Chuck - Where is the line?

[jhcutt]

Call it cliche.. And I'd greatly appreciate it if the admins didn't automatically lock this topic. 

 

I've blown off my post-game steam. Tonight wasn't 100% his fault. I feel that the players have to be accountable for the decisions they make on the field as well. I don't give Pagano any credit for coaching a one good half of a game. 

 

I'm just curious though, all circumstances aside (interim HC candidates, etc) -- If the losses continue to pile up this year, consecutively. At what point, or do you believe a change will be made at all for head coach? 1-5? 1-10? Losing Andrews first game back? 

 

I've said it before and i'll continue to say it again-- Don't expect to win another game this year with Chuck Pagano making the key decisions on the field.

Losing to San Francisco would be the lowest we have been in years and my ideal point of cutting him loose, or even looking ahead - Losing Andrew's debut. I would hope that would be the final straw. 

 

Just for fun, let's play devil's advocate here. What do you think? 

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

1 minute ago, jhcutt said:

Call it cliche.. And I'd greatly appreciate it if the admins didn't automatically lock this topic. 

 

I've blown off my post-game steam. Tonight wasn't 100% his fault. I feel that the players have to be accountable for the decisions they make on the field as well. I don't give Pagano any credit for coaching a one good half of a game. 

 

I'm just curious though, all circumstances aside (interim HC candidates, etc) -- If the losses continue to pile up this year, consecutively. At what point, or do you believe a change will be made at all for head coach? 1-5? 1-10? Losing Andrews first game back? 

 

Losing to San Francisco, or looking ahead - Losing Andrew's debut, I would hope that would be the final straw. 

 

 

 

 

I could be wrong,  but I think you're going to be disappointed.....

 

I suspect Ballard will give Pagano a lot of latitude.....     under terrible circumstances this team was very competitive with a much, much better team for 2 1/2 quarters playing in perhaps the most difficult stadium for a visiting team.

 

There was a reason the Colts were a 13 point underdog just to start.....

 

[jhcutt]

I really hope that isn't the case.. and being a Kansas City resident for the past decade, I know Ballard is smarter than that. 

No offense, but who gives a crap about us being competitive for 2.5 quarters in a loud stadium?? We lost. I don't care what the line is or where you are playing, Three weeks in, Seattle isn't proving their worth as a top tier team. They barely beat a winless SF team in that stadium by 3 points and we were outscored tonight 36-3 in the 2nd half. 

 

So, i'll say again. Where is the last straw? Regardless of the deficit, or the line which is irrelevant. How many losses will it take in a row to make a change? If at all? 

 

 

 

[WoolMagnet]

I'm sure Ballard is refining his short list as we speak, and has been.

This season is hard enough without Andrew, and i dont see the advantage changing head coaches has on THIS season.

  Ballard seems like a standup guy.  I think he'll give Pagano the season unless he loses the locker room.  Im also sure his choice(s) is /are currently working on other teams.  

  Get thru the season and evaluate players and coaches.  Work Andrew back in and get these young guys some experience.  Add LBs and OL and coaches in offseason and we'll look pretty solid next year.  Its a bummer, but thats kinda how i see it playing out.

[#12.]

Here's the thing - we're one game out of first, two of our three losses are non-conference and Houston and Jacksonville have tough games next week.  If they beat the Niners and stay near or around .500 until Luck returns, in this division they're still alive, and if they're still alive, Chuck likely finishes the season.

[tfunky14]

Tied 18-18 with 2 minutes left in the third qtr.

 

Unfortunately it snowballed from there. It happens to good teams, its a tough place to play at night.

[NewEra]

I don't think it'll change till end of season. Who would take his place that we might assume would be better?

[GhostofJohnnyU]

The strip sack fumble return for a TD was the proverbial giant rock rolling down hill, and it rolled right over the Colts.

 

What's surprising is that the first half pick 6 didn't start it.

[lollygagger8]

I think Ballard will let Pagano finish out the rest of the year.

 

I believe Ballard already has some ideas for a replacement next year. 

 

[Hammer]

10 minutes ago, lollygagger8 said:

I think Ballard will let Pagano finish out the rest of the year.

 

I believe Ballard already has some ideas for a replacement next year. 

 

I don't think Ballard will have a damned thing to say about it. Until Irsay falls out of love with Pagano, nothing much will change. I'm pretty sure Ballard would have fired him before the season started, if he could have.

 

 

[RollerColt]

There's not going to be a last straw, mainly because Ballard will be looking at this logically. It won't be one defining moment for him, but looking at the bigger overall picture with all of the little moments, good and bad, put together. He will wait out the season, and then make his evaluation once it's over. 

[ColtsBlitz]

It was 1 of 2 things:

 

-The line didn't come to play in the second half. Brissett didn't officially get hit in the first half. The line fell apart. 

 

- The halftime adjustment didn't apply to any part of the team, but especially the offensive line. I doubt it's Philbin, but the only other excuse is they didn't prepare for the second half (coaches). 

[Defjamz26]

Personally, after the Rams game I thought he should be fired the next time someone dropped 40 points on us since we hold the record since 2012 for most games with 40 or more points Given up and 35+ point losses. No reason we should be giving up points like that.

 

Unfortunately I don't think Luck is going to be the saving grace this team needs either. We may have to watch this team play through the season before Pagano is gone.

[Malakai432]

I don't think he's going anywhere this season BUT if the Niners manage to embarrass the Colts @ Los it could get really ugly.  I don't think they will but with this team anything is possible.  Primarily going forward I just want to see the young fellas, new players improve.  Fortunately the division isn't that good so who knows what they could do once Luck comes back.  That being said I fear for him behind this OL.  

[Dark Superman]

People actually want Luck to come back this season and play behind this horrendous line.

Good riddance.

[ColtJ82]

I'm not totally convinced Pagano will be gone after the season. 

[BOTT]

4 minutes ago, ColtJ82 said:

I'm not totally convinced Pagano will be gone after the season. 

Why so negative?

[Myles]

I think it will be at the end of the season when we see him go.  

It was nice and surprising to see the Colts in it the whole first half.   I thought the defense looked pretty good.   Brissett looked decent.   Although, I think a big reason the Colts were in it were because most penalties and close calls (reviews) went in the Colts favor.  

[Devildog]

None. 

[RollerColt]

5 minutes ago, Myles said:

Although, I think a big reason the Colts were in it were because most penalties and close calls (reviews) went in the Colts favor.  

Very true Myles. I also wonder if Seattle didn't take us seriously coming into the game, and then got shell shocked a bit when our defense came to play.

 

I couldn't believe the score was 3 to 2 after the first quarter. I was fully expecting to at least give up 14 points by that point. 

[deedub75]

5 hours ago, #12. said:

Here's the thing - we're one game out of first, two of our three losses are non-conference and Houston and Jacksonville have tough games next week.  If they beat the Niners and stay near or around .500 until Luck returns, in this division they're still alive, and if they're still alive, Chuck likely finishes the season.

 

It really shouldn't matter what else is going on in the division.  That's should not play a role in Pagano's future. This division has been bad since he took over the team and he is still the coach because the division is so bad. Thinking Luck is going to return and immediately be able to play great after not playing in a game since January isn't something I'd hang my hat on. 

[gacoop1]

I believe this consistent mediocre performance after six years as HC doesn't justify his retention.  He's totally lost out there, doesn't make adjustments, doesn't hold his coaches accountable and this translate into blowouts.....New blood needs to be infused on this team to get some pulse.  Ballard need to make some changes now and let the new HC adjust this season and find out the teams need thru the draft.

[Cynjin]

6 hours ago, jhcutt said:

I really hope that isn't the case.. and being a Kansas City resident for the past decade, I know Ballard is smarter than that. 

No offense, but who gives a crap about us being competitive for 2.5 quarters in a loud stadium?? We lost. I don't care what the line is or where you are playing, Three weeks in, Seattle isn't proving their worth as a top tier team. They barely beat a winless SF team in that stadium by 3 points and we were outscored tonight 36-3 in the 2nd half. 

 

So, i'll say again. Where is the last straw? Regardless of the deficit, or the line which is irrelevant. How many losses will it take in a row to make a change? If at all? 

 

 

 

 

What's the point of changing mid-season?  If Ballard has a candidate in mind for head coach, he probably is not currently on the Colts staff, which means the candidate is not available for the Colts to hire.  There is just no point in changing coaches at any point during the season, clean house the day after the season ends.

[Defjamz26]

5 minutes ago, deedub75 said:

 

It really shouldn't matter what else is going on in the division.  That's should not play a role in Pagano's future. This division has been bad since he took over the team and he is still the coach because the division is so bad. Thinking Luck is going to return and immediately be able to play great after not playing in a game since January isn't something I'd hang my hat on. 

Actually it's the opposite. The division was bad maybe the first 3 years he was here. Then it got better, except for maybe the Jags. Only reason he's coach still is they kind of owed him at least 1 season without Grigson to see how much that played a factor.

[BOTT]

19 minutes ago, RollerColt said:

Very true Myles. I also wonder if Seattle didn't take us seriously coming into the game, and then got shell shocked a bit when our defense came to play.

 

I couldn't believe the score was 3 to 2 after the first quarter. I was fully expecting to at least give up 14 points by that point. 

Hawks offense is fairly putrid

[aaron11]

i do think chuck should go, but im not blaming him for this one

 

the line cant block, especially without kelly and brissett turns it over too much 

 

we have no run game, except for QB scrambles 

[IinD]

Don't recall because I was just watching and not observing the first few plays, but did Vujo cause Bond's injury?

 

If so, can someone get this guy out of here. We can't have him taking out the QB and linemen constantly..

[The Fish]

This is a theme with Chuck's squad. Blowout losses. They're all their own horror story- no two are alike, but the end results are the same.

I don't see how he could possibly be retained after this season. 

I'm not sure what the common thread I'm looking at is, but the last three games, this squad has actually averaged out into something better than projected if still pretty unimpressive (the upshot being that I don't think this is the least talented roster in the NFL- that's being said and it's wrong, not much of an upshot all things considered though..)

[Fisticuffs111]

82-15. That's how badly we've been outscored in the 2nd half this season. In just 4 games.

[ColtsBlueFL]

Pagano is in the second year of a 4 year extension.  He gets paid for this season, and through 2019.  Coaching, or fired. That's real cash out of the owners pocket.  And the next HC will require similar, or greater pay too.  More real cash.  I guess Irsay needs more butts in seats, and sell more NFL memorabilia... Oh.. wait... 

 

I think most 'football' folks feel firing a head coach mid-season doesn't really accomplish much except make fans momentarily happy.  That is, until the losing streak resumes once again.

 

IE: 2015 Dolphins.  Miami starts 1-3.  Steven Ross fires Joe Philbin and installs Dan Campbell as interim HC.  Miami wins 2 games straight and are now 3 - 3 and on a winning streak!  Momentum to make a playoff push?  Nah...  they lost 7 out of the next 10 games to finish 6 - 10. 

 

At least they hire Adam Gase for 2016, go 1 - 4 to start.  then Gase gets them on a 9 - 2 run to finish 10 - 6.  Nice!! Now this year, the Dolphins are 1 - 2, with the only win a 2 point victory over the 'we always keep it real close but lose' L.A. Chargers.  Gase and Cutler in Chicago were a fine duo (Jay's best season in his career) but seem ineffective. Would Tannehill have been better? Who knows...  winning in the NFL is hard.  All wins are good, but hard to come by... even with good coaches.

 

We all want better coaches, but we need a few better players, better execution of plays that are called, and the good players we have have must to improve and not melt down or have mental lapses; especially in critical stages of the game.

[lollygagger8]

1 hour ago, BOTT said:

Hawks offense is fairly putrid

 

Against everyone except the Colts

[Defjamz26]

14 minutes ago, The Fish said:

This is a theme with Chuck's squad. Blowout losses. They're all their own horror story- no two are alike, but the end results are the same.

I don't see how he could possibly be retained after this season. 

I'm not sure what the common thread I'm looking at is, but the last three games, this squad has actually averaged out into something better than projected if still pretty unimpressive (the upshot being that I don't think this is the least talented roster in the NFL- that's being said and it's wrong, not much of an upshot all things considered though..)

If I'm not mistaken this loss to the Seahawks makes it 14 games (including the playoffs) that an opponent has dropped 40 or more points on the Colts in the Pagano era. And I thinks it's now 7 or 8 games since 2012 we've lost by 30 or more points, which is first in the NFL.

[IinD]

7 minutes ago, Defjamz26 said:

If I'm not mistaken this loss to the Seahawks makes it 14 games (including the playoffs) that an opponent has dropped 40 or more points on the Colts in the Pagano era. And I thinks it's now 7 or 8 games since 2012 we've lost by 30 or more points, which is first in the NFL.

Without getting all doom and gloom, prepare for a few more this year. Pitt will be a 30+ loss. Hou could potentially pound us as well. Bills looking good early also.

 

Let's pray Brissett doesn't get hurt or that list of potential blowouts grows.

[Horse Shoe Heaven]

8 hours ago, jhcutt said:

Call it cliche.. And I'd greatly appreciate it if the admins didn't automatically lock this topic. 

 

I've blown off my post-game steam. Tonight wasn't 100% his fault. I feel that the players have to be accountable for the decisions they make on the field as well. I don't give Pagano any credit for coaching a one good half of a game. 

 

I'm just curious though, all circumstances aside (interim HC candidates, etc) -- If the losses continue to pile up this year, consecutively. At what point, or do you believe a change will be made at all for head coach? 1-5? 1-10? Losing Andrews first game back? 

 

I've said it before and i'll continue to say it again-- Don't expect to win another game this year with Chuck Pagano making the key decisions on the field.

Losing to San Francisco would be the lowest we have been in years and my ideal point of cutting him loose, or even looking ahead - Losing Andrew's debut. I would hope that would be the final straw. 

 

Just for fun, let's play devil's advocate here. What do you think? 

 

 

REALLY???

[RollerColt]

1 hour ago, BOTT said:

Hawks offense is fairly putrid

Very true. They seem to live or die by Wilson's legs. I'm interested to see how they fare against the Rams next weekend. 

[throwing BBZ]

kinda feel like you are the last straw.

[pgt_rob]

Wilson connected with everyone. Vontae Davis had a bad night.

[MackAttack]

8 hours ago, jhcutt said:

Call it cliche.. And I'd greatly appreciate it if the admins didn't automatically lock this topic. 

 

I've blown off my post-game steam. Tonight wasn't 100% his fault. I feel that the players have to be accountable for the decisions they make on the field as well. I don't give Pagano any credit for coaching a one good half of a game. 

 

I'm just curious though, all circumstances aside (interim HC candidates, etc) -- If the losses continue to pile up this year, consecutively. At what point, or do you believe a change will be made at all for head coach? 1-5? 1-10? Losing Andrews first game back? 

 

I've said it before and i'll continue to say it again-- Don't expect to win another game this year with Chuck Pagano making the key decisions on the field.

Losing to San Francisco would be the lowest we have been in years and my ideal point of cutting him loose, or even looking ahead - Losing Andrew's debut. I would hope that would be the final straw. 

 

Just for fun, let's play devil's advocate here. What do you think? 

 

 

I recommend you stop trying to guess esp on this forum. Some fans will never get tired of losing with pagano as our coach. He WILL get fired at some point that's the important thing just be patient. 

[a06cc]

For me it was the players that melted. Pagano was actually great yesterday. Used his timeouts and challenges correctly. That was the improvement Irsay was talking about. We have to get Luck and Kelly back on offense. The defense can only do so much.

[indyagent17]

3 hours ago, RollerColt said:

There's not going to be a last straw, mainly because Ballard will be looking at this logically. It won't be one defining moment for him, but looking at the bigger overall picture with all of the little moments, good and bad, put together. He will wait out the season, and then make his evaluation once it's over. 

I think the biggest issue is WHO is out there that is a slam dunk replacement?