Colts Defense As Of Now....

[MarquisJ]

I must say fellow colts fans.. Im worried.. I tried to be very optimistic about our defense with a new DC and small acqusitions this year but after this Art Jones situation it got me thinking more. Our new and improve O-line/Offense won't mean anything if our defense can't get off the field. As of now I'm looking at a DB room that is very shaky besides Vontae.. Questions at ILB, who's going to start with DQ do we have any ILB that can cover etc etc. and our dline lord... Everyone in our division running backs are people to be worried about murray, ivory, lamar miller... They are going to run the football down our throats, Im not saying to doing anything stupid trade wise but this could be a long season.. I hope we are way better prepared than last year in some games. In 97 seasons of the NFL nothings changed.. DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS (p.s i know its early still we haven't even reached TC and I'm ranting but boredom strikes again) 

[BOTT]

Had to end with a cliche didn't you...

 

the offense will carry the load in the regular season, but the defense will spell doom in the playoffs....unless the colts get a lucky draw. So saying the offense won't mean anything is quite a stretch.

[oldunclemark]

33 minutes ago, MarquisJ said:

I must say fellow colts fans.. Im worried.. I tried to be very optimistic about our defense with a new DC and small acqusitions this year but after this Art Jones situation it got me thinking more. Our new and improve O-line/Offense won't mean anything if our defense can't get off the field. As of now I'm looking at a DB room that is very shaky besides Vontae.. Questions at ILB, who's going to start with DQ do we have any ILB that can cover etc etc. and our dline lord... Everyone in our division running backs are people to be worried about murray, ivory, lamar miller... They are going to run the football down our throats, Im not saying to doing anything stupid trade wise but this could be a long season.. I hope we are way better prepared than last year in some games. In 97 seasons of the NFL nothings changed.. DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS (p.s i know its early still we haven't even reached TC and I'm ranting but boredom strikes again) 

Calm down...my man.

I cant answer defensive questions now but offense DOES win as evidenced by New England 2 years ago.

The most important unitl on any team is the offensive line..and that's where we'll be much improved an d physically stronger..We will have a very good offense...we will be playing with the lead ..

 

You don't like Patrick Robinson, Darius Butler ...(Pro Bowl) Mike Adams and our rookie who runs a 4.3?

Okay..Nate Irving is a pretty good LB...

...we're a little short in the line....I cant talk that one up....but we will score....You're going to like it

 

....lets wait until training camp opens before we panic

[IAColtsFan]

The defense last year suffered mostly due to a vanilla scheme and an offense that either turned the ball over or went 3 and out.  If you were to go back and look at last year (outside of a few games; the two blowouts come to mind) the defense kept us in the game going into the 4th.  They just were too gassed to hold up.

 

With improvements on offense, a non-vanilla scheme (I believe the new DC will mix things up; probably with some growing pains) and the improvements made on the defensive side (Robinson > Toler, Moore/Irving > Freeman, Geathers = Lowery), I don't see the defense being as bad as everyone is making it sound.  They won't be top 10 but they will be good enough to keep us in games.

[Krauses]

54 minutes ago, Blue Preying Mathis said:

The defense last year suffered mostly due to a vanilla scheme and an offense that either turned the ball over or went 3 and out.  If you were to go back and look at last year (outside of a few games; the two blowouts come to mind) the defense kept us in the game going into the 4th.  They just were too gassed to hold up.

 

With improvements on offense, a non-vanilla scheme (I believe the new DC will mix things up; probably with some growing pains) and the improvements made on the defensive side (Robinson > Toler, Moore/Irving > Freeman, Geathers = Lowery), I don't see the defense being as bad as everyone is making it sound.  They won't be top 10 but they will be good enough to keep us in games.

Agree with you on robinson being an upgrade of toilet toler. But unproven Moore/irving being an improvement of Freeman is a stretch 

[Lawrence Owen]

If we keep Jones...week 5 our d-line should be solid.  Having Jones, Anderson(hoping he's 100% by then), Langford, Ridgeway moving in and out should be a VERY good line.

LB's are a ? due to we don't know how Moore/Irving will turn out.  It's just a wait and see approach really.  I have faith in Mathis' ability to get to the QB...he's never let down on that yet. (even last year, his snaps/qb sack ratio was quite good)

I'm ok with our secondary right now...just not the depth. if someone goes down,...we could be in trouble,  just like the last couple years.  Hoping Smith turns out to be a decent coverage guy.

[IAColtsFan]

15 hours ago, Krauses said:

Agree with you on robinson being an upgrade of toilet toler. But unproven Moore/irving being an improvement of Freeman is a stretch 

 

Calling Moore/Irving unproven is a bigger stretch than my thinking they are an improvement. Both have played well in this league before coming to the Colts.

 

They both have admitted to being off last year (either trade with new system or overweight after an injury). 

 

I will admit that either I should have used way more > for the Robinson/Toler or a >= for the Moore/Irving/Freeman to show that it is a lesser of an improvement. Yet I highly doubt anyone will say "I wish we kept Freeman" any time during the season. 

[twfish]

I really don't see huge weaknesses outside of possible OLB. Our corner back group will be improved from last year with the subtraction of toler alone. However add in djoun smith (3rd round pick highly touted by some including gruden) and tevin Mitchell (who we had our eyes set on in last year's draft that we stole from the redskins) I'm not huge on robinson but he should suffice this year. We have Irving Moore sylvestre (quick and should be able to cover) and Morrison who the colts are very high on. I really liked freeman and he is the definition of a class act to me however last year was his first year without and injury. The D-line I'm rather excited about. Keep in mind Art probably would have been cut if he had not taken a pay cut and wasn't fully expected in training camp to begin the year so between langford Ridgeway Kerricane Parry (say all you want about him being undersized I still think he's a great player) McGill Quarles and then getting Anderson back sometime in the middle of the season hopefully I have very little doubt that Jones will be missed greatly. Olb hopefully Mathis gets on fire early like he did late in the season and Cole starts finishing plays. Bates and maggitt will probably surprise some people. I really don't think our D will be bad and should be better than last years

[TheRustonRifle#7]

I will wait to see what our new DC thinks of the players before worrying...

[Devildog]

.

[Malakai432]

I see them being about the same as last year.  I hope they improve obviously,  and maybe the emergence of a gem or two would be great.

[BOTT]

The problem isn't the weak spots, it's the areas that lack strength.  Other than Luck and the receivers I don't think there is another area that scares opposing teams....as of now.

[will426]

Yeahhh not worried about our run defense

[will426]

22 hours ago, Krauses said:

Agree with you on robinson being an upgrade of toilet toler. But unproven Moore/irving being an improvement of Freeman is a stretch 

When they both played in his absence they did no worse and both showed pass rushing ability..now coverage wise I didn't get a good look

[will426]

22 minutes ago, BOTT said:

The problem isn't the weak spots, it's the areas that lack strength.  Other than Luck and the receivers I don't think there is another area that scares opposing teams....as of now.

Forget scaring people lets just win and we've won with worse squads than this

[Gavin]

20th or worse but we should have a couple players with bright spots in Langford and Adams. Other then that our defensive deficiencies have been talk about again and again. Best hope the run game shows up which for the first time since 2007 stands a glimmer of hope

[BOTT]

43 minutes ago, will426 said:

Forget scaring people lets just win and we've won with worse squads than this

I'm not saying they aren't going to win games, but they need more talent on the roster.

[WoolMagnet]

So, let me get this right.

our defense went from looking good to horrible all because we lost Art Jones for 4 games but, at the same time, we should dump him because we won't have him for 4 games?

oh ok, now I understand.......... I guess?

[Dark Superman]

Langford, Jones, Anderson, Parry and the kid we drafted in the fourth round.

I think we'll be fine.

[backshoulderfade]

We are a breakout pass rusher away from a viable playoff defense. That is a huge if though.

[will426]

as of now art jones is just a body to me. Has been useless since being signed and is continuing to remain useless even when he comes back id put him behind everyone to make him earn playing time 

[WoolMagnet]

There may be a chance to bring in help when teams make cuts.  There may be some serviceable vets available.  Especially this year which was supposed to be a good draft year for DL.

The uncertainty of Anderson and Jones (health) is concerning, but if healthy across the board, I kinda am optimistic about this DL.

But who really knows, we thought that at WR last year too.

depth is the greatest concern.  But we have to remember the roster turnover that has taken place since about 2012.  It doesn't happen overnight unfortunately.

[AKB]

Im worried but not scared.

[Gavin]

If we get the run game going and make more of an effort to run the ball that will help some.....Otherwise I'm expecting a 20th or worse defense yards per game average

[MacDee1975]

I'm not with you at all, OP.

 

First of all, I was expecting Art Jones to be cut regardless before this season started.  So in my eyes, no loss at all.

 

There is talent and potential decent depth at virtually every defensive position, the likes we haven't seen around these parts in a while.

 

No juggernaut, mind you, but easily enough to be a defense in the top half of the league.

 

 

[BOTT]

18 minutes ago, MacDee1975 said:

I'm not with you at all, OP.

 

First of all, I was expecting Art Jones to be cut regardless before this season started.  So in my eyes, no loss at all.

 

There is talent and potential decent depth at virtually every defensive position, the likes we haven't seen around these parts in a while.

 

No juggernaut, mind you, but easily enough to be a defense in the top half of the league.

 

 

Talent and depth at every position?  You can't be talking about the Colts....

[AKB]

1 hour ago, MacDee1975 said:

I'm not with you at all, OP.

 

First of all, I was expecting Art Jones to be cut regardless before this season started.  So in my eyes, no loss at all.

 

There is talent and potential decent depth at virtually every defensive position, the likes we haven't seen around these parts in a while.

 

No juggernaut, mind you, but easily enough to be a defense in the top half of the league.

 

 

What reason would they have possibly cut jones before the season?...............

 

 

Please explain.

[twfish]

4 minutes ago, AustinnKaine said:

What reason would they have possibly cut jones before the season?...............

 

 

Please explain.

Injuries, I'd put money down that if he would not have taken a pay cut he wouldn't be on the roster. We have a lot of youth with potential at the position so no reason to cut one of them just so he can get injured. 2 straight seasons with injuries and now 4 game suspension. Wouldn't be surprised if he's cut mid way through tc as is

[AKB]

Just now, twfish said:

Injuries, I'd put money down that if he would not have taken a pay cut he wouldn't be on the roster. We have a lot of youth with potential at the position so no reason to cut one of them just so he can get injured. 2 straight seasons with injuries and now 4 game suspension. Wouldn't be surprised if he's cut mid way through tc as is

He said he thought Jones would be cut 'REGARDLESS' before the season starts. 

 

So what you are saying doesn't apply.

[twfish]

10 minutes ago, AustinnKaine said:

He said he thought Jones would be cut 'REGARDLESS' before the season starts. 

 

So what you are saying doesn't apply.

I just gave the reasons why he would be cut so it does apply.... but okay...

[krunk]

I doubt they cut Art Jones this season

[AKB]

3 minutes ago, twfish said:

I just gave the reasons why he would be cut so it does apply.... but okay...

And those reasons aren't valid. They wouldn't have restructured if he was going to be cut. I don't think that's a complicated concept to comprehend.

 

Now the PED violation is a different story. I was speaking on his statement that Jones was going to be cut before the beginning of the season REGARDLESS of anything. Which just isn't plausible. 

[krunk]

I just doubt they cut him this season at this juncture unless he just puts up a poor showing in the preseason I guess.   He's a pretty good player if he's able to play.  Who else would we be bringing in that already knows the defense that's on his talent level unless we are talking swinging some type of trade or giving up a draft pick like we did with Sio Moore?  With the 4 game suspension I think there's a very strong chance he'll be healthy.   If he's injured for a significant amount of time beyond that I'd say that's a wrap on his career with the Colts from that point.  We'll see I guess.

[MacDee1975]

9 hours ago, AustinnKaine said:

What reason would they have possibly cut jones before the season?...............

 

 

Please explain.

 

What reason?  Take your pick:

 

He's never healthy, he will never be the player he was before 2 major injuries, he's 30, we have depth at that position now.

 

Completely and totally plausible.  You don't think anyone has ever been cut after restructuring their contracts?  lol

[Steamboat_Shaun]

As much as I'd love to have the Broncos defense from last year, it's just not happening, so daydreaming and wishing does none of us any good.

 

IMO, a middle of the pack defense (and I think they'll be a little better than middle of the pack) will be good enough to complement this offense, assuming Luck & Co have the bounce back year I'm anticipating. Sustaining drives and scoring points will go a long way to keep the D fresh and put them in the best position to attack and be aggressive. That's not something that was present last year, and the defense suffered as a result.

[Superman]

I don't expect the defense to be good this season. They might have their games here and there, but for the most part, I think the defense will be questionable all year.

 

That has little to do with losing Art Jones, though. I didn't expect him to play much anyways, if he even made the roster. Now he's out for a month, and his roster spot is in danger again.

 

Henry Anderson is likely to miss the beginning of the season. And even if/when he comes back, I would expect him to be less than 100% in effectiveness, and playing a limited role. His year is 2017, unfortunately. The team needs to protect him to make sure he doesn't have an avoidable setback.

 

The main problem is pass rush, and that's either going to come from Mathis and the rest of the rotation, or it won't come at all. My money is on the latter, because I just don't believe we have the horses, but I hope I'm proved wrong. Trevor Bates could be interesting in camp... I've seen a little of his tape from Maine, and he stands out, albeit against inferior competition. Ridgeway might bring some interior penetration.

 

I think the secondary will be fine, I'm looking forward to Geathers starting, and I think Robinson is an improvement on Toler. I'm not thrilled with the ILBs, especially in coverage, but if Sio Moore gets a shot, I think he can be better than Freeman was. Let's hope he's healthy.

 

I also expect the coaching to be better. Manusky wasn't bad, but he didn't have any special qualities that could help his players excel. Other position coaches will hopefully be improvements as well. 

 

In all, I think the defense will have an aggregate high teens to low 20s rank, taking points, yards, turnovers, etc., into consideration. Anything better than that will be a pleasant surprise.

[Gavin]

Off topic but the Vikings just tweeted they placed Phil Loadholt on the Reserve/Retired list

[RollerColt]

I'm looking for the defense to be average. And, that's okay with me. The offense, per usual, will need to take over the games and work the clock. The key will be giving the rookies and oldies rest to make plays. I agree with Sups, Anderson needs to get back into this thing slowly. We will need him big time for years to come. No sense in overdoing it at the start of the season.

[krunk]

38 minutes ago, Superman said:

I don't expect the defense to be good this season. They might have their games here and there, but for the most part, I think the defense will be questionable all year.

 

That has little to do with losing Art Jones, though. I didn't expect him to play much anyways, if he even made the roster. Now he's out for a month, and his roster spot is in danger again.

 

Henry Anderson is likely to miss the beginning of the season. And even if/when he comes back, I would expect him to be less than 100% in effectiveness, and playing a limited role. His year is 2017, unfortunately. The team needs to protect him to make sure he doesn't have an avoidable setback.

 

The main problem is pass rush, and that's either going to come from Mathis and the rest of the rotation, or it won't come at all. My money is on the latter, because I just don't believe we have the horses, but I hope I'm proved wrong. Trevor Bates could be interesting in camp... I've seen a little of his tape from Maine, and he stands out, albeit against inferior competition. Ridgeway might bring some interior penetration.

 

I think the secondary will be fine, I'm looking forward to Geathers starting, and I think Robinson is an improvement on Toler. I'm not thrilled with the ILBs, especially in coverage, but if Sio Moore gets a shot, I think he can be better than Freeman was. Let's hope he's healthy.

 

I also expect the coaching to be better. Manusky wasn't bad, but he didn't have any special qualities that could help his players excel. Other position coaches will hopefully be improvements as well. 

 

In all, I think the defense will have an aggregate high teens to low 20s rank, taking points, yards, turnovers, etc., into consideration. Anything better than that will be a pleasant surprise.

What's your outlook on Maggitt?

[Superman]

13 minutes ago, krunk said:

What's your outlook on Maggitt?

 

No outlook from me. I watched a couple videos, didn't take notes or try to grade/scout what I saw, just wanted to see what he looked like. I wasn't impressed, but I didn't think he was bad. I have him as a camp guy who won't stick around past final cuts. 

 

He struck me as a typical Grigson/Pagano pass rusher, which isn't a good thing. Some quickness and burst, but not agile and fluid, stiff, no real moves, no range in space, high effort, plays hard. Smaller, slightly more athletic Werner, with more motor. I hope I'm wrong.