Would Goodell possibly vote in a rule against player protesting?

[ReMeDy]

Would something like this be possibly voted in next season, such as any player who either kneels or has their fist raised is fined? At first I dismissed this idea, but having considered it, I've seen the NFL implement ridiculous fines, such as you're only allowed certain brands of equipment, touchdown celebration scrutiny, the media attendance requirement (ie. Marshawn Lynch), and lack of player contact in practices (ie. Seahawks). The NFL can fine players both in and out of game, so why not also during the National Anthem?

If there is indeed a correlation between protesting and lower NFL ratings, it could be in Goodell's interest to stamp this issue out before it spirals out of control. It's possible these protests are costing the NFL money, whether they want to admit it or not.

 

Oh, and have the fines go to police and military veterans.

[NewColtsFan]

 

I don't think he can.

 

Player protest was a negotiated piece of the players union contract with the owners.

 

They'd have to open up a complete re-negotiation and the players are not likely to give up personal freedom,  at least not without considerable cost to the owners.       I don't see either side budging.....

 

This is a principle thing for both sides.....

 

[ReMeDy]

26 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't think he can.

 

Player protest was a negotiated piece of the players union contract with the owners.

 

They'd have to open up a complete re-negotiation and the players are not likely to give up personal freedom,  at least not without considerable cost to the owners.       I don't see either side budging.....

 

This is a principle thing for both sides.....

 

 

Ahh okay, that makes sense the NFL would allow that. I have to wonder if the owners -- when they signed this contract -- thought the player protests would stem from their clubs, lack of playing time, etc. and not something political. I doubt the owners saw this coming, but yea, at this point, there's not much they can do if both parties agreed to it.

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, ReMeDy said:

 

Ahh okay, that makes sense the NFL would allow that. I have to wonder if the owners -- when they signed this contract -- thought the player protests would stem from their clubs, lack of playing time, etc. and not something political. I doubt the owners saw this coming, but yea, at this point, there's not much they can do if both parties agreed to it.

 

Honestly,   I don't think the owners saw this coming.....

 

Hard for me to say one way or the other if the players did.....      Dunno.....

 

[gacoop1]

Just a sad display of expressing your views by disrespecting freedom.  These * wouldn't be enjoying a lavish lifestyle with their millions if it weren't for the brave men and women that sacrifice their lives. 

[2006Coltsbestever]

I agree I don't think the owners seen this coming and I can see more and more protesting by players as the weeks go on. I am for protesting serious issues I just don't like players dissing the Anthem. Some people in here agree with me and some don't. The next CBA the NFL comes out with will be extremely interesting on many topics, like how much power Goodell should have, more player safety, Salary Cap, and the kneeling of the flag/protesting. It will be fun to see what the NFL comes up with during the next CBA.

[2006Coltsbestever]

8 minutes ago, gacoop1 said:

Just a sad display of expressing your views by disrespecting freedom.  These * wouldn't be enjoying a lavish lifestyle with their millions if it weren't for the brave men and women that sacrifice their lives. 

I agree!

[King Colt]

I think the players being on the field for the anthem started in 2009. He could change that but it probably would not set well with the players and the media could jump "racist" in a heartbeat. This protest looks silly with only a couple players out of the whole team taking a knee.

[jvan1973]

5 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't think he can.

 

Player protest was a negotiated piece of the players union contract with the owners.

 

They'd have to open up a complete re-negotiation and the players are not likely to give up personal freedom,  at least not without considerable cost to the owners.       I don't see either side budging.....

 

This is a principle thing for both sides.....

 

Where in the CBA is player protests discussed?      

[crazycolt1]

It will go away when the media finds something else to get their attention.

The only thing that comes to mind is the NFL and the networks agree to not show fans running out onto the field. The reason was it was taking away from the essence of the sport.

So far Goodell said he supported the players. That will change when the viewers numbers go down and this issue is related.

People seem to forget that it is not all on Goodell when It is the majority owners who run the show.

[NewColtsFan]

7 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

Where in the CBA is player protests discussed?      

 

I have no idea.

 

I only know when this issue was raised I heard stories that player expression,  the freedom to protest, was a negotiated right for the players.

 

Why would you think I have the CBA at my finger tips.

 

Put another way,   if the players DIDN'T have the right,  don't you think the owners would've shut this down by now?

 

[jvan1973]

12 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I have no idea.

 

I only know when this issue was raised I heard stories that player expression,  the freedom to protest, was a negotiated right for the players.

 

Why would you think I have the CBA at my finger tips.

 

Put another way,   if the players DIDN'T have the right,  don't you think the owners would've shut this down by now?

 

There is nothing in the CBA about player protests.  The owners can't keep the players from their first amendment right.     If player expression and freedom to protest were in the CBA it wouldn't be a penalty to dance in the end zone.    Every player could say their dance was in protest to one cause or another if it were in the CBA,  which it isn't

[NewColtsFan]

12 minutes ago, jvan1973 said:

There is nothing in the CBA about player protests.  The owners can't keep the players from their first amendment right.     If player expression and freedom to protest were in the CBA it wouldn't be a penalty to dance in the end zone.    Every player could say their dance was in protest to one cause or another if it were in the CBA,  which it isn't

 

So,  you think there's nothing in the CBA that gives the players the right to protest?  

 

Is that what you're saying?

 

I'm simply telling you what I heard was that this was a negotiated right.     It was not explained that the players were simply exercising their 1st amendment freedom of speech.      

 

And by the argument you made in your post,  a player could dance in the EZ and say it was his 1st amendment right.

 

[jvan1973]

1 minute ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

So,  you think there's nothing in the CBA that gives the players the right to protest?  

 

Is that what you're saying?

 

I'm simply telling you what I heard was that this was a negotiated right.     It was not explained that the players were simply exercising their 1st amendment freedom of speech.      

 

And by the argument you made in your post,  a player could dance in the EZ and say it was his 1st amendment right.

 

There is nothing in the CBA giving the players the right to protest or freedom to express themselves.    There is no rule requiring them to stand for the anthem either.    

[southwest1]

15 hours ago, ReMeDy said:

Would something like this be possibly voted in next season, such as any player who either kneels or has their fist raised is fined? At first I dismissed this idea, but having considered it, I've seen the NFL implement ridiculous fines, such as you're only allowed certain brands of equipment, touchdown celebration scrutiny, the media attendance requirement (ie. Marshawn Lynch), and lack of player contact in practices (ie. Seahawks). The NFL can fine players both in and out of game, so why not also during the National Anthem?

If there is indeed a correlation between protesting and lower NFL ratings, it could be in Goodell's interest to stamp this issue out before it spirals out of control. It's possible these protests are costing the NFL money, whether they want to admit it or not.

 

Oh, and have the fines go to police and military veterans.

Hey there RMDY, 

 

I respect you as a regular on the forum & your thread is an unconventional idea with an interesting twist on it especially if the owners who pay his salary, the commissioner's, start to get nervous that ratings start to decline & their broadcasting dollars in the next CBA come in at a much lower number for TV station airing rights. 

 

It's hard for the league to take a position of moral authority though after fans learned that the military paid 32 franchises for paid patriotism on TV now. Because it makes the owners look like greedy bloodsuckers who only care about our soldiers, sailors, flyboys, & mud marine crawlers & Seal Team units when they get a big enough cut to act like they care. 

 

Part of the problem is Presidential election weariness. Once that decision is made, a lot of this anxiety will subside I think. All the league can really enforce among player are uniform violations, footwear violations, & football violations. The weird one though is when Steelers RB DeAngelo Williams wanted to continue to color his hair pink beyond breast cancer awareness month in support of his mother because he's not say a cheerleader so you can't really tell a player what to put in his hair or how long or short it should be. Nobody tells Goodell what to put in his hair in terms of gel, color, or how it is styled do they? Yes, I know. You can't have every player do something visually for their own personal cause. However, how is pink coloring different that say a gray removal product especially when a helmet is placed over your head? 

 

 

I know; it's the open flood gates quagmire. If 1 exception is permitted, then where does it stop moving forward? Therein lies the crux of the problem. 

 

The thing I wonder about is say red, white & blue shoes worn on 911 by players. If no one was fined for this violation, then this failure to act is the epitome of hypocrisy & a complete lack of rule consistency. I have no proof of this example BTW. I'm just curious that's all. 

 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, jvan1973 said:

There is nothing in the CBA giving the players the right to protest or freedom to express themselves.    There is no rule requiring them to stand for the anthem either.    

 

So,  why doesn't Goodell simply invoke the "Best Interest of the NFL Clause" and state that the players cannot protest and must stand at attention?

 

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, jvan1973 said:

There is nothing in the CBA giving the players the right to protest or freedom to express themselves.    There is no rule requiring them to stand for the anthem either.    

 

 

 

 

JV....

 

It appears you're right.     I just surfed the net looking for information one way or the other.     And here is an interview with DeMaurice Smith the head of the NFLPA,  and in the interview he says there is nothing in the CBA giving the players a right to protest.    

 

Interesting.    Directly contradicts what I heard.

 

But if Smith is saying it,  it has to be true.      I'll link the interview....

 

https://www.thenation.com/article/what-the-nfl-players-union-chief-has-to-say-about-colin-kaepernicks-protest/

 

For some unknown reason,  the website is not letting my cut and paste the quote...    something about formatting issue....    but the answer is the 2nd paragraph after the question about what would the union do to support the players.....

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jules]

These guys who kneel or sit for the anthem are PEACEFULLY protesting, they are not hurting a fly......It's MLK style protesting with nothing but being peaceful about it. They are not violent or hurting ANYONE directly. They are just expressing their personal views and some do care about those who are oppressed even if they themselves have money.

 

If you crack down on the players individuality too much down the road then you might as well call it the "National Fascist League."

 

 

Ratings may be down since a lot of late night games suck too. How many times this year have the Bears been on at night for example? And a lot of stars are out this year........and a few have retired like Manning who was a face of the league for so long. MNF this past week sucked with the Falcons destroying the Saints bad defense.

 

Brady is out for another week and I bet Pats games sky rocket in ratings with his return. JJ Watt is now out. Adrian Peterson is out. The list goes on.......

 

People get bored. And actually the peaceful protesting gives the NFL attention so in a way they should be thankful for it. If people don't watch since a few sit or kneel for the Anthem then I give up on those people and it just further proves the point of someone like Kaepernick. 

[southwest1]

Thanks for your link above to such a fascinating article NCF. I keep coming back to something Shannon Sharpe always says on his new FS1 TV show called "Skip & Shannon"...Real meaningful social change always needs to make others uncomfortable in order to succeed & promote a large shift in daily society & Mr. Sharpe is exactly right. Nothing will change for the better without ruffling some feathers thru rebellion against the way things are. History has demonstrated this fact for decades & centuries. Relax, I'm not about to lead an angry mob with pitch forks & torches here. 

 

The other thing I noticed is when the President of the Players Association said he reached out to Colin Kaep by phone for support I laughed because if the Niners released him tomorrow & Kaep wasn't in the league anymore, would Mr. Smith even care? I highly doubt it. We only care if that QB is on a football roster. The 49ers give him a platform to express his views globally. Take that access away & Colin virtually becomes irrelevant overnight as a celebrity with clout & a public figure of stature. 

 

Bringing up boxer Mohammad Ali was fascinating too because he paid a heavy price for his views not to serve overseas in SE Asia, which pales in comparison to the minor heat Colin is enduring right now. It's not even close. 

[southwest1]

45 minutes ago, Jules said:

These guys who kneel or sit for the anthem are PEACEFULLY protesting, they are not hurting a fly......It's MLK style protesting with nothing but being peaceful about it. They are not violent or hurting ANYONE directly. They are just expressing their personal views and some do care about those who are oppressed even if they themselves have money.

 

If you crack down on the players individuality too much down the road then you might as well call it the "National Fascist League."

 

 

Ratings may be down since a lot of late night games suck too. How many times this year have the Bears been on at night for example? And a lot of stars are out this year........and a few have retired like Manning who was a face of the league for so long. MNF this past week sucked with the Falcons destroying the Saints bad defense.

 

Brady is out for another week and I bet Pats games sky rocket in ratings with his return. JJ Watt is now out. Adrian Peterson is out. The list goes on.......

 

People get bored. And actually the peaceful protesting gives the NFL attention so in a way they should be thankful for it. If people don't watch since a few sit or kneel for the Anthem then I give up on those people and it just further proves the point of someone like Kaepernick. 

Great post Jules! To be clear, I will always stand for the Natl. no matter what because I respect the sacrifice so many veterans & their families make to give me the right to say whatever I want within reason & not fear that poof I will magically disappear tomorrow if SW1 accidentally upsets the powers that be. Enough said. 

 

You're also exactly right when you state that protestors aren't harming anybody physically in their civil acts of defiance wanting a safer America for everyone regardless of their race, gender, & background. And yes, key athletes being down & out injury wise this season doesn't help much on the watch ability TV factor this yr. either. 

 

I do have some misgivings though over some TV personalities thinking Colin Kaep is some sort of profound civil rights leader at the moment though. Colin is young, considerably naive, & has very little life experience to be deemed a mentor for social change right now. I have no doubt he's encountered discrimination in his life & he deserves credit for starting a natl. dialogue about respect among cultures with less bloodshed & violence on this planet sure. But, Gandhi he is not & never will he be in my opinion. 

[SilentHill]

meh, non issue, some teams like the LA Ram's have rules about players standing for the anthem, and it's totally up to the team to enforce it's own rules.

[jvan1973]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

So,  why doesn't Goodell simply invoke the "Best Interest of the NFL Clause" and state that the players cannot protest and must stand at attention?

 

Because that would be a terrible look for him and the league.   Why would he do that?

[Gabriel Alexander Morillo]

2 hours ago, Jules said:

These guys who kneel or sit for the anthem are PEACEFULLY protesting, they are not hurting a fly......It's MLK style protesting with nothing but being peaceful about it. They are not violent or hurting ANYONE directly. They are just expressing their personal views and some do care about those who are oppressed even if they themselves have money.

 

If you crack down on the players individuality too much down the road then you might as well call it the "National Fascist League."

 

 

Ratings may be down since a lot of late night games suck too. How many times this year have the Bears been on at night for example? And a lot of stars are out this year........and a few have retired like Manning who was a face of the league for so long. MNF this past week sucked with the Falcons destroying the Saints bad defense.

 

Brady is out for another week and I bet Pats games sky rocket in ratings with his return. JJ Watt is now out. Adrian Peterson is out. The list goes on.......

 

People get bored. And actually the peaceful protesting gives the NFL attention so in a way they should be thankful for it. If people don't watch since a few sit or kneel for the Anthem then I give up on those people and it just further proves the point of someone like Kaepernick. 

I agree with your views on that protests should be allowed. But player injuries happen every year, players retiring happens every year, this Kapernick situation does not. It's much less of a leap in logic to attribute the ratings drop to something new taking place rather than something that's happened for the past every single year. 

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, jvan1973 said:

Because that would be a terrible look for him and the league.   Why would he do that?

 

I didn't say he should do it.....    I personally don't favor that.

 

But it appears more Americans would like that....   the protests are not, on balance, popular....

 

It's been noted that the TV ratings for the NFL are down this year....   down each week....    perhaps there are other reasons for that.....       but the NFL is the most corporate sports league in the world,  and the bottom line almost always wins....    and if they feel that these protests are hurting the league and the teams,   I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to do something.

[oldunclemark]

19 hours ago, ReMeDy said:

Would something like this be possibly voted in next season, such as any player who either kneels or has their fist raised is fined? At first I dismissed this idea, but having considered it, I've seen the NFL implement ridiculous fines, such as you're only allowed certain brands of equipment, touchdown celebration scrutiny, the media attendance requirement (ie. Marshawn Lynch), and lack of player contact in practices (ie. Seahawks). The NFL can fine players both in and out of game, so why not also during the National Anthem?

If there is indeed a correlation between protesting and lower NFL ratings, it could be in Goodell's interest to stamp this issue out before it spirals out of control. It's possible these protests are costing the NFL money, whether they want to admit it or not.

 

Oh, and have the fines go to police and military veterans.

No pro sports commissioner could or would do anything like that

[ruksak]

Watching petulant multimillionaires who have tasted the best of what American opportunity can offer anyone, of ANY race, protesting how unfair American life is ..............?

 

Reason #27 why I stopped watching NFL football after 39 years of rabid fandom. 

 

Millennials.......you @#$&ing suck

[Cynjin]

11 hours ago, ruksak said:

Watching petulant multimillionaires who have tasted the best of what American opportunity can offer anyone, of ANY race, protesting how unfair American life is ..............?

 

Reason #27 why I stopped watching NFL football after 39 years of rabid fandom. 

 

Millennials.......you @#$&ing suck

 

I am with you ruksak, Cromatie protesting the National Anthem on foreign soil is the last straw for me.  Maybe, I will pay attention next year but I am done for this season.  Everyone else, I hope you have a more enjoyable season than it has been so far.  

[wizwor]

No.  If he wanted the protests to stop, he could cite behavior unbecoming.  The problem is that whatever decision the league could make, it would offend a bunch of people.  So, they say nothing, do nothing, lose viewers.