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im not sure if I want to support football anymore...


bap1331

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After watching the movie concussion, it makes it hard to support football. We've seen a rise of young players going into retirement and I think this may be the sole reason they are retiring early but not saying it.

 

Is cte or brain damage risk really worth your health not only for themselves but for their family? It's not something happening only in football but boxing, wrestling, and soon to be ufc (it's a relatively new sport not around long enough to see the effects)

 

The NFL will do anything to say it isn't a serious problem but that mostly has to do with putting money into their pockets.

 

What were your thoughts after watching the movie concussion? I thought it was a great movie to bring awareness and now I see why Goodell is doing everything in his power to make football a safer sport but there is so much you can do but you can't prevent repeated hits.

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1 hour ago, bap1331 said:

After watching the movie concussion, it makes it hard to support football. We've seen a rise of young players going into retirement and I think this may be the sole reason they are retiring early but not saying it.

 

Is cte or brain damage risk really worth your health not only for themselves but for their family? It's not something happening only in football but boxing, wrestling, and soon to be ufc (it's a relatively new sport not around long enough to see the effects)

 

The NFL will do anything to say it isn't a serious problem but that mostly has to do with putting money into their pockets.

 

What were your thoughts after watching the movie concussion? I thought it was a great movie to bring awareness and now I see why Goodell is doing everything in his power to make football a safer sport but there is so much you can do but you can't prevent repeated hits.

I think football will change dramatically in the next 15 years. Contact will be greatly reduced. I find it difficult to have the same passion for the game after seeing the lives of so many men that I admired come to such tragic ends.

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I haven't seen the movie personally, but I think there's more to the early retirements than simply concussion awareness. I believe the increasing prevalence of Internet access (esp. with cellphones) means it's easier than ever for someone to learn a new hobby for free in the comfort of their own living room. If I wanted to learn gardening (heaven forbid), I could go to YouTube, search up instructional videos, read non-bias authentic reviews on gardening products, post on gardening forums, download e-books, and watch live gardening videos on video streaming sites. I could even make some money off advertisements and sponsors, if I'm good enough.

Check out Walter Thurmond -- he's retiring and plans to go into video/directing.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000665832/article/walter-thurmond-28-retiring-after-six-nfl-seasons

In that clip, the guy speaking for Walter mentions this is a trend we will start seeing -- young guys who spend a few years in the NFL, grab a few millions, then run with it to pursue a new passion. It's a scary slope and NFL scouts will have to take a hard look at 1st round young prospects to figure out if they really want to play football or if they're in it for quick cash.

We're also seeing similar trends in millennials across the board -- young people who bounce from job to job. There's something about today's youth where they're more open to trying new things than content like their forefathers. Show me a millennial who is prepared to work 15+ years for a company; it's a rare thing! Hell, I worked 3.5 years at Burger King and my friends always ask me how I didn't go crazy (I'm 30 btw).

As for concussions, there's a lot of jobs that have risk involved. These guys get paid millions. They're athletes. It goes with the territory, so I don't mean to sound cruel but I could care less about concussion awareness. There are a lot more dangerous jobs out there that pay far less.

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1 hour ago, ReMeDy said:

I haven't seen the movie personally, but I think there's more to the early retirements than simply concussion awareness. I believe the increasing prevalence of Internet access (esp. with cellphones) means it's easier than ever for someone to learn a new hobby for free in the comfort of their own living room. If I wanted to learn gardening (heaven forbid), I could go to YouTube, search up instructional videos, read non-bias authentic reviews on gardening products, post on gardening forums, download e-books, and watch live gardening videos on video streaming sites. I could even make some money off advertisements and sponsors, if I'm good enough.

Check out Walter Thurmond -- he's retiring and plans to go into video/directing.
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000665832/article/walter-thurmond-28-retiring-after-six-nfl-seasons

In that clip, the guy speaking for Walter mentions this is a trend we will start seeing -- young guys who spend a few years in the NFL, grab a few millions, then run with it to pursue a new passion. It's a scary slope and NFL scouts will have to take a hard look at 1st round young prospects to figure out if they really want to play football or if they're in it for quick cash.

We're also seeing similar trends in millennials across the board -- young people who bounce from job to job. There's something about today's youth where they're more open to trying new things than content like their forefathers. Show me a millennial who is prepared to work 15+ years for a company; it's a rare thing! Hell, I worked 3.5 years at Burger King and my friends always ask me how I didn't go crazy (I'm 30 btw).

As for concussions, there's a lot of jobs that have risk involved. These guys get paid millions. They're athletes. It goes with the territory, so I don't mean to sound cruel but I could care less about concussion awareness. There are a lot more dangerous jobs out there that pay far less.

Most people don't think in the terms of how hard it is to be a NFL player. They see the players on game day and then go about their lives. They don't think about most of these active players cant hardly even walk after game day. They don't feel the pain. Sitting with most of your body in ice water. The competition of someone taking your job away for a few reasons. Most don't think about the dark side of football. It wouldn't be surprising to see what you are talking about being more common in the future. Grab yourself a few million and hit the road. Those smart enough to make smart investments would never have to work like they did to reach the NFL.

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1 hour ago, crazycolt1 said:

It wouldn't be surprising to see what you are talking about being more common in the future. Grab yourself a few million and hit the road.

 

Yea with a few million, hell, I could retire. Unless I'm Jamarcus Russell, then I'm looking to play again because football is the only skill I know! Football isn't exactly a skill that transfers over to most other careers, lol.

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4 hours ago, ReMeDy said:

 

Yea with a few million, hell, I could retire. Unless I'm Jamarcus Russell, then I'm looking to play again because football is the only skill I know! Football isn't exactly a skill that transfers over to most other careers, lol.

 

Unless it comes with leadership skills and work ethic intrinsic in you that you can apply to other jobs easily. However, if you have those leadership skills and work ethic to go with your football skills, there is a great chance you succeed as QB in the NFL and you probably don't leave. But if you don't have the football skills but have the other skills, yes, like Steve Miller's band sang about Billy Joe and Bobby Sue "Go on, take the money and run". :)

 

I am certain the NFL owners and rules will adapt, football will still be there but in a diluted fashion.

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I'll admit that after seeing that movie it really makes me question how I can support the nfl given their lack of cooperation and their lack of resources they put into the research to protect players or at the very least send them through a full on course with the risks involved. Sure a player you would assume knows the risks but I also acknowledge this problem starts way before they reach the NFL. 

 

 I think it's more a problem of public concern and awareness at an age that's appropriate before they enter football. Again this isnt all on the NFL but without a doubt they have the ability to raise the awareness and fund research more  then any other organization. 

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It may be a good idea to check into the facts before deciding on something like that.  

 

The movie's producers have no penalties for not telling the truth and it's very clear that the intention of the movie was a hit piece on the NFL.

 

I'm not saying the NFL is blameless. . . But I would check all the facts and not necessarily just trust some hit piece on the NFL.

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3 minutes ago, Valpo2004 said:

It may be a good idea to check into the facts before deciding on something like that.  

 

The movie's producers have no penalties for not telling the truth and it's very clear that the intention of the movie was a hit piece on the NFL.

 

I'm not saying the NFL is blameless. . . But I would check all the facts and not necessarily just trust some hit piece on the NFL.

I have not seen the movie but I was thinking the same thing. I am not too sure if a movie script that is written to sell tickets shows an unbiased view of reality. We all pretty much know about the past of the NFL and it's attempts to circumvent a lot of facts concerning the effects if concussions. But IMO things have changed a lot since those days. Rules have been made to protect players and safety is kept in mind as much as possible. It is a very violent game to say the least. There is only so much the NFL can do without effecting the game where people lose interest.

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I'm not holding the NFL responsible for debilitating injuries in this era. In the 60,70 and 80's maybe there was more they could have done but did we posses the technology back then? Idk. In the 2000+ years, no, these issues were well known and the history of the game has been presented and technology has continued to evolve to improve the safety of the players.

 

These kids know full well what risks are present in playing such an impact sport and yet they choose to go play college ball in hopes of a multi million dollar NFL contract regardless of the risks. Not to get political at all but soldiers sign up for the armed forces knowing they could get killed in action or severely injured yet they choose that risk and I don't hear many saying we should get rid of the armed forces. These NFL players get paid a lot of money to take on these risks of permanent disability by playing the game and it's 100% by their choice. Nobody forces them to risk their health, they want the life and money that football provides even knowing the risks and knowing the history of what's occurred to former players in the NFL over time. No, I don't have much sympathy for them making their personal choice to risk it for money. 

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Concussion is about honesty and awareness.  If we're all honest about football, and make potential players fully aware of possible consequences, then you should still fully support the sport of football.

 

A lot of people associated with the NFL, and football in general, made a lot of very bad decisions to try and white-wash the consequences of playing football in the last 50 years.  In today's more progressive society, we can be honest about football, and there are still people that will want to play.

 

People sign up for the military for a paycheck despite the risks.  People work insanely dangerous jobs for a big paycheck, despite the risks.  People will ALWAYS play professional sports for a HUGE paycheck, despite the risks.

 

We just have to be honest about the risks, and make sure athletes are aware of the consequences.

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13 hours ago, Lucky Colts Fan said:

Concussion is about honesty and awareness.  If we're all honest about football, and make potential players fully aware of possible consequences, then you should still fully support the sport of football.

 

A lot of people associated with the NFL, and football in general, made a lot of very bad decisions to try and white-wash the consequences of playing football in the last 50 years.  In today's more progressive society, we can be honest about football, and there are still people that will want to play.

 

People sign up for the military for a paycheck despite the risks.  People work insanely dangerous jobs for a big paycheck, despite the risks.  People will ALWAYS play professional sports for a HUGE paycheck, despite the risks.

 

We just have to be honest about the risks, and make sure athletes are aware of the consequences.

 

That's very true. . . there are a lot of dangerous occupations out there that can mess you up for life and most of those occupations don't pay $400,000 a year minimum salary.

 

 

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No sympathy for players who have entered the NFL in the past few years as others have said the players know the risk and choose to take that risk for the paycheck. 

 

Even prior to all the current medical info common sense should have told athletes that exposing your body to the level of frequent abuse common in the NFL (and other contact sports) could potentially result in future health issues... So I also have very little sympathy for players from prior generations. 

 

There could be multiple in game deaths each year, and I have no doubt there would still be no shortage of players willing to take the risk for the money; so why should anyone feel guilty about watching and enjoying the NFL or any other dangerous sport. 

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On ‎5‎/‎31‎/‎2016 at 11:40 PM, bap1331 said:

After watching the movie concussion, it makes it hard to support football. We've seen a rise of young players going into retirement and I think this may be the sole reason they are retiring early but not saying it.

 

Is cte or brain damage risk really worth your health not only for themselves but for their family? It's not something happening only in football but boxing, wrestling, and soon to be ufc (it's a relatively new sport not around long enough to see the effects)

 

The NFL will do anything to say it isn't a serious problem but that mostly has to do with putting money into their pockets.

 

What were your thoughts after watching the movie concussion? I thought it was a great movie to bring awareness and now I see why Goodell is doing everything in his power to make football a safer sport but there is so much you can do but you can't prevent repeated hits.

Its tough but they know what they are getting themselves into when they signed up for football.

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Are you boycotting zoos too because a arguably poor parent doesn't hold onto their child near a gorilla pen.

these are young men paid TOO MUCH money to play a game.  They have other options (including pan-handling or frying burgers as do we all.

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1 hour ago, BOTT said:

yeah, don't worry about coal miners, construction workers, roughnecks, etc....worry about the professional athlete.

 

Well they're not constantly getting hit in the head and they have safety precautions to make sure they don't get hurt. Football players have no choice.

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5 hours ago, WoolMagnet said:

Are you boycotting zoos too because a arguably poor parent doesn't hold onto their child near a gorilla pen.

these are young men paid TOO MUCH money to play a game.  They have other options (including pan-handling or frying burgers as do we all.

 

Well then the pan handling or frying burgers guy should work harder to be that athlete or wealthy guy. It's their choice to live that lifestyle. You think these athletes are handed these jobs?

 

There is a 1 in a million chance your child grows up to be an athlete. Most of them take risks and fail. It's not easy to get to that point in the first place.

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8 hours ago, jameszeigler834 said:

Its tough but they know what they are getting themselves into when they signed up for football.

 

Well, if you saw the movie, cte wasn't discovered until 2002. So relatively it's new and the nfl has done everything to cover it up and say it's not true. So technically unless your child was born in 2002, these guys don't know what they signed up for and the risks.

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Just now, bap1331 said:

 

Well then the pan handling or frying burgers guy should work harder to be that athlete or wealthy guy. It's their choice to live that lifestyle. You think these athletes are handed these jobs?

 

There is a 1 in a million chance your child grows up to be an athlete. Most of them take risks and fail. It's not easy to get to that point in the first place.

Thats kinda my point. I wasn't knocking pan-handlers or fry cooks.

we all have the right to choose our own path.  Whether or not it works out, is an entirely different issue.

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Another odd thing, imo, is the restrictions on practicing in pads, how much you can hit in practife, etc.

practice makes "perfect", as we've heard, so wouldn't more PROPER tackling practice make for more perfect (safer) tackling and hits?

sometimes the NFL really seems to contradict what it states its goals are.

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10 hours ago, bap1331 said:

 

Well, if you saw the movie, cte wasn't discovered until 2002. So relatively it's new and the nfl has done everything to cover it up and say it's not true. So technically unless your child was born in 2002, these guys don't know what they signed up for and the risks.

What I am saying here is it s a violent sport it always has been that will never change.

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Its rough but not nearly the most dangerous job on the planet. Life is a risk. Concussions can happen at anytime as can CTE. You can get them just tripping over your own feet or slipping in the bathtub and bumping your head and not know you have it. Also plenty actually come away after their football careers with little wear and tear or long-term symptoms

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7 minutes ago, Gavin said:

Its rough but not nearly the most dangerous job on the planet. Life is a risk. Concussions can happen at anytime as can CTE. You can get them just tripping over your own feet or slipping in the bathtub and bumping your head and not know you have it. Also plenty actually come away after their football careers with little wear and tear or long-term symptoms

 

I don't think it's nearly as simple as you make it out to be.

 

CTE is not typically thought of to be the result of one incident.     So, it's not a case, of tripping, falling and hitting your head on something.

 

It's thought to happen when your head is being used over and over and over again in the same manner.    So, lineman blocking the guy in front of them in practice, day after day,  and then in games, week after week.    So they have a large number of hits again and again on pretty much the same spot on the brain.

 

THAT's cte.....

 

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13 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't think it's nearly as simple as you make it out to be.

 

CTE is not typically thought of to be the result of one incident.     So, it's not a case, of tripping, falling and hitting your head on something.

 

It's thought to happen when your head is being used over and over and over again in the same manner.    So, lineman blocking the guy in front of them in practice, day after day,  and then in games, week after week.    So they have a large number of hits again and again on pretty much the same spot on the brain.

 

THAT's cte.....

 

Right. That's certainly one way CTE can happen. No question about that. repetitive blows to the head but a single severe blow to the head can do it to. People that have seizures have been reported get CTE as well. I dont think its just about the number of blows one takes to the head either but the impact of the blow itself.

 

One can get punch drunk from one single hard blow to the head and have symptoms from that blow much later. Military personnel have been diagnosed with it, baseball players. I think its much more about the force of the blow than the number of blows BUT both I believe play a part

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1 hour ago, Gavin said:

Its rough but not nearly the most dangerous job on the planet. Life is a risk. Concussions can happen at anytime as can CTE. You can get them just tripping over your own feet or slipping in the bathtub and bumping your head and not know you have it. Also plenty actually come away after their football careers with little wear and tear or long-term symptoms

 

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't think it's nearly as simple as you make it out to be.

 

CTE is not typically thought of to be the result of one incident.     So, it's not a case, of tripping, falling and hitting your head on something.

 

It's thought to happen when your head is being used over and over and over again in the same manner.    So, lineman blocking the guy in front of them in practice, day after day,  and then in games, week after week.    So they have a large number of hits again and again on pretty much the same spot on the brain.

 

THAT's cte.....

 

 

52 minutes ago, Gavin said:

Right. That's certainly one way CTE can happen. No question about that. repetitive blows to the head but a single severe blow to the head can do it to. People that have seizures have been reported get CTE as well. I dont think its just about the number of blows one takes to the head either but the impact of the blow itself.

 

One can get punch drunk from one single hard blow to the head and have symptoms from that blow much later. Military personnel have been diagnosed with it, baseball players. I think its much more about the force of the blow than the number of blows BUT both I believe play a part

 

Guys, the "C" in CTE stands for "chronic".  Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy means repeated brain damage.  One bad hit to the head can cause a concussion, but it can't cause CTE.  Prolonged head trauma is CTE.  If I understand it correctly, you don't even have to suffer a concussion, but just suffer from repeated damage to the brain due to hits to the head.

 

I think the average person suffers at least one concussion in their lifetime, but not many people suffer repeated hits to the head in their life, much less in their profession.  NFLers and boxers are a rare breed, and research on their brains is proving it.  It takes a certain amount of cajones to risk your brain for a paycheck.

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23 minutes ago, Lucky Colts Fan said:

 

 

 

Guys, the "C" in CTE stands for "chronic".  Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy means repeated brain damage.  One bad hit to the head can cause a concussion, but it can't cause CTE.  Prolonged head trauma is CTE.  If I understand it correctly, you don't even have to suffer a concussion, but just suffer from repeated damage to the brain due to hits to the head.

 

I think the average person suffers at least one concussion in their lifetime, but not many people suffer repeated hits to the head in their life, much less in their profession.  NFLers and boxers are a rare breed, and research on their brains is proving it.  It takes a certain amount of cajones to risk your brain for a paycheck.

 

Thank you, Lucky Colts Fan.

 

I appreciate you stepping in and clarifying things.     At least,  you did for me.

 

Whether you did for our other friend is anyone's guess.......

 

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2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't think it's nearly as simple as you make it out to be.

 

CTE is not typically thought of to be the result of one incident.     So, it's not a case, of tripping, falling and hitting your head on something.

 

It's thought to happen when your head is being used over and over and over again in the same manner.    So, lineman blocking the guy in front of them in practice, day after day,  and then in games, week after week.    So they have a large number of hits again and again on pretty much the same spot on the brain.

 

THAT's cte.....

 

 

Yeah, I don't know how many concussions Mike Webster had, but he took a lot of blows to the head.  In older NFL films, you see a lot of OLinemen using a "headbutt" move to try and block guys.  May not have been knocked out, but they got knocked in the head over, and over, and over...

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19 hours ago, bap1331 said:

 

Well, if you saw the movie, cte wasn't discovered until 2002. So relatively it's new and the nfl has done everything to cover it up and say it's not true. So technically unless your child was born in 2002, these guys don't know what they signed up for and the risks.

What about those with black lung from the mines, or soldiers suffering from exposure to napalm, or those with mesothelioma from working around asbestos? This is nothing new.  Its not known until its known.

what price do you, me, or anyone put on their health.  To some its worth the risk and money, to others, not so much:

the fact remains we all have our own choices to make.  Good , bad, or indifferent.

i would suspect we will see an increase in players making good money for a few years, and retiring sooner.  Now that it is more widely known, its up to the player to make that choice:. They can always study a little harder (novel concept, i know) while they ar given a free education for playing a game. Then they have opportunities for "normal" work like the rest of us.  Maybe they should think about getting a degree instead of coming out early and/or not completing requirements for graduation:

yes, i feel bad for those who didn't know, but not so much now:

inalso read a study where concussions are just as frequent in soccer, but because we in the states don't like soccer, its not discussed.

 

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34 minutes ago, Lucky Colts Fan said:

 

 

 

Guys, the "C" in CTE stands for "chronic".  Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy means repeated brain damage.  One bad hit to the head can cause a concussion, but it can't cause CTE.  Prolonged head trauma is CTE.  If I understand it correctly, you don't even have to suffer a concussion, but just suffer from repeated damage to the brain due to hits to the head.

 

I think the average person suffers at least one concussion in their lifetime, but not many people suffer repeated hits to the head in their life, much less in their profession.  NFLers and boxers are a rare breed, and research on their brains is proving it.  It takes a certain amount of cajones to risk your brain for a paycheck.

 

That is correct. I was about to write just that. It is the repeated brain trauma that causes CTE, not one or two incidents of head injury. 

 

In addition to boxers, and football players, CTE has been found in soccer players. When soccer players "head" the ball repeatedly, as they do in practice, they are getting repetitive blows to their head.

 

This is a good read on the subject:

 

http://www.newyorker.com/news/sporting-scene/cost-header

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On ‎6‎/‎1‎/‎2016 at 3:50 AM, crazycolt1 said:

Most people don't think in the terms of how hard it is to be a NFL player. They see the players on game day and then go about their lives. They don't think about most of these active players cant hardly even walk after game day. They don't feel the pain. Sitting with most of your body in ice water. The competition of someone taking your job away for a few reasons. Most don't think about the dark side of football. It wouldn't be surprising to see what you are talking about being more common in the future. Grab yourself a few million and hit the road. Those smart enough to make smart investments would never have to work like they did to reach the NFL.

 

Yeah, a lot of people minimalize the "problems" NFL players have because they get to "play a game for a living".  But when it becomes a profession for these guys, and a very demanding profession, mentally, emotionally, and especially physically, it might not be as "fun" as it is for the rest of us goofing around in the backyard.

 

These guys have to take that "game" as seriously as the rest of us take our jobs.  If they don't "sacrifice" their bodies on a regular basis, they don't get a paycheck.  They are literally risking their future health for money, right now.

 

It's a shame, but if they are fully aware going in, and they sign the dotted line, they are going to make enough money to justify the physical consequences.

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The film was a hit piece, which not only attempted to defame the league, but also exploited the NFL's brand to drive revenue. 

 

You know what happens when Indycar drivers hit their heads?  The contents get rearranged.  What acronym do they use for that?

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33 minutes ago, Clem-Dog said:

The film was a hit piece, which not only attempted to defame the league, but also exploited the NFL's brand to drive revenue. 

 

You know what happens when Indycar drivers hit their heads?  The contents get rearranged.  What acronym do they use for that?

 

The race car comparison is apples and oranges.  Nobody can deny the dangers of racing a car at 100+ mph.  That isn't a scenario of "prolonged trauma over time", that's a scenario of "one fatal impact"...

 

The NFL tried to deny the dangers of football.

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41 minutes ago, Clem-Dog said:

The film was a hit piece, which not only attempted to defame the league, but also exploited the NFL's brand to drive revenue. 

 

You know what happens when Indycar drivers hit their heads?  The contents get rearranged.  What acronym do they use for that?

 

DOA

 

Dead    On     Arrival

 

 

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