You guys do realize we're about a pass rusher or 2 and relative health away from contending

[AllYouNeedIsLuck]

I truly believe this to be the case

 

Shame it'll be hard to get those pass rushers tho....

[SkyBane]

Ayyyy Imao

 

The entire linebacking corps is a disaster area, and we need a new RB in the near future, as well as a replacement safety and depth at corner.

 

[Lef]

I agree that we are close. No team has pro bowl talent at every position. A consistent pass rush and montcrief back in the line up and we are a very strong team - just one man's opinion. 

[twfish]

9 minutes ago, SkyBane said:

Ayyyy Imao

 

The entire linebacking corps is a disaster area, and we need a new RB in the near future, as well as a replacement safety and depth at corner.

 

You mean Depth at safety and a replacement cb...

[SkyBane]

Just now, twfish said:

You mean Depth at safety and a replacement cb...

Nope. Adams has what, 1 maybe 2 years left in him? We need an assured replacement for him. We have a one corner in Vontae, but nobody really to play beside him, which is a depth issue.

[BProland85]

Indy needs 2 pass rushing OLBs, 1 good coverage ILB, a true NT, another 2 quality CBs after Davis, and a quality young RB before they truly maximize their potential. 

[twfish]

Just now, SkyBane said:

Nope. Adams has what, 1 maybe 2 years left in him? We need an assured replacement for him. We have a one corner in Vontae, but nobody really to play beside him, which is a depth issue.

You forget about Geathers, a pick from last year who is playing pretty good, and t.j green the second round pick who is honestly miles ahead of what most here thought. There will be a few growing pains but these 2 I'll put money on are our safetys of the future. I'd be happy with a depth pick in this draft. Cb however outside of vontae I'm not comfortable with anyone. Get another cb to go along with Davis and our secondary would be upper half of the league.

[Boiler_Colt]

Without the qb, we'd be competing for the #1 pick. That's not a roster thats close to competing for a title. We need an overhaul in several areas.

[Fisticuffs111]

My thing is no matter how much talent we get, I just don't trust our head coach to get the job done.

Not trying to make it some huge debate because I believe Irsay when he says Grigson and Pagano are here for the long haul, but it's the main reason why I'm not super optimistic on the future.

[Malakai432]

The ILBs are a train wreck in my opinion.  McNary makes me want to break something and DQ seems very sub par without Freeman along with him factor in he's 33.  The D has a good bit of work to do IMO.  I'm willing to give Morrison the benefit of the doubt but he would have to make a significant improvement from what we've seen in my opinion to be worthwhile next year, which is a possibility but I'm not going to hold my breath. 

[crazycolt1]

12 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

My thing is no matter how much talent we get, I just don't trust our head coach to get the job done.

Not trying to make it some huge debate because I believe Irsay when he says Grigson and Pagano are here for the long haul, but it's the main reason why I'm not super optimistic on this team's future.

While I do understand why you would feel that way I would like just make a couple of points.

Pagano more than likely done his best coaching job last season to bring this team to a 8-8 record. That may sound crazy to some but there was no quit in this team when they had every reason you can think of for them to.

The fight and never give up mentality came from Pagano IMO. This team fought for Pagano and made it clear they were.

Before last season the record speaks for itself. Like it or not Pagano has one of the best records in the NFL for a first 4 1/2 year rookie head coach.

There are some who point fingers and want to bring up all kinds of reasons why Pagano has this record. But the fact remains he has it.

Irsay had patience with Dungy and it paid off. I am not predicting or saying that things will get turned around but changing the head coach now or at the end of the season puts this team back to square one.

There have been so many different reasons fans have brought up we need a change. IMO giving this team a chance to make the changes to improve includes Pagano.

[Jules]

Yeah I guess so.........

[SkyBane]

1 minute ago, crazycolt1 said:

IMO giving this team a chance to make the changes to improve includes Pagano.

Why are you asking a man who has shown no propensity for change, and even that he belongs in this century as a head coach, to change? If Pagano is a given, then the only way to win is to build a team that has enough talent to win in spite of his miserable decision making.

[Hoosiernsavga]

All our LBers need to be replaced. And we are a couple CB away from a good secondary. 

I will be upset if we draft more then one offensive player and that should be a rb in next years draft! 

[colts_mp]

Contending for what?  If you mean contending for the division among other mediocre teams then I wholeheartedly agree.  If you mean contending for a deep run in the playoffs then I think we are still a ways from that.  New England, Pittsburgh (with a healthy Ben) and maybe another team or two are still out of our league so to speak.

 

 

[jbaron04]

1 hour ago, BProland85 said:

Indy needs 2 pass rushing OLBs, 1 good coverage ILB, a true NT, another 2 quality CBs after Davis, and a quality young RB before they truly maximize their potential. 

Yup you speak all truth 

[crazycolt1]

3 minutes ago, SkyBane said:

Why are you asking a man who has shown no propensity for change, and even that he belongs in this century as a head coach, to change? If Pagano is a given, then the only way to win is to build a team that has enough talent to win in spite of his miserable decision making.

That is your opinion and I cant fault you for feeling that way.

All of this wasn't a problem when we were going three 11-5 seasons in a row.

Pagano can only coach the players brought in for him to coach. He cant teach talent to players who lack it. The players who are talented have done fine under Pagano.

What you call miserable decisions are super magnified when the team looses so most dwell on him and point fingers like he is the main reason for the losses. That may be true but it may not be either.

IMO Irsay being patient is the best decision to make at this point.

[crazycolt1]

8 minutes ago, Hoosiernsavga said:

All our LBers need to be replaced. And we are a couple CB away from a good secondary. 

I will be upset if we draft more then one offensive player and that should be a rb in next years draft! 

I think you are 100% correct.  Our linebackers are putting so much pressure on the other positions it ain't funny.

We may have to sign a higher paid LB or make a trade for a LBer. Drafting a couple of LBs we would still have to wait for them to get NFL ready. Having a veteran LB would help that process IMO.

[Fisticuffs111]

25 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

While I do understand why you would feel that way I would like just make a couple of points.

Pagano more than likely done his best coaching job last season to bring this team to a 8-8 record. That may sound crazy to some but there was no quit in this team when they had every reason you can think of for them to.

The fight and never give up mentality came from Pagano IMO. This team fought for Pagano and made it clear they were.

Before last season the record speaks for itself. Like it or not Pagano has one of the best records in the NFL for a first 4 1/2 year rookie head coach.

There are some who point fingers and want to bring up all kinds of reasons why Pagano has this record. But the fact remains he has it.

Irsay had patience with Dungy and it paid off. I am not predicting or saying that things will get turned around but changing the head coach now or at the end of the season puts this team back to square one.

There have been so many different reasons fans have brought up we need a change. IMO giving this team a chance to make the changes to improve includes Pagano.

I hear that, and I do acknowledge that Pagano is a solid motivator.

However, I'll always be one to bring up that Pagano has a very average record outside of our division and has been lucky to coach in objectively the worst division with one of the best QB's in the league.

But even beyond that the biggest thing for me is I think more times than not, especially in the playoffs, Pagano will rarely ever have the coaching advantage. And I think that's key in the playoffs when you see the more elite coaches of the league.

 

I will agree that giving him a chance to improve is legit. I really hope to see more games like this recent Titans game, and even the Texans game aside from the collapse.

[crazycolt1]

3 minutes ago, Fisticuffs111 said:

I hear that, and I do acknowledge that Pagano is a solid motivator.

However, I'll always be one to bring up that Pagano has a very average record outside of our division and has been lucky to coach in the worst division in football with one of the best QB's in the league. But IMO that's a debate that most fans are decided on one way or another and it's not worth arguing.

But the biggest thing for me is, I think more times than not, especially in the playoffs, Pagano will never have the coaching advantage. And I think that's key in the playoffs when you see the elite coaches of the league.

The only way to become an elite coach is experience.

Most of these elite coaches you speak of had their rough starts just as well and didn't become elite till they learned from their mistakes and gained their experience. Even Bill Belichick started out 36-44 as a head coach. He also went 5-11 his first year with the Patriots.

Now I am not suggesting that Pagano will come close to what Bill is but I was just using that as an example.

[Fisticuffs111]

2 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

The only way to become an elite coach is experience.

Most of these elite coaches you speak of had their rough starts just as well and didn't become elite till they learned from their mistakes and gained their experience. Even Bill Belichick started out 36-44 as a head coach. He also went 5-11 his first year with the Patriots.

Now I am not suggesting that Pagano will come close to what Bill is but I was just using that as an example.

 

I totally agree about him gaining exprience.

I loved his agressiveness in the Titans game and same goes for most of the Texans game. I think and really hope he can make a similar turnaround that Ron Rivera did when he was on the hotseat a couple years ago. Just gotta get more Riverboat Chuck.

[JPFolks]

1 hour ago, Lef said:

I agree that we are close. No team has pro bowl talent at every position. A consistent pass rush and montcrief back in the line up and we are a very strong team - just one man's opinion. 

But most contenders have more pro bowl players on their defense.  We have Davis and an ancient Safety.  Has anyone else on D made the Pro Bowl while a Colt? 

[SkyBane]

4 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

But most contenders have more pro bowl players on their defense.  We have Davis and an ancient Safety.  Has anyone else on D made the Pro Bowl while a Colt? 

I think I read in a history book that Mathis did, but Julius Caeser was in power at the time, so the records could be misleading.

[WoolMagnet]

2 hours ago, AllYouNeedIsLuck said:

I truly believe this to be the case

 

Shame it'll be hard to get those pass rushers tho....

I kind of think this too. 

Load up on linebackers (inside and out), and maybe a cb and/or rb later in draft.

but we will both be laughed at in  3 ...... 2 ......... 1 ..........

[KelownaColtsFan]

I would say we are about 4 LB's,  2 DL, a CB, and a RB away from any form of legitimacy, not all need to be pro bowlers but they should at least be starting caliber. The Colts are blessed with a great QB, who makes them somewhat competitive from week to week, but your kidding yourself if you think this team is even close to a championship. If they do some how make the playoffs they will once again be embarrassed by the Patriots.

[JPFolks]

31 minutes ago, SkyBane said:

I think I read in a history book that Mathis did, but Julius Caeser was in power at the time, so the records could be misleading.

I am trying to remember what year(s) he made it, but I did forget about him sadly.  He's so irrelevant these days.  I was surprised to learn, however, that was his first ever touchdown.   I think he was in the Pro Bowl his big year with the sacks lead.  Sadly that accomplishment was followed directly with a PED scandal.  And then massive injury and now he's just not the same.  

[SkyBane]

1 minute ago, JPFolks said:

I am trying to remember what year(s) he made it, but I did forget about him sadly.  He's so irrelevant these days.  I was surprised to learn, however, that was his first ever touchdown.   I think he was in the Pro Bowl his big year with the sacks lead.  Sadly that accomplishment was followed directly with a PED scandal.  And then massive injury and now he's just not the same.  

Kidding aside, Mathis is actually a 6 time probowler, 2008-2013. His irrelevance these days is sad to watch, but he will be in the Colts ring of honor one day.

 

Still needs to be replaced though.

[KelownaColtsFan]

Just now, JPFolks said:

I am trying to remember what year(s) he made it, but I did forget about him sadly.  He's so irrelevant these days.  I was surprised to learn, however, that was his first ever touchdown.   I think he was in the Pro Bowl his big year with the sacks lead.  Sadly that accomplishment was followed directly with a PED scandal.  And then massive injury and now he's just not the same.  

For a guy who was so dominant in his prime, he sure has fallen off a cliff in terms of talent after his injury. Still one of my favorites.

[crazycolt1]

15 minutes ago, JPFolks said:

I am trying to remember what year(s) he made it, but I did forget about him sadly.  He's so irrelevant these days.  I was surprised to learn, however, that was his first ever touchdown.   I think he was in the Pro Bowl his big year with the sacks lead.  Sadly that accomplishment was followed directly with a PED scandal.  And then massive injury and now he's just not the same.  

It was his 2nd TD.

[AZColt11]

In response to the original post, I would agree it would be a nice start, probably win them a game or two, which is certainly better.  Do I think it would have them contending in the South?  Absolutely.  Do I think it would have them making a run at a Superbowl?  Not with just that.  I still think they are a ways off from beating NE in the playoffs, and they are the top dog right now.  I think if we got a couple of "werewolves" and another good CB opposite Vontae, and at least one good ILB, then they would be close.  If you added a competent RT, then you got something!  How long it will take to get all that is anybody's guess.  Mine is 1-2 years if done correctly.

[19colt]

Denver has 4 excellent pass rushers. Yeah one was the #2 pick but the other 3 aren't. Indy has to find a way to get a couple then watch the rest of the D suddenly look better!

[AZColt11]

25 minutes ago, 19colt said:

Denver has 4 excellent pass rushers. Yeah one was the #2 pick but the other 3 aren't. Indy has to find a way to get a couple then watch the rest of the D suddenly look better!

To do that though they can't spend a lot of dough.  They will need to hit on some draft picks, which is one reason why I advocated for higher picks because, even though not a lock, your chances of hitting go up higher in the draft.  Where you gain the advantage is good draft picks that will be cheap for a few years, not paying high-priced FA's.  And it's anybody's guess how that will turn out.

[NewColtsFan]

4 hours ago, AllYouNeedIsLuck said:

I truly believe this to be the case

 

Shame it'll be hard to get those pass rushers tho....

 

Contending for what?

 

The AFC South title?

 

The AFC Championship game appearance?

 

The Super Bowl?

 

What?

 

In the grand scheme of things it really doesn't matter,  because we are NOT 2 pass rushers and relative health away from contending.

 

Our defense is currently ranked 30th or 31st.     That's not two pass rushers away from contending.

 

We don't stop the run and the only thing we do worse than that is not stop the pass!       Hello?!?

 

I'm sorry,  but we're a long way from contending....

 

[Defjamz26]

[James Ducheteau]

7 hours ago, KelownaColtsFan said:

I would say we are about 4 LB's,  2 DL, a CB, and a RB away from any form of legitimacy, not all need to be pro bowlers but they should at least be starting caliber. The Colts are blessed with a great QB, who makes them somewhat competitive from week to week, but your kidding yourself if you think this team is even close to a championship. If they do some how make the playoffs they will once again be embarrassed by the Patriots.

The pats are going to embarrass who ever they play in the AFC championship game

[HungarianColtsFan]

Imo we are't close but aren't that far away from being a contender. Seems like we have a serviceable O-line and we were set at WR/TE. We must stabilize our D for being a true contender.

[corgi]

6 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Contending for what?

 

The AFC South title?

 

The AFC Championship game appearance?

 

The Super Bowl?

 

What?

 

In the grand scheme of things it really doesn't matter,  because we are NOT 2 pass rushers and relative health away from contending.

 

Our defense is currently ranked 30th or 31st.     That's not two pass rushers away from contending.

 

We don't stop the run and the only thing we do worse than that is not stop the pass!       Hello?!?

 

I'm sorry,  but we're a long way from contending....

 

If the team could rush the QB it would make the secondaries life a lot easier. Still have he issues at ILB for sure though. Decent to good pass rush and ILB play and the defense is way better.

[Valpo2004]

11 hours ago, AllYouNeedIsLuck said:

I truly believe this to be the case

 

Shame it'll be hard to get those pass rushers tho....

 

It's a bit more then that.  

 

As someone else said, pretty much the entire linebacking corps needs to be replaced.  We need some improvement at CB2 and we're going to have to get a new RB.  Gore can only go on like this for so long. 

 

Also the OL needs to hold up.  I have some faith that our improvements to the OL will pay off next year.  But that actually has to come to fruition.  

 

But if TJ Green pans out, we have the safeties to compete, the DL to compete, one of the CB's to compete.  If our OL pans out we have the OL to compete the QB to compete and the receivers and TE's to compete.

 

Right now we have the RB to compete but he's going into his contract year next year and he's on the edge of retirement so he will need to be replaced.  Also a problem is that we lack RB depth.  And that's really not a position where you can afford to be lacking depth. 

[throwing BBZ]

11 hours ago, AllYouNeedIsLuck said:

I truly believe this to be the case

 

Shame it'll be hard to get those pass rushers tho....

 

 If we could add a couple of Hall of Famers to rush and Edwin Jackson turns into Edwin Singletary. lol
 

[Jason_]

7 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

 

 

In the grand scheme of things it really doesn't matter,  because we are NOT 2 pass rushers and relative health away from contending.

 

Our defense is currently ranked 30th or 31st.     That's not two pass rushers away from contending.

 

 

 

 

I agree with the OP to be honest.  Yeah our defense is currently ranked 30th or 31st.  But imo that is largely due to all of the injuries and a new DC.  We have no idea how much Monachino might have mixed up the scheme in the offseason, but even if he made very few changes, it's still an entirely new coaching staff on D and that alone will lead to struggles.  Add to that all of the injuries to the secondary and the DL, our 2 strongest position groups, and yeah they're definitely going to struggle. 

 

I honestly don't believe that we've truly seen what this defense is capable of in its current state.