Frank

[Pat Beach 81]

What are the chances gore gets cut in training camp if he shows he's run out of gas. The micheal signing has me thinking. What's the cap hit if we cut him?

[indyagent17]

Cap Hit is 3.5 Million and I do not see him getting cut 

[21isSuperman]

He won't get cut.  Christine Michael is not a threat to Frank Gore.

[lollygagger8]

Frankly, I don't believe there's a frankin' chance Frank gets cut. 

[throwing BBZ]

1 hour ago, Pat Beach 81 said:

What are the chances gore gets cut in training camp if he shows he's run out of gas. The micheal signing has me thinking. What's the cap hit if we cut him?

 

The obvious answer to your question is.... 100% if he is out of gas. bla bla bla
No chance he is out of gas. So... bla bla bla

 His Cap hit is $3.5M if he makes the 53 man roster.
 With Zero Dead Cap hit if we do cut him.

 I see you are a newer/low post member. Enjoy.
  And you can find info covering player salary and Cap #`s at spotrac or over the cap. This comes up to question a lot, so i hope you take a look at them.

[bababooey]

I don't get why people think Christine Michael, who has not done anything in the NFL, will be a threat to both Frank Gore and Marlon Mack.

[Lucky Colts Fan]

16 minutes ago, bababooey said:

I don't get why people think Christine Michael, who has not done anything in the NFL, will be a threat to both Frank Gore and Marlon Mack.

 

Yeah, nobody cuts their workhorse for a role-player.

[Samu-Rye]

I think the only person who will be affected by the Christine Michael signing, will be the guy who has to clean out Michael's locker on September 3.

[HungarianColtsFan]

3 hours ago, Pat Beach 81 said:

What are the chances gore gets cut in training camp if he shows he's run out of gas. The micheal signing has me thinking. What's the cap hit if we cut him?

 

Barring a serious (season ending) injury I think the chance is a big fat 0.

[TheOptimist88]

I don't think the Michael signing is Gores replacement but a Commitee of Mack, Turbin, and Michael could. While I think it's highly unlikely I can't ignore the fact it might happen. No one saw Matt Overton getting cut, I'm pretty sure we're in for a few more surprises.

[A8bil]

Interesting proposition.  Anything is possible.  I'm not sure I understand the notion that Michael has done nothing in the NFL.  He's got a careeer 4.3 ypc avg, so he's been effective when given the chance, but there is something going on that has teams giving up on him. Bad friends?  Bad attitude?  Who knows, but the ability is there. 

[NewColtsFan]

4 hours ago, indyagent17 said:

Cap Hit is 3.5 Million and I do not see him getting cut 

 

There is no cap hit if Gore gets cut.

 

He's got a $3.5 Mill salary,  but zero is guaranteed.       We can cut Gore today if we want with zero negative financial impact to the team.        Gore is an easy cut if we choose to.

 

But unless something completely unexpected happens,  Gore is not going anywhere....

 

 

 

[Steamboat_Shaun]

7 minutes ago, A8bil said:

Interesting proposition.  Anything is possible.  I'm not sure I understand the notion that Michael has done nothing in the NFL.  He's got a careeer 4.3 ypc avg, so he's been effective when given the chance, but there is something going on that has teams giving up on him. Bad friends?  Bad attitude?  Who knows, but the ability is there. 

 

He led the Seahawks in total carries last year, FWIW.

 

[NewColtsFan]

41 minutes ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

He led the Seahawks in total carries last year, FWIW.

 

 

Which leads to the question that all Colts fans should b´ asking themselves....

 

If Michael was doing such a good job for Seattle last year,   and Pete Carroll is famous for being willing to take in the most unique, outgoing personalities,   then why did Seattle cut him in the middle of the season?      And I thnk this was the 2nd time that Seattle had him and let him go...

 

Lots of very good teams have had Michael and he's done OK for them and at the end of the day,   they're willing to let him go....

 

If you're the Colts,  you're hoping that he matures,  that things slow down for him,   that he can take car´of his personal business,   that he can do the little things on a football field BESIDES just running the ball.     All of the above,  or some of the above.      But you hope the light comes on for him while Michael is wearing a Colts uniform....         that would be a win-win situation...

 

[BR-549]

3 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

 

The obvious answer to your question is.... 100% if he is out of gas. bla bla bla
No chance he is out of gas. So... bla bla bla

 His Cap hit is $3.5M if he makes the 53 man roster.
 With Zero Dead Cap hit if we do cut him.

 I see you are a newer/low post member. Enjoy.
  And you can find info covering player salary and Cap #`s at spotrac or over the cap. This comes up to question a lot, so i hope you take a look at them.

Hey friend... I don't want to start trouble with you because I do value what you have to say most of the time.... but I do want to make a statement.  

 

Who cares what anyone's post count is.  We all start at zero. The OP just wants to start a conversation and it has gotten some responses.  Anyone can look info up on the internet, but maybe the OP wanted others input.

I just don't get the I have more post than you so your thoughts don't matter.... go look it up attitude.

 

Besides, we don't have much to discuss right now anyway.

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

4 minutes ago, BR-549 said:

Hey friend... I don't want to start trouble with you because I do value what you have to say most of the time.... but I do want to make a statement.  

 

Who cares what anyone's post count is.  We all start at zero. The OP just wants to start a conversation and it has gotten some responses.  Anyone can look info up on the internet, but maybe the OP wanted others input.

I just don't get the I have more post than you so your thoughts don't matter.... go look it up attitude.

 

Besides, we don't have much to discuss right now anyway.

 

 

 

 

I think you've misread BBZ comments about post counts...

 

I think all he's saying is.....   "Hey,  I see you're new here.    Welcome.    Enjoy the website."

 

I try to do this too.     I wouldn't read anything more than that in this case.      Honestly.

 

[BR-549]

Just now, NewColtsFan said:

 

 

I think you've misread BBZ comments about post counts...

 

I think all he's saying is.....   "Hey,  I see you're new here.    Welcome.    Enjoy the website."

 

I try to do this too.     I wouldn't read anything more than that in this case.      Honestly.

 

I could have....  you may be right and if that is the case then I withdraw my statement.  And I have never seen him disrespect anyone so that is likely true.

 

I have, in the past seen people think that post count means something.  Other than loyalty to the forum it really means nothing at all.

 

So I respectfully appreciate you stepping in as I had not looked at it that way.  Thanks

[BR-549]

4 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

 

I think you've misread BBZ comments about post counts...

 

I think all he's saying is.....   "Hey,  I see you're new here.    Welcome.    Enjoy the website."

 

I try to do this too.     I wouldn't read anything more than that in this case.      Honestly.

 

It is possible however to hover over an avatar and see exactly when someone joins.  Just because they have a low post count it doesn't mean that they are new.

[BOTT]

Don't see it happening, but it wouldn't bother me if he did.

[1959Colts]

I wouldn't be shocked

[NewColtsFan]

3 hours ago, BR-549 said:

It is possible however to hover over an avatar and see exactly when someone joins.  Just because they have a low post count it doesn't mean that they are new.

 

This is not only correct,   but it's a very good point.       This is a mistake that I,  myself,  have made more than once.      I mistook a low number of posts for being a new poster.      When, in fact,   the poster had been a member for a few years and had just not posted much before that.       That does happen.

 

It's a good lessonfor all of us to remember,  me included.

 

I typically make note of someone being new when it's the first time I've noticed them and I check when they joined....      or when they raise an issue that has been beaten to death in the recent past and someone who just joined wouldn't know that so is not up to speed on those discussions.      Doesn't mean they're necessarily wrong,    but sometimes it means they're not aware of insights that are posted here....

 

Thanks again....             

[Virtuoso80]

I could be that example, joined in 2011 but very low post count.  I just like doing a lot of the reading, but don't post as much.  

[SilentHill]

11 hours ago, Lucky Colts Fan said:

 

Yeah, nobody cuts their workhorse for a role-player.

 

no one cuts their 3rd round pick the same year they draft them.....oh wait, Ballard did that.

 

I wouldn't be surprised.

[life long]

10 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

This is not only correct,   but it's a very good point.       This is a mistake that I,  myself,  have made more than once.      I mistook a low number of posts for being a new poster.      When, in fact,   the poster had been a member for a few years and had just not posted much before that.       That does happen.

 

It's a good lessonfor all of us to remember,  me included.

 

I typically make note of someone being new when it's the first time I've noticed them and I check when they joined....      or when they raise an issue that has been beaten to death in the recent past and someone who just joined wouldn't know that so is not up to speed on those discussions.      Doesn't mean they're necessarily wrong,    but sometimes it means they're not aware of insights that are posted here....

 

Thanks again....             

I have had to get accounts on this forum since the 2000's. I have had at least 3 others accounts. In my younger years , i would seem to forget passwords and had far too many emails. So when i could no longer log in, I would just make a new account. Lol. 

[Pat Beach 81]

I'm not a new member & I don't post a lot, but I do check the message board daily. A lot of good insight on here & it feeds my colts obsession. Anyways thanks for the responses & info. I occasionally check cap websites but for the most part I rely on this forum because there seems to be more folks more interested in that on here than me. 

Im not saying micheal is going to be a stud or a starter, but if Mack shows promise and turbin & micheal can fill the void while he gets reps I think Ballard has to consider cutting frank. Franks been an excellent team player & I hope he shows up @ camp looking like he did 10 years ago but I highly doubt that's going to happen. $3.5 mil could get you a nice FA corner or safety help if geathers is out. 

[LJpalmbeacher2]

I don't think Gore will be cut, but if it did happen I doubt it would effect the team negatively. I like Gore, he's had a nice career, but at this point in his career he doesn't make much of a difference. Last season I think only 1 carry over 20 yards. If it means more carries for Mack then that could be a positive thing.

[jet1968]

Gore is still the best running back on the Colts team.

[indyagent17]

18 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

There is no cap hit if Gore gets cut.

 

He's got a $3.5 Mill salary,  but zero is guaranteed.       We can cut Gore today if we want with zero negative financial impact to the team.        Gore is an easy cut if we choose to.

 

But unless something completely unexpected happens,  Gore is not going anywhere....

 

 

 

you know I saw that on the bottom but it had an asterisk so since it was not clear I went worst case. Thanks for getting the right info buddy

[A8bil]

1 hour ago, LJpalmbeacher said:

I don't think Gore will be cut, but if it did happen I doubt it would effect the team negatively. I like Gore, he's had a nice career, but at this point in his career he doesn't make much of a difference. Last season I think only 1 carry over 20 yards. If it means more carries for Mack then that could be a positive thing.

Funny how once Gore achieves milestones that had been elusive for years -- 100 yard games, 1000 yard season -- he's nothing special and can be replaced by a mid-round rookie who hasn't gotten a yard in the NFL yet.  Fans... 

[A8bil]

I'm optimistic that with the continuity of the O-line, this will be a good year for the offense.  I think too many of you underappreciated the challenge Gore faced in this offense over the past two years.  No one had better success than him behind this line.  Keep that in mind when you're pining for some journeyman or small conference rookie back to take gore's place.

[crazycolt1]

11 minutes ago, A8bil said:

I'm optimistic that with the continuity of the O-line, this will be a good year for the offense.  I think too many of you underappreciated the challenge Gore faced in this offense over the past two years.  No one had better success than him behind this line.  Keep that in mind when you're pining for some journeyman or small conference rookie back to take gore's place.

I don't think I under appreciated Gore when he fumbled a game away or missed a TD pass that would have won a game.

Look, I like Gore a lot and think he has been one of the best RBs in the league but reality is he is getting old.

[crazycolt1]

20 minutes ago, A8bil said:

Funny how once Gore achieves milestones that had been elusive for years -- 100 yard games, 1000 yard season -- he's nothing special and can be replaced by a mid-round rookie who hasn't gotten a yard in the NFL yet.  Fans... 

Reality and age. Nothing you can do about either.

[Steamboat_Shaun]

19 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Which leads to the question that all Colts fans should b´ asking themselves....

 

If Michael was doing such a good job for Seattle last year,   and Pete Carroll is famous for being willing to take in the most unique, outgoing personalities,   then why did Seattle cut him in the middle of the season?      And I thnk this was the 2nd time that Seattle had him and let him go...

 

Lots of very good teams have had Michael and he's done OK for them and at the end of the day,   they're willing to let him go....

 

If you're the Colts,  you're hoping that he matures,  that things slow down for him,   that he can take car´of his personal business,   that he can do the little things on a football field BESIDES just running the ball.     All of the above,  or some of the above.      But you hope the light comes on for him while Michael is wearing a Colts uniform....         that would be a win-win situation...

 

 

His pass protection is terrible, & being bad in pass protection can be a deal breaker for RBs in the NFL. If I had to guess, I'd say that's why he was let go by Seattle & Green Bay. But he has a gift for straightforward, north-south running, so when he's on the field, it'll probably be in 3rd down, short yardage situations.

[A8bil]

2 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Reality and age. Nothing you can do about either.

Reality:  Gore achieved those milestones last year, behind a makeshift line.  No one has seen him this year to evaluate whether his age has caught up to him.

 

Age:  Most backs fall off the cliff by age 32.  Gore is not most backs, and has already proven he's in that top .0001% of players to have ever lined up at RB.  He's a future HOF with a running style that is conducive to him producing even as a 34 year old.  He's a workout warrior.

 

Can't do anything about either age or reality, but there is no proof to suggest Gore will not be able to better his output from last year, but some fans have already put him out to pasture.  Again, none of these younger backs were able to run better than Gore last year beyond this line.  When someone does, then -- and only then -- Gore needs to relinquish his starting role.   

[A8bil]

2 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

I don't think I under appreciated Gore when he fumbled a game away or missed a TD pass that would have won a game.

Look, I like Gore a lot and think he has been one of the best RBs in the league but reality is he is getting old.

Hmmm...so pointing out a rare mistake by Gore proves your objectivity?  No player is immune to mistakes...Luck makes multiple per game.

[LJpalmbeacher2]

2 hours ago, A8bil said:

Funny how once Gore achieves milestones that had been elusive for years -- 100 yard games, 1000 yard season -- he's nothing special and can be replaced by a mid-round rookie who hasn't gotten a yard in the NFL yet.  Fans... 

 

1,000 yard Milestones are a product from Yester-Year when schedules were 12 &14 games. Today some Top Backs approach 1,000 yards midway in season.Gore's better days are long gone(low YPC & only 1 run 20 yards or more last season) and I don't expect him getting any younger or better anytime soon.

I'm fine if he stays, and fine if he's cut. But I'd like to see another RB carry the majority of the workload.

[A8bil]

46 minutes ago, LJpalmbeacher said:

 

1,000 yard Milestones are a product from Yester-Year when schedules were 12 &14 games. Today some Top Backs approach 1,000 yards midway in season.Gore's better days are long gone(low YPC & only 1 run 20 yards or more last season) and I don't expect him getting any younger or better anytime soon.

I'm fine if he stays, and fine if he's cut. But I'd like to see another RB carry the majority of the workload.

1000 yard season are irrelevant according to whom?  Still, only 10 or so backs reach that milestone each year, and few backs do it consistently.  I keep saying this...a 3.9 ypc avg is not pedestrian.  Look at the HOF running backs and their career ypc.  You'ld be shocked how many are right around 4 ypc.  A RB who can churn out a consistent 4 ypc is very good, and it is particularly good for the colts, who have had pretty poor run blocking for a couple years.  Long runs?  Blount, Crowell, Howard, Hyde...all were amongst the tops in big plays from scrimmage last year.  None are meaningfully faster than Gore.  Why then could they spring them for big gains?  Look at Gore's highlight films and see how many unblocked defenders he encounters once he gets passed the LOS.  Now look at highlight films for some of these other backs.  Look specifically at 5:09 of this video for Blount:

 

 

Every defenders is being blocked at the point of attack, and Blount is sprung for a long TD.  That is what is needed for long runs, and it is something that Hilton, Dorsett and Moncrief are poor at...no RB is going to spring big gains for the colts without help from blockers.

[MackAttack]

Just now, lollygagger8 said:

Frankly, I don't believe there's a frankin' chance Frank gets cut. 

How Frank of you

[Lucky Colts Fan]

3 hours ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

His pass protection is terrible, & being bad in pass protection can be a deal breaker for RBs in the NFL. If I had to guess, I'd say that's why he was let go by Seattle & Green Bay. But he has a gift for straightforward, north-south running, so when he's on the field, it'll probably be in 3rd down, short yardage situations.

 

Especially when you have a franchise QB like Wilson, Rodgers, and... LUCK!  I can just see Michael whiffing on a blitzing-MLB that levels Luck and breaks another rib or something...

 

Reminds me of a game where Donald Brown whiffed on a block that led to Peyton getting sacked, and we got this great audio of Peyton yelling "DAMMET DONALD!"

 

[BOTT]

4 hours ago, A8bil said:

1000 yard season are irrelevant according to whom?  Still, only 10 or so backs reach that milestone each year, and few backs do it consistently.  I keep saying this...a 3.9 ypc avg is not pedestrian.  Look at the HOF running backs and their career ypc.  You'ld be shocked how many are right around 4 ypc.  A RB who can churn out a consistent 4 ypc is very good, and it is particularly good for the colts, who have had pretty poor run blocking for a couple years.  Long runs?  Blount, Crowell, Howard, Hyde...all were amongst the tops in big plays from scrimmage last year.  None are meaningfully faster than Gore.  Why then could they spring them for big gains?  Look at Gore's highlight films and see how many unblocked defenders he encounters once he gets passed the LOS.  Now look at highlight films for some of these other backs.  Look specifically at 5:09 of this video for Blount:

 

 

Every defenders is being blocked at the point of attack, and Blount is sprung for a long TD.  That is what is needed for long runs, and it is something that Hilton, Dorsett and Moncrief are poor at...no RB is going to spring big gains for the colts without help from blockers.

3.9 ypc is pedestrian in 2017.