threeflight

Ballard seems to be signing guys just "because".....

Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, IndyD4U said:

I don't think people realize just how bad this roster is/was. The first string guys are/were borderline NFL starters, not to mention the 2nd and 3rds behind them. 

 

We have gotten better with every move 

Not sure we are better... not by much if any... still a lot to prove.... 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

Well Ballard did offer him a long-term deal, that's been verified. And he opted to play for the other team on a one year deal. What other conclusion is there to make?

I must have missed the verification part.

 

But I would say the terms of the contract...not the teams...is what the reason would be.

 

She says 5 yr 60 mil, but left out an important piece I'm sure.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Pelt said:

You may or may not like one signing coming soon, from an individual I was talking with here in Memphis this morning... unless he was just telling me what he thought I wanted to hear. 

 

Who?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Indyfan4life said:

Atlanta is in a better position to win than we are. Sometimes money =/= chance at championship. Atlanta will regress this year though. 

A real...bonafide...$60 mill compared to $8 mill?

 

Uh...no.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It has not gone the way I expected. We had top 10 money and I expected at least one big splash.

 

I'm not as sold on Sheard as everyone else. He's a guy who was trending the wrong way in New England. Whose to say that doesn't continue here? The Simon signing is a nice one.

 

But other than that we're really kind of going through the refuse piles. They're all low-risk signing, but they also are low-reward. Mingo, and Schwenke probably aren't going to do a whole lot to make this team better. And I don't even expect Al Woods (no, really, what's up with this?) to make the final 53.

 

I know he plans to build through the draft, but I was expecting a little more out of this FA period.

 

 

*

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Sure didn't take long for the posters to turn on Ballard....

I remember some of us saying the night he was hired that he'd be a hero until he made his first draft..and then he'd be a villian..

 

 

 

didn't take that long, did it?

Edited by oldunclemark
spell
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
44 minutes ago, Old Colt said:

Not sure we are better... not by much if any... still a lot to prove.... 

He hasn't had one draft yet..

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

Unless the offense is outstanding -- explosive and efficient -- the Colts aren't going to be serious contenders in 2017. That should have been obvious a long time ago. One draft and one free agent period wasn't going to transform this roster.

Yes, I agree.

Do you think we'll better off using some early picks on offensive playmakers to try and improve on that side and become a top 5 offense OR use them on defense and slowly build on that side?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, LJpalmbeacher said:

Yes, I agree.

Do you think we'll better off using some early picks on offensive playmakers to try and improve on that side and become a top 5 offense OR use them on defense and slowly build on that side?

 

I don't think the issue with offense is personnel, I think it's coaching. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Superman said:

 

I don't think the issue with offense is personnel, I think it's coaching. 

I don't disagree.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Flash7 said:

Sure, understandable.

 

Does adding quality FAs negate CB's ability to also add depth through FA with nearly 50M in cap space? For example, we could have signed POE and possibly even Zach Brown, and still signed all of the depth players that are currently signed. (I understand that just because we are interested in players, it does not mean that they will sign with us, as there are other options available).

 

Does adding qualtiy FAs negate CB's ability draft quality players?

Respectfully, I don't see why you cant do both?

 

Exactly.

There was enough $ to do both.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, DougDew said:

I must have missed the verification part.

 

But I would say the terms of the contract...not the teams...is what the reason would be.

 

She says 5 yr 60 mil, but left out an important piece I'm sure.  

 

Yeah who knows what the guaranteed money was, but if I had to speculate I'd say it was in the ballpark of $20mil, and very front loaded.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Colts apparently offered Poe a 5 year $60 million contract and he turned it down for a 1 year $8 million dollar contract?

 

Just doesn't make sense to me. He could of made $10-12 annually here with a long term commitment. Who turns that down? Maybe the guaranteed money wasn't enough? But still.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let's just wait and see how the draft pans out before we call out Ballard. He's filling holes and adding depth and hopefully he can nail the draft.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

Yeah who knows what the guaranteed money was, but if I had to speculate I'd say it was in the ballpark of $20mil, and very front loaded.

Poe probably wanted between $30-35 million in guaranteed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, threeflight said:

These are some quotes over on Stampede Blue, and I cannot argue with any of them.

 

Could someone name 1 position group we've upgraded?

TE , nope we are down 1 guy
OL, Reitz retired Harrison walk, sign Brian Schwenke
DL, Kerr out sign Hunt & Harris
OLB, Mathis retired, Cole walk, Walden walk, sign Sheard & Simon
ILB, DQ released no signings
DB, Adams out, Robinson released, Butler on market, no signings
P Boomstick retired Locke signed

We only have 7 draft picks

 

This feels like the Grigson years all over again only Grigson never had this much money to spend.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really frustrated. All the cap money that we had and we aren’t signing a single big impact player. Not one! Our answer to improve the OL is the second coming of Mike McGlynn (Schwenke). We have not addressed ILB. We have not addressed CB. We have not addressed pass rush or OLB as I don’t think Mingo, Simon, and Shepard are much of an upgrade over what we had.

The last few years have been tough. Teams like the Broncos and Giants and Patriots have found a way to get the guys they want while we settle for depth players that help bring competition. I know the roster is a mess and cannot be fixed over night, but would it hurt to have anyone that is considered one of the best at what they do ( besides Luck)?

 

Ballard lied to us all

I remember in one of his first interviews he stated that when they do go into free agency they are going to get guys who have "earned it". All the Colts have done so far is Sheard- backup, Simon- backup, Schwenke-back up and loves to play video games, Mingo- bust, Hunt-bust, and Woods-back up.

I had high hopes for Ballard, but these moves add zero impact players and the Colts HAD MONEY TO GET THEM. If I was Pagano I would go ahead and pack my bags. This team isn’t winning more than 6 games.

So what where you expecting? We'd sign Poe, Hightower, Bouye, and Jefferson? We went after two of those guys, got an interview from one, and ended up with 0. Is Chris Ballard disappointing you because he's not brain washing ppl to come play for us? You can't force talent to come just because you have money, we swung at big names and missed. Simon and Sheard are both HUGE upgrades, they're not All-Pros but will be a great addition. BTW FA is not even close to being done.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Pelt said:

Oh well, nice to know that coming into this forum for wonderful constructive discussion like this remains consistent.

No offense Mr Pelt, but when you reach so far that you look like Stretch Armstrong, you gonna get a little flak. It was said without malice......

 

Actually, the big names are not signing because the ghost of Bill Polian floats around the corridors of the LOS.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, DougDew said:

A real...bonafide...$60 mill compared to $8 mill?

 

Uh...no.

If I have the chance to win a super bowl, I'm going to take it. Why do you think so many players go to New England and take LESS money?

 

Think. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't read all this thread but to the OP I would say this:  If the Colts were one or perhaps two blue-chip players away from contending, I'd agree with you.  What Ballard has done/not done would not make much sense.  Of course, if they WERE that close Grigson and not Ballard would be making these moves.  I think he is looking at things with a long-term view.  That does not make fans happy and please the "win now" mainstream fans.  But it IS the right way to go about a re-build, which this clearly is.  You rely on the draft for your blue-chippers, maybe ad one via FA, and the rest of the FA's are fill-in guys.  The Colts may not be much better than they were in January, but they will be better off with this approach and via the draft.  Hang in there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let's say hypothetically we didn't get any better in Free Agency (even though I definitely think we have in some positions), at least the roster has the same quality of talent, but is like, on average, 2-3 years younger. Most of the guys we signed, in essence, are entering their prime. Doesn't mean we got world-beaters, but it means a lot when you're trying to build a strong roster and not just a trying to squeak by with a good "starting roster" with no depth behind them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, oldunclemark said:

Sure didn't take long for the posters to turn on Ballard....

I remember some of us saying the night he was hired that he'd be a hero until he made his first draft..and then he'd be a villian..

 

 

 

didn't take that long, did it?

No there is people talking % on him because FA like lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, Kyle said:

so dumb...

 

Choice A: Pay a player to play punter.  Get him without using a draft pick

Choice B: Pay a player to play punter.  Get him by using a draft pick

 

Why does part of you go "uh oh" when our punter retired and we picked up a new one in free agency.  

 

As soon as I read your statement on how you felt about CB signing a FA punter,  all of me went, "uh oh, this guy is posting just because"

 

 

 

I'm still waiting for someone to explain why Locke is such a bad pick up, he's a good punter. Maybe doesn't quite have as much leg strength but that's not the most important thing to look for in a punter. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, threeflight said:

These are some quotes over on Stampede Blue, and I cannot argue with any of them.

 

Could someone name 1 position group we've upgraded?

We only have 7 draft picks

 

This feels like the Grigson years all over again only Grigson never had this much money to spend.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really frustrated.

 

Ballard lied to us all

 

Hmmm...Stampede Blue. Now there's a fan site with objective opinions......kind of reminds me of a bunch of spoiled little kids stomping their feet and demanding; "I want a championship and I want it now!" Can we wait until this thing unfolds a little before we assess Ballard? I would be a little more concerned if he spent all the money on FAs, trying to fill starting roles, for the sake of public opinion. Let's give this guy a chance to do his thing. We may be pleasantly surprised.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah there may not be any marquis players so far but at least the guys he's bringing in are all under 30 and still have potential to improve.  Who knows, every year there are several players who surprise and have that breakout year after a move.  Perhaps we will have one?  Let's also wait until after the draft to begin to judge this guy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am perfectly content with what has happened so far.....we needed volume (quality second and third stringers)...done with FA money where you don't have to pay redonkulous money.....We need talent do that with the draft where again you don't have to pay redonkulous money........a blind man can see that is a vast improvement for overpaying for names in FA and drafting back ups ala He who shall not be named.....

 

It's a pretty simple formula for anyone with reasonable thought process to dream up......If you wanted a reasonable assessment of this team you could say we needed:

1-WR

1-RB

1-RG

1-RT

2-NT

1-DE

6-LB

3-CB

2-S

1-P

minimum to be Super Bowl Worthy......That's 19 position improvements......if he hits on EVERY DRAFT PICK  (not reasonable or possible) by reasonable estimation. That would mean he addressed 13 of the 19 needs in one off season that would be phenominal....what is reasonable would be 3 starters from the draft....and hopefully one is a difference maker.....and it would be a GR8 offseason, and we would still be 6-10 players short of a dynasty......but he would have fixed 50% + of the problem which would be awesome...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

Yeah who knows what the guaranteed money was, but if I had to speculate I'd say it was in the ballpark of $20mil, and very front loaded.

I think the contracts are probably closer in terms of actual monies than what typically gets reported on the surface.  Those big dollar multi-year contracts that are presented are often smaller and shorter in reality.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Ballard is doing the best with what he has to work with. Does he have a lot of money? Heck yes he does. But there's another factor in here that some people seem to miss: the player themselves. They have the ultimate choice to sign where they want to go. 

 

And a good portion of these free agents are those who are now ready to compete for a Superbowl. The hard truth is we are a good few years from contention, which means a lot of (but not all of course) high valued players will be looking for a better chance of ROI. Those that have already cashed in with rings of course will look for the money, but for the guys who have never even reached the big one, they will want to go with a team they feel has the best chance. 

 

Take Poe for example. He could have signed a deal with us, probably played great and even get some rewards out of it. But instead he chose Atlanta. Why? I bet there's a good chance it was because they were just in the Superbowl! 

 

You can argue and say "yeah, but we have Luck". And you're right. He alone raises our franchise value. But a lot of other pieces and building needs to take place here. If can stun the league this coming season and win more than expected, then I wouldn't be surprised if we get more looks from players in next year's free agency. I personally still hope we build through the draft to be honest.

 

And I'm going to wait and let Ballard work before I start to cast judgement. Just as I did with Grigson. We honestly don't know enough at this point. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pretty standard fare for a new GM tear down/rebuild job. Hunt, Schwenke, Woods, all good role players I think, replacing the role players we let go.

 

He said he wants to primarily build through the draft. But you can only draft so many players.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, threeflight said:

These are some quotes over on Stampede Blue, and I cannot argue with any of them.

 

Could someone name 1 position group we've upgraded?

TE , nope we are down 1 guy
OL, Reitz retired Harrison walk, sign Brian Schwenke
DL, Kerr out sign Hunt & Harris
OLB, Mathis retired, Cole walk, Walden walk, sign Sheard & Simon
ILB, DQ released no signings
DB, Adams out, Robinson released, Butler on market, no signings
P Boomstick retired Locke signed

We only have 7 draft picks

 

This feels like the Grigson years all over again only Grigson never had this much money to spend.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really frustrated. All the cap money that we had and we aren’t signing a single big impact player. Not one! Our answer to improve the OL is the second coming of Mike McGlynn (Schwenke). We have not addressed ILB. We have not addressed CB. We have not addressed pass rush or OLB as I don’t think Mingo, Simon, and Shepard are much of an upgrade over what we had.

The last few years have been tough. Teams like the Broncos and Giants and Patriots have found a way to get the guys they want while we settle for depth players that help bring competition. I know the roster is a mess and cannot be fixed over night, but would it hurt to have anyone that is considered one of the best at what they do ( besides Luck)?

 

Ballard lied to us all

I remember in one of his first interviews he stated that when they do go into free agency they are going to get guys who have "earned it". All the Colts have done so far is Sheard- backup, Simon- backup, Schwenke-back up and loves to play video games, Mingo- bust, Hunt-bust, and Woods-back up.

I had high hopes for Ballard, but these moves add zero impact players and the Colts HAD MONEY TO GET THEM. If I was Pagano I would go ahead and pack my bags. This team isn’t winning more than 6 games.

 

Well what that tells me is to not spend much time over at Stampede Blue.  Not a great deal of deep thinkers over there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Flash7 said:

1. New England had the #1 scoring defense, and we already know about their prolific offense. They have plenty of play makers. They signed Talib, and then signed Revis (Super Bowl victory) and just signed Gilmore this Free Agency. Atlanta just signed POE, which is what many would have been satisfied with as a big free agent pickup. I agree that Green Bay and Pittsburgh do a good job building through the draft. If anything, those 4 teams illustrate that there is more than 1 way to get it done. 

 

2. The Texans do not have a quality QB. The Giants are adding play makers, however, I wouldn't say that they have plenty of play makers. KC is a good team with an above average QB. What happens to KC in the playoffs is what you would expect.

 

3. I don't think that anyone is advocating that we "Break the Bank" for a few difference makers. I think it's reasonable to pay players what the market dictates their value is. If we wait to pay for play makers, (AKA- add depth now and next year or the year after go after high-end FA's) that's fine, just note that the market is only going up. 

 

4. Jacksonville had the #6 defense, after being ranked at the bottom the past few years.

1. My examples were last year's Championship teams. New England essentially has 2 on defense, Atlanta has one very young pass rusher, etc, etc. New England may add one or two free agent rentals a year but can get away with that due to how well the rest of their roster is constructed and having TB play really under-market value.

 

2. The Giants are not adding playmakers, they had five 1st or 2nd team All-Pros this past season and spent a ton of money on defense. It amounted to giving up 38 points and losing to the Packers in the first round. Contrast that with New England's two, one of which is leaving more than likely. We need a better system and better breadth of quality, 1-2 big name guys won't do that better than 6-7 competent ones. 

 

3. In order to sign high-end free agents you need to commit to some amount of long-term money (usually), I agree it's possible to get a bigger free agent once we have a better idea of the direction our team is going, which is why I think patience is key. If we are looking at his time in KC as a template, nearly all of their stalwart defensive players were drafted. 

 

No one may be writing that we need to "break the bank" but that's what the OP is implying by his post. Teams in our situation (rebuilding/struggling defense) have made big, cost eating signings before (Miami with Suh, Jacksonville with any defensive player of the past decade, Eagles with Asomugha, Byrd to the Saints, Redskins with Haynesworth, etc, etc, etc) and it never works out when the team around that player is crap. Then that team ends up eating that contract for years. Even the Broncos had a really good base through the draft before adding Free Agents.

 

4. Ok, and that amounted to 3 wins. My point is that we just need a defense to competent to win. For that we need to improve at every position, which is why it makes more sense to me to slowly build depth then add someone if needed later.

 

I think we are essentially agreeing so I'll just leave it at that. I understand wanting to sign bigger free agents, it is just crazy to me that people are already frustrated with Ballard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, threeflight said:

Am I the only one who is not liking what I am seeing so far with Ballard's free agent signings?  

 

He has signed 2 players who I guess could be considered starters in Simon and Sheard, and even they are not what I would call blue chippers by any stretch.

 

Other than that, he seems to be getting rid of the Colt players who were here already and just replacing them with "guys".  And I am starting to get the impression he doesn't really have any rhyme or reason to his signings.  It is almost as if he is signing them just because they weren't Colts.  

 

As soon as he signed that punter a little part of me went "uh oh".  I know he is just a punter but to me, it seems so much better to draft one then sign a guy like that.

 

And that was just the beginning.  Al Woods?  Mingo?  Schwenke?  Hunt?  And while their contracts are not large, they are still for $5 million or so and it is starting to eat away at our cap space and I cannot say we are any better off today then we were a month ago.

 

I just get the feeling that he really doesn't know what they heck he is doing, and is making changes just for the sake of changes.

 

Thoughts?

I disagree totally.   I really like the signings he has made. 

i don't understand the bolded part.   You still have to fill the roster.   Ballard is being very careful to sign needed pieces for reasonable contracts.   He's also signing guys who are young.   I don't think this team was one or 2 huge FA signings away from being a playoff team.   However, after the players he has brought in, they are much closer.  I think this team had almost no depth at any position.   Now they do have some. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, John Waylon said:

It has not gone the way I expected. We had top 10 money and I expected at least one big splash.

 

I'm not as sold on Sheard as everyone else. He's a guy who was trending the wrong way in New England. Whose to say that doesn't continue here? The Simon signing is a nice one.

 

But other than that we're really kind of going through the refuse piles. They're all low-risk signing, but they also are low-reward. Mingo, and Schwenke probably aren't going to do a whole lot to make this team better. And I don't even expect Al Woods (no, really, what's up with this?) to make the final 53.

 

I know he plans to build through the draft, but I was expecting a little more out of this FA period.

 

 

*

 

My two cents....

 

There were really no true difference making, impact, change-the-game level players.  People who think Nick Perry was that type of guy are fooling themselves.  So they have gone about free agency with the idea of getting solid, role playing guys who are younger and can be had relatively inexpensively.  They will use the draft to try and get their playmakers.  

 

The defense today is miles better than what it was last year.  Well, maybe not miles better but they are certainly improved.  The best defenses out there really only have a small handful of difference makers.  The bulk are JAGs.  The Colts' JAGs this year are better than last year's.  

 

I think anyone who is surprised by the offseason to this point was not paying attention to Ballard.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Rick_Grimes said:

Poe probably wanted between $30-35 million in guaranteed.

 

I can't look at your avi without thinking "Caaaaarrrrllllll" and cracking up. Too funny.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know what you expected him to do.  We have so many holes on defense, it doesn't matter who we sign.  We are not in the win-now phase anymore.  That ship has sailed.  We are in full rebuild mode and to be honest, the signings have been solid.  At this point, we need to start building for depth and rotation and draft our future starters.  We need longevity at this point.

 

I am ok with the signings.  Nice solid guys who can come in provide depth.  I'm looking forward to the draft more than FA.  If we can hit in the draft in the next few years while keeping our cap situation looking good to sign some stars, we may be able to rebound quicker.  Until then, just enjoy the ride.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I didn't like his suit, and he should have never shaved. And his draft picks will suck. Season's over before it starts. Can't believe he didn't sign Bouye, Hightower, Poe, Garçon and Jackson. Never should have let J. Harrison go. His house is too small, no curb appeal. No one wants to come to Indy, should move the franchise. Offense stinks, averaged 26 points a game. Could have traded Luck for Glennon straight up, but Glennon didn't want to be affected by instability in the organization. Reports are an administrative assistant was leaving to go to Farmers and Glennon was spooked. 

 

I think I covered the first 8 days of free agency.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, imacoltfan said:

I didn't like his suit, and he should have never shaved. And his draft picks will suck. Season's over before it starts. Can't believe he didn't sign Bouye, Hightower, Poe, Garçon and Jackson. Never should have let J. Harrison go. His house is too small, no curb appeal. No one wants to come to Indy, should move the franchise. Offense stinks, averaged 26 points a game. Could have traded Luck for Glennon straight up, but Glennon didn't want to be affected by instability in the organization. Reports are an administrative assistant was leaving to go to Farmers and Glennon was spooked. 

 

I think I covered the first 8 days of free agency.

 

Nailed it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.