Why not Peppers?

[krunk]

I think Peppers could be very similar to Cam Chancellor if he focused on one position. 

[krunk]

I'm not sure if I see the Colts drafting him though.  Maybe only in the case that they switch Geathers to ILB, but listening to Ballard he kept speaking of Geathers as a hybrid so I'm not confident that move is happening.

[krunk]

 

I'd have zero problem with adding this guy to our team. 

[SP_21]

8 hours ago, krunk said:

 

I'd have zero problem with adding this guy to our team. 

He really seems like a great guy with a good head on his shoulders. I wouldn't be too upset if we drafted him. 

 

Really can't go wrong at 15. So many great prospects. Hope we stay away from guys with character issues and draft someone like Peppers. 

[Qcolts]

 Wouldn't mind this pick. This defense needs playmakers. Not one player on our entire defense screams playmaker. If he's that guy, you pick him and find a place for Geathers. 

[NewColtsFan]

 

There are plenty of reasons to be against Peppers...

 

First of which,  he is NOT a playmaker.

 

In two years as a starter,  he has, I think, 11 pass break-ups and 1 interception.    And 10 of those break-ups were in his first year,  and then they made him a linebacker this year and he had one.

 

Scouts note he simply doesn't have much production.    Read the write-up on him from NFL.com.     He is NOT what you think he is.      He MIGHT BE someday.    But that day is not in his rookie year.

 

There's a reason why he is mostly viewed as a late first to early 2nd round pick.    So, do you really want to take him at 15?       Not me.     And I'm not sure I want to trade down to take him.     There are other safeties I like more.     Don't be taken in by the hype.    Right now he's Fools Gold.     Maybe by his 2nd year with the right coaching he'll be what you're hoping for....   but I'm not sure that's what the Colts need in 2017.

 

Here's his bio profile:        Read it.    It will be eye opening for some.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/profiles/jabrill-peppers?id=2557980

 

[AZColt11]

5 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

There are plenty of reasons to be against Peppers...

 

First of which,  he is NOT a playmaker.

 

In two years as a starter,  he has, I think, 11 pass break-ups and 1 interception.    And 10 of those break-ups were in his first year,  and then they made him a linebacker this year and he had one.

 

Scouts note he simply doesn't have much production.    Read the write-up on him from NFL.com.     He is NOT what you think he is.      He MIGHT BE someday.    But that day is not in his rookie year.

 

There's a reason why he is mostly viewed as a late first to early 2nd round pick.    So, do you really want to take him at 15?       Not me.     And I'm not sure I want to trade down to take him.     There are other safeties I like more.     Don't be taken in by the hype.    Right now he's Fools Gold.     Maybe by his 2nd year with the right coaching he'll be what you're hoping for....   but I'm not sure that's what the Colts need in 2017.

 

Here's his bio profile:        Read it.    It will be eye opening for some.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/profiles/jabrill-peppers?id=2557980

 

This has been my issue with him.  He also doesn't really have one position of focus, although i think he best fits one of the safety positions.  But there were some guys in the Big Ten alone that out-produced him, one I'm hoping we look at next year in Tegray Scales.  Have you seen HIS production?  Man!  Now THAT's a LB.

 

Not saying he CAN'T be that guy, he's certainly athletic enough.  And some guys like him settle into one position and explode.  Just not sure I want to risk the 15th pick to find out.  Now if he's there in round 2, yeah!

[stitches]

4 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

There are plenty of reasons to be against Peppers...

 

First of which,  he is NOT a playmaker.

 

In two years as a starter,  he has, I think, 11 pass break-ups and 1 interception.    And 10 of those break-ups were in his first year,  and then they made him a linebacker this year and he had one.

 

Scouts note he simply doesn't have much production.    Read the write-up on him from NFL.com.     He is NOT what you think he is.      He MIGHT BE someday.    But that day is not in his rookie year.

 

There's a reason why he is mostly viewed as a late first to early 2nd round pick.    So, do you really want to take him at 15?       Not me.     And I'm not sure I want to trade down to take him.     There are other safeties I like more.     Don't be taken in by the hype.    Right now he's Fools Gold.     Maybe by his 2nd year with the right coaching he'll be what you're hoping for....   but I'm not sure that's what the Colts need in 2017.

 

Here's his bio profile:        Read it.    It will be eye opening for some.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2017/profiles/jabrill-peppers?id=2557980

 

The Colts are not in absolute need for anything in 2017. You don't draft for 2017. You draft for 2017-2025. His 10 pass breakups were not this year, but the previous year when he played his natural position at safety. This is GREAT production for safety. None of the safeties projected in the top two rounds have a season with that many passes defended(maximum is 7). Not Hooker, not Adams, not Budda Baker, not Obi, not Marcus Williams. He had 5.5 tackles for loss that season, too. Only Hooker and Jamal Adams who are projected top 5 have a season with that many tackles for loss. This is GREAT production for the safety position. And he did it in the only season he had the chance to do it. He doesn't have the interceptions. That's it... that's the only lack of production you can point to if you evaluate him as a safety.

 

I'm not saying I would want him at 15. There are probably going to be players I would rather have, but I wouldn't be disappointed if we drafted him.

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, stitches said:

The Colts are not in absolute need for anything in 2017. You don't draft for 2017. You draft for 2017-2025. His 10 pass breakups were not this year, but the previous year when he played his natural position at safety. This is GREAT production for safety. None of the safeties projected in the top two rounds have a season with that many passes defended(maximum is 7). Not Hooker, not Adams, not Budda Baker, not Obi, not Marcus Williams. He had 5.5 tackles for loss that season, too. Only Hooker and Jamal Adams who are projected top 5 have a season with that many tackles for loss. This is GREAT production for the safety position. And he did it in the only season he had the chance to do it. He doesn't have the interceptions. That's it... that's the only lack of production you can point to if you evaluate him as a safety.

 

I'm not saying I would want him at 15. There are probably going to be players I would rather have, but I wouldn't be disappointed if we drafted him.

 

The Colts hope to make the playoffs in 2017.    They'd like to win the division and not just get in as a wild card,  though they'd take it if they could.     The Colts have TONS of needs...      And frankly,  safety isn't one of the highest.      But I'd take Hooker,  Adams and even Melifowanu.    I think they all have higher ceilings long-term than Peppers.

 

Read the profile.    See what they're saying about Peppers.....    you might re-think your position.

 

[stitches]

2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

The Colts hope to make the playoffs in 2017.    They'd like to win the division and not just get in as a wild card,  though they'd take it if they could.     The Colts have TONS of needs...      And frankly,  safety isn't one of the highest.      But I'd take Hooker,  Adams and even Melifowanu.    I think they all have higher ceilings long-term than Peppers.

 

Read the profile.    See what they're saying about Peppers.....    you might re-think your position.

 

I've read the profile. I just don't agree with it. I think people are judging Peppers by his linebacker tape and transposing their evaluation onto his safety projection. I don't think that's fair and I don't think it's likely to give you a reliable projection. I think he's much better safety prospect than his linebacker tape would indicate.

[Andrew Luck fan club]

Would be a bad pick at #15. 

 

Jabrill Peppers 2014-2016 Coverage Stats While the Primary Defender (via @PFF_College): 94 Times Targeted

58 RECEPTIONS ALLOWED

6 Passes Defended

0 INTs (1 deflection as secondary defender) (via @CFBFilmRoom)

2015 20.4% missed tackle rate as a Safety/DB

2016 Targeted 12 times as primary defender Allowed 8 receptions for 93 yards (11.625 yds avg.) and 6 1st downs

 

I don't like his tape either. There's so much better options in the later rounds. Like I said before, 5th best safety in the whole draft. 

 

 

•  

[Andrew Luck fan club]

16 minutes ago, stitches said:

I've read the profile. I just don't agree with it. I think people are judging Peppers by his linebacker tape and transposing their evaluation onto his safety projection. I don't think that's fair and I don't think it's likely to give you a reliable projection. I think he's much better safety prospect than his linebacker tape would indicate.

Where is his tape where he plays free safety? 

[stitches]

59 minutes ago, Majin Vegeta said:

Where is his tape where he plays free safety? 

I just tried to find the tape to show you and ended up watching 3 different games of him from last year. All snaps. I have to say he looks much worse than I remembered. He was a piece they moved around all the defense even in 2015 it seems. He played CB, slot corner, SS, even some LB. I have no idea why I had left with the impression that he was a huge playmaker. I swear I watched several games last year and he looked like one... or at least I thought he did at the time. Now that I'm watching he looks... kind of meh. He's good tracking the shallow routes and most of what's ahead of him, and he has the speed to cover deep but he is absolutely clueless on deep routes... he's a bit like TJ Green... runs with his back to the ball, never turns around, never tracks the ball, runs over opponents for pass interferences. WOW! wth? That's shocking to me. I have no idea how I was left with the impression he's good at it before? I have to apologize for my previous posts it seems. Both to you and to @NewColtsFan. You might have been right about this one. He also doesn't seem to wrap opponents when he tackles them. He tries to undercut them, or hit them with his body, which probably won't work too well in the NFL.

 

I take most of what I said back. After watching that tape again, I don't really want him in the first... Weirdly enough he actually looked best on offense and on returns. Here's the videos I watched for reference:

 

 

 

 

[Valpo2004]

On 3/17/2017 at 3:40 AM, Rick_Grimes said:

I don't really see too many Colts fans pitching for us to draft Peppers at 15. The guy can play numerous positions and can help elevate our return game as well. We could have him play safety or maybe even bulk him up a little and have him as a LB. We desperately need someone on this defense who can make plays and add a little versatility to this defense. Peppers can be that guy. I would love to see Geathers and Peppers as our starting safeties and we can bring in TJ Green off the bench for certain formations. I love guys like Harris, Lamp and Cook.. but I wouldn't mind adding a guy like Peppers to our defense.

 

Because he's not that good at either position.  

 

Guy has like 1 Int, 0 passes defensed, and 0 forced fumbles on his entire freaking college career.  He just hits people really hard.  

 

We already have that in Geathers.  

[stitches]

11 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

Because he's not that good at either position.  

 

Guy has like 1 Int, 0 passes defensed, and 0 forced fumbles on his entire freaking college career.  He just hits people really hard.  

 

We already have that in Geathers.  

Umh... he had a season with 10 passes defended as a DB. That's more than any other safety in this class. I just watched his tape, most of those are on passes in front of him or to the side(he gets his hands in front of opponents and bats the ball away). He's not good on deep ball coverage. He loses track of the ball and never looks back to it until he crashes with an opponent for PI or the opponent catches the ball.

[Valpo2004]

2 hours ago, stitches said:

I just tried to find the tape to show you and ended up watching 3 different games of him from last year. All snaps. I have to say he looks much worse than I remembered. He was a piece they moved around all the defense even in 2015 it seems. He played CB, slot corner, SS, even some LB. I have no idea why I had left with the impression that he was a huge playmaker. I swear I watched several games last year and he looked like one... or at least I thought he did at the time. Now that I'm watching he looks... kind of meh. He's good tracking the shallow routes and most of what's ahead of him, and he has the speed to cover deep but he is absolutely clueless on deep routes... he's a bit like TJ Green... runs with his back to the ball, never turns around, never tracks the ball, runs over opponents for pass interferences. WOW! wth? That's shocking to me. I have no idea how I was left with the impression he's good at it before? I have to apologize for my previous posts it seems. Both to you and to @NewColtsFan. You might have been right about this one. He also doesn't seem to wrap opponents when he tackles them. He tries to undercut them, or hit them with his body, which probably won't work too well in the NFL.

 

I take most of what I said back. After watching that tape again, I don't really want him in the first... Weirdly enough he actually looked best on offense and on returns. Here's the videos I watched for reference:

 

 

 

 

 

Great deal of respect for being a big enough person to admit you where wrong.  Most people on the internet just disappear.  

 

I will also say that I'm an Iowa fan and watched Iowa play them and he didn't impress in that game either.  Got juked by the Iowa RB (Wadley) on a couple occasions.  

 

A lot of hype for him but the production isn't there.  To me he's developmental so I'd push him to the 4th. 

[Valpo2004]

Just now, stitches said:

Umh... he had a season with 10 passes defended as a DB. That's more than any other safety in this class.

 

That is true I apologize for being wrong on the number.  Still his production isn't really there for any position.  

[stitches]

3 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

 

That is true I apologize for being wrong on the number.  Still his production isn't really there for any position.  

I don't think he's bad generally. But I thought he's much better than this. I still think he will command a second round pick. For example, I'd take him before TJ Green. He's better sideline to sideline and on plays in front of him IMO. But he's just as bad as TJ on long and deep balls where he needs to turn back, run and then look back for the ball.

[Valpo2004]

8 minutes ago, stitches said:

I don't think he's bad generally. But I thought he's much better than this. I still think he will command a second round pick. For example, I'd take him before TJ Green. He's better sideline to sideline and on plays in front of him IMO. But he's just as bad as TJ on long and deep balls where he needs to turn back, run and then look back for the ball.

 

I would too all things being equal but I wouldn't have taken TJ in the second either.  I tend to see round 4 as your round for taking developmental guys.  Maybe even round 3.  

 

Round 1 guys should be ideally able to start right away and Round 2 guys ideally should be at least a major contributor right away.  That's just my personal opinion though.  

[Defjamz26]

Drafting Peppers at 15 would be like drafting Green all over again. I'm not even sure Peppers has the skills to hold up as a FS.

[NewColtsFan]

5 hours ago, stitches said:

I just tried to find the tape to show you and ended up watching 3 different games of him from last year. All snaps. I have to say he looks much worse than I remembered. He was a piece they moved around all the defense even in 2015 it seems. He played CB, slot corner, SS, even some LB. I have no idea why I had left with the impression that he was a huge playmaker. I swear I watched several games last year and he looked like one... or at least I thought he did at the time. Now that I'm watching he looks... kind of meh. He's good tracking the shallow routes and most of what's ahead of him, and he has the speed to cover deep but he is absolutely clueless on deep routes... he's a bit like TJ Green... runs with his back to the ball, never turns around, never tracks the ball, runs over opponents for pass interferences. WOW! wth? That's shocking to me. I have no idea how I was left with the impression he's good at it before? I have to apologize for my previous posts it seems. Both to you and to @NewColtsFan. You might have been right about this one. He also doesn't seem to wrap opponents when he tackles them. He tries to undercut them, or hit them with his body, which probably won't work too well in the NFL.

 

I take most of what I said back. After watching that tape again, I don't really want him in the first... Weirdly enough he actually looked best on offense and on returns. Here's the videos I watched for reference:

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for this.....

 

I want to be clear about this....    I think Peppers is talented.   And I think someday he'll be a very, very good safety.     I'm just not sure when,  but I don't think it happens in 2017.   

 

I hope we can find someone who can impact our games this year.....   the lone exception to that rule is McKinley,  who I'd be willing to wait for.     Quality pass rush is hard to find,  so I'd grab it while I could...

 

[stitches]

Here's an alternative look at Peppers, very much worth watching:

 

 

[LJpalmbeacher2]

Peppers is not the type of player the colts traditionly draft/sign.

I mean he's a high profile player AND will receive a lot of media attention. Other than qb's, we don't usually get marque names, especially on Defense.

 

Personally, I would like him very much here. He would be exciting and interesting to see how he would be used.

[Andrew Luck fan club]

49 minutes ago, stitches said:

Here's an alternative look at Peppers, very much worth watching:

 

 

That's almost exactly what we have Geathers do.