backshoulderfade Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Luck in at #3 http://thelab.bleacherreport.com/best-quarterbacks-nfl-2016-formula/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VocableLoki Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Interesting rankings, thought it was crazy with Rodgers in the 20's but the formula makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisfarley Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 (Remember: Running a really good offense hurts your score—blowouts don't leave a lot of room to be clutch.) hmmmm, at times our offense fell short of "really good", so I surmise that the #3 ranking is legit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colt18 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 That's funny because there's still this narrative going around that Luck is turnover prone in crunch time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luck is Good Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 2 minutes ago, colt18 said: That's funny because there's still this narrative going around that Luck is turnover prone in crunch time. That's an invalid narrative for sure. Andrew may make some bonehead plays during parts of the game, but when it comes to the last drive, Andrew has proven to be pretty good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backshoulderfade Posted January 18, 2017 Author Share Posted January 18, 2017 2 minutes ago, colt18 said: That's funny because there's still this narrative going around that Luck is turnover prone in crunch time. Where? He is and always has been captain comeback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colt18 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 7 minutes ago, Luck is Good said: That's an invalid narrative for sure. Andrew may make some bonehead plays during parts of the game, but when it comes to the last drive, Andrew has proven to be pretty good 5 minutes ago, backshoulderfade said: Where? He is and always has been captain comeback. Other forums. I post on a couple other ones, a lot of times I see ignorant people criticize Luck on his boneheaded plays. While he still tends to try to do too much when the rest of the team is failing him, he has drastically cut down his turnovers this year. He's also had the best season of his career and people still criticize him because the team isn't winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ztboiler Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Best closer in the game. Has been since day 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backshoulderfade Posted January 18, 2017 Author Share Posted January 18, 2017 9 minutes ago, colt18 said: Other forums. I post on a couple other ones, a lot of times I see ignorant people criticize Luck on his boneheaded plays. While he still tends to try to do too much when the rest of the team is failing him, he has drastically cut down his turnovers this year. He's also had the best season of his career and people still criticize him because the team isn't winning. Even when he's turning the ball over 25 times a season, he is still money in the clutch. People are dumb and have something against him after all his pre-draft hype. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabriel Alexander Morillo Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 ironically I feel like this year he and our entire offense crapped the bed, hard, in clutch time. Which was very weird to see since IMO Luck has been the most clutch QB since entering the league. Seem like the Lions stole our mojo this year lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bababooey Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 2 minutes ago, Gabriel Alexander Morillo said: ironically I feel like this year he and our entire offense crapped the bed, hard, in clutch time. Which was very weird to see since IMO Luck has been the most clutch QB since entering the league. Seem like the Lions stole our mojo this year lol Our offense had nothing to do with our defense blowing leads against the Texans and Lions. Also didn't spot the Jags an absurd lead in London. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backshoulderfade Posted January 18, 2017 Author Share Posted January 18, 2017 18 minutes ago, Gabriel Alexander Morillo said: ironically I feel like this year he and our entire offense crapped the bed, hard, in clutch time. Which was very weird to see since IMO Luck has been the most clutch QB since entering the league. Seem like the Lions stole our mojo this year lol See, I feel like Luck was fantastic. Drops, sacks and pressure were major limiting factors and he still came out with 33 tds and 4500 yards total in 15 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creekside Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Something wrong with the formula. Bradford at 11 and Kaepernick at 4, both better than Tom Brady at 13..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backshoulderfade Posted January 18, 2017 Author Share Posted January 18, 2017 6 minutes ago, egg said: Something wrong with the formula. Bradford at 11 and Kaepernick at 4, both better than Tom Brady at 13..... Brady plays with a lead a very high % of the time. It's not a slight on him as a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabriel Alexander Morillo Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 27 minutes ago, bababooey said: Our offense had nothing to do with our defense blowing leads against the Texans and Lions. Also didn't spot the Jags an absurd lead in London. I'm talking about a few times when luck had the chance to take the lead with a final drive. A big part of having chances to comeback is the bad defense. Trust me the defense gets no pass from me. They're the worst group as a whole in the NFL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creekside Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 2 minutes ago, backshoulderfade said: Brady plays with a lead a very high % of the time. It's not a slight on him as a QB. Sure, no doubt. But over the years many, many times the Patriots will be down at halftime only to come roaring back. Nobody will ever convince me that Colin Kaepernick and Sam Bradford are better clutch quarterbacks than Tom Brady........ Maybe unpopular, but I don't think Andrew Luck is either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chad72 Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 12 minutes ago, backshoulderfade said: Brady plays with a lead a very high % of the time. It's not a slight on him as a QB. So does Aaron Rodgers, even more than Brady. If you look at their entire body of work, Rodgers has few 4th qtr. comebacks compared to a whole bunch of them for Brady. That is why I felt QBs like Peyton, Brady, Brees are more clutch QBs than Rodgers over their entire lifetime. Rodgers plays best when he has a lead or is tied for the lead. I call him the ultimate front runner. He may be the most physically gifted QB but when it comes to being down by a TD or more in the 4th qtr., I'd take Peyton, Brady and Brees before I take Rodgers. Rodgers' record speaks loud and clear on that front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csmopar Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 17 hours ago, egg said: Something wrong with the formula. Bradford at 11 and Kaepernick at 4, both better than Tom Brady at 13..... Tom Brady has a smaller chance of having to be in a come back situation. Normally the Patriots are on the positive side of the score board. There was a stat being shown during the Steelers/Chiefs game that showed Brady playing with a lead some 70-something percent of the time, league high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csmopar Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 17 hours ago, egg said: Sure, no doubt. But over the years many, many times the Patriots will be down at halftime only to come roaring back. Nobody will ever convince me that Colin Kaepernick and Sam Bradford are better clutch quarterbacks than Tom Brady........ Maybe unpopular, but I don't think Andrew Luck is either. I believe this forumula is only looking at last minute, 4th quarter comebacks, not half time turn arounds. That said, if you look at total number of 4th quarter comebacks, Peyton-45 Brady-38 top 2 right there, Andrew Luck-14 Now lets look at per year average (rounded to nearest whole game: Luck: 4 Manning:3 Brady:2 Total Number of Game winning drives under 5 to play in 4th: Manning: 56 Marino:51 Brady: 49 Luck : 18. Total Number of Game winning drives under 5 to play in 4th average per year: Luck: 5 Manning: 4 Brady: 3 So based of this, I'd have to say the number one Captain Comeback at this point is Manning, based purely on the total number, but that's skewed by playing some many years. Looking at the average number per year however, shows Luck being number in league history with Manning second and Brady 3rd. But we're splitting hairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tmoney Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 18 hours ago, Gabriel Alexander Morillo said: ironically I feel like this year he and our entire offense crapped the bed, hard, in clutch time. Which was very weird to see since IMO Luck has been the most clutch QB since entering the league. Seem like the Lions stole our mojo this year lol You are absolutely right. I love Andrew just as much as all of you but he is not the perfect god among men that we all like to make him to be. As much as it pains me Andrew has a turnover problem. He might not throw pics on the last drive of a game, but in big games especially this year he hurt the team badly with turnovers. The game against Oakland proves my point perfectly. Second game against Houston as well. He really just tries to do too much and its hard to blame him with the supporting cast he has but he needs to work on the turnovers, and he needs a running game or hell throw close to 15 pics every year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creekside Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 1 hour ago, csmopar said: I believe this forumula is only looking at last minute, 4th quarter comebacks, not half time turn arounds. That said, if you look at total number of 4th quarter comebacks, Peyton-45 Brady-38 top 2 right there, Andrew Luck-14 Now lets look at per year average (rounded to nearest whole game: Luck: 4 Manning:3 Brady:2 Total Number of Game winning drives under 5 to play in 4th: Manning: 56 Marino:51 Brady: 49 Luck : 18. Total Number of Game winning drives under 5 to play in 4th average per year: Luck: 5 Manning: 4 Brady: 3 So based of this, I'd have to say the number one Captain Comeback at this point is Manning, based purely on the total number, but that's skewed by playing some many years. Looking at the average number per year however, shows Luck being number in league history with Manning second and Brady 3rd. But we're splitting hairs. It would also be pertinent to identify these two factors to determine "clutch" (IMO) : 1) The number of opportunities that were failed attempts. 2) How many slim leads are maintained in the last minutes by getting a first down to run out the clock. Considering these, I think Manning and Brady would blow by pretty much everyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csmopar Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 1 minute ago, egg said: It would also be pertinent to identify these two factors to determine "clutch" (IMO) : 1) The number of opportunities that were failed attempts. 2) How many slim leads are maintained in the last minutes by getting a first down to run out the clock. Considering these, I think Manning and Brady would blow by pretty much everyone else. i actually looked for those and couldnt find any data for them. But let's also think, they've both played over 16 years, naturally their numbers will be higher total than say a Mariotta, or Carr, or Luck.... etc. at this point anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creekside Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 31 minutes ago, csmopar said: i actually looked for those and couldnt find any data for them. But let's also think, they've both played over 16 years, naturally their numbers will be higher total than say a Mariotta, or Carr, or Luck.... etc. at this point anyway. I like Andrew Luck and I am glad the Colts have him. But in 2016 he was "outclutched" several times. The game that bugs me most is the last Texans game. In the most important game of the year, Andrew played poorly. The defense played well enough to win, the O-line played well enough to win. Luck did not. Anyway, I'm looking forward to next year. I think Luck and the offense will be much improved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csmopar Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 15 minutes ago, egg said: I like Andrew Luck and I am glad the Colts have him. But in 2016 he was "outclutched" several times. The game that bugs me most is the last Texans game. In the most important game of the year, Andrew played poorly. The defense played well enough to win, the O-line played well enough to win. Luck did not. Anyway, I'm looking forward to next year. I think Luck and the offense will be much improved. maybe, but no one is ever perfect. I'd say his ratio of clutch performances to clutch time failures is 9:1 or better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colt18 Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 33 minutes ago, egg said: I like Andrew Luck and I am glad the Colts have him. But in 2016 he was "outclutched" several times. The game that bugs me most is the last Texans game. In the most important game of the year, Andrew played poorly. The defense played well enough to win, the O-line played well enough to win. Luck did not. Anyway, I'm looking forward to next year. I think Luck and the offense will be much improved. Luck was not "outclutched several times". There are definitely a few games that we lost even after Luck got us the lead. Luck could have played better in the last Texans game but in no way shape or form did the OL or defense play well enough to win. Lamar Miller gashed that defense repeatedly and Clowney pressured Luck the entire game. He even had an unblocked sack/fumble in the redzone due to Dwayne Allen completely blowing the play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coltsva Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Instead of "game winning drives" it would be nice to see "lead changing drives" in the last 5 minutes, to help factor in when you get your team the lead late in the game and the defense blows it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creekside Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 1 hour ago, colt18 said: He even had an unblocked sack/fumble in the redzone due to Dwayne Allen completely blowing the play. Luck knew that Clowney was being single blocked by a tight end. Go back and look. Luck is hit 3 seconds after the snap. The play calls for a quick pass. He should have thrown it out of bounds if the target was covered... like most good QB's would.....instead, he holds the ball... Go look at the two INTs: On the one, Allen is laying face down on the ground before Luck begins his forward motion to pass... If you excuse these two plays, ok, they were bang,bang. But there is no excuse for the other INT: Luck is hit in the pocket, in the back a full 9 seconds after the ball is snapped. He had a full 8 seconds to do something other that turn the ball over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creekside Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 3 hours ago, csmopar said: maybe, but no one is ever perfect. I'd say his ratio of clutch performances to clutch time failures is 9:1 or better Not this year, no way. He failed to be clutch in the 1st Jags game. Failed twice in the 1st Hou game (one in reg and one in OT) ..Failed once in 2nd Hou game....failed in the Denver game (I know the fumble wasn't his fault, but the previous pick six was).....the only game he was clutch that I can think of (going by our definition), was the last Jags game.....I could be corrected on that, just going by memory.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
csmopar Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 3 minutes ago, egg said: Not this year, no way. He failed to be clutch in the 1st Jags game. Failed twice in the 1st Hou game (one in reg and one in OT) ..Failed once in 2nd Hou game....failed in the Denver game (I know the fumble wasn't his fault, but the previous pick six was).....the only game he was clutch that I can think of (going by our definition), was the last Jags game.....I could be corrected on that, just going by memory.... i'm talking overall. yes, this yr he didn't pull it off as often. but the defense also couldnt stop a thing either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creekside Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 2 hours ago, colt18 said: Luck was not "outclutched several times". There are definitely a few games that we lost even after Luck got us the lead. Luck could have played better in the last Texans game but in no way shape or form did the OL or defense play well enough to win. Lamar Miller gashed that defense repeatedly and Clowney pressured Luck the entire game. He even had an unblocked sack/fumble in the redzone due to Dwayne Allen completely blowing the play. Going by the definition of this discussion, in the first Hou game, Osweiler was clutch two times, once in reg and once in OT. .....In that game, Luck failed 3 times: 1) Colts had a seven point lead and the ball with 2:37 left in reg. and went 3 and out. ...(clutch fail) 2) Colts had the ball with :44 left with game tied 5 plays and punted......(clutch fail) 3) Colts get ball in OT with game tied. 5 plays and punt.....(clutch fail) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jameszeigler834 Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 23 hours ago, bababooey said: Our offense had nothing to do with our defense blowing leads against the Texans and Lions. Also didn't spot the Jags an absurd lead in London. The lions game we had the lead with 37 seconds left and blew it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jameszeigler834 Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 Just now, jameszeigler834 said: The lions game we had the lead with 37 seconds left and blew it. The defense was awful and it is a whole new level of terrible and yet the two guys that blame land on still have jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creekside Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 7 minutes ago, csmopar said: i'm talking overall. yes, this yr he didn't pull it off as often. but the defense also couldnt stop a thing either. But that's not completely true....what I mean is, like the 1st Jags game, the Colt D forced the Jags to punt twice in the last several minutes giving Luck and the offense two chances for a " clutch" win....But the offense just could not get it done....and in the Bronco game, the Colts could have won 20-19 if the Colt's offense hadn't given up 15 points......all spilled milk under the bridge... Anyway, I do agree this year is not indicative of the norm..... I expect Luck and the offense to click next year with an all-around improved team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creekside Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 On 1/18/2017 at 11:56 AM, bababooey said: Our offense had nothing to do with our defense blowing leads against the Texans........ It certainly did: In game one, the Colt's offense got the ball with 2:37 left in regulation sitting on a 7 point lead. Had they gotten just one first down, they could have run out the clock, or close to it. But they went 3 and out and took only 37 seconds off the clock....Then, in OT, the offense ran 5 plays and punted. In game two, the defense held the Texans to one TD and four FG's while the offense turned the ball over 3 times........ Not saying the defense was good, but neither was the offense...and they share the blame for both losses......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldunclemark Posted January 19, 2017 Share Posted January 19, 2017 On 1/18/2017 at 11:02 AM, backshoulderfade said: Luck in at #3 http://thelab.bleacherreport.com/best-quarterbacks-nfl-2016-formula/ 'cluctch'..as well as 'under pressure' or 'special situations' are all debatable and arbitrary terms This makes for a nice story but its all one man's ipinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backshoulderfade Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 3 minutes ago, oldunclemark said: 'cluctch'..as well as 'under pressure' or 'special situations' are all debatable and arbitrary terms This makes for a nice story but its all one man's ipinion Absolutely. So many factors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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