Already tired of Pagano

[MFT5]

49 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Your comment about cancer saving Pagano's job puts this whole comment in the toilet.

Pagano took this team farther into the playoffs and on to the AFC championship game after coming back from cancer. For you to even bring that to the table is asinine.

 

most ppl dnt like facts I understand nor does your comment make me retract anything I said. You found a thought en my post that had an emotion stringent and acknowledged the rest was rationally merited. You dnt think the same mind that raised the question of how this was acceptable couldn't bring up that cancer is apart of the caveat that is Chucks career

 

... Do I want anyone to have cancer, ofcourse not but am I going to pretend like it woujdnt go over well if we fired him shortly after #ChuckStrong 

 

Tell me what on the field has changed since Chucks been here & I'll retract my statement ...

 

Btw new chick doesn't accept excuses neither will I 

[Jason_]

15 minutes ago, MFT5 said:

 

most ppl dnt like facts I understand nor does your comment make me retract anything I said. You found a thought en my post that had an emotion stringent and acknowledged the rest was rationally merited. You dnt think the same mind that raised the question of how this was acceptable couldn't bring up that cancer is apart of the caveat that is Chucks career

 

... Do I want anyone to have cancer, ofcourse not but am I going to pretend like it woujdnt go over well if we fired him shortly after #ChuckStrong 

 

Tell me what on the field has changed since Chucks been here & I'll retract my statement ...

 

Btw new chick doesn't accept excuses neither will I 

 

why would they have fired him shortly after ChuckStrong?  He got cancer during his first year as HC.   There was no reason whatsoever to fire him once he got back.  

[crazycolt1]

24 minutes ago, MFT5 said:

 

most ppl dnt like facts I understand nor does your comment make me retract anything I said. You found a thought en my post that had an emotion stringent and acknowledged the rest was rationally merited. You dnt think the same mind that raised the question of how this was acceptable couldn't bring up that cancer is apart of the caveat that is Chucks career

 

... Do I want anyone to have cancer, ofcourse not but am I going to pretend like it woujdnt go over well if we fired him shortly after #ChuckStrong 

 

Tell me what on the field has changed since Chucks been here & I'll retract my statement ...

 

Btw new chick doesn't accept excuses neither will I 

Facts? You are the one who is over looking them.

[NewColtsFan]

5 hours ago, life long said:

I'm not saying he sucks. Just not good enough to be above criticism, which you seem to be implying. If fans like yourself can be critical of Luck, then why can't others be critical of the coaches. Great coaches elevate their players and vice versa. Who do you believe deserves more credit for past offensive success, Luck or his OC's? Luck is not perfect but I believe he has won in spite of his coaches at times. 

 

I've been critical of Chudzinski.      I don't object to fans being critical of him at all.     I just want the arguments to be reasonable.

 

I didn't like his play calling in either of the Houston games last season and espeically in the Kansas City game.

 

I thought we looked predictable and well scouted.      I thought it looked like our opponents knew what we were doing when we broke the huddle.    When I see that,  to me it looks like our opponents have 12 players on defense and we can't seem to get anyone open.      I find that disturbing.      I'm hoping Ballard has a long talk with Chud about what KC saw in our offense that made defending us look almost like child's play.    Clearly we were doing something wrong.

 

So, I don't think Chud is above criticism.      But right now I think there is a real pitch forks and burning torches mentality that I don't find very helpful.....

 

[MFT5]

14 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

why would they have fired him shortly after ChuckStrong?  He got cancer during his first year as HC.   There was no reason whatsoever to fire him once he got back.  

 

He's obviously not good at his job & out of his league. im not arguing w any of yall. The product he's inadvertently created speaks for itself. Whether you agree its a lack talent or like me agree that his coaching, decision making & leadership directly tie into all of this.

 

Pagano is subpar & has done the best he's capable of. Im not satisfied & if you are then I guess you dnt care about your team trully being the best

 

8-8 in this division is rediculous the jags have young talent but theyre all over the place.

 

the Texans have one the division bck2bck w out a Qb or real offense to speak of

 

... and the Titans are becoming dangerous offensively but won't be anything to worry about (think the East to the Cavs, competition eventually worthy of mentioning but no real threat

[MFT5]

24 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Facts? You are the one who is over looking them.

like what exactly, how chuck is the definition of mediocre 

[crazycolt1]

6 minutes ago, MFT5 said:

like what exactly, how chuck is the definition of mediocre 

Facts. You have an opinion. Don't call it facts.

[MFT5]

2 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

Facts. You have an opinion. Don't call it facts.

like the FACT yu dnt like I brought up Chuck's cancer as his license for piloting a drowning ship & never refuted my points that suggest his employment was unmitigated... yes it's my opinion but it's a touching subject for those who lack rationale ... im sorry if you're upset he's on his last leg but the rolling ball of cleches is on the chopping block

[crazycolt1]

14 minutes ago, MFT5 said:

like the FACT yu dnt like I brought up Chuck's cancer as his license for piloting a drowning ship & never refuted my points that suggest his employment was unmitigated... yes it's my opinion but it's a touching subject for those who lack rationale ... im sorry if you're upset he's on his last leg but the rolling ball of cleches is on the chopping block

I am not upset at all. Another one of your opinions that has no merit.

For you to connect Chucks cancer to his coaching ability is not only a joke it is an insult.

[chad72]

15 hours ago, MFT5 said:

 Cancer saved Pags job ... 

 

Irsay's obsession with Peyton saved Pagano's job. Going 3-1 vs Peyton, never letting him win in Indy scored a ton of brownie points with Irsay, IMO. 2016 was the only season where Peyton was not a factor, heck we even beat the Broncos in their SB winning year.

 

But then the off season was more about Grigson departing than anything else. Pagano is clearly feeling the heat now that Irsay can see a little more clearly, with more and more factors removed and Pagano and his coaches evaluated in a vacuum now, IMO.

 

Of course, this is just my opinion. Irsay has to go through the process of elimination and give Pagano enough chances to sink or swim since he was the one who tied both Grigson and Pagano at the hip.

[Jason_]

1 hour ago, MFT5 said:

 

He's obviously not good at his job & out of his league. im not arguing w any of yall. The product he's inadvertently created speaks for itself. Whether you agree its a lack talent or like me agree that his coaching, decision making & leadership directly tie into all of this.

 

Pagano is subpar & has done the best he's capable of. Im not satisfied & if you are then I guess you dnt care about your team trully being the best

 

8-8 in this division is rediculous the jags have young talent but theyre all over the place.

 

the Texans have one the division bck2bck w out a Qb or real offense to speak of

 

... and the Titans are becoming dangerous offensively but won't be anything to worry about (think the East to the Cavs, competition eventually worthy of mentioning but no real threat

 

that's all well and good...you've had 5 years to form that opinion.  I disagree with it but that's not really relevant.  YOU said he should have been fired after ChuckStrong.  That was during his first year as HC during which he only coached what, like 4 games?  There's NO WAY anyone could have seen enough from him in that time to make a definite determination that he should be fired.  

[lollygagger8]

I said basically the same thing in the other thread: 

 

You can't be an an easy going coach at first and then try to be a tough guy after that. What players are going to respond to that? You come off disingenuous!  

 

Think of your boss right now. If he/she has been a softy the entire time you've worked there, and then decided one they are going to be a ballbuster, is it really going to resonate with employees? 

[lollygagger8]

[Old Colt]

22 hours ago, NannyMcafee said:

This is the first preseason I have seen people be so judgmental. The colts never do good in preseason. Ever. 

They never do good in the preseason.......  not doing good iin the regular season either since Bruce A was coaching....  same problems... can't tackle, can't block, can't stop score, can't score...  0-4 start on the way if Luck doesn't play and at this point 1- 3 if he does..... 

[Jason_]

1 minute ago, Old Colt said:

They never do good in the preseason.......  not doing good iin the regular season either since Bruce A was coaching....  same problems... can't tackle, can't block, can't stop score, can't score...  0-4 start on the way if Luck doesn't play and at this point 1- 3 if he does..... 

 

well that's simply not at all true

[DougDew]

Its only been 2 preseason games and some key starters aren't playing.

 

[Old Colt]

Just now, J@son said:

 

well that's simply not at all true

Terrible tackling, gave up 24 points in both preseason games, 1st string scored against the other #1's, FG's only,(TD was against their 2nd and 3rd team) and the opposition spends more time in our backfield than we do....  we loose to Rams if ST plays, lose to Cardinals, Browns will get to the statue ST and win and Seahawks.... let's save the jet fuel and forget them.  With Luck we'll beat the Browns, but it is not likely he'd be sharp enough to beat the rams game 1 (if he were to play at this point) and expecting this defense to stop any of these teams with their tackling is rose colored glasses right now.  we'll see Saturday, if they can stop or hold Pittsburgh below 24 points and if the 1st team can score more than 3.....

[Jason_]

1 minute ago, Old Colt said:

Terrible tackling, gave up 24 points in both preseason games, 1st string scored against the other #1's, FG's only,(TD was against their 2nd and 3rd team) and the opposition spends more time in our backfield than we do....  we loose to Rams if ST plays, lose to Cardinals, Browns will get to the statue ST and win and Seahawks.... let's save the jet fuel and forget them.  With Luck we'll beat the Browns, but it is not likely he'd be sharp enough to beat the rams game 1 (if he were to play at this point) and expecting this defense to stop any of these teams with their tackling is rose colored glasses right now.  we'll see Saturday, if they can stop or hold Pittsburgh below 24 points and if the 1st team can score more than 3.....

 

none of that has anything to do with my post.  I bolded and underlined the specific portion of your post that I was replying to.  

[MFT5]

1 hour ago, J@son said:

 

that's all well and good...you've had 5 years to form that opinion.  I disagree with it but that's not really relevant.  YOU said he should have been fired after ChuckStrong.  That was during his first year as HC during which he only coached what, like 4 games?  There's NO WAY anyone could have seen enough from him in that time to make a definite determination that he should be fired.  

i never said he shouldve been fired after the #chuckstrong year go bck 1 page and you'll see i said "year 2, definitely year 3" meaning 1-2 years of full evaluation of Man/Team projection & progress. Literally this team is the same as When he got here and yu can debate the offense has regressed 

[Jason_]

3 hours ago, MFT5 said:

 

most ppl dnt like facts I understand nor does your comment make me retract anything I said. You found a thought en my post that had an emotion stringent and acknowledged the rest was rationally merited. You dnt think the same mind that raised the question of how this was acceptable couldn't bring up that cancer is apart of the caveat that is Chucks career

 

... Do I want anyone to have cancer, ofcourse not but am I going to pretend like it woujdnt go over well if we fired him shortly after #ChuckStrong 

 

Tell me what on the field has changed since Chucks been here & I'll retract my statement ...

 

Btw new chick doesn't accept excuses neither will I 

 

this is specifically what I was referring to.  I'm now not entirely sure what your point was in that statement...my point however is that at that time there was no reason to even consider firing Chuck so whether it would have gone over well due to ChuckStrong or not is irrelevant.

[Dingus McGirt]

21 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Wrong title for the thread. Might as well be "For those who  all hate Pagano start your whine fest here".

For some reason the "For those about to rock" tune hit me...

[RockThatBlue]

On 8/21/2017 at 4:03 PM, J@son said:

 

Then this has to be the first preseason since you've joined because this is absolutely nothing new. Lol

Agreed, but it does seem a bit more over the top than past years. We have folks wanting to fire people after preseason games. In past years, they at least waited until the season actually started lol

[Nadine]

2 minutes ago, RockThatBlue said:

Agreed, but it does seem a bit more over the top than past years. We have folks wanting to fire people after preseason games. In past years, they at least waited until the season actually started lol

but we had a nice off season with no fire people threads

 

[RockThatBlue]

2 minutes ago, Nadine said:

but we had a nice off season with no fire people threads

 

That was the calm before the storm

[coltsfeva]

1 hour ago, DougDew said:

Its only been 2 preseason games and some key starters aren't playing.

 

Don't try to bring objectivity into the thread, the Colts are 0-2 and it's all because of Chuck!

Guys are injured and it's Chuck's fault.

The players are not executing and it's Chuck's fault.

It's obvious he's not a competent HC, even though Irsay (who has the most to lose) trusts him to be.

The bad field - Chucks fault, he's too soft, he's disingenuous now because he's trying to be tough.

He's dumb, has a rah rah mentality, is responsible for bad drafts, etc. etc. etc. 

 

 

What I'm tired of, is all the negativity coming out of the fan base and local press. But that's the way of the world today: GIVE ME WHAT I WANT NOW!!! 

I hope Chuck does well this year and proves all of the haters wrong. Give the man a chance this year and let's see what happens. By the way, the Pats are 0-2 this preseason as well, maybe they should shake up their coaching staff as well?

[RockThatBlue]

18 hours ago, bananabucket said:

There is nothing to suggest Pagano is a good coach.  I don't think he's as detrimental as many here do, but he's certainly not helping matters.  The problem is I'm not sure we'd find anyone better.  Just have to hope the Chris Ballard of coaches falls into our laps.

I think hes average. Could find better, could find worse. 

[FanFromtheWasteland]

22 hours ago, Superman said:

Pagano can't win. People call him soft and complain because he never calls players out when they don't play well. Then he engages in some relatively tough talk -- for him, not compared to the rest of the league; this is the kind of stuff coaches say routinely in the NFL -- and now he's whining and scapegoating.

 

Double standard. 

 

Just say you hate Pagano no matter what, stake your position, and be done with it. You don't have to make up reasons for it. 

Seems like it's different people complaining.......to me anyway

[FanFromtheWasteland]

2 hours ago, lollygagger8 said:

I said basically the same thing in the other thread: 

 

You can't be an an easy going coach at first and then try to be a tough guy after that. What players are going to respond to that? You come off disingenuous!  

 

Think of your boss right now. If he/she has been a softy the entire time you've worked there, and then decided one they are going to be a ballbuster, is it really going to resonate with employees? 

I would if someone gets fired

[Superman]

20 minutes ago, coltsfeva said:

I hope Chuck does well this year and proves all of the haters wrong. Give the man a chance this year and let's see what happens. By the way, the Pats are 0-2 this preseason as well, maybe they should shake up their coaching staff as well?

 

So do I, but I would like to point out that my particular complaints have absolutely nothing to do with the Colts being 0-2, and I don't care whether they win these preseason games. I do care about how the team plays, and so far I don't think they're playing well. 

[chrisfarley]

On 8/21/2017 at 3:58 PM, Colton Stenger said:

Is it just me or is anyone else already tired of Pagano and his complaining. He can't blame his GM anymore so he's looking for a new scapegoat to cover his butt, he's a defensive coach with a consistently bad defense and has made poor hirings for offensive coordinator (not counting Arians) and after his last rant blaming his young players for there injuries and lack of production just amazes me, with that attitude he is gonna lose the locker room. I do think Ballard has improved the defense and offense (the addition of Mack at Rb is promising) but I do believe we will not improve as a team until we have a real leader at Head Coach, I don't know who that is but I trust Ballard to make smart decisions moving forward.

First game of season is a ways off.  We are likely going to win that game, and if so, what will your thoughts be on Pagano after the first win (be it an ugly win or not, I'm talking about a victory in the NFL, and that aint easy), will he get any credit?  probably some, ,but it's a positive start and perhaps surprising to you and others... but I'm banking that we collect a win game 1.

[krunk]

If we look bad against Pitt then I'll get mildly concerned I guess.  Usually with Chuck if we still look bad by that 3rd preseason game it usually carries over into the 1st game at least.

[coltsfeva]

3 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

So do I, but I would like to point out that my particular complaints have absolutely nothing to do with the Colts being 0-2, and I don't care whether they win these preseason games. I do care about how the team plays, and so far I don't think they're playing well. 

Agreed Supe,

  My point is that the players we have been watching are either just learning to play together (like the front 7), are inexperienced or won't be on the team Sept 10th. 

  Players get better with experience. We accept that. I believe coaches are the same;(look at Belicheck's first five years). 

   I'm not saying Pagano is Belicheck or Lombardi. If this year is a disaster, he's probably gone. I guess I'm in a "wait and see" mode, hoping the team is relatively healthy.

[Superman]

12 minutes ago, coltsfeva said:

Agreed Supe,

  My point is that the players we have been watching are either just learning to play together (like the front 7), are inexperienced or won't be on the team Sept 10th. 

  Players get better with experience. We accept that. I believe coaches are the same;(look at Belicheck's first five years). 

   I'm not saying Pagano is Belicheck or Lombardi. If this year is a disaster, he's probably gone. I guess I'm in a "wait and see" mode, hoping the team is relatively healthy.

 

It's just a total strawman to paint this as people being mad because the Colts are 0-2, is all I'm saying.

 

But I agree, the players we're watching have a long way to go, and some will be going away in a couple weeks. So I'm not stressed out about them. But I would like to see more intensity, physicality, and focus on the field, even in preseason. 

 

I hope we see that early in this next game. If guys are flying around and sticking close to receivers and making tackles and finishing blocks, then I'll feel loads better about what's going on, and it won't have anything to do with a win or a loss.

[Zoltan]

23 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

After reading the things you have said in this thread I find it hipocritical you call Pagano a cry baby.

I started this thread because I wanted to know how others felt about how he handled himself with this last press, I don't think I have made a statement that cannot be backed up and I have not over exaggerated. If you are gonna join the conversation please add something with substance instead of personal attacks against someone who just wants to hear what others think about a teams coach.

[crazycolt1]

11 minutes ago, Colton Stenger said:

I started this thread because I wanted to know how others felt about how he handled himself with this last press, I don't think I have made a statement that cannot be backed up and I have not over exaggerated. If you are gonna join the conversation please add something with substance instead of personal attacks against someone who just wants to hear what others think about a teams coach.

You started a thread that has been talked to death. Where have you been? This subject has been known to hijack and derail threads.

What makes this one any different?

[Zoltan]

21 hours ago, Horse Shoe Heaven said:

Honestly NO!!!! I am my tired of people on here complaining about Pagano. The Colts had a crappy team last year, & they were still 500? Was still 500 when Luck was injured the year before. Pagano has not had a losing season EVER! I think some of you younger fans got spoiled by Peyton, and early Luck success. I have been a Colt fan long enough to remember enduring HORRIBLE TEAMS!! For many years. Pagano is a good coach and he will figure it out! This is a young team with a Ol thats well OK, and a defense with a lot of new guys that need to gel and a mixture of young guys that will take there lumps. OH and that Luck guy is out. He doesn't make much of a difference. For those who want him out be careful for what you wish for, it could get a lot worse.

You make some valid points about him not having a losing season, but not having a losing season isn't good enough in my opinion. We brought in a defensive coach who could finally give us a good defense so we could finally not rely on the arm of our quarterback, which was the reason we only have 1 Super Bowl win with manning and the reason why Aaron Rodgers only has one Super Bowl win and I think if we don't have a losing season this year it's gonna be because Luck comes back and saves the season, otherwise I see us below 500

[Zoltan]

2 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

You started a thread that has been talked to death. Where have you been? This subject has been known to hijack and derail threads.

What makes this one any different?

As you can see I don't post stuff often, I usually talk with my Facebook sports group but wanted to hear from the colts fanbase (So I guess sorry for wanting peoples opinion). if you don't want to talk about it then don't no one is making you stay on the thread. 

[Zoltan]

19 hours ago, GoColts8818 said:

I think Pagano should have been gone after last year but I don't think he's been a complainer or was blaming the GM either.  I don't think he's looking for a scapegoat this year either. 

 

I think he was expressing frustration, just as many here have, about all the injuries the Colts have had. 

 

Pagano has proven to be a players coach probably too much of one at times so I also don't buy the argument that he's going to lose the lockeroom either. 

 

Again I support a coaching change but I think some of what you are charging Pagano with here is unfair. 

What I would say is the problem is how he expressed his frustration, I'm all for a coach calling out players when they are dragging there butts, but it's how he did it, it didn't sound well thought out and his demeanor is why I think it looked like he was more wallowing then expressing frustration 

[crazycolt1]

24 minutes ago, Colton Stenger said:

As you can see I don't post stuff often, I usually talk with my Facebook sports group but wanted to hear from the colts fanbase (So I guess sorry for wanting peoples opinion). if you don't want to talk about it then don't no one is making you stay on the thread. 

 

The name of your tread is "Already Tired Of Pagano". You weren't looking for a debate or an opinion.

 

[CoachLite]

On ‎8‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 5:32 PM, Superman said:

 

The players don't look prepared, nor are they playing with any urgency. Everyone has preached competition, but it doesn't look like it's brought out anything special in anyone. Maybe because no one has been rewarded for good performance, so far. If they get Mack some increased work, and get Morris on the field sooner, maybe that will help.

The players don't look prepared because they AREN'T prepared. I used to comment that the players looked "dazed and confused". The competition seems to be "who can look most dazed and confused". I haven't bought into the "we don't have the talent" whine for years. We don't develop whatever talent we might have. That doesn't seem about to change.