And I acknowledge that is not from an official NFL site, but other sites corroborated this information. So, players on Reserve/PUP (which is what it's called when a player is on PUP during the regular season) they cannot work with other players..only the trainers.  Therefore, the work that ESPN reported he did during last week's practice could not have happened either until after week 6's games were over with.

 

You're absolutely correct about the PUP rules.

My point was that according to the reports from Sunday, in the grand scheme of Luck returning it's not going to get him back any faster if he's allowed to warm up with his teammates or not. He could warm up somewhere else and make the same physical progress.

[Jason_]

 

21 minutes ago, ColtsSouljah said:

 

You're absolutely correct about the PUP rules.

My point was that according to the reports from Sunday, in the grand scheme of Luck returning it's not going to get him back any faster if he's allowed to warm up with his teammates or not. He could warm up somewhere else and make the same physical progress.

 

But he did more than just warm up.  The quote I provided from the article I linked to explicitly says he warmed up BEFORE DOING individual drills wit the QBs and then throwing routes to the receivers.  So he warmed up...but then did more with other players, and the important part is the throwing routes to his receivers.  He has to build up his timing and chemistry with them again.  He hasn't played a game or thrown a ball in practice to his receivers since late last year.  He's absolutely going to have to regain that chemistry and that timing with them.  It doesn't matter if he can chuck the ball 90 yards if he has no timing/chemistry with the guy he's throwing to.

 

 

[ColtsBlueFL]

21 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

I'm not sure what that means.   But I've always thought Patience was a great name for a girl.

 

20 hours ago, Nadine said:

It's what I aspire to.  It is a good name

 

Much better than the other...  Patients...  

 

3 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

Reports are today he's doing route trees those are things he wouldn't be able to do if he was on PUP.  Him not being on PUP is letting him do things he wouldn't be able to do if he was.

 

1 hour ago, ColtsSouljah said:

 

You are assuming that during those two weeks he was doing practice that he otherwise could not have been.

The reports during Sunday's game said the only "practicing" he was doing last week was practicing that he could have been doing anywhere (and thus could have been doing while on the PUP list).
In other words, the practicing he was doing was not dependent upon being able to practice with the team. So, for last week's practice, it did not matter if he was off the PUP list or not according to the reports during Sunday's game.

 

No matter what, if he was on Reserve/PUP, he could not practice today (like Teddy Bridgewater still cannot).  And today-

 

"This past week, it was elementary quarterbacking: 10-yard throws to equipment trainers, routes to receivers against no defense. On Thursday, the Colts’ first team workout as they prep for Monday’s game against the Tennessee Titans, Luck was doing considerably more, starting with his warmup, when he was chucking the football 40 yards and with considerable more zip than he was a week ago. "

 

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2017/10/12/andrew-luck-ramps-up-colts-practice/758546001/

 

He may or may not have made the same progress last week if he did the routine he did away from his team (assuming he actually could, we really don't know if trainers can run routes in 'air' like NFL pro receivers, etc.). But there is no way he could/would be allowed to do what he did today.  Luck wants to be by his team and involved, and on PUP you can't really be around the team in practice in any meaningful capacity, for fear of punishment for violating PUP rules.

 

He will be ready when he is ready, Dr, Chao has predicted November for a while now and it looks like he'll be spot on once more. (Sorry @oldunclemark)  I was hoping for a Jags game start, realizing Bengals game was a real possibility. There are some here that pushed it out to the Steelers game, probably allowing for the consider patience the organization is showing in this 'process'. We still don't know for sure though, but it appears it will be sooner  rather than later at this point - barring an unforeseen setback as Luck ramps up his activity.

 

"The arm responded well to his workload this past week, well enough the Colts felt comfortable ramping up his involvement this week. He won’t play Monday in Tennessee, and it remains highly unlikely he plays a week from Sunday against the Jacksonville Jaguars, but it’s becoming evident Luck has entered the final stage of his recovery. Asked if he sees the finish line, Luck offered this: “I think I do.”

He just wasn’t ready to say when he’ll reach it.

A strong indicator will arrive when Luck begins practicing every day without hiccup. He threw Thursday, and he’ll do so again Saturday, taking Friday off to rest. The Colts are playing this with patience, ..."

[JPPT1974]

Yeah as really seems like that of Luck is getting better. But needs to not rush into things.