Earl Okine

[Superman]

8 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

That's one of the things that makes me so angry. When you have a franchise QB like Andrew Luck you don't screw around and try to do some stupid 3 year plan. That's just dumb to put it simply. You go out and load up and go all in every year. The whole thing literally makes zero sense to me. But a lot of people on here just want to buy into this "plan" that Grigson has, and when somebody like myself questions it, or calls it stupid they wanna get all tore up and say this or that and call me out, etc. I mean come on guys. Wake up. With a different GM we could be sitting where Seattle is right now. Loaded at every position. But the big question is this. Why worry about 5 years from now when you could win now and cross that bridge when you get there? If we draft well and have Andrew Luck we're gonna be set in 5 years anyway. Why waste away the first 5 years of his career trying to build piece by piece? In other words. Why wait when you can have it now, and not to mention have it longer? What we're doing is giving ourselves a little 5-6 year window to win a SB or 2. Ridiculous.

 

Good heavens.

 

Maybe your post would have a chance of not being totally ridiculous if there was no salary cap and/or no guaranteed money on big contracts. But there is a salary cap, and big contracts do have guaranteed money.

 

Therefore, your post totally misses the mark.

 

This is not a defense of Grigson. But it doesn't take a great GM to know that you can't just "load up and go all in every year." That's just wild talk, and it makes no sense.

[COLTS449]

23 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

Good heavens.

 

Maybe your post would have a chance of not being totally ridiculous if there was no salary cap and/or no guaranteed money on big contracts. But there is a salary cap, and big contracts do have guaranteed money.

 

Therefore, your post totally misses the mark.

 

This is not a defense of Grigson. But it doesn't take a great GM to know that you can't just "load up and go all in every year." That's just wild talk, and it makes no sense.

 

I'm not talking about loading up as in what the Giants just did. I'm talking about trying to fill every major hole within the budget. I mean I know we couldn't sign 5-6 prime time players each offseason, but there was no reason whatsoever why we couldn't have signed another good free agent or 2. Like re-signing Freeman and a guy like Bruce Irvin could have made a major difference, not drafting a project player in the 2nd could have made a major difference. The whole thought of not trying to be a Super Bowl contender this year really bothers me. No it infuriates me to be honest. I feel we're throwing away several years of Luck's career basically. But yeah, Honestly think with the right pieces we could have been real Super Bowl contenders. We did address the OL. But had we just brought in a pass rusher who could give us around 10 sacks I think that could have been the difference in winning a few playoff games or barley making the playoffs. I just love my team Supe, and every offseason I'm so excited thinking we're gonna take that next big step and be a dominant team and every year I'm disappointed.

[COLTS449]

20 minutes ago, jim scheurich said:

I agree with "why wait for a SB run". If Luck can stay healthy and Gore has some running room and health as well, colts could make some noise. How many years did Manning have a shaky Defense?

 

What's so funny is that people want to say we went all in last year with Gore, Dre, Cole, Langford, Herremans, etc. But all we did was sign a bunch of older guys on the decline. LOL that's not going all in. That's just being incompetent.

[jim scheurich]

2 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

What's so funny is that people want to say we went all in last year with Gore, Dre, Cole, Langford, Herremans, etc. But all we did was sign a bunch of older guys on the decline. LOL that's not going all in. That's just being incompetent.

U forgot Andre...Too many new faces. Need some consistency!

[jim scheurich]

Just now, jim scheurich said:

U forgot Andre...Too many new faces. Need some consistency!

My bad I see Dre up there!

[krunk]

34 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

Man. I mean a guy like Mingo has superstar caliber talent. He just hasn't tapped into it. Remember a guy named Vontae Davis? Don't you wish we had kept some UDFA to start at CB instead of trading for Vontae? Look at Jerry Hughes. What he's done in Buffalo. I mean a lot of times those super skilled guys go to a new team and realize their potential. You know just as well as I do that the chances of one of those UDFA's becoming a dominant pass rusher is slim to none.

Vontae was still good in Miami. He never lost that, Philbin just didn't like the way he went about his business as a professional so he traded him to make a statement.  Mingo has not shown anything to this point enough for somebody to want to trade for him.  You can sit back and wait long enough and he'll probably get cut anyway.  I ain't even that sure about Hughes anymore now that Rex is there with the 3-4.  All Hughes sack numbers went down quite a bit last year.  I can see where you are coming from about UDFA, or 7th rounders but they do have talent and please believe the coaches are on the look out for whoever else would improve the team so don't be so impatient.  Let the process work itself out just like it did when you were looking for us to sign a corner in FA.  We'll get there!  All we need is 1 guy to hit from those UDFA/7th rounders and maybe somebody else we add to the mix and we'll be alright. They ain't done making moves so sit back and see what they put together.  The offense should be able to put up more points this year and that in itself will give us way more pass rushing opportunities than we had last year.  Let the full picture come together before you get frustrated cuz.  Have some faith bro!

[krunk]

44 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

Man. I mean a guy like Mingo has superstar caliber talent. He just hasn't tapped into it. Remember a guy named Vontae Davis? Don't you wish we had kept some UDFA to start at CB instead of trading for Vontae? Look at Jerry Hughes. What he's done in Buffalo. I mean a lot of times those super skilled guys go to a new team and realize their potential. You know just as well as I do that the chances of one of those UDFA's becoming a dominant pass rusher is slim to none.

 

Remember hall of famer John Randle was a UDFA so you just never know about things.  Give things a chance to play out.

[southwest1]

32 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

That's one of the things that makes me so angry. When you have a franchise QB like Andrew Luck you don't screw around and try to do some stupid 3 year plan. That's just dumb to put it simply. You go out and load up and go all in every year. The whole thing literally makes zero sense to me. But a lot of people on here just want to buy into this "plan" that Grigson has, and when somebody like myself questions it, or calls it stupid they wanna get all tore up and say this or that and call me out, etc. I mean come on guys. Wake up. With a different GM we could be sitting where Seattle is right now. Loaded at every position. But the big question is this. Why worry about 5 years from now when you could win now and cross that bridge when you get there? If we draft well and have Andrew Luck we're gonna be set in 5 years anyway. Why waste away the first 5 years of his career trying to build piece by piece? In other words. Why wait when you can have it now, and not to mention have it longer? What we're doing is giving ourselves a little 5-6 year window to win a SB or 2. Ridiculous.

I'm not gonna lie to ya C-449. There is a part of my psyche that agrees with you. HOF talent like Luck possesses is extremely rare & I'm not Grigson's biggest fan either & if he had been committed to giving Andrew help on the o-line faster starting in 2012 as opposed to drafting WRs or bringing in older vets like Andre Johnson we'd be better off. 

 

I get Superman's point about salary cap restrictions, but I get what you're driving too C-449, I want 2 SB rings within 8-10 yrs not 1 SB appearance within say 6 years. I get that no GM can have a stellar team at both offense & defense on any team given free agency & limited cap space once Andrew gets his monster contract, but a stout offensive line always travels well. I just wanted a draft like 2016 much earlier in Ryan's GM tenure I guess. 

 

When Luck got his lacerated kidney, I think the front office finally woke up. As in don't squander this superstar QB's talent any longer. Protect him & preserve him at all costs. 

 

[Superman]

14 minutes ago, COLTS449 said:

 

I'm not talking about loading up as in what the Giants just did. I'm talking about trying to fill every major hole within the budget. I mean I know we couldn't sign 5-6 prime time players each offseason, but there was no reason whatsoever why we couldn't have signed another good free agent or 2. Like re-signing Freeman and a guy like Bruce Irvin could have made a major difference, not drafting a project player in the 2nd could have made a major difference. The whole thought of not trying to be a Super Bowl contender this year really bothers me. No it infuriates me to be honest. I feel we're throwing away several years of Luck's career basically. But yeah, Honestly think with the right pieces we could have been real Super Bowl contenders. We did address the OL. But had we just brought in a pass rusher who could give us around 10 sacks I think that could have been the difference in winning a few playoff games or barley making the playoffs. I just love my team Supe, and every offseason I'm so excited thinking we're gonna take that next big step and be a dominant team and every year I'm disappointed.

 

SMH

 

I know you're just throwing ideas out there, so I don't mean to nitpick, but just as an exercise let's look at things for a minute. Bruce Irvin got $9.25m/year. He has 14 sacks over the last three seasons. Is he your 10 sack guy? Is he worth that money? His was one of the more reasonable free agent contracts, by the way. Olivier Vernon got twice as much. (Concession: Pernell McPhee would have been the best grab last offseason, for not that much more than we gave Trent Cole.)

 

Another nitpick: Jerrell Freeman was a cast-off CFL guy that no one took seriously. Four years later, you're acting like he's irreplaceable, and dumping on guys who come from similar backgrounds. If they found him, why can't they find the next him? (Concession: I'd have kept Freeman for that money, and cut Jackson.)

 

And I personally think you're just waaay off on TJ Green. It's cool that you have a different opinion of him, but you've determined already that he's a bad pick despite general consensus from draftniks and others being that he's actually a pretty good value. We want young defenders with a chance of being star guys, and he fits the bill. I think you should ease up on him in particular. Clark is a project player, Green can contribute right now. JMO

 

And overall, the bolded comments are just completely contrary to everything the staff has been saying since they took over. I don't know why you've decided that they are resigned to not being contenders in 2016, because they've said/done nothing to make anyone think that, unless you think that not going on a spending spree means they don't want to contend. After seeing the money that got thrown around this offseason, I'm glad the Colts didn't get involved. That doesn't mean they aren't trying to build the team the best they can.

 

This team went 6-3 without Luck. The major shortcomings on offense were Luck not playing well and the OL being bad. Let's assume Luck plays and plays better, and let's assume that the OL is better. No reason this team isn't able to win the division. Let's assume the coverage is better, with Toler replaced by Robinson and Vontae having a more 2014-ish season. And let's assume that some of these coaching changes pay off. No reason this team can't make a deep playoff run.

 

Yeah, there are flaws. Lack of a pass rush is a critical flaw, maybe fatal. But you've already thrown in the towel on this season, and it's early May. I don't know why you have decided that all is lost, but I don't get it.

[jim scheurich]

10 minutes ago, Superman said:

 

SMH

 

I know you're just throwing ideas out there, so I don't mean to nitpick, but just as an exercise let's look at things for a minute. Bruce Irvin got $9.25m/year. He has 14 sacks over the last three seasons. Is he your 10 sack guy? Is he worth that money? His was one of the more reasonable free agent contracts, by the way. Olivier Vernon got twice as much. (Concession: Pernell McPhee would have been the best grab last offseason, for not that much more than we gave Trent Cole.)

 

Another nitpick: Jerrell Freeman was a cast-off CFL guy that no one took seriously. Four years later, you're acting like he's irreplaceable, and dumping on guys who come from similar backgrounds. If they found him, why can't they find the next him? (Concession: I'd have kept Freeman for that money, and cut Jackson.)

 

And I personally think you're just waaay off on TJ Green. It's cool that you have a different opinion of him, but you've determined already that he's a bad pick despite general consensus from draftniks and others being that he's actually a pretty good value. We want young defenders with a chance of being star guys, and he fits the bill. I think you should ease up on him in particular. Clark is a project player, Green can contribute right now. JMO

 

And overall, the bolded comments are just completely contrary to everything the staff has been saying since they took over. I don't know why you've decided that they are resigned to not being contenders in 2016, because they've said/done nothing to make anyone think that, unless you think that not going on a spending spree means they don't want to contend. After seeing the money that got thrown around this offseason, I'm glad the Colts didn't get involved. That doesn't mean they aren't trying to build the team the best they can.

 

This team went 6-3 without Luck. The major shortcomings on offense were Luck not playing well and the OL being bad. Let's assume Luck plays and plays better, and let's assume that the OL is better. No reason this team isn't able to win the division. Let's assume the coverage is better, with Toler replaced by Robinson and Vontae having a more 2014-ish season. And let's assume that some of these coaching changes pay off. No reason this team can't make a deep playoff run.

 

Yeah, there are flaws. Lack of a pass rush is a critical flaw, maybe fatal. But you've already thrown in the towel on this season, and it's early May. I don't know why you have decided that all is lost, but I don't get it.

Never should have let freeman go.  hope your right about green, there were a lot of players on the board ranked way better than him. personally I don't like the pick.  As u stated above, lack of rush may be detrimental.

[Andrew Luck's Beard]

Julius Peppers has had double-digit sacks at 3-4 OLB for the Packers and is 6'7" and 287 pounds, very similar to Okine's size.

[Superman]

10 minutes ago, jim scheurich said:

Never should have let freeman go.  hope your right about green, there were a lot of players on the board ranked way better than him. personally I don't like the pick.  As u stated above, lack of rush may be detrimental.

 

Why can't Junior Sylvestre or Sio Moore replace Freeman? Seriously, go back and look at where Freeman came from. Cast off by Tennessee, went to Canada for three years, then the Colts grabbed him. By the way, he's a converted safety from a D2 school.

[Gavin]

3 hours ago, Superman said:

 

SMH

 

I know you're just throwing ideas out there, so I don't mean to nitpick, but just as an exercise let's look at things for a minute. Bruce Irvin got $9.25m/year. He has 14 sacks over the last three seasons. Is he your 10 sack guy? Is he worth that money? His was one of the more reasonable free agent contracts, by the way. Olivier Vernon got twice as much. (Concession: Pernell McPhee would have been the best grab last offseason, for not that much more than we gave Trent Cole.)

 

Another nitpick: Jerrell Freeman was a cast-off CFL guy that no one took seriously. Four years later, you're acting like he's irreplaceable, and dumping on guys who come from similar backgrounds. If they found him, why can't they find the next him? (Concession: I'd have kept Freeman for that money, and cut Jackson.)

 

And I personally think you're just waaay off on TJ Green. It's cool that you have a different opinion of him, but you've determined already that he's a bad pick despite general consensus from draftniks and others being that he's actually a pretty good value. We want young defenders with a chance of being star guys, and he fits the bill. I think you should ease up on him in particular. Clark is a project player, Green can contribute right now. JMO

 

And overall, the bolded comments are just completely contrary to everything the staff has been saying since they took over. I don't know why you've decided that they are resigned to not being contenders in 2016, because they've said/done nothing to make anyone think that, unless you think that not going on a spending spree means they don't want to contend. After seeing the money that got thrown around this offseason, I'm glad the Colts didn't get involved. That doesn't mean they aren't trying to build the team the best they can.

 

This team went 6-3 without Luck. The major shortcomings on offense were Luck not playing well and the OL being bad. Let's assume Luck plays and plays better, and let's assume that the OL is better. No reason this team isn't able to win the division. Let's assume the coverage is better, with Toler replaced by Robinson and Vontae having a more 2014-ish season. And let's assume that some of these coaching changes pay off. No reason this team can't make a deep playoff run.

 

Yeah, there are flaws. Lack of a pass rush is a critical flaw, maybe fatal. But you've already thrown in the towel on this season, and it's early May. I don't know why you have decided that all is lost, but I don't get it.

Just a nitpick here but as to Green......I don't believe he was on any top 100 players list until he predictably blew up the combine with numbers. I'm also pretty certain though it has yet to play out in reality that as a #2 in a Man scheme that we replaced a Toler with maybe a notch just above Toler....maybe. Though if that holds true I'm hoping Robinson holds true to form like h did in New Orleans and counters that with making plays a lot of plays on the ball. I also don't think Cole was bad considering he was in a rotation. I've decided to go back over the games on Rewind and try to see if I can see why PFF handed out the grades they did to players.

 

They have Cole at a 77.1 pass rush grade and a 78.8 run defense grade(329 pass snaps, 204 pass snaps) . Neither number is outstanding or what some expected but both numbers rated as Starter numbers in. I also don't think I would have paid Vernon nearly what he got but he did get quite a bit of pressure last year on the QB IN 543 pass snaps with a 90.7 pass rush grade and 12th in run defense grade at 84.9

 

For comparison PFF has Mathis at a 75.3 pass rush grade and 51.3 run defense grade (380 pass snaps, 180 run snaps)

 

Not to say PFF is right of course but they do have interesting grades on the two to me (Mathis, Cole).

 

Maybe Cole really did get more combined pressure then Mathis though Mathis obviously had more sacks? What are your thoughts on that (QB pressures are not available. Maybe PFF already took that down?)

 

 

Overall they have Cole at a 79.3 grade

Mathis at 71.7 grade

[indyagent17]

Earl has a high motor so I would not be against him. I think you will see him split time as DE and OLB 

[BlueShoe]

On 5/3/2016 at 2:28 PM, Luck12-to-Hilton13 said:

Idk, at 290 pounds?? 

 

That would be a big OLB. I can't see him playing Rush, but SAM is not too far of a stretch. He probably needs to drop about 20 pounds to be agile enough though.

 

Maybe we will have a new HULK Defense. Roll out our front seven, all 290 plus. 

 

Just kidding. But if they do that then I want naming rights. LOL

[Superman]

2 hours ago, Gavin said:

Just a nitpick here but as to Green......I don't believe he was on any top 100 players list until he predictably blew up the combine with numbers. I'm also pretty certain though it has yet to play out in reality that as a #2 in a Man scheme that we replaced a Toler with maybe a notch just above Toler....maybe. Though if that holds true I'm hoping Robinson holds true to form like h did in New Orleans and counters that wi

 

Draftniks drastically adjust their boards after the Combine. I don't really think NFL staffs do the same. Whenever you hear GMs and former personnel guys talk about how the Combine affects their boards, they all speak as if the Combine isn't as relevant as it's made out to be. I say all of this to suggest that I think draftniks catch up after the Combine. Doesn't mean Green didn't move up after he had a good workout, but I doubt he moved up 50 spots.

 

Also, as a counterpoint, there weren't many top 50 lists without Andrew Billings, but he went #122. So...

 

As for Robinson vs Toler, I disagree. Toler was very bad last year, and Robinson was better. It's an upgrade.

[Gavin]

6 hours ago, Superman said:

 

SMH

 

I know you're just throwing ideas out there, so I don't mean to nitpick, but just as an exercise let's look at things for a minute. Bruce Irvin got $9.25m/year. He has 14 sacks over the last three seasons. Is he your 10 sack guy? Is he worth that money? His was one of the more reasonable free agent contracts, by the way. Olivier Vernon got twice as much. (Concession: Pernell McPhee would have been the best grab last offseason, for not that much more than we gave Trent Cole.)

 

Another nitpick: Jerrell Freeman was a cast-off CFL guy that no one took seriously. Four years later, you're acting like he's irreplaceable, and dumping on guys who come from similar backgrounds. If they found him, why can't they find the next him? (Concession: I'd have kept Freeman for that money, and cut Jackson.)

 

And I personally think you're just waaay off on TJ Green. It's cool that you have a different opinion of him, but you've determined already that he's a bad pick despite general consensus from draftniks and others being that he's actually a pretty good value. We want young defenders with a chance of being star guys, and he fits the bill. I think you should ease up on him in particular. Clark is a project player, Green can contribute right now. JMO

 

And overall, the bolded comments are just completely contrary to everything the staff has been saying since they took over. I don't know why you've decided that they are resigned to not being contenders in 2016, because they've said/done nothing to make anyone think that, unless you think that not going on a spending spree means they don't want to contend. After seeing the money that got thrown around this offseason, I'm glad the Colts didn't get involved. That doesn't mean they aren't trying to build the team the best they can.

 

This team went 6-3 without Luck. The major shortcomings on offense were Luck not playing well and the OL being bad. Let's assume Luck plays and plays better, and let's assume that the OL is better. No reason this team isn't able to win the division. Let's assume the coverage is better, with Toler replaced by Robinson and Vontae having a more 2014-ish season. And let's assume that some of these coaching changes pay off. No reason this team can't make a deep playoff run.

 

Yeah, there are flaws. Lack of a pass rush is a critical flaw, maybe fatal. But you've already thrown in the towel on this season, and it's early May. I don't know why you have decided that all is lost, but I don't get it.

I think he could be an upgrade but he did play in the slot a lot last year. He did play over 400 passing snaps...But again not much against a teams #2 wr and especially not #1 (god forbid Vontae goes down for a lengthy amount of time). Don't get me wrong, Im optimistic here though it may not sound like it and I expect him to at least play up to being a #2 Corner but its hard to get those images out of your head regarding the liability he was as a starter frequently in NO.

 

On a different note I have no idea why I just quoted another one of your replies but this reply was meant for your last quote to me, I am on my laptop do to desk being out of commission (permanently. Its old....so going to save up for a new one)

[K-148]

On 04.05.2016 at 6:33 AM, COLTS449 said:

Lets just trade for Mingo and hope he realizes his potential.

Great plan. Trade and hope. Draft and hope. And pray. You have to hope and pray to make it work. Grigson is dumb because he draft and trade without hope. That's why he failed. Know what? Colts have to trade for all that 2013 draft garbage: Mingo, Dion Jordan and Jarvis Jones (OLBs), Cooper and Warmack (OGs), Joeckel (RT), Elam and Cyprien (Ss), Milliner and Hayden (CBs), Te'o (ILB). We need fresh blood and hope at that positions.

[crazycolt1]

37 minutes ago, K-148 said:

Great plan. Trade and hope. Draft and hope. And pray. You have to hope and pray to make it work. Grigson is dumb because he draft and trade without hope. That's why he failed. Know what? Colts have to trade for all that 2013 draft garbage: Mingo, Dion Jordan and Jarvis Jones (OLBs), Cooper and Warmack (OGs), Joeckel (RT), Elam and Cyprien (Ss), Milliner and Hayden (CBs), Te'o (ILB). We need fresh blood and hope at that positions.

 The Colts have one bad draft and Grigson is Dumb?  Horse feathers.

[NewColtsFan]

6 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

 The Colts have one bad draft and Grigson is Dumb?  Horse feathers.

 

The Colts have had TWO bad drafts.

 

2013:  only Thornton left (OK if you want to include Vonte here)

2014:  only Mewhort and Moncrief left

 

But that's it for each draft.    That's not nearly enough.    This is, in part,  why the roster is so thin right now.     Also, if you want to analyze Grigson, then you also have to include Free Agents.     And his record here is very poor.

 

[Gavin]

4 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

The Colts have had TWO bad drafts.

 

2013:  only Thornton left (OK if you want to include Vonte here)

2014:  only Mewhort and Moncrief left

 

But that's it for each draft.    That's not nearly enough.    This is, in part,  why the roster is so thin right now.     Also, if you want to analyze Grigson, then you also have to include Free Agents.     And his record here is very poor.

 

10 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

 

I'd say poor is being to kind when it comes to the draft. I wont even get into the FA decisions. I'm in a good mood I'd like to stay that way

[K-148]

10 minutes ago, crazycolt1 said:

 The Colts have one bad draft and Grigson is Dumb?  Horse feathers.

It was a sarcasm. It is dumb to trade for Mingo and HOPE he realizeshis potential. Why not HOPE Joeckel realizes his potential? Do the Colts need RT? Here is a solution: trade for Joeckel and HOPE! Colts need OLB? Trade for Jarvis Jones & Dion Jordan! Don/t forget to HOPE. Bingo!

[K-148]

18 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

The Colts have had TWO bad drafts.

 

2013:  only Thornton left (OK if you want to include Vonte here)

2014:  only Mewhort and Moncrief left

 

But that's it for each draft.    That's not nearly enough.    This is, in part,  why the roster is so thin right now.     Also, if you want to analyze Grigson, then you also have to include Free Agents.     And his record here is very poor.

 

NE keep only 2nd (2) and 3rd (2) rounders from 2013 draft. And Dobson will not last long. So NE do not have better luck with 4-7th rounders.

As for 2014 draft, NE had 9 selections (5 in first 4 rounds) and keep 1 2nd rounder and 3 4th rounders. None of them contribute the way Mewhort and Moncrief can. 1st round pick is no longer with the NE. Colts had only 5 picks, and only 2 in first 4 rounds (2nd, 3rd rounds).

[akcolt]

23 hours ago, krunk said:

 

I promise Spence won't have more sacks than Robert Mathis this year

I think some are sleeping on Mathis. An achilles injury takes time to recover from. We should see what Mathis really has left this year. At the least I expect he will be better than last year.

 

If Maggitt is fully recovered from the hip injury then we got a steal. He can play in this league when he's a full go.

 

Thompson has real potential too from what I have read and seen. He arrived at the Cuse a top TE recruit and played on the bball team. He's an athlete who can get after the QB. He also is pretty good at stripping the ball. A little like a former Colt from the Cuse. He needs to get better vs the run and is more of a rotational guy pass rush specialist. I like his upside. 

[akcolt]

5 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

The Colts have had TWO bad drafts.

 

2013:  only Thornton left (OK if you want to include Vonte here)

2014:  only Mewhort and Moncrief left

 

But that's it for each draft.    That's not nearly enough.    This is, in part,  why the roster is so thin right now.     Also, if you want to analyze Grigson, then you also have to include Free Agents.     And his record here is very poor.

 

The entire league had a bad 2013 draft. That draft was historically bad. Grig's had a bad 2013 period. He made the trade that cost us or 2014 1st. 

 

Mewhort and Moncrief start and John was plucked off the PS. He's in Miami. He took a shot on a couple of character guys Newsome and Jackson both bit him in the butt. Character problems usually do. The best way to judge a person is to look at their past. 

[krunk]

1 hour ago, akcolt said:

I think some are sleeping on Mathis. An achilles injury takes time to recover from. We should see what Mathis really has left this year. At the least I expect he will be better than last year.

 

If Maggitt is fully recovered from the hip injury then we got a steal. He can play in this league when he's a full go.

 

Thompson has real potential too from what I have read and seen. He arrived at the Cuse a top TE recruit and played on the bball team. He's an athlete who can get after the QB. He also is pretty good at stripping the ball. A little like a former Colt from the Cuse. He needs to get better vs the run and is more of a rotational guy pass rush specialist. I like his upside. 

 

I like Thompson and Maggitt although I worry some about Maggitt because it seems he gets a season ending injury just about every year.  If healthy he is a pretty good pass rusher.

[krunk]

6 hours ago, K-148 said:

NE keep only 2nd (2) and 3rd (2) rounders from 2013 draft. And Dobson will not last long. So NE do not have better luck with 4-7th rounders.

As for 2014 draft, NE had 9 selections (5 in first 4 rounds) and keep 1 2nd rounder and 3 4th rounders. None of them contribute the way Mewhort and Moncrief can. 1st round pick is no longer with the NE. Colts had only 5 picks, and only 2 in first 4 rounds (2nd, 3rd rounds).

 

Exactly. Grigson ain't the only GM with some failed draft picks and classes.  Some like to present the information as if it's exclusive to Grigson.

[NewColtsFan]

2 hours ago, akcolt said:

The entire league had a bad 2013 draft. That draft was historically bad. Grig's had a bad 2013 period. He made the trade that cost us or 2014 1st. 

 

Mewhort and Moncrief start and John was plucked off the PS. He's in Miami. He took a shot on a couple of character guys Newsome and Jackson both bit him in the butt. Character problems usually do. The best way to judge a person is to look at their past. 

 

 

That's why Grigson has basically said "No more knuckleheads until the 5th round."

 

 

[Superman]

12 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

The Colts have had TWO bad drafts.

 

2013:  only Thornton left (OK if you want to include Vonte here)

2014:  only Mewhort and Moncrief left

 

But that's it for each draft.    That's not nearly enough.    This is, in part,  why the roster is so thin right now.     Also, if you want to analyze Grigson, then you also have to include Free Agents.     And his record here is very poor.

 

 

I don't think 2014 was a bad draft, unless you're including the Richardson trade.  Two starters out of five picks, one with star potential. A 40% hit rate in any draft is good, IMO.

 

And then Newsome and Jackson are both gone for being knuckleheads. We saw some decent play out of Newsome as a rookie.

[NewColtsFan]

1 hour ago, Superman said:

 

I don't think 2014 was a bad draft, unless you're including the Richardson trade.  Two starters out of five picks, one with star potential. A 40% hit rate in any draft is good, IMO.

 

And then Newsome and Jackson are both gone for being knuckleheads. We saw some decent play out of Newsome as a rookie.

 

I don't think you can come away from any draft with just two players on the roster and call it a good draft.

 

Especially after it comes right after the 2013 draft,  which also had just two bodies and that includes Vonte.

 

You have to replenish the roster and the Colts have failed to do it on a number of levels,  both the draft,  and Free Agency.

 

Getting just four total bodies over a two year window is why there's been so much pressure on the front office to hit in '15 and '16.

 

By the way,   hard an amazing stat the other day.     That the New York Football Giants have just ONE drafted player out of 5 drafts from 2009 to 2013.     30 picks ---- ONE player!!         Holy Cow!!

 

And their GM,  Jerry Reese has been the man at the helm for TWO Super Bowl wins!!

 

That explains -- in part -- how the Giants have had FOUR straight sub-500 years.      I don't want the Colts to end up there.......     Just saying....

 

 

[jim scheurich]

21 hours ago, Superman said:

 

Why can't Junior Sylvestre or Sio Moore replace Freeman? Seriously, go back and look at where Freeman came from. Cast off by Tennessee, went to Canada for three years, then the Colts grabbed him. By the way, he's a converted safety from a D2 school.

Thanks for the reply. I didn't say he couldn't be replaced. Lot of talent there to let go. Maybe $ was an issue, I don't know. My guess is he isn't going to be replaced this year. Hopefully he is though.

[Gavin]

2 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't think you can come away from any draft with just two players on the roster and call it a good draft.

 

Especially after it comes right after the 2013 draft,  which also had just two bodies and that includes Vonte.

 

You have to replenish the roster and the Colts have failed to do it on a number of levels,  both the draft,  and Free Agency.

 

Getting just four total bodies over a two year window is why there's been so much pressure on the front office to hit in '15 and '16.

 

By the way,   hard an amazing stat the other day.     That the New York Football Giants have just ONE drafted player out of 5 drafts from 2009 to 2013.     30 picks ---- ONE player!!         Holy Cow!!

 

And their GM,  Jerry Reese has been the man at the helm for TWO Super Bowl wins!!

 

That explains -- in part -- how the Giants have had FOUR straight sub-500 years.      I don't want the Colts to end up there.......     Just saying....

 

 

40% of 7 is 3 players

[NewColtsFan]

36 minutes ago, Gavin said:

40% of 7 is 3 players

 

Well,  thanks for the math lesson,  but what does that have to do with anything?

 

Feel free to complete your thought.      Because what you presented,  is not a complete thought.

 

[Gavin]

4 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Well,  thanks for the math lesson,  but what does that have to do with anything?

 

Feel free to complete your thought.      Because what you presented,  is not a complete thought.

 

Superman said 40% is a good hit rate in any draft, Out of a normal draft of 7 round that's 3 hits, Typically 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounds though obviously it varies. But anyway 40% hit rate of 7 is 3

[NewColtsFan]

37 minutes ago, Gavin said:

Superman said 40% is a good hit rate in any draft, Out of a normal draft of 7 round that's 3 hits, Typically 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounds though obviously it varies. But anyway 40% hit rate of 7 is 3

 

OK.....   but it seems like your response should've been sent to Superman and not to me.

 

He was saying he thought the Colts had a good draft with 2 players.     You were saying 40 percent equals 3 players.     Seems like that comment should've been intended for Superman and not me.....

 

Just saying.....

 

[LockeDown]

The great Ted Hendricks (6'7" 220 lbs) started his career with the Colts at DE and Shula finally moved him to linebacker.  The rest is history.  Earl is about the same height and if loses some weight to gain quickness that wouldn't be so hard to believe.  Today's players have trainers that can get them wherever they want. 

[Gavin]

9 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

OK.....   but it seems like your response should've been sent to Superman and not to me.

 

He was saying he thought the Colts had a good draft with 2 players.     You were saying 40 percent equals 3 players.     Seems like that comment should've been intended for Superman and not me.....

 

Just saying.....

 

Your right. I missed my intended poster, It should have went to Supe

[Gavin]

5 hours ago, Superman said:

 

I don't think 2014 was a bad draft, unless you're including the Richardson trade.  Two starters out of five picks, one with star potential. A 40% hit rate in any draft is good, IMO.

 

And then Newsome and Jackson are both gone for being knuckleheads. We saw some decent play out of Newsome as a rookie.

40% of 7 is 3

[gacker65]

On 5/4/2016 at 8:45 AM, DougDew said:

While this is theoretically true, I don't think using hindsight helps to determine what could have happened in any draft.  Yes, the way the draft unfolded suggests that we could have had Spence at 18, (even could have traded down) and got Martin at 48.  

 

But once we begin to chart alternative selections, the rest of the draft may not have unfolded the way it did.

 

For example, if the draft is at the top of the second round with us already taking Spence, would Martin be selected by some other team ahead of us, since Spence being off the board would have influenced many of the decisions made before pick 48?

 

Houston drafted Martin 2 spots below us.  Knowing that we had drafted Spence and that we coveted a C, its highly likely they would have traded up ahead of us.  Especially considering that we stole Dorsett from them last year and they would have loved to return the favor.

 

So when looking at alternative realities, we would have had Spence, then likely Green, and who knows what center other than Blythe.  None of the others available after Martin are really any better than Blythe.....or Holmes or Harrison for that matter.

 

While not perfect,  I like the idea of having a solid C being involved in every offensive snap, and making do with situational pass rushers that aren't necessarily useful in every defensive snap....at this time.

We could have drafted Spence.  Still moved down and gotten Martin or possibly Kelly

[Superman]

6 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

I don't think you can come away from any draft with just two players on the roster and call it a good draft.

 

Especially after it comes right after the 2013 draft,  which also had just two bodies and that includes Vonte.

 

You have to replenish the roster and the Colts have failed to do it on a number of levels,  both the draft,  and Free Agency.

 

Getting just four total bodies over a two year window is why there's been so much pressure on the front office to hit in '15 and '16.

 

By the way,   hard an amazing stat the other day.     That the New York Football Giants have just ONE drafted player out of 5 drafts from 2009 to 2013.     30 picks ---- ONE player!!         Holy Cow!!

 

And their GM,  Jerry Reese has been the man at the helm for TWO Super Bowl wins!!

 

That explains -- in part -- how the Giants have had FOUR straight sub-500 years.      I don't want the Colts to end up there.......     Just saying....

 

Then you're including the trade in that equation. And the Montori Hughes deal from the year before, which you never liked. That's fine.

 

What I'm saying is that hitting on two picks out of five isn't bad. If you applied that standard to any given draft, you'll probably find that it's representative of an excellent draft. In 2012, Luck, Fleener, Allen, Hilton, out of 10 picks. The problem with 2014 is that we didn't have enough picks. Of course, that's on Grigson either way.

 

Giants are a good of example of slippage in the draft. I wonder how Marc Ross fits, especially since he was one of my favorites before we hired Grigson. But while they only have one guy remaining from those 30 picks, I'm pretty sure they've let several decent to good players leave in free agency.