Collie's Scary Statement, he is apparently in denial regarding concussions and their effects

[bayone]

Collie Thinks A Person Can Be Perfectly Fine After Nine Or Ten Concussions

Article gives studies of course refuting what Collie States

Collie on radio station KHTK in Sacramento with host Grant Napear, I wonder if Collie is continuing to feel the effects of those concussions.

Take, for example, Collie's answer to Napear's question as to whether or not he's 'scared' after having so many concussions so early in his career.

Not really. If it was one of those things that I had a history of concussions and now I’m getting worse or more-and-more frequent then it would definitely be a worry of mine in the near future, but I’ve known players who play with 9 or 10 concussions and who have lived on to have successful careers and haven’t had any symptoms later on in life, so again everyone is different. Everyone handles each injury different and hopefully down the road it’ll be perfectly fine.

I'd like to know who those people are that Collie is referring to, because studies conducted by the University of North Carolina’s Center for the Study of Retired Athletes, one of most prestigious medical centers in the country, say Collie's statement is about as ignorant as one can get on the subject.

My link

[ALuck12]

He is kind of right on that though. Look at Pujols and his wrist injury, a normal guy is out for 4-6 weeks and he is back in 2 weeks. Everyone reacts to injuries differently and we will have to wait and see how he progresses.

[bayone]

He is kind of right on that though. Look at Pujols and his wrist injury, a normal guy is out for 4-6 weeks and he is back in 2 weeks. Everyone reacts to injuries differently and we will have to wait and see how he progresses.

All react differently that is true , but i feel u err on side of caution & one cant think one is invincible. Believe me all the studies coming out are pointing to developing ongoing issues in an increasing # of cases , I am a retired Dr. My Professional Opinion though that wasnt my field

That's 1 reason why they are pouring much money into trying to make a safer helmet

But this is also interesting, studies on football players have shown its the lineman, I think study was on the OL , not sure that although dont get true concussions , actually get many miny ones all the time and evaluating brain response show they are suffering worse effects than those u see laid out.

The reason is that Collie & others are hit from the side, while the lineman get many hits to front of head and when brain bounces back & forth from a hit , its frontal ones that cause more damage with far less of a hit than brain bouncing side to side

[PonyUp]

So what should he say?

He's obviously made a choice. He loves the game and wants to play.. So he's choosing to believe something that is likely wrong to make himself feel better about his choice. Don't people do this all the time in life? I have to believe he's been told and knows the reality of things. He can't do what he does scared of what could happen. He's just doing what he feels he needs to do to get on with his career and telling himself what he needs to hear. He's got educated medical people all around him.

Also, just because he made those comments doesn't mean he and the medical staff wont do everything they can to prevent future concussions (Equipment, preparations, ect.)

[CCH]

What's he gonna say? "I'm terrified every time I step on the field, I have nightmares about getting hit in the head and it's going to affect my performance." He can't say that, and he's right everyone is different when it comes to injuries.

[Coltssouth]

I agree. It is his life and I think the maximum precautions will be taken to prevent him getting injured again. Please . . . I don't want to see him down again like last season. It scared me to death.

I also think the recovery time will factor into the seriousness of the situation if it would happen again. Not that you would ever get totally over it I don't think but the seriousness of it would be less than say 3 hits in 3 weeks.

Stay safe Austin!

[bayone]

I agree. It is his life and I think the maximum precautions will be taken to prevent him getting injured again. Please . . . I don't want to see him down again like last season. It scared me to death.

I also think the recovery time will factor into the seriousness of the situation if it would happen again. Not that you would ever get totally over it I don't think but the seriousness of it would be less than say 3 hits in 3 weeks.

Stay safe Austin!

I am not saying he shouldn't play, just saying he should be more realistic regarding future consequences that are possible, he seems to be dismissing them outright

[Coltssouth]

I know Barry. I get where you are coming from.

We love our players and want them to stay safe.

Life is full of "what if's". I hope he is making the right decision and like you I want only the best for our guys.

In your profession I'm sure you have a lot more knowledge than me about the reprecussions of what he has decided.

I just want him to stay safe.

[Nadine]

my thoughts exactly........plus you made me laugh just thinking about him saying that. I think he just misspoke a bit. Not something to make a federal case out of.

What's he gonna say? "I'm terrified every time I step on the field, I have nightmares about getting hit in the head and it's going to affect my performance." He can't say that, and he's right everyone is different when it comes to injuries.

[Andy]

Mat Hoffman, BMX rider. The guy has been in 2 coma's and has had over 20 concussions, not to mention over 300 stitches, and broken bones. It goes to show you that a man's body can withhold a lot of pain. Then again, this is the case for only 1 person

[IndyJayman]

I just hope he is ok. We need him real real bad...

[colts89]

well, maybe he is tired of all the retired talk... proabbly the only thing he gets asked

[bayone]

well, maybe he is tired of all the retired talk... proabbly the only thing he gets asked

Yes this was another question asked I just found on different link and can listen to his podcast if u want , at end of article there is a link for the podcast

Tell me as a guy who runs patterns against safeties and cornerbacks what was last year like with all the head injuries going across the middle? How did you deal with that?

“I think I have kind of put that behind me. I don’t like to dwell on it too much just because it can affect your play going across the middle and catching another ball. You don’t want things like that popping up in your mind. I try to ignore any thought I do have of it. I don’t want to watch it. People want to show me and ask how I felt during that time and what not. I just kind of brush it aside because it is one of those things that it is in the past and it’s unfortunate. I was unlucky, but I’m just looking forward to this next season and getting on with it.”

My link

[justcolts]

So what should he say?

He's obviously made a choice. He loves the game and wants to play.. So he's choosing to believe something that is likely wrong to make himself feel better about his choice. Don't people do this all the time in life? I have to believe he's been told and knows the reality of things. He can't do what he does scared of what could happen. He's just doing what he feels he needs to do to get on with his career and telling himself what he needs to hear. He's got educated medical people all around him.

Also, just because he made those comments doesn't mean he and the medical staff wont do everything they can to prevent future concussions (Equipment, preparations, ect.)

ditto

[Mouthfire]

Collie Thinks A Person Can Be Perfectly Fine After Nine Or Ten Concussions

Article gives studies of course refuting what Collie States

Collie on radio station KHTK in Sacramento with host Grant Napear, I wonder if Collie is continuing to feel the effects of those concussions.

Take, for example, Collie's answer to Napear's question as to whether or not he's 'scared' after having so many concussions so early in his career.

Not really. If it was one of those things that I had a history of concussions and now I’m getting worse or more-and-more frequent then it would definitely be a worry of mine in the near future, but I’ve known players who play with 9 or 10 concussions and who have lived on to have successful careers and haven’t had any symptoms later on in life, so again everyone is different. Everyone handles each injury different and hopefully down the road it’ll be perfectly fine.

I'd like to know who those people are that Collie is referring to, because studies conducted by the University of North Carolina’s Center for the Study of Retired Athletes, one of most prestigious medical centers in the country, say Collie's statement is about as ignorant as one can get on the subject.

My link

Meh.... UNC Medical Center isn't that particularly prestigious. Yeah, but point taken... Best evidence shows repeated concussions have a cumulative effect over time. Collie is pretty deluded.

[21isSuperman]

I don't think Collie is in denial. It's not like doctors have been documented as saying that he should not play because he is hurt and he is ignoring them and it's not like doctors are saying he still has symptoms and he is denying them. All he has said is that everyone reacts differently to injuries and he isn't worried about concussions. As long as the doctors let him play, I'm not worried.

[Thewholefnshow28]

I am sure there have been many players who have suffered multiple concussions that went on to live a good life after football, but those numbers are not very high.

He needs to go talk to the family of Dave Duerson or go talk to Kyle Turley about the affects of multiple concussions on the brain and the daily life of someone living with the results of multiple concussions.

I understand that he is not going to talk about being scared and so on, but behind closed doors with his wife I hope he is taking concussions a bit more serious. You do not need scientist to tell you causing multiple damage to your brain is not a good thing.

[buccolts]

Mat Hoffman, BMX rider. The guy has been in 2 coma's and has had over 20 concussions, not to mention over 300 stitches, and broken bones. It goes to show you that a man's body can withhold a lot of pain. Then again, this is the case for only 1 person

How old is Mat Hoffman, and what might his capacity be 10, 15, 20 years down the road.

Also, and I obviously say this without a decent google search, what lead to John Mackey's problems (proper care for ex-players aside)?

Mohammad Ali?

Yes, everyone handles these issues differently, at least in the beginning, but I'd have to believe it effects all to varying degrees.

I agree with 'what else would he say', but I also agree with the concern that he could truly be in denial, and take unnecessary risks.

[Andy]

How old is Mat Hoffman, and what might his capacity be 10, 15, 20 years down the road.

Also, and I obviously say this without a decent google search, what lead to John Mackey's problems (proper care for ex-players aside)?

Mohammad Ali?

Yes, everyone handles these issues differently, at least in the beginning, but I'd have to believe it effects all to varying degrees.

I agree with 'what else would he say', but I also agree with the concern that he could truly be in denial, and take unnecessary risks.

He's 38 now, but he got all his injuries in his late teens to late 20's. No doubt Hoffman will have problems in the future, and if Collie gets more concussions he will too. I think he can withhold 3 or 4, unless he gets a really bad concussion like Merril Hoge.

[everybodysgotone]

Meh.... UNC Medical Center isn't that particularly prestigious. Yeah, but point taken... Best evidence shows repeated concussions have a cumulative effect over time. Collie is pretty deluded.

My ten years of reviewing medical records, serving interrogatory questions, reviewing MD deposition testimony in NC....all say otherwise. Do your homework. To think the collective opinion coming out of UNC on this matter is easily dismissed is ignorant.

Collie isn't deluded. If he's decided to step back on the field this is the only public media stance he can make. Period. We'll see from his on-field actions how he really feels.

[Mouthfire]

My ten years of reviewing medical records, serving interrogatory questions, reviewing MD deposition testimony in NC....all say otherwise. Do your homework. To think the collective opinion coming out of UNC on this matter is easily dismissed is ignorant.

Collie isn't deluded. If he's decided to step back on the field this is the only public media stance he can make. Period. We'll see from his on-field actions how he really feels.

No offense, but I don't think you read my post closely enough. I was merely pointing out that UNC wasn't one of the most prestigious institutes in the country (which it isn't). That honor belongs to the "big dogs", such as Harvard, Mayo, Hopkins, and Cleveland Clinic. As a physician and clinical researcher at an academic medical institution, I think I would know the difference. Heck, even UNC's next door neighbor, Duke University, is far more prestigious than they are.

Don't get me wrong. They're a really good medical institute, but they're "second tier", at best. And I do agree with their assessment regarding concussions.

[Mouthfire]

My ten years of reviewing medical records, serving interrogatory questions, reviewing MD deposition testimony in NC....all say otherwise. Do your homework. To think the collective opinion coming out of UNC on this matter is easily dismissed is ignorant.

Collie isn't deluded. If he's decided to step back on the field this is the only public media stance he can make. Period. We'll see from his on-field actions how he really feels.

No offense, but I don't think you read my post closely enough.  I was merely pointing out that UNC wasn't one of the most prestigious institutes in the country (which it isn't).  That honor belongs to the "big dogs", such as Harvard, Mayo, Hopkins, and Cleveland Clinic.  As a physician and clinical researcher at an academic medical institution, I think I would know the difference.  Heck, even UNC's next door neighbor, Duke University, is far more prestigious than they are.

Don't get me wrong.  They're a really good medical institute, but they're "second tier", at best.  And I do agree with their assessment regarding concussions.

[bayone]

My ten years of reviewing medical records, serving interrogatory questions, reviewing MD deposition testimony in NC....all say otherwise. Do your homework. To think the collective opinion coming out of UNC on this matter is easily dismissed is ignorant.

Collie isn't deluded. If he's decided to step back on the field this is the only public media stance he can make. Period. We'll see from his on-field actions how he really feels.

Shawn, as said, I want him to step back on field and be fine, but if gets more concussions , I hope he is just saying that to be in a positive attitude so doesnt think about it when going across the middle , etc, etc, but knows privately that the more u get the chance increase on later problems in life

[bayone]

No offense, but I don't think you read my post closely enough. I was merely pointing out that UNC wasn't one of the most prestigious institutes in the country (which it isn't). That honor belongs to the "big dogs", such as Harvard, Mayo, Hopkins, and Cleveland Clinic. As a physician and clinical researcher at an academic medical institution, I think I would know the difference. Heck, even UNC's next door neighbor, Duke University, is far more prestigious than they are.

Don't get me wrong. They're a really good medical institute, but they're "second tier", at best. And I do agree with their assessment regarding concussions.

u did note this so just forget about whether a good instiution or not that wasnt at all part of your take on the post from how I read u

U NOTED

Yeah, but point taken... Best evidence shows repeated concussions have a cumulative effect over time. Collie is pretty deluded.

As I just said to another poster

I want him to step back on field and be fine, but if gets more concussions , I hope he is just saying that to be in a positive attitude so doesnt think about it when going across the middle , etc, etc, but knows privately that the more u get the chance increase on later problems in life

[everybodysgotone]

No offense, but I don't think you read my post closely enough.  I was merely pointing out that UNC wasn't one of the most prestigious institutes in the country (which it isn't).  That honor belongs to the "big dogs", such as Harvard, Mayo, Hopkins, and Cleveland Clinic.  As a physician and clinical researcher at an academic medical institution, I think I would know the difference.  Heck, even UNC's next door neighbor, Duke University, is far more prestigious than they are.

Don't get me wrong.  They're a really good medical institute, but they're "second tier", at best.  And I do agree with their assessment regarding concussions.

UNC and DUMC are both learning medical institutions, therefore staff turnover is a constant like it is everywhere else - I don't need an education on how things work. It boils down to individual physicians and facilities and what they can do for a particular patient at any point in time. "Reputation" can have very little meaning....I've seen that played out time & again. I can recall several cases right off the top of my head where MDs from DUMC referred patients/clients to UNC for care because they would receive better care there for their particularly complex medical issue. As a person that has disected and seen up-close how beurocracy, bias, fear, personal issues, cash flow, and certain other alliances, etc., play such a huge role in medical care people receive/don't receive....I too can speak from much experience. Your so-called "big dogs" list is extremely short and the level of care one could receive there, depending on the issue, could be matched and sometimes surpassed at any number of facilities across the country. Period. UPMC, Pittsburgh and CHKD, Norfolk, are a couple more that leap to mind without having to ponder much at all in connection with specific situations in years past.

[everybodysgotone]

Shawn, as said, I want him to step back on field and be fine, but if gets more concussions , I hope he is just saying that to be in a positive attitude so doesnt think about it when going across the middle , etc, etc, but knows privately that the more u get the chance increase on later problems in life

Exactly, Barry. There's no way Collie is blowing his situation off. It's a focal point for the league and I'm quite sure he's heard enough for a lifetime from team Drs., the good folks at UNC, his wife and family......and probably a lot of others. All of the other players in the league knows this too. DBs are gonna test him to find out where he really is regardless of what he says to the media. But "deluded"....that's ridiculous....and you'd think a clinical Dr./researcher like mouthfire would know the difference fer cryin' out loud.

[Mouthfire]

Exactly, Barry. There's no way Collie is blowing his situation off. It's a focal point for the league and I'm quite sure he's heard enough for a lifetime from team Drs., the good folks at UNC, his wife and family......and probably a lot of others. All of the other players in the league knows this too. DBs are gonna test him to find out where he really is regardless of what he says to the media. But "deluded"....that's ridiculous....and you'd think a clinical Dr./researcher like mouthfire would know the difference fer cryin' out loud.

A bit testy, are we?

My only two points:

1) There is a certain disconnect between what Collie is saying and what the medical literature states. If he's just being political, then so be it. But I sure hope he isn't truly blowing off the multiple concussions.

2) Perhaps a bit irrelevant to the discussion, but UNC was being billed as "one of the most prestigious institutions in the country", which it really isn't widely regarded as such. Perhaps I'm being a bit anal in pointing it out, but I'd rather have UNC's research stand on it's own merits, rather than on exaggerated accolades. And yes, my short list of truly elite medical centers is incomplete, and probably does include both DMC and UPMC, as well as other places like UPenn.

But again, I'm perhaps I'm just being a bit of a medical snob. UNC is actually quite a fine institution. It just isn't one of the elite ones.

[braveheartcolt]

Come on guys, join The Lancet forum or go watch some episodes of House......

[bayone]

A bit testy, are we?

My only two points:

1) There is a certain disconnect between what Collie is saying and what the medical literature states. If he's just being political, then so be it. But I sure hope he isn't truly blowing off the multiple concussions.

2) Perhaps a bit irrelevant to the discussion, but UNC was being billed as "one of the most prestigious institutions in the country", which it really isn't widely regarded as such. Perhaps I'm being a bit anal in pointing it out, but I'd rather have UNC's research stand on it's own merits, rather than on exaggerated accolades. And yes, my short list of truly elite medical centers is incomplete, and probably does include both DMC and UPMC, as well as other places like UPenn.

But again, I'm perhaps I'm just being a bit of a medical snob. UNC is actually quite a fine institution. It just isn't one of the elite ones.

Tell u a story & make it fast, My mom probably had a brain tumor for a good 10 to 15 years before diagnosis, Initially all tests by NYU, then when moved to Mich , many Drs from U of M, all had tunnel vision & insisted all symptoms were due to a car accident although myself, disabled ( 1988 ) ankle reconstructive surgeon , & Brother a Top Diagnostic radiologist insisted intial symtoms started earlier, 1 symptom was increasingly hard to swallow , so they dilated her esophagus with balloon & also tried to stimulate throat muscles with electric TORTURE pulses for someone then in the upper 80's, now my brother and i got together, took all symptoms, said cranial nerves 9-12 involved, took her to my neurologist, 1 of best in country also trained at U of M , who I should of to begin with, agreed , wrote an RX for MRI of tiny spot in brain where nerves cross, I sent her out of state to my brother who ran the MRI and he found the tumor at that spot

I dont care what institution we are talking about, all are individual cases, and I pity the family that doesnt have 2 kids in it that are Drs to make sure a diagnosis is found to act on when the system fails u

[bayone]

Come on guys, join The Lancet forum or go watch some episodes of House......

Love The reply

[everybodysgotone]

Come on guys, join The Lancet forum or go watch some episodes of House......

Will try and keep it dumbed down for ya.

[wercolts]

I am not saying he shouldn't play, just saying he should be more realistic regarding future consequences that are possible, he seems to be dismissing them outright

Seems to me it's his defensive mechanism. Doesn't want to be thinking about the what ifs, just wants to play at the highest level possible. Hard to do if you're afraid.

[braveheartcolt]

Will try and keep it dumbed down for ya.

No need sir. I'm not remotely interested in your medical musings:

A. Because it's boring

B. This is a football forum

C. It's giving me a headache

Cheers

[GoPats]

I don't have a particularly extensive medical background... at one point when I was working in the outdoor industry I had a WFR (Wilderness First Responder) certification, but others here far exceed my knowledge and experience.

That said, I think this is more of a common sense issue. Collie is somewhat right in that "everyone is different" when it comes to medical issues. Some people smoke two packs a day and never get cancer. Others never touch tobacco and do.

But as far as risk factors go, you've got to look at the facts. Collie suffered multiple concussions in a very short time period last season. And no matter what uniform the guy wears, you don't want to see him jeopardize his and his family's future. I'm sure he'll listen to his docs and will make the right choice, even if it's a hard one.

[braveheartcolt]

I don't have a particularly extensive medical background... at one point when I was working in the outdoor industry I had a WFR (Wilderness First Responder) certification, but others here far exceed my knowledge and experience.

That said, I think this is more of a common sense issue. Collie is somewhat right in that "everyone is different" when it comes to medical issues. Some people smoke two packs a day and never get cancer. Others never touch tobacco and do.

But as far as risk factors go, you've got to look at the facts. Collie suffered multiple concussions in a very short time period last season. And no matter what uniform the guy wears, you don't want to see him jeopardize his and his family's future. I'm sure he'll listen to his docs and will make the right choice, even if it's a hard one.

He will. I do object to those saying he must hang up his cleats. There are millions of people who risk their lives every day doing their job. And probably thousands die world wide doing it. He's old enough to make up his own mind.

[-JJ-]

Concussions are NOW linked to Lou Gehrig's disease (who was beaned 7 times)

ALS. They've proven it now and can be fatal over the years as the body disinegrates with the mind intact which is a horrible slow death.

Some ex-football players have died from this. They found a fluid in the skull that gets in the spinal col. and causes it.

Concussions are for real NOW!

[bayone]

Concussions are NOW linked to Lou Gehrig's disease (who was beaned 7 times)

ALS. They've proven it now and can be fatal over the years as the body disinegrates with the mind intact which is a horrible slow death.

Some ex-football players have died from this. They found a fluid in the skull that gets in the spinal col. and causes it.

Concussions are for real NOW!

ALS is fatal, I personally know of someone who went to Dr Kevorkien for assisted suicide for it

& its a Terribly debilitating disease u just dont want to live through

[bayone]

Concussions are NOW linked to Lou Gehrig's disease (who was beaned 7 times)

ALS. They've proven it now and can be fatal over the years as the body disinegrates with the mind intact which is a horrible slow death.

Some ex-football players have died from this. They found a fluid in the skull that gets in the spinal col. and causes it.

Concussions are for real NOW!

ALS is fatal, I personally know of someone who went to Dr Kevorkien for assisted suicide for it

& its a Terribly debilitating disease u just dont want to live through

[ReMeDy]

I've got half a mind to slap Collie upside the head... if it wouldn't give him another concussion.

[everybodysgotone]

No need sir. I'm not remotely interested in your medical musings:

A. Because it's boring

B. This is a football forum

C. It's giving me a headache

Cheers

Tell ya what braveheart, there's a real simple neuro test I believe would benefit you & your conditions ^ here. Maybe give you some feeling for things as they relate on various levels. Care to learn more?