threeflight

Ballard seems to be signing guys just "because".....

183 posts in this topic

7 minutes ago, CheezyColt said:

I see what you're saying and I can agree to a point.  I think it's probably just a preference thing.  Looks like Ballard is wanting to fill the roster with solid, albeit not dazzling, players at all positions (assuming something is done at cornerback during free agency).  This way he won't necessarily be forced into taking a player due to such a glaring need and he can actually try to go for BPA in the draft.  It's sacrificing high end talent at one position for moderate/solid talent at multiple positions.  I don't disagree with that philosophy when taking over a new team, though I can see why some would prefer at least one or two marquee players at the expense of solid talent at maybe less impactful positions.  Just preference I guess. :)

You have to get the game changers in the draft.  Those players generally don't become available in free agency, unless you luck out, taking a chance on a player like Rodney Harrison with injury concerns.  And the players who appear to be game changers in free agency, more often than not, turn out to be busts. 

 

This, I think, is the way to do it, and I'll admit Grigson tried in his way to follow this model, but just because he failed at it doesn't mean Ballard will.

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1 hour ago, threeflight said:

 

As soon as he signed that punter a little part of me went "uh oh".  I know he is just a punter but to me, it seems so much better to draft one then sign a guy like that.

 

so dumb...

 

Choice A: Pay a player to play punter.  Get him without using a draft pick

Choice B: Pay a player to play punter.  Get him by using a draft pick

 

Why does part of you go "uh oh" when our punter retired and we picked up a new one in free agency.  

 

As soon as I read your statement on how you felt about CB signing a FA punter,  all of me went, "uh oh, this guy is posting just because"

 

 

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Grigson understand importance of having quality depth, but he formed that depth with washed up vets. Ballard also is trying to form rotational/depth core before signing big names, but this core is much younger and cheaper. Hunt will replace Langford, Sheard will replace Cole, Simon will replace Walden. Either younger/cheaper or better. Next offseason will be much more interesting.

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27 minutes ago, threeflight said:

These are some quotes over on Stampede Blue, and I cannot argue with any of them.

 

Could someone name 1 position group we've upgraded?

TE , nope we are down 1 guy
OL, Reitz retired Harrison walk, sign Brian Schwenke
DL, Kerr out sign Hunt & Harris
OLB, Mathis retired, Cole walk, Walden walk, sign Sheard & Simon
ILB, DQ released no signings
DB, Adams out, Robinson released, Butler on market, no signings
P Boomstick retired Locke signed

We only have 7 draft picks

 

This feels like the Grigson years all over again only Grigson never had this much money to spend.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really frustrated. All the cap money that we had and we aren’t signing a single big impact player. Not one! Our answer to improve the OL is the second coming of Mike McGlynn (Schwenke). We have not addressed ILB. We have not addressed CB. We have not addressed pass rush or OLB as I don’t think Mingo, Simon, and Shepard are much of an upgrade over what we had.

The last few years have been tough. Teams like the Broncos and Giants and Patriots have found a way to get the guys they want while we settle for depth players that help bring competition. I know the roster is a mess and cannot be fixed over night, but would it hurt to have anyone that is considered one of the best at what they do ( besides Luck)?

 

Ballard lied to us all

I remember in one of his first interviews he stated that when they do go into free agency they are going to get guys who have "earned it". All the Colts have done so far is Sheard- backup, Simon- backup, Schwenke-back up and loves to play video games, Mingo- bust, Hunt-bust, and Woods-back up.

I had high hopes for Ballard, but these moves add zero impact players and the Colts HAD MONEY TO GET THEM. If I was Pagano I would go ahead and pack my bags. This team isn’t winning more than 6 games.

 

That's a GRUMPY crowd over there. I like Josh's writing, but the comments section take on a life of their own, and are just generally bitter. They do allow profanity though, so whenever I feel the need to drop a gratuitous ^^^, that's where I go.

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We are striking out on the big time free agents because like I've said before, there is little to make a big time free agent want to come here. The weather is bad, city life ain't great, small market, bad team, state income taxes. When is that last time we signed a big time free agent that wasn't past his prime?

 

Ballard tried going after Perry, Bouye, Poe, Zeitler, and Z. Brown and they are choosing other teams. We have the fill the roster somehow.

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This guy sucks!! what a terrible idea to fill our starter spots on our team with young players from the draft......

 

I really don't know why everyone thought this could be fixed in one offseason. Grigson absolutely destroyed our team it's damn near impossible to fix it in one offseason. It's gonna take atleast 2 possibly 3 to fix his mess. Me personally I don't care if we are great next year it gives ballad another high pick opportunity and more then likely we can dump chuck. Seems like a winner any way I look at it!!

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32 minutes ago, bananabucket said:

Ballard is seriously pissing me off.

Good.

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Every GM needs to be given a chance to make his own mark on the team. If you listen to the fans, you may end up sitting with them.

 

How can you not see that we have improved a non-existent pass rush with quality backups that have starter upside in Simon and Sheard? 

 

How can you not see that they are trusting the gelling of the young OL and letting the continuity flow into this year?

 

It is OK to be on the fence but if they end up winning the division and a playoff game, a lot of us will be eating our words.

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2 hours ago, Pelt said:

You may or may not like one signing coming soon, from an individual I was talking with here in Memphis this morning... unless he was just telling me what he thought I wanted to hear. 

Since Poe is from Memphis I am assuming you were talking about him and your friend was clearly speaking with facts (since he was signed).  This is very vague comment though.

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nothing has really moved the needle for me yet

 

simon and sheard are decent pick ups, but they would be back ups on a good team

 

we need a great draft or we wont be much better than last year

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Ballard has been on the job for less than 2 months and people are already tired of him haha

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55 minutes ago, TheRustonRifle#7 said:

Lol!!!!! Thanks for clarifying....how long until the "Fire Ballard Threads" start popping up?

theyve already started..... I consider this one of them.  Just wait until the draft, it'll get ugly

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44 minutes ago, bananabucket said:

Ballard is seriously pissing me off.

:puhleeze:

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Those of you who can't see the clear theme of these signings, I'm not sorry.

 

Those of you who don't understand how the structure of contracts allows us cap flexibility, I'm not sorry.

 

Those of you who were delusional enough to think shelling out money to several big name free agents is a recipe for success, I'm not sorry.

 

Those of you who think that Ballard can simply sign who he wants with a click of his fingers as if free will does not exist.

 

Sure, you are entitled to your opinion. Once you post it on these forums it is open to ridicule. Embrace it. It's a great tool for education. What I am trying to say is that this thread is DUMB

 

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2 hours ago, lester said:

 

I can see what Ballard is doing.

 

He is getting rid of 30 year old depth and adding 26 year old depth. ...and the depth he has been signing has  almost universally the same career story - guys who never quite panned out and/or were playing behind some really, really good players on really, really good squads.

 

If one wanted to build a base into which to insert 7 round-four or better draft picks, that is how you do it. None of the draft picks can just assume the job is theirs because the guy ahead of the is 'old' - the 'other guy' is also a former high round draft pick who is one team away from leaving the league. They will be here to fight. This whole team for 2017 is made from young, hungry guys. Not stars, yet (for some of them), but hungry and ready for their chance.

 

Clearly, that is the strategy.

I'm out of likes, but I wanted to say that this post is fantastic.

 

1 hour ago, threeflight said:

These are some quotes over on Stampede Blue, and I cannot argue with any of them.

 

Could someone name 1 position group we've upgraded?

TE , nope we are down 1 guy
OL, Reitz retired Harrison walk, sign Brian Schwenke
DL, Kerr out sign Hunt & Harris
OLB, Mathis retired, Cole walk, Walden walk, sign Sheard & Simon
ILB, DQ released no signings
DB, Adams out, Robinson released, Butler on market, no signings
P Boomstick retired Locke signed

We only have 7 draft picks

 

This feels like the Grigson years all over again only Grigson never had this much money to spend.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really frustrated. All the cap money that we had and we aren’t signing a single big impact player. Not one! Our answer to improve the OL is the second coming of Mike McGlynn (Schwenke). We have not addressed ILB. We have not addressed CB. We have not addressed pass rush or OLB as I don’t think Mingo, Simon, and Shepard are much of an upgrade over what we had.

The last few years have been tough. Teams like the Broncos and Giants and Patriots have found a way to get the guys they want while we settle for depth players that help bring competition. I know the roster is a mess and cannot be fixed over night, but would it hurt to have anyone that is considered one of the best at what they do ( besides Luck)?

 

Ballard lied to us all

I remember in one of his first interviews he stated that when they do go into free agency they are going to get guys who have "earned it". All the Colts have done so far is Sheard- backup, Simon- backup, Schwenke-back up and loves to play video games, Mingo- bust, Hunt-bust, and Woods-back up.

I had high hopes for Ballard, but these moves add zero impact players and the Colts HAD MONEY TO GET THEM. If I was Pagano I would go ahead and pack my bags. This team isn’t winning more than 6 games.

COLTS449, is this you? Did you make another username?

 

17 minutes ago, DaColts85 said:

Since Poe is from Memphis I am assuming you were talking about him and your friend was clearly speaking with facts (since he was signed).  This is very vague comment though.

He posted after that saying that he saw Poe in the airport and spoke with him, but Poe must've just told him what he wanted to hear since he signed with the Falcons.

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9 minutes ago, Shive said:

 

He posted after that saying that he saw Poe in the airport and spoke with him, but Poe must've just told him what he wanted to hear since he signed with the Falcons.

That would be pretty cool right there.

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1 hour ago, threeflight said:

 

 

This feels like the Grigson years all over again only Grigson never had this much money to spend.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really frustrated. All the cap money that we had and we aren’t signing a single big impact player. Not one! Our answer to improve the OL is the second coming of Mike McGlynn (Schwenke). We have not addressed ILB. We have not addressed CB. We have not addressed pass rush or OLB as I don’t think Mingo, Simon, and Shepard are much of an upgrade over what we had.

The last few years have been tough. Teams like the Broncos and Giants and Patriots have found a way to get the guys they want while we settle for depth players that help bring competition. I know the roster is a mess and cannot be fixed over night, but would it hurt to have anyone that is considered one of the best at what they do ( besides Luck)?

 

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but this is factually incorrect no? I thought we had plenty of cap space during several of the Grigson years.

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1 minute ago, DaColts85 said:

That would be pretty cool right there.

Yeah. I mean, he was pretty nice about it when he 'lied' to me. I kinda wished that he would have just said "I can't really say" when I asked him if he was signing with the Colts instead of telling me it was Indy. Maybe his agent advised him to say stuff like that, or he was just having some fun at my expense.

 

Either way, the moral of the story is - The next time I see another potential Colt, just leave him alone. haha

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3 minutes ago, Pelt said:

Yeah. I mean, he was pretty nice about it when he 'lied' to me. I kinda wished that he would have just said "I can't really say" when I asked him if he was signing with the Colts instead of telling me it was Indy. Maybe his agent advised him to say stuff like that, or he was just having some fun at my expense.

 

Either way, the moral of the story is - The next time I see another potential Colt, just leave him alone. haha

That is still pretty cool to run into someone and have some potential inside information.

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1 hour ago, threeflight said:

These are some quotes over on Stampede Blue, and I cannot argue with any of them.

 

Could someone name 1 position group we've upgraded?

TE , nope we are down 1 guy
OL, Reitz retired Harrison walk, sign Brian Schwenke
DL, Kerr out sign Hunt & Harris
OLB, Mathis retired, Cole walk, Walden walk, sign Sheard & Simon
ILB, DQ released no signings
DB, Adams out, Robinson released, Butler on market, no signings
P Boomstick retired Locke signed

We only have 7 draft picks

 

This feels like the Grigson years all over again only Grigson never had this much money to spend.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really frustrated. All the cap money that we had and we aren’t signing a single big impact player. Not one! Our answer to improve the OL is the second coming of Mike McGlynn (Schwenke). We have not addressed ILB. We have not addressed CB. We have not addressed pass rush or OLB as I don’t think Mingo, Simon, and Shepard are much of an upgrade over what we had.

The last few years have been tough. Teams like the Broncos and Giants and Patriots have found a way to get the guys they want while we settle for depth players that help bring competition. I know the roster is a mess and cannot be fixed over night, but would it hurt to have anyone that is considered one of the best at what they do ( besides Luck)?

 

Ballard lied to us all

I remember in one of his first interviews he stated that when they do go into free agency they are going to get guys who have "earned it". All the Colts have done so far is Sheard- backup, Simon- backup, Schwenke-back up and loves to play video games, Mingo- bust, Hunt-bust, and Woods-back up.

I had high hopes for Ballard, but these moves add zero impact players and the Colts HAD MONEY TO GET THEM. If I was Pagano I would go ahead and pack my bags. This team isn’t winning more than 6 games.

You know, it could very well be that Ballard IS trying to go after some higher profile/productive players, but is having difficulty signing them due to the tenuous situation that Pagano is in right now. Ballard might be hamstrung, so to speak.

 

The players agents might be advising their clients to sign elsewhere because of the instability of the head coaching situation here.

 

Just pure speculation on my part.

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52 minutes ago, threeflight said:

These are some quotes over on Stampede Blue, and I cannot argue with any of them.

 

Could someone name 1 position group we've upgraded?

TE , nope we are down 1 guy
OL, Reitz retired Harrison walk, sign Brian Schwenke
DL, Kerr out sign Hunt & Harris
OLB, Mathis retired, Cole walk, Walden walk, sign Sheard & Simon
ILB, DQ released no signings
DB, Adams out, Robinson released, Butler on market, no signings
P Boomstick retired Locke signed

We only have 7 draft picks

 

This feels like the Grigson years all over again only Grigson never had this much money to spend.

Sorry for the negativity but I am really frustrated. All the cap money that we had and we aren’t signing a single big impact player. Not one! Our answer to improve the OL is the second coming of Mike McGlynn (Schwenke). We have not addressed ILB. We have not addressed CB. We have not addressed pass rush or OLB as I don’t think Mingo, Simon, and Shepard are much of an upgrade over what we had.

The last few years have been tough. Teams like the Broncos and Giants and Patriots have found a way to get the guys they want while we settle for depth players that help bring competition. I know the roster is a mess and cannot be fixed over night, but would it hurt to have anyone that is considered one of the best at what they do ( besides Luck)?

 

Ballard lied to us all

I remember in one of his first interviews he stated that when they do go into free agency they are going to get guys who have "earned it". All the Colts have done so far is Sheard- backup, Simon- backup, Schwenke-back up and loves to play video games, Mingo- bust, Hunt-bust, and Woods-back up.

I had high hopes for Ballard, but these moves add zero impact players and the Colts HAD MONEY TO GET THEM. If I was Pagano I would go ahead and pack my bags. This team isn’t winning more than 6 games.

 

1. LB has most likely gotten better.  All our LB's just got like 7 years younger.  Or did the author of this not realize how old and for the most part terrible all our LB's where???

 

2. Grigson did have that much money to spend.  The 2013 offseason he was LOADED with cap space.  Way more then Ballard has, especially when you figure in the increase in the cap leading to increased salaries.

 

In fact most seasons Grigson had around 40M in cap space.

 

Let's see what Grigson did with all that cap space.

 

Gosder Cherilus - Yeah that went well

 

Greg Toler - That went even better.  

 

Erik Walden - One of the few FA's that actually was decent

 

Donald Thomas - Played in like 2 games, was injured the rest of the time

 

LaRon Landry - That went well

 

Ricky Jean Francois - All star!!

 

Matt Hasselbeck - Managed to sign a decent backup QB.  

 

Aubrayo Franklin 

 

Darrius Heyward-Bey - Awesome hands

 

Ahmad Bradshaw - Useful but always injured.

 

3. Whaaahh I want to Colts to sign a star player at every position.  Gosh I really get tired of this line of thinking.  

 

 

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Ballard is doing what any GM would do, including our former GM, when faced with the same circumstances.  

 

The older players on the roster were stop gaps, indented to be replaced with young draft choices.  The ones that weren't replaced with young players via the past few drafts need to be replaced via free agency.  Some URFAs are replaced with others, and some RFAs are replaced with UFRAs.  

 

You don't replace 30 to 36 year old players with different 30 - 36 year old players, (for one thing, the pool of players with which to get replacements consists predominately of young players...duh) so replacing older JAGS with younger JAGS kind of happens on its own without having to have any grand plan beyond trying to field a 53 man roster for the coming season.

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The threads that are on this site lately, smh.

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10 minutes ago, Pelt said:

You know, it could very well be that Ballard IS trying to go after some higher profile/productive players, but is having difficulty signing them due to the tenuous situation that Pagano is in right now. Ballard might be hamstrung, so to speak.

 

The players agents might be advising their clients to sign elsewhere because of the instability of the head coaching situation here.

 

Just pure speculation on my part.

 

To some degree I buy this, but at the same time I doubt Jeffery, Zeitler, or Bouye made their decisions based on the amazing head coaching situations of the respective teams that they signed with.

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Quality depth is important. We up until this off season haven't had anything. Building through the draft is the way to go. This team has become pretty barren and old talent wise. It's gonna take some time. 

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16 minutes ago, Cynjin said:

The threads that are on this site lately, smh.

 

The offseason brings with it an entirely new genre of bad thread topics.

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Pass rushers would be difference makers. Unfortunately, the great ones never hit the market. 

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2 hours ago, CheezyColt said:

This would be the fault of the previous GM... hard to put that on Ballard.  You just expect him to sign a bunch of high-priced free agents and get a top 10 defense when the defense has like 3 starting caliber players on it to begin with?  One injury and we'd be no better off than before.  Patience, people.  This isn't going to be a one year turn around to dominance.

 

Agree 100%.  He (like Grigson) inherited a large problem.  Like others have said, most of these signings are low-risk.

 

We still have need (IMO) for a back-up RB/eventual replacement of Gore.  We have a need at TE (I think it'd be dangerous to go into the season counting on Doyle and Swoope as our only 2 TEs -- Doyle is solid, and Swoope has shown positive signs of improvement, but we don't know he's going to keep his development up).  We likely have a need at OL, though the line seemed better towards the end of last year -- Philbin hopefully can let Ballard know if his young guys are developing or if we need to fill some more holes there, regardless we could use depth (I like the signing of Schwenke, though I am not convinced he is more than just a versatile depth player ala Joe Reitz).  If the coaches don't think they'll be able to utilize Dorsett better, we may have a need at WR.  We could certainly use help at DL (too bad Dontari walked away), LB (our LB corps was a joke last year -- we need help at all 4 positions), and in the secondary.  And we needed to address a punter.

 

It isn't like we've let any stars walk -- Adams was solid, but he's also old probably wanted too much.  DQwell was a good 'stop-gap' signing by Grigs, but I think his PED use suggests he was starting to feel the decline we were all watching.  Allen never did anything spectacular for us.  Walden was solid for us, but on the wrong side of 30.  Kerr was nothing more than a rotational DL.  Patrick Robinson was hurt and didn't look all that great when he was healthy.

 

Ballard has gotten us some extra draft picks, which we need.  He likely has a draft strategy in place, or pretty well in place.  A few of the guys he is signing have potential, aren't worse than what we had, and none are major risks.  Unfortunately, with what he inherited, Ballard has to fill in some spots on the roster with non-superstars right now.  There isn't much sense in keeping average older players around, when we have the opportunity to bring in average younger players (especially some that have potential to continue developing and become solid players, like Simon).  The draft isn't exactly that strong for LBs, so it makes sense he's going to the market for them. 

 

Personally, I like what he's doing better than what Grigs did when he overpaid for RJF, Laron Landry, Tom Zbikowski, and Samson Satele. Ballard isn't breaking the bank, and he's getting players that are equal to or better than what we had (IMO, anyway).

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OP, how about you actually respond to the people countering your stance on Ballard? 

 

You keep posting the same. How about constructing a proper argument and respond to the various posts in here?

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Ballard is doing just fine per my estimation. Guys he is picking up seems to bring on some competition, and competition is not a bad thing. The guys that are leaving couldn't get it done and that was obvious. 

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Let's try to understand what people are actually arguing on both sides.

 

Some are arguing that CB is doing a good job building a younger defense with players that have potential to play better than they have shown. This will increase competition within the team and overall, increase the competitiveness of the team. CB will build the team through the draft and if you are looking for star players, wait for the draft.

 

The other side is arguing that CB should have added difference makers to the defense rather than low-level starters with potential, or back ups. This is essentially spending the cap with minimal return. If you look around the league, the teams with the best defenses have the best players -- difference makers. The Colts do not have any, and haven't since Freeney, Mathis, Sanders, and Bethea in their prime. Some are tired of average players and would rather have 1 or 2 difference makers added, rather than 5-6 average players (which is what has been happening for too long). 

 

NO ONE (I don't think) is arguing that every signing has to be a HOF or pro-Bowler. That is a straw man argument.

 

If you look at both arguments, they both have merit. Overall, it depends on your view on how to build the team.

 

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3 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

The other side is arguing that CB should have added difference makers to the defense rather than low-level starters with potential, or back ups. This is essentially spending the cap with minimal return. If you look around the league, the teams with the best defenses have the best players -- difference makers. The Colts do not have any, and haven't since Freeney, Mathis, Sanders, and Bethea in their prime. Some are tired of average players and would rather have 1 or 2 difference makers added, rather than 5-6 average players (which is what has been happening for too long). 

 

And Freeney, Mathis, Sanders, and Bethea were all draft picks, none were free agent acquisitions. IMO, that supports the argument for building decent depth in free agency, and getting star playmakers in the draft.

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4 minutes ago, Flash7 said:

Let's try to understand what people are actually arguing on both sides.

 

Some are arguing that CB is doing a good job building a younger defense with players that have potential to play better than they have shown. This will increase competition within the team and overall, increase the competitiveness of the team. CB will build the team through the draft and if you are looking for star players, wait for the draft.

 

The other side is arguing that CB should have added difference makers to the defense rather than low-level starters with potential, or back ups. This is essentially spending the cap with minimal return. If you look around the league, the teams with the best defenses have the best players -- difference makers. The Colts do not have any, and haven't since Freeney, Mathis, Sanders, and Bethea in their prime. Some are tired of average players and would rather have 1 or 2 difference makers added, rather than 5-6 average players (which is what has been happening for too long). 

 

NO ONE (I don't think) is arguing that every signing has to be a HOF or pro-Bowler. That is a straw man argument.

 

If you look at both arguments, they both have merit. Overall, it depends on your view on how to build the team.

 

 

The most successful clubs in the league don't necessarily need a ton of playmakers to make it through the playoffs. New England, Atlanta, Green Bay and Pittsburgh aren't loaded with playmakers and yet they are all in the Conference Championship games.

 

The Texans and Giants, on the other hand, have plenty of playmakers and went home after the first round. Kansas City is in the same boat. We have a good enough offense that we can emulate Atlanta before Denver.

 

I agree that our defense needs difference makers but breaking the bank to bring in a few just results in a top-heavy roster that can be easily exploited. We need so much help that I don't think throwing money at big free agents will beef up our defense enough. Jacksonville has been doing this for years with no result.

 

I think it's just reasonable to be patient at this point, see how some draft picks pan out. If the defense clearly isn't improved next season, then it's time to re-evaluate. 

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4 minutes ago, Steamboat_Shaun said:

 

And Freeney, Mathis, Sanders, and Bethea were all draft picks, none were free agent acquisitions. IMO, that supports the argument for building decent depth in free agency, and getting star playmakers in the draft.

Sure, understandable.

 

Does adding quality FAs negate CB's ability to also add depth through FA with nearly 50M in cap space? For example, we could have signed POE and possibly even Zach Brown, and still signed all of the depth players that are currently signed. (I understand that just because we are interested in players, it does not mean that they will sign with us, as there are other options available).

 

Does adding qualtiy FAs negate CB's ability draft quality players?

Respectfully, I don't see why you cant do both?

 

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I knew this was coming the minute Poe signed elsewhere.

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1 minute ago, Flash7 said:

Sure, understandable.

 

Does adding quality FAs negate CB's ability to also add depth through FA with nearly 50M in cap space? For example, we could have signed POE and possibly even Zach Brown, and still signed all of the depth players that are currently signed. (I understand that just because we are interested in players, it does not mean that they will sign with us, as there are other options available).

 

Does adding qualtiy FAs negate CB's ability draft quality players?

Respectfully, I don't see why you cant do both?

 

 

Poe is the guy that Ballard clearly wanted from the get-go, that was his big FA target. But he didn't want him on a 1-year rental. Basically what happens in that scenario is he puts up a Pro-Bowl season for the Colts and leaves to the highest bidder, how does that make our team better in the long-term?

 

He's already been in contact and had contract negotiations with Zach Brown, so maybe something materializes there. Jon Jenkins is meeting with the Indy brass tomorrow.

 

I guess I just don't understand why people are acting as if free agency is over, and no one else can be signed. There are still plenty of players available.

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