Pagano - 11th Best Coach in the NFL

[BOTT]

Just now, jvan1973 said:

Have you ever heard an ex player dog him?  

 

I'm sure not all players love Belichick, doesn't mean they have reason to dog him.  I was just saying Walsh was known to be very tough behind closed doors.

[2006Coltsbestever]

6 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

Bill walsh was loved by his players

I have seen Bill Walsh explode on his players watching NFL films though, like cussing and getting in their faces. I think a lot of his players feared him as well. I cant ever remember Dungy chewing anyone out and never heard him cuss either. A yeller isn't always the best way to go either though so having a players Coach doesn't always mean you cant win multiple SB's. It just depends what works for your type of a team. I loved the Dungy days and loved our team makeup, just not sold on him being labeled a GREAT coach. It depends on who you blame most of our Playoff losses on back in those days. I blame Dungy more than I do Peyton.

[jvan1973]

3 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I have seen Bill Walsh explode on his players watching NFL films though, like cussing and getting in their faces. I think a lot of his players feared him as well. I cant ever remember Dungy chewing anyone out and never heard him cuss either. A yeller isn't always the best way to go either though so having a players Coach doesn't always mean you cant win multiple SB's. It just depends what works for your type of a team. I loved the Dungy days and loved our team makeup, just not sold on him being labeled a GREAT coach. It depends on who you blame most of our Playoff losses on back in those days. I blame Dungy more than I do Peyton.

All coaches go off at some point on players.   That doesn't mean they are a good or bad coach.   

[crazycolt1]

5 hours ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

I just hate the black and white argument that is winning percentage. When your division is a cakewalk for your first 4 years yeah you will have a higher percentage then say someone in the AFC North 

You hate the back and white argument? That's cool. I hate narrow minds too.

[Colts_Fan12]

1 minute ago, crazycolt1 said:

You hate the back and white argument? That's cool. I hate narrow minds too.

Yeah I'm narrow minded cause I can tell chuck is a mediocre to average coach I know how you feel cheerleader 

[2006Coltsbestever]

Hopefully Chuck goes 11-5 again and we make a deep Playoff run so he can prove the haters wrong.

[ColtsBlitz]

49 minutes ago, BOTT said:

I have never been a fan of "players coach."  Most of them seem to be soft when it comes to discipline and practice. 

He's taken a few poor timeouts over five yrs.  I didn't write them down, but I don't think anyone would claim he is good with clock management.

 

The discipline is definitely a step down in terms of intensity with a player coach than from a more non-player coach. However I would rather have a player coach than a Chip Kelly. There is no doubt this will be a do or die year for Pagano. 

[shasta519]

I don't like Pagano. I don't think he is good at the in-game aspects of a HC...but I also think his talent evaluation is lacking and that he is partly responsible for this subpar roster.

 

Regardless, I don't believe he is a lameduck HC. I think he will be here for at least two more seasons. 

[Colts_Fan12]

41 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Hopefully Chuck goes 11-5 again and we make a deep Playoff run so he can prove the haters wrong.

He needs to do more then that he needs to start games better and not get us in holes he needs to gameplay better he needs to not get owned by NE and Pitt and needs to not make dumb boneheaded plays and improve his * poor click management 

[Colts_Fan12]

20 minutes ago, shastamasta said:

I don't like Pagano. I don't think he is good at the in-game aspects of a HC...but I also think his talent evaluation is lacking and that he is partly responsible for this subpar roster.

 

Regardless, I don't believe he is a lameduck HC. I think he will be here for at least two more seasons. 

Totally agree and sadly I think you are right I feel like we are stuck with his stupid crap for a few more years 

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Yeah I'm narrow minded cause I can tell chuck is a mediocre to average coach I know how you feel cheerleader 

I am sorry you cant face the facts. Your dislike of Chuck wont let you.

[Colts_Fan12]

Just now, crazycolt1 said:

I am sorry you cant face the facts. Your dislike of Chuck wont let you.

What facts the simple winning percentage argument? Like I'm the only one in here who thinks that's a foolish way to judge a coach gtho 

[crazycolt1]

5 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

What facts the simple winning percentage argument? Like I'm the only one in here who thinks that's a foolish way to judge a coach gtho 

The fact is he has yet to have a losing season. Another fact is he has one of the best records of any coach in history for his first five years. Yet another fact his players love to play for him.

The final fact is you wont accept facts.

[Colts_Fan12]

Just now, crazycolt1 said:

The fact is he has yet to have a losing season. Another fact is he has one of the best records of any coach in history for his first five years. Yet another fact his players love to play for him.

The final fact is you wont accept facts.

Yeah you win I'm not arguing with you you're annoying as hell and just a * cheerleader you will always gladly accept average glad you are not in charge of the team.

[crazycolt1]

5 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Yeah you win I'm not arguing with you you're annoying as hell and just a * cheerleader you will always gladly accept average glad you are not in charge of the team.

Another fact, the facts show he is better than average so go back to your fairy tales.

[Colts_Fan12]

Just now, crazycolt1 said:

Another fact, the facts show he is better than average so go back to your fairy tales.

He's definitely the next BB glad you discovered this 

[crazycolt1]

8 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

He's definitely the next BB glad you discovered this 

Now you are getting totally ridiculous because you realize how silly you are.

[Colts_Fan12]

1 minute ago, crazycolt1 said:

Now you are getting totally ridiculous because you realize how silly you are.

No I just don't have time to have a discussion with a homer cheerleader. You are the only * here calling him better then average that's exactly what he is and almost everyone on the board has said this except you.

[crazycolt1]

8 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

No I just don't have time to have a discussion with a homer cheerleader. You are the only * here calling him better then average that's exactly what he is and almost everyone on the board has said this except you.

Yep, all the bashers are out and you are one of them. The crowd suits you well.

[NewColtsFan]

18 minutes ago, Colts_Fan12 said:

Yeah you win I'm not arguing with you you're annoying as hell and just a * cheerleader you will always gladly accept average glad you are not in charge of the team.

 

Except that the two people who are in charge of the team (Irsay and Ballard)  agree more with Crazy Colt than they do with you.

 

So take it up with them....

 

[Colts_Fan12]

10 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Except that the two people who are in charge of the team (Irsay and Ballard)  agree more with Crazy Colt than they do with you.

 

So take it up with them....

 

For now 

[BOTT]

47 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Except that the two people who are in charge of the team (Irsay and Ballard)  agree more with Crazy Colt than they do with you.

 

So take it up with them....

 

Publicly 

[Imrryr]

5 hours ago, BOTT said:

You weren't hoping for that at all.  You just claimed something that nobody can prove or disprove.

If win loss statistics cant prove someones at least decent i dont know where you get off thinking you know someones bad.

[crazycolt1]

7 hours ago, BOTT said:

Hence the word "most".  Although I'm not sure I would call Dungy a players coach.  He was a rare bird who demanded respect in his own way.

 

if we named the great coaches I don't think many would classify as a players coach.

Is that why when Tampa Bay won their super bowl the Bucs players contacted and credited Dungy with their win?

[Jason_]

5 hours ago, BOTT said:

Publicly 

 

He's still here isn't he?

[BOTT]

4 hours ago, Imrryr said:

If win loss statistics cant prove someones at least decent i dont know where you get off thinking you know someones bad.

Barry Switzer has a nice record and won a super bowl.

[crazycolt1]

6 hours ago, BOTT said:

Publicly 

??- I highly doubt that Irsay kept Pagano for publicity.

[BOTT]

4 hours ago, J@son said:

 

He's still here isn't he?

Because Irsay could,hire any of the guys he's been sniffing around the last couple years.

[BOTT]

2 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

??- I highly doubt that Irsay kept Pagano for publicity.

You are a gem

[UKColt13]

He's not the worst in the league but he's been bailed out of holes by his QB.

 

Not bottom 5 but he's not 11th.

 

He's not Ballard's choice though. Dave Taub I think will be here next offseason unless we get a playoff victory.

[crazycolt1]

1 hour ago, UKColt13 said:

He's not the worst in the league but he's been bailed out of holes by his QB.

 

Not bottom 5 but he's not 11th.

 

He's not Ballard's choice though. Dave Taub I think will be here next offseason unless we get a playoff victory.

If he wasn't Ballard's choice he wouldn't be here.

[crazycolt1]

2 hours ago, BOTT said:

You are a gem

Instead of debating what you think all you can do is attack someone on a personal level because they don't agree with you. You are like a broken record with your never ending line of nonsense.

[Yoshinator]

We will never win a SB with Pagano, plain and simple. Despite the winning percentage, a closer look at the facts show the same theme over and over. 11 of the 16 games we played last year, we scored 3 points or less in the first quarter. This puts us at a tremendous disadvantage. The offense is supposed to be the strength of the team, and you see how poor Pagano does coaching it. We have yet to beat either the Steelers or Patriots since Pagano has been head coach. What are we supposed to do, wait til Brady retires and hope Pagano can finally do something 3 years down the line when Luck's 2nd contract is almost up? 

 

The only reason he is even an average coach, is because Luck carried the Colts in 2012-2014. When Luck got injured and exposed and the AFC South became competitive, Pagano became exposed for what he is today, an average 8-8 coach that coaches a team with an elite QB. On a team without an elite QB, he'd be worse than that, and coaches ranked below him would be at his level. 

 

Pagano was lucky that Irsay made the decision to fire Grigson and not him. Could of very well fired both, but decided not too, most likely because of what it would cost after re-signing both, and he wanted to give Pagano an extra year with a different GM. Doesn't mean anything though in the long run unless he gets his junk together and coaches this team like he's supposed too.

 

 

[jvan1973]

11 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

We will never win a SB with Pagano, plain and simple. Despite the winning percentage, a closer look at the facts show the same theme over and over. 11 of the 16 games we played last year, we scored 3 points or less in the first quarter. This puts us at a tremendous disadvantage. The offense is supposed to be the strength of the team, and you see how poor Pagano does coaching it. We have yet to beat either the Steelers or Patriots since Pagano has been head coach. What are we supposed to do, wait til Brady retires and hope Pagano can finally do something 3 years down the line when Luck's 2nd contract is almost up? 

 

The only reason he is even an average coach, is because Luck carried the Colts in 2012-2014. When Luck got injured and exposed and the AFC South became competitive, Pagano became exposed for what he is today, an average 8-8 coach that coaches a team with an elite QB. On a team without an elite QB, he'd be worse than that, and coaches ranked below him would be at his level. 

 

Pagano was lucky that Irsay made the decision to fire Grigson and not him. Could of very well fired both, but decided not too, most likely because of what it would cost after re-signing both, and he wanted to give Pagano an extra year with a different GM. Doesn't mean anything though in the long run unless he gets his junk together and coaches this team like he's supposed too.

 

 

Heard the same thing about Dungy.

 

Also,  pagano went 8-8 without luck for the majority of the 15 season

[Yoshinator]

4 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

Heard the same thing about Dungy.

 

Also,  pagano went 8-8 without luck for the majority of the 15 season

I bet you did. Unfortunately, Luck isn't Peyton, and I don't think we'll squeeze a SB appearance through NE with the team the way it is and the way we play this time. Your 2nd point is spot on, however.

[Jason_]

24 minutes ago, Jared Cisneros said:

 

 

The only reason he is even an average coach, is because Luck carried the Colts in 2012-2014. When Luck got injured and exposed and the AFC South became competitive, Pagano became exposed for what he is today, an average 8-8 coach that coaches a team with an elite QB.

 

this makes absolutely no sense.  "In a year with Luck injured and the AFC becoming competitive, Pagano became exposed for being an average coach with an elite QB"...but he still led the team to an 8-8 record (something most teams don't do without their franchise QB out for an extended period of time) in a division you yourself said was more competitive than in years past with a roster that 99% of the free world considers to be the worst, or at least one of the worst, in the NFL.  How did that "expose" him?

[Yoshinator]

Just now, J@son said:

 

this makes absolutely no sense.  "In a year with Luck injured and the AFC becoming competitive, Pagano became exposed for being an average coach with an elite QB"...but he still led the team to an 8-8 record (something most teams don't do without their franchise QB out for an extended period of time) in a division you yourself said was more competitive than in years past with a roster that 99% of the free world considers to be the worst, or at least one of the worst, in the NFL.  How did that "expose" him?

It exposed him because it showed how much he dropped off without Luck carrying the team. The division got better and he crumbled. It shows Pagano was the product of an elite QB and a poor division. Without that, he's an average coach. He also had Luck back for 15 games this year and still went 8-8. 

[Jason_]

1 hour ago, Jared Cisneros said:

It exposed him because it showed how much he dropped off without Luck carrying the team. The division got better and he crumbled. It shows Pagano was the product of an elite QB and a poor division. Without that, he's an average coach.

 

again I'm just not seeing the same connection you are.  Pagano took the team to an 8-8 record without Luck and with what most consider an incredibly deficient level of talent on the roster.  He did so in a division that you yourself said was more competitive.  Most coaches that lose their franchise QB for 9 games lose probably over 75% of those games, but Pagano actually had a better record without Luck that season than he did with Luck.  I don't see how that at all indicates that Pagano is the product of Luck.  If anything it leads more credence to the idea that Luck and his inconsistent play/decision-making has been a bigger part of the problem than most are willing to admit to.

 

Quote

He also had Luck back for 15 games this year and still went 8-8. 

 

yeah, but they also had to start a different offensive line combination how many times?  How many members of the secondary went down through the season?  Hell we opened with season with 3 of our top 4 defensive backs out of the game.  Also had a brand new coaching staff with new schemes and potentially new terminology.  Combine all of these things together and yeah there were going to be struggles...managing to come out 8-8 considering all of those factors is actually quite an accomplishment.  Most teams would crumble under those circumstances.

[Yoshinator]

2 minutes ago, J@son said:

 

again I'm just not seeing the same connection you are.  Pagano took the team to an 8-8 record without Luck and with what most consider an incredibly deficient level of talent on the roster.  He did so in a division that you yourself said was more competitive.  Most coaches that lose their franchise QB for 9 games lose probably over 75% of those games, but Pagano actually had a better record without Luck that season than he did with Luck.  I don't see how that at all indicates that Pagano is the product of Luck.  If anything it leads more credence to the idea that Luck and his inconsistent play/decision-making has been a bigger part of the problem than most are willing to admit to.

 

 

yeah, but they also had to start a different offensive line combination how many times?  How many members of the secondary went down through the season?  Hell we opened with season with 3 of our top 4 defensive backs out of the game.  Also had a brand new coaching staff with new schemes and potentially new terminology.  Combine all of these things together and yeah there were going to be struggles...managing to come out 8-8 considering all of those factors is actually quite an accomplishment.  Most teams would crumble under those circumstances.

I guess the problem I have is our best unit was terrible early on most games (the offense), and our defense did a decent job of keeping us in it. Maybe Pagano was doing his job as a defensive coach in that regard, but we should of been more like the Packers or Saints, not the way we were. It is possible Luck has truly regressed, and I like to think right now that it is due to injury (he was playing like 2013-2014 RGIII last year in the way he was piling up his stats in the 2nd half), but that's remained to be seen. This year I'd just like to beat the Steelers or Patriots just once and am very frustrated right now. Without any control, it absolutely drives me nuts, as there is nothing I can do about it.

[Colts_Fan12]

2 hours ago, crazycolt1 said:

Instead of debating what you think all you can do is attack someone on a personal level because they don't agree with you. You are like a broken record with your never ending line of nonsense.

Talk about a broken record...... sheesh that is you and your rah rah "everything in the organization is perfect" mentality