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Getting tired of Luck taking a beating in the game and on this board


theanarchist

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I'm tired of all the Andrew Luck bashing and second guessing and overpaid talk going on. This guy has taken one the toughest beatings a player can take his first 4 years in the league yet he's managed to win without the benefit of 1) a running game 2) pass protection 3) a defense and 4) a front office who will get some real talent around him. For those of you saying "I'd like to see Luck do this that or the other..." how about seeing it the way it really is? How about getting Luck a team that has some talent where it counts?

 

Can't stop the run. Cant rush the passer. Receivers cant get separation. Running game is weak. No depth. Pass defense is horrendous. Yet we still have people thinking Luck needs to be better. 3rd in the NFL in passing yards. 5th in TD's. Sacked 25 times the most in the league!. Sick of all the bashing on Luck! Id like to see him walk on water too but that aint gonna happen. Get real people.

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The whole "holding the ball too long" rhetoric is ridiculous. You could argue that happens what, 2-3 times a game? Out of ~40 passes. It's even more ridiculous when you consider that's exactly what those plays call for and the alternative is trying to make a risky play that could turn into a fumble or interception.

 

I'm perfectly fine with the decisions Luck has made so far this year. Zero complaints.

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3 minutes ago, BCoop said:

The whole "holding the ball too long" rhetoric is ridiculous. You could argue that happens what, 2-3 times a game? Out of ~40 passes. It's even more ridiculous when you consider that's exactly what those plays call for and the alternative is trying to make a risky play that could turn into a fumble or interception.

 

I'm perfectly fine with the decisions Luck has made so far this year. Zero complaints.

yes  poor play design for a young and unproven Oline....  glad you agree

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Luck has been smarter with the timing of his releases this year resulting in fewer turnovers compared to last year at this point in time. 

 

It will be a combination of mixing up the play calling for quicker releases, not holding the ball as much for those few passes if the reads are not open, and if push comes to shove, take the sack and live to fight another down.

 

The ones that will worry most if the running game becomes consistent and D improve are the ones that have Luck as their FF QB since he wouldn't have to throw as much. :)

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2 minutes ago, Coltfreak said:

yes  poor play design for a young and unproven Oline....  glad you agree

 

The offense is fine. 

 

We're averaging 27.7 ppg which is good for 3rd in the league. If you cut down on some of the penalties and drops, and we're probably the clear cut #1 offense in the NFL. 

 

Sure, there are situations where a quick passing attack could be helpful against teams like Denver or Minnesota. On the whole though, the play calling has been fine. Luck has been fine. And the line is improving with 2 solid performances in a row. 

 

Like I mentioned in my first post, complaining at this point is odd timing. Any frustration should be 100% focused on the defense.

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47 minutes ago, Dustin said:

Nobody bashes Luck on this board what are you talking about.

I've seen the word overpaid a bit in regards to Andrew since my return to the forum. So I do see what the OP is talking about 

 

Everyone has their own opinion on things though so it is what it is 

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As others have said, AL has worked on his game and is showing marked improvement on timing/awareness. He seems to be improving a bit on leading his receiver and letting them make plays on the ball. He's not fully there yet with his game, but is improving his skill set. He's the reason we even have a chance when the Colts suit up. I fully believe in a couple of more drafts, the team should be allot more competitive. 

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We just want to hold Luck up to the standard that his contract and quite frankly his hype have set for him.  Luck can't simply be good.  He needs to be great to outstanding.  Luck needs a 16 game season with 10 or less INT.  He needs to cut down the fumbles.  That is all we ask.  For the most part the sacks are not his fault.  But most if not all the turnovers are.  That is the only hole in his game and he has improved on that this year.

 

But to think he is above criticism because he is "our QB" or because he's the best player on this team is ridiculous to me.  When he stinks or costs us a game it should be pointed out just like when the defense or another particular player stinks or costs us the game.

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1 hour ago, theanarchist said:

I'm tired of all the Andrew Luck bashing and second guessing and overpaid talk going on. This guy has taken one the toughest beatings a player can take his first 4 years in the league yet he's managed to win without the benefit of 1) a running game 2) pass protection 3) a defense and 4) a front office who will get some real talent around him. For those of you saying "I'd like to see Luck do this that or the other..." how about seeing it the way it really is? How about getting Luck a team that has some talent where it counts?

 

Can't stop the run. Cant rush the passer. Receivers cant get separation. Running game is weak. No depth. Pass defense is horrendous. Yet we still have people thinking Luck needs to be better. 3rd in the NFL in passing yards. 5th in TD's. Sacked 25 times the most in the league!. Sick of all the bashing on Luck! Id like to see him walk on water too but that aint gonna happen. Get real people.

Somebody needs a Snickers.

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1 hour ago, TKnight24 said:

I've seen the word overpaid a bit in regards to Andrew since my return to the forum. So I do see what the OP is talking about 

 

Everyone has their own opinion on things though so it is what it is 

 

Some have said that yes.  

 

But as overthecap.com said his pay is not a "position buster"

 

If the Colts told Luck to walk and that they where not paying him, I'm guessing 5 teams would offer him the contract the Colts gave him or better.  

 

Crap, Osweiller got 72 mil for like 5 decent games playing for the SB champs.  

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1 hour ago, tikyle said:

We just want to hold Luck up to the standard that his contract and quite frankly his hype have set for him.  Luck can't simply be good.  He needs to be great to outstanding.  Luck needs a 16 game season with 10 or less INT.  He needs to cut down the fumbles.  That is all we ask.  For the most part the sacks are not his fault.  But most if not all the turnovers are.  That is the only hole in his game and he has improved on that this year.

 

But to think he is above criticism because he is "our QB" or because he's the best player on this team is ridiculous to me.  When he stinks or costs us a game it should be pointed out just like when the defense or another particular player stinks or costs us the game.

 

I'd agree with this. He's our guy, but I'm not afraid to hold him accountable when applicable. The Houston game is a good example. There were 2 plays in particular (bad interception, taking a late sack outside the pocket on 3rd & long, could've thrown it away) that one could easily point to and say "those plays cost us the game." But at the same time, we all know that Luck has zero margin for error, and if he makes even a single mistake, the rest of the team ultimately isn't good enough to overcome it.

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I'm not a quarterback coach and I don't know one so I'd like to ask a question here. Why does it seem that Andrew often releases the ball so low that it hits the outstretched arm of a defender being blocked? It seems to happen 2-3 times a game. I realize his lineman are often pushed right back into him, but is there something about his release point? At 6'4'', I wouldn't think deflections would be a problem for him.

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12 minutes ago, sreeb2deeni said:

I'm not a quarterback coach and I don't know one so I'd like to ask a question here. Why does it seem that Andrew often releases the ball so low that it hits the outstretched arm of a defender being blocked? It seems to happen 2-3 times a game. I realize his lineman are often pushed right back into him, but is there something about his release point? At 6'4'', I wouldn't think deflections would be a problem for him.

Its not so much that he throws it too low...  he doesn't pump fake. So linemen tend to know when to get their hands up. 

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1 hour ago, cdgacoltsfan said:

Yeah...Josh did great with Tebow

 

In your statement is the answer. Tebow.

 

Josh with Luck would be totally different than Josh with Tebow, or did I misunderstand you?

 

Besides, when Tebow was made starting QB, Mike McCoy was the OC for the Broncos. Josh just drafted him, shipped out Cutler and had Orton as his starting QB for most of the time he was head coach.

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17 minutes ago, sreeb2deeni said:

I'm not a quarterback coach and I don't know one so I'd like to ask a question here. Why does it seem that Andrew often releases the ball so low that it hits the outstretched arm of a defender being blocked? It seems to happen 2-3 times a game. I realize his lineman are often pushed right back into him, but is there something about his release point? At 6'4'', I wouldn't think deflections would be a problem for him.

You have to keep in mind the defensive players are trained to jump and put their arms in the air when they cant get to him. Most of them are over 6 feet tall.

The problem might improve as the offensive line improves with passing lanes much like gaps made for the running backs.

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12 minutes ago, The Lucky Neck Beard said:

Its not so much that he throws it too low...  he doesn't pump fake. So linemen tend to know when to get their hands up. 

 

Good observation on the pump fake. OL are typically coached to continue to engage till the whistle but sometimes, smart DL know that if they cannot get to the QB, take a tad step back and try deflect the throw.

 

The only game we got Brady to throw 3 INTs against us was when Montae Raegor and company managed to tip a couple of throws in the middle in Foxboro in 2006 regular  season.

 

 

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1 hour ago, The Lucky Neck Beard said:

Its not so much that he throws it too low...  he doesn't pump fake. So linemen tend to know when to get their hands up. 

 

He's not big on pump fakes, but I've noticed a couple few this season. 

 

The OL should cut the edges more often, though, especially on screens and slants. 

 

On other btw, Hilton beat his man on a slant for a TD, although it was nullified by a sloppy procedural penalty (I think that's on Luck, he didn't let everyone get set because he was trying to get the play off before the defense was ready). First slant I've seen from the Colts in a long time... 

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Does anyone know how many times Luck has been hit this season? On a game by game basis?

 

I ask because I don't think he's been getting hit that much, at least not due to the line play. Still a lot of pressure, way more than there should be. And I think defenses get away with hitting him late way more than they should (at least they called one on the Titans). And so far, way too many sacks, but that's getting better also.

 

Pressure is subjective, so even the total pressures number needs context. Especially when it comes to how long the play takes to develop, and when in the play the pressure comes. There's plays like the 4th down against the Texans, and that's totally due to poor protection, but then there are plays where the QB gets pressured after a 2-3 seconds have passed, or the QB breaks the pocket to extend his passing window, and that's not really on the line. Two people can watch one game and come up with totally different "pressure" numbers.

 

As for people criticizing Luck, that's nonsense. The guy is the only reason the Colts have any shot at winning any game right now. Last year, he wasn't playing well, Hasselbeck stepped in and the offense actually got more efficient. This year, that's not the case. Replace Luck with an average backup and the Colts are 0-7, IMO. 

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5 hours ago, throwing BBZ said:

Take a shot of B-12 Homer as we wait for Lucky to get better at sooo many things.
  Chud is doing his Job bringing his game up to a higher standard. It has been a LONG ____ wait!!

The Homers are the ones who think the D is gonna magically get better when they are at the bottom of the NFL 

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12 minutes ago, Superman said:

Does anyone know how many times Luck has been hit this season? On a game by game basis?

 

I ask because I don't think he's been getting hit that much, at least not due to the line play. Still a lot of pressure, way more than there should be. And I think defenses get away with hitting him late way more than they should (at least they called one on the Titans). And so far, way too many sacks, but that's getting better also.

 

Pressure is subjective, so even the total pressures number needs context. Especially when it comes to how long the play takes to develop, and when in the play the pressure comes. There's plays like the 4th down against the Texans, and that's totally due to poor protection, but then there are plays where the QB gets pressured after a 2-3 seconds have passed, or the QB breaks the pocket to extend his passing window, and that's not really on the line. Two people can watch one game and come up with totally different "pressure" numbers.

 

As for people criticizing Luck, that's nonsense. The guy is the only reason the Colts have any shot at winning any game right now. Last year, he wasn't playing well, Hasselbeck stepped in and the offense actually got more efficient. This year, that's not the case. Replace Luck with an average backup and the Colts are 0-7, IMO. 

I dont think anyone is criticizing his talent, but he does hold the ball too long.  He has admitted himself.  Said some of the sacks are because of it.   I blame it on play calling more than anything.  Plays take too long to develop.   And I think Luck is not always sure where the pocket is going to form so he hesitates to see where he needs to move to find it. 

 

Shorter passes would do this team a big favor.  It would protect Luck and give the Oline less time to have to hold off the wolves

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1 hour ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Only 4 INT's through 7 games. I like that stat as he is on pace to throw less than 10 and that is where you want that number. 32 TOTAL TD's - Passing/Rushing = 2 a game and 9 INT's is a Great season which is basically what he is on pace for.

Exactly. I don't get why some are pointing a finger at Luck. Any QB putting the ball up as much as Luck does has a few picks. Those QBs that don't dink and dunk.

I think being the Colts are struggling getting wins there are in turn a few fans put a magnifying glass on every aspect and then want to make an issue of it.

The Colts are 3rd in the league on offense so anyone wanting to point them as a reason we have as many losses as we have are looking at the wrong reason.

IMO the losses are directly attributed to poor linebacker play.

 

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5 hours ago, tikyle said:

We just want to hold Luck up to the standard that his contract and quite frankly his hype have set for him.  Luck can't simply be good.  He needs to be great to outstanding.  Luck needs a 16 game season with 10 or less INT.  He needs to cut down the fumbles.  That is all we ask.  For the most part the sacks are not his fault.  But most if not all the turnovers are.  That is the only hole in his game and he has improved on that this year.

 

But to think he is above criticism because he is "our QB" or because he's the best player on this team is ridiculous to me.  When he stinks or costs us a game it should be pointed out just like when the defense or another particular player stinks or costs us the game.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/F/FavrBr00.htm

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MannPe00.htm

 

1) Less than 10 picks? Above are the stats of two of the all time greats. There really isnt much dispute about that. Favre was able to do this 1 time in his career and Manning threw less than 10 1 time as well.

 

2) I'm not sure how you can honestly make a statement about "But most if not all of the turnovers are" his fault? So, Im assuming you have gone over all the game film and decided that every pick he's ever thrown and every fumble he made were unforced errors? Give me a break, passes get tipped, balls get batted, sacks turn into fumbles much easier for quarterbacks that running backs because of the differences in how the ball is carried.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Superman said:

Does anyone know how many times Luck has been hit this season? On a game by game basis?

 

I ask because I don't think he's been getting hit that much, at least not due to the line play. Still a lot of pressure, way more than there should be. And I think defenses get away with hitting him late way more than they should (at least they called one on the Titans). And so far, way too many sacks, but that's getting better also.

 

Pressure is subjective, so even the total pressures number needs context. Especially when it comes to how long the play takes to develop, and when in the play the pressure comes. There's plays like the 4th down against the Texans, and that's totally due to poor protection, but then there are plays where the QB gets pressured after a 2-3 seconds have passed, or the QB breaks the pocket to extend his passing window, and that's not really on the line. Two people can watch one game and come up with totally different "pressure" numbers.

 

As for people criticizing Luck, that's nonsense. The guy is the only reason the Colts have any shot at winning any game right now. Last year, he wasn't playing well, Hasselbeck stepped in and the offense actually got more efficient. This year, that's not the case. Replace Luck with an average backup and the Colts are 0-7, IMO. 

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?tabSeq=2&offensiveStatisticCategory=OFFENSIVE_LINE&role=TM&d-447263-n=1&d-447263-o=2&d-447263-p=1&d-447263-s=PASSING_QBHIT

 

50 times. Good enough for 3rd worst in the NFL. Yet Luck is 3rd best in yards and 5th in TD's.

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7 hours ago, BCoop said:

The whole "holding the ball too long" rhetoric is ridiculous. You could argue that happens what, 2-3 times a game? Out of ~40 passes. It's even more ridiculous when you consider that's exactly what those plays call for and the alternative is trying to make a risky play that could turn into a fumble or interception.

 

I'm perfectly fine with the decisions Luck has made so far this year. Zero complaints.

I have searched and searched and cannot find where i read this, but i KNOW i did and it was a statistics site, not an opinion board., so i appologize for not having a link to back this up,...but:

I did read that so far this year A. Luck takes the 2nd longest in the NFL to let the ball go.  And was like 5th longest to decide to tuck and run when he has made that decision.

This is averages for the year,..not picking out a single play and timing it.  So yes,...he does hold the ball too long still. 

But like said earlier in the thread, i am NOT bashing Luck,...just some constructive critism.  I like Luck and think he's the top QB in the NFL at this time i would want.   Yes over Brady, Rodgers, Newton, ect.  When Luck is 'on',..no-one is better than Luck.

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