Props to the coaches

[NannyMcafee]

It's just another form of inconsistency from the pagano coaching staff. One day we do ok. The next week we get blown out by the rams. 

 

I wont say kudos to this coaching staff until we can put true consistency together. It's awesome when we play well, we just can't play well for a whole 60 minutes week in and week out. 

 

The day the colts get beat beat because the other team was actually better and not because we shot ourselves in the foot, is the day that ill consider giving pagano kudos for losing. 

 

But right now, he just consistently sucks. 

 

He has gone so far down hill it's going to take a whole season of complete 60 minute games with consistency that I'll be ok that he is our coach. And I just don't see that ever happening. 

 

#thewritingonthewall 

 

 

[Roger]

15 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

That's tricky. The here and now changes from week to week. If we are going to talk about an owners impact, then it's not really fair to only allow how a person (fan) feels today, based on a few current wins or losses. We need to look at the history of decisions, and how those decisions ultimately impacted the organization. 

 

I believe Jim Irsay's historical success places him in high regards amongst NFL owners. 

I doubt Irsay is held in high regard by any of the other owners.  He's an embarrassment in his personal dealings.

[colts2dasuperbowl]

D was good, O was not.

I didn't like the O playcalling because when you start a QB that has never started a game in his pro career, you don't make him throw 40 times. You run the ball. When Frank Gore only gets 14 carries and your QB who is a first time starter, who got traded to this team 3 weeks ago throw it out 40 times, there is something wrong. W or L I would've felt much better if we had a different game plan.

[BlueShoe]

3 minutes ago, Roger said:

I doubt Irsay is held in high regard by any of the other owners.  He's an embarrassment in his personal dealings.

 

I am quite sure you are wrong about that. 

 

[Roger]

1 minute ago, BlueShoe said:

 

I am quite sure you are wrong about that. 

 

As I am certain that you are wrong.

[NannyMcafee]

10 hours ago, BlueShoe said:

 

I disagree with almost everything you have written.

 

If Pagano takes this team to the playoffs then he is likely getting a new deal.

 

In his FIVE years, Pagano has never had a losing season. Average coaches do not sport winning records. 

 

Just because you want something to happen, it doesn't mean it will. Like it or not, Pagano still controls his own destiny.

 

pagano doesn't control his own destiny. Pretending he's not on the hot seat just because you think he isn't doesn't mean he isn't sitting on that seat. 

 

Have you forgotten what Peyton Manning did for his HCs? Can you honestly look at Andrew and say the same thing isn't happening? Sure. You could point at 2015 and say Pagano has won without luck. He has also lost with Luck. But Andrew is no Peyton. And can only carry this team so far on his shoulders while getting the snot knocked out of him. 

 

I also disagree that he will get "a new deal" if this team goes to the playoffs. He may not get fired. But that doesn't call for an extension either. 

 

The best way to look at Pagano is in games that really matter the most. Like the AFCCG. Or, against the Texans when the playoffs were on the line. The dude COACHED a complete meltdown in both games. He has a lot more control over our wins and losses than you want to give him credit for. 

 

Look at Purdues culture change. It is looking really good for them with their current HCs style of coaching. 

 

People dont want to fire someone for messing up occasionally. That would be ludicrous. They want to fire Chuck Pagano because he continues to make the SAME MISTAKES that he has always made. 

 

Anyone who doesn't learn from their mistakes is doomed to repeat them. And I for one am tired of watching pagano repeat the same mistakes over and over. 

[Buck Showalter]

Just looking at some of the more objective aspects of the team under Pagano's tutelage, the Colts have now had 4 consecutive 0-2 starts to the season and outside of a few games the team has seemed under prepared & started flat, still after several seasons, this aspect has not been addressed efficiently. 

 

Without looking at very specific x's & o's the offensive game plans seem to be neglecting or under-utilizing team strengths & everyone knows how the defense has performed.

 

Also, if you compare the Pagano regime to the Dungy years one thing that stands out significantly is the difference in time-management. Watching the Dungy/Peyton years was almost like a master's course in how to efficiently run time-management. However, under Pagano there are often questionable time-outs and seemingly poor use of 2 minute drills etc. Another aspect between the Dungy years and the past few seasons under Pagano are the increase in penalties, Dungy's teams were disciplined and were one of the fewest penalized teams in the league, Pagano's are not  as well disciplined and do not show the same level of composure on the field. 

 

I have never been a Pagano hater, & have hoped nothing but success for the man, however the facts seem to point to Pagano being somewhat out of his element, and the Colts will probably need to do better at HC to be a true contender...

 

 

 

 

 

 

[shasta519]

17 minutes ago, colts2dasuperbowl said:

D was good, O was not.

I didn't like the O playcalling because when you start a QB that has never started a game in his pro career, you don't make him throw 40 times. You run the ball. When Frank Gore only gets 14 carries and your QB who is a first time starter, who got traded to this team 3 weeks ago throw it out 40 times, there is something wrong. W or L I would've felt much better if we had a different game plan.

 

And if you are going throw it that much, ~25% of those attempts should be dumpoffs to RBs. The playcalling resulted in 4 total targets for RB...and only one to Mack.

[colts2dasuperbowl]

Just now, shastamasta said:

 

And if you are going throw it that much, ~25% of those attempts should be dumpoffs to RBs. The playcalling resulted in 4 total targets for RB...and only one to Mack.

Yup. that is what I'm talking about. You let your first time qb make safe decisions, which is to throw it out to TEs and RBs and not force throws to tight coverage.

[DaColts85]

20 minutes ago, colts2dasuperbowl said:

D was good, O was not.

I didn't like the O playcalling because when you start a QB that has never started a game in his pro career, you don't make him throw 40 times. You run the ball. When Frank Gore only gets 14 carries and your QB who is a first time starter, who got traded to this team 3 weeks ago throw it out 40 times, there is something wrong. W or L I would've felt much better if we had a different game plan.

Are you familiar with who our QB is?  This was not his first start.  Playcalling could have been a little different yes...but for the most part it was good.  Actually something they need to continue to do for JB and Luck.  JB used his dump off's more than Luck which I liked.

[colts2dasuperbowl]

4 minutes ago, DaColts85 said:

Are you familiar with who our QB is?  This was not his first start.  Playcalling could have been a little different yes...but for the most part it was good.  Actually something they need to continue to do for JB and Luck.  JB used his dump off's more than Luck which I liked.

I guess I was wrong about that. 3rd time starter. I didn't know he started 2 games in NE. Thanks for correcting it.

 

[DaColts85]

4 minutes ago, colts2dasuperbowl said:

I guess I was wrong about that. 3rd time starter. I didn't know he started 2 games in NE. Thanks for correcting it.

 

My bad for coming off like that...just read it again and I sound like an *.  Sorry for that!

[colts2dasuperbowl]

Just now, DaColts85 said:

My bad for coming off like that...just read it again and I sound like an *.  Sorry for that!

nah, I didn't do a proper research before posting it =)

I just thought Grappolo was the backup and JB being a second year and all just made me assumed that he only started in preseason games. hehe

 

[Dingus McGirt]

1 hour ago, BlueShoe said:

 

You think this is rock bottom?

 

LOL. 

 

Dear Dingus, you have clearly been sheltered. 

A fan since 1967.  I know what the bottom looks like for the team wearing the horse shoe.  This team is pretty darn close.

 

[BlueShoe]

2 minutes ago, Dingus McGirt said:

A fan since 1967.  I know what the bottom looks like for the team wearing the horse shoe.  This team is pretty darn close.

 

 

LOL. 

 

No. As an avid Indy Colts fan since 1984, I can assure you this team is no where near hitting rock bottom. 

[Dingus McGirt]

5 minutes ago, BlueShoe said:

 

LOL. 

 

No. As an avid Indy Colts fan since 1984, I can assure you this team is no where near hitting rock bottom. 

Dunno sir.  I could have sworn I saw sand on some uniform bottoms yesterday.

[JTrouble]

2 hours ago, ColtsBlueFL said:

 

Not going to get in the Pags is great or horrid debate, but with all due respect, that Browns team was/is actually now the Baltimore Ravens.  They moved the year Bill Belichik's contract was ended (fired technically by the soon to be Ravens, for 1996) and they won the Super Bowl a few years later (2000).  I guess it could be said Bill helped set the foundation for that Ravens team while they were the Browns.

Yes I know the history  My point was that I think BB is one heckuva coach. I would also say that I was happy with Pags the first 3 years. I do think there was some overachieving going on during those years but I'm not complaining  The past 3 years though I've not been a happy camper lol. I also know the whole "no losing seasons" argument but to me NOT making the playoffs is a losing season. Especially in this division. The trajectory arrow is pointing down and has been for some time. I know what I see on game day & I've seen enough of Pags, time to move on IMO.

[BlueShoe]

3 hours ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

pagano doesn't control his own destiny. Pretending he's not on the hot seat just because you think he isn't doesn't mean he isn't sitting on that seat. 

 

Have you forgotten what Peyton Manning did for his HCs? Can you honestly look at Andrew and say the same thing isn't happening? Sure. You could point at 2015 and say Pagano has won without luck. He has also lost with Luck. But Andrew is no Peyton. And can only carry this team so far on his shoulders while getting the snot knocked out of him. 

 

I also disagree that he will get "a new deal" if this team goes to the playoffs. He may not get fired. But that doesn't call for an extension either. 

 

The best way to look at Pagano is in games that really matter the most. Like the AFCCG. Or, against the Texans when the playoffs were on the line. The dude COACHED a complete meltdown in both games. He has a lot more control over our wins and losses than you want to give him credit for. 

 

Look at Purdues culture change. It is looking really good for them with their current HCs style of coaching. 

 

People dont want to fire someone for messing up occasionally. That would be ludicrous. They want to fire Chuck Pagano because he continues to make the SAME MISTAKES that he has always made. 

 

Anyone who doesn't learn from their mistakes is doomed to repeat them. And I for one am tired of watching pagano repeat the same mistakes over and over. 

 

Woa! Slow down, McFly. You're going to pull something. 

 

Chuck Pagano absolutely controls his own destiny. If he wins and keeps this team united then it would be foolish to get rid of him. Other teams would be lining up for his services if he makes the 2017 Colts season a successful campaign. 

 

That said, Pagano is certainly on the hot seat, and has been for a couple of years now. 

 

Winning or losing gets you off the hot seat, and it could go either way for Chuck. 

[BlueShoe]

3 hours ago, Roger said:

As I am certain that you are wrong.

 

Both of us can't be right. Stop in at the next owners meeting and ask them. 

[BlueShoe]

2 hours ago, Dingus McGirt said:

Dunno sir.  I could have sworn I saw sand on some uniform bottoms yesterday.

 

LOL. 

[Myles]

4 hours ago, NannyMcafee said:

It's just another form of inconsistency from the pagano coaching staff. One day we do ok. The next week we get blown out by the rams. 

 

I wont say kudos to this coaching staff until we can put true consistency together. It's awesome when we play well, we just can't play well for a whole 60 minutes week in and week out. 

 

The day the colts get beat beat because the other team was actually better and not because we shot ourselves in the foot, is the day that ill consider giving pagano kudos for losing. 

 

But right now, he just consistently sucks. 

 

He has gone so far down hill it's going to take a whole season of complete 60 minute games with consistency that I'll be ok that he is our coach. And I just don't see that ever happening. 

 

#thewritingonthewall 

 

 

That is a good point.  

[Myles]

4 hours ago, shastamasta said:

 

And if you are going throw it that much, ~25% of those attempts should be dumpoffs to RBs. The playcalling resulted in 4 total targets for RB...and only one to Mack.

The way the WR's played, the RB's should have been targeted more.  

 

If the Colts make the playoffs, maybe Pagano should keep his job.   But frankly, it is not going to happen.   Cleveland and Seattle coming up.  I think they'll be 1-3 at best.   The Browns haven't been playing too bad, although they are also 0-2.   

[BOTT]

16 hours ago, BlueShoe said:

If the Colts fan base made the decisions then we would fire at least one coach after every loss. 

 

In other words, the fans would drive this team into the ground, much like the Cleveland Browns over the past decade or so. 

 

The Browns franchise finally figured it out, and understood the importance of keeping Hue Jackson around. They're investing into their coaching staff.

 

A quick way to become the laughing stock of the NFL is to make a habit of firing people. 

.....or hiring the wrong people 

[BOTT]

4 hours ago, NannyMcafee said:

 

pagano doesn't control his own destiny. Pretending he's not on the hot seat just because you think he isn't doesn't mean he isn't sitting on that seat. 

 

Have you forgotten what Peyton Manning did for his HCs? Can you honestly look at Andrew and say the same thing isn't happening? Sure. You could point at 2015 and say Pagano has won without luck. He has also lost with Luck. But Andrew is no Peyton. And can only carry this team so far on his shoulders while getting the snot knocked out of him. 

 

I also disagree that he will get "a new deal" if this team goes to the playoffs. He may not get fired. But that doesn't call for an extension either. 

 

The best way to look at Pagano is in games that really matter the most. Like the AFCCG. Or, against the Texans when the playoffs were on the line. The dude COACHED a complete meltdown in both games. He has a lot more control over our wins and losses than you want to give him credit for. 

 

Look at Purdues culture change. It is looking really good for them with their current HCs style of coaching. 

 

People dont want to fire someone for messing up occasionally. That would be ludicrous. They want to fire Chuck Pagano because he continues to make the SAME MISTAKES that he has always made. 

 

Anyone who doesn't learn from their mistakes is doomed to repeat them. And I for one am tired of watching pagano repeat the same mistakes over and over. 

Considering the talent around him and the coaching, what Andrew has done is more impressive than what Manning did early in his career.

[Myles]

18 minutes ago, BOTT said:

Considering the talent around him and the coaching, what Andrew has done is more impressive than what Manning did early in his career.

Tough call.   What Luck has done with his talent, Manning did by masking some coaching deficiencies.   Or maybe by adding to the coaching.   He was the offensive coordinator on the field which isn't common in the NFL.  

[BOTT]

1 hour ago, Myles said:

Tough call.   What Luck has done with his talent, Manning did by masking some coaching deficiencies.   Or maybe by adding to the coaching.   He was the offensive coordinator on the field which isn't common in the NFL.  

So your saying Manning masked the coaching defincies of guys like Tom Moore and Howard Mudd?

[crazycolt1]

On ‎9‎/‎17‎/‎2017 at 9:41 PM, compuls1v3 said:

With all the negativity from the first game, I really felt they did a good job of 1) Giving us the best chance to win by starting JB 2) Getting the better performance out of the defense (Melvin and Mathias were stepping it up from last week) 3) throwing that challenge flag, 4) calling that time out to ice the kicker. Overall, the forum, in general seems much more at ease this week, and I believe it was largely so to the coaching.

This thread has turned into a bash Pagano thread. The bashers hi jack and derail most every thread.

[crazycolt1]

8 hours ago, Roger said:

I doubt Irsay is held in high regard by any of the other owners.  He's an embarrassment in his personal dealings.

Horse dung

[gacoop1]

This team needs an overhaul.  Pagano is the main one that needs to go.  Bring in a new HC with his people, and you'll see a big difference in the philosophy, play calling and the culture of having a winner......Can't blame the fans if they're bashing Pagano, because I see the same thing the way his coaching.....Bellichick won't let this happen, he holds his players accountable and not pat them lovingly on the head.  These players are adults, they don't need to be enabled, cuddled and pat on the butt if they make a bonehead play. Play calling sucks, Mack is much younger than Gore, I say trade Gore and start developing the younger Mack.  I guess they're satisfied having Gore gained 40 yards a game, that isn't going to cut it to win ball games.....Again, Pagano has to go.

[Freenyfan102]

 

 

Really We are 0-2 again for the 4 year in a ROW, In a freaking Row

[Myles]

12 hours ago, BOTT said:

So your saying Manning masked the coaching defincies of guys like Tom Moore and Howard Mudd?

Yes.  

[jimmy g]

On 9/18/2017 at 8:43 AM, BlueShoe said:

 

That would make perfect sense. Why not fire a coach with several double-digit winning seasons in a row? That will make other coaches want to sign with you. 

 

Fire someone after every loss! Make a game out if it. Line them up in the center of town and have them play Duck, Duck, Goose. 

 

For the record, I am a Hue Jackson fan and have been for a long time. He got a raw deal with the Raiders. 

I know im old; i started school in 1959, and Ike was President. I understand that things have changed in this world.  I don't know how modern math adds 3 plus 2 by their relationship to 10.

 

But your logic of 'we shouldn't fire Pags because BB started 5 and 5,' or 'because the Chiefs didn't win Super Bowls after they fired Marty Schottenheimer' has me just thinking one word:

 

Wow.....

 

 

[BlueShoe]

7 minutes ago, jimmy g said:

I know im old; i started school in 1959, and Ike was President. I understand that things have changed in this world.  I don't know how modern math adds 3 plus 2 by their relationship to 10.

 

But your logic of 'we shouldn't fire Pags because BB started 5 and 5,' or 'because the Chiefs didn't win Super Bowls after they fired Marty Schottenheimer' has me just thinking one word:

 

Wow.....

 

 

 

I am not sure what math you're referring to. You must be reading someone else's posts and mine, and lumping them together. Your reply seems bizarre to me so I am not really sure.

 

I never said 3 plus 2 equals 10. Have no idea what you even mean by that. I only mentioned Belichick because at one time the Patriots fans wanted him fired too. The Chiefs were a wreck of a team after they fired Marty, and struggled to regain an identity for quite some time. 

 

I am college educated with a few decades of work experience to boot. I am capable of following any logic you could produce. So where is your logic? And what are you talking about?

[Roger]

3+2=10 in base five.

[ÅÐØNϧ 1]

I'm not gonna congratulate coaches who are a day late & a dollar short . Had the Colts managed to WIN then i would feel differently , 

IMO there was many good signs the team looked better especially the defense but unfortunately its a 60 minute game & we failed to get a WIN this game was winnable we snatched defeat from the jaws of VICTORY.. 

 

Maybe Pagano & the Colts should copy Bellicheck & the patriots  he sucked his first 5 years & turned it around with a decade of cheating & now he's the best coach out there who ever said cheaters did'nt prosper ?   

[lollygagger8]

The best thing they did was start Hooker and Q Wilson. Those two are our future!!! 

 

 

[Roger]

12 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

This thread has turned into a bash Pagano thread. The bashers hi jack and derail most every thread.

People are just giving Pagano his props.

[NannyMcafee]

12 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

This thread has turned into a bash Pagano thread. The bashers hi jack and derail most every thread.

 

If you mean threads that have to do with the coaching staff then I agree. Otherwise using the word "derail" and "most", is inaccurate. 

 

If our head coach is reason behind mediocrity then I see no reason to talk good about his ability to coach. 

 

Not one person here has bashed pagano as a person. It has all been solely about his ability as a head coach. In fact almost all of the bashers agree that pagano is a hell of a person. He just can't coach. There's no reason to defend his coaching ability. Zero. None. Zilch. Wins and losses don't define a coach (although they certainly help). It's in game adjustments. I have seen some really ugly wins in the NFL. And I don't go saying that team is great because they got a W. 

 

So until the guy is gone, and is replaced with someone who can learn and grow, then you will continue to see coaching staff threads become "derailed" by the haters. Which truly in the sense of the word aren't really hating the man himself. Would you honestly support any HC the colts have? What is your limit? Do we have to become bottom feeders in the league for you to finally throw in the towel? Some of us would like to avoid that. 

 

I just don't understand your dislike for many on this forums dislike for Paganos coaching style. 

 

[Buck Showalter]

21 hours ago, Roger said:

I doubt Irsay is held in high regard by any of the other owners.  He's an embarrassment in his personal dealings.

I don't know. I'd say Irsay has been a pretty solid figure/owner throughout the leagues growth over the past 20 years, & in the process he has been a fairly visible figure as well (maybe it seems that way to me being a Colts fan)...

However, outside of Kraft, Jerry Jones, or the late Al Davis, I'd say Irsay is as "visible" an owner as they come & I'd take him over the others anyday...

 

As far as other owners respecting Irsay, who knows, but I fail to see how Irsay has been bad for the league, so I'll assume most other owners are concerned with their bottom line & their own brand first, and then the shield/ league second. So if there is any real animosity between owners (& I'm sure there is some between most) I'd bet some of that boils down to a hint of jealousy over Irsays success during the Peyton/ Polian/Dungy era...

 

Anyways, while Irsay is unconventional, has obviously fought his own demons, & makes the occassional twitter gaff, he is also a guy who wears his heart on his sleeve and is significantly generous to the community of Indy. 

In my opinion the good far out ways the bad, but if that's an embarrassment, so be it...

I'll still root for the guy...

[Roger]

1 minute ago, Buck Showalter said:

I don't know. I'd say Irsay has been a pretty solid figure/owner throughout the leagues growth over the past 20 years, & in the process he has been a fairly visible figure as well (maybe it seems that way to me being a Colts fan)...

However, outside of Kraft, Jerry Jones, or the late Al Davis, I'd say Irsay is as "visible" an owner as they come & I'd take him over the others anyday...

 

As far as other owners respecting Irsay, who knows, but I fail to see how Irsay has been bad for the league, so I'll assume most other owners are concerned with their bottom line & their own brand first, and then the shield/ league second. So if there is any real animosity between owners (& I'm sure there is some between most) I'd bet some of that boils down to a hint of jealousy over Irsays success during the Peyton/ Polian/Dingy era...

 

Anyways, while Irsay is unconventional, has obviously fought his own demons, & makes the occassional twitter gaff, he is also a guy who wears his heart on his sleeve and is significantly generous to the community of Indy. 

In my opinion the good far out ways the bad, but if that's an embarrassment, so be it...

I'll still root for the guy...

While we see things differently, I think you have solid reasons to feel as you do.