Jump to content
Indianapolis Colts
Indianapolis Colts Fan Forum

Making Sense of the OL


Archer

Recommended Posts

A lot to digest with the OL.  Which players are keepers at which positions?  Who are the starters?  Which ones are dead men walking at this point?  Here are some of my thoughts:

 

Kelly – Instant starter at center.  He could play OG at a high level, but I’d expect that Kelly stays at C his whole career.

 

Clark – I think he’ll be a pure OT from the start.  He has LT ability, length, and athletic traits, but comes from a system that is nothing like a pro system.  He has a lot of development necessary before he can be a pro OT.  For that reason, I doubt he gets moved around a lot in his rookie year.  He should get work on both sides and then settle down as Costanzo’s back-up on the left side during the season.

 

Haeg – When I was looking for middle round ZBS OGs who could also be a swing OT (position flex, as Grigson puts it), Haeg was the one I fell in love with.  We don’t know for sure how our system will change this year, but Philbin has apparently been associated with ZBS in the past.  I think Haeg will start TC as the back-up RG and we’ll see what happens.  Unlike Clark, I think the pro-ready Haeg will be tried everywhere but center during TC.

 

Blythe – One of a group of players vying for the back-up center duties.  Harrison, Holmes, and Blythe will all be trying to show they can be the versatile interior back-up by playing both guard spots and center.  With the ZBS emphasis, I’m not so sure that Blythe’s small size puts him at a huge disadvantage over the others, as ZBS concepts usually entail smaller, quicker interior linemen.  Blythe is no lock to make the roster, and he may end up being waived and hopefully added to the PS.

 

Thornton – Will start TC as the starting RG.  This will remain his until someone beats him out for the starting role, which may or may not happen.   

 

Reitz – Impossible to know what Philbin thinks of him.  To me, he was quietly a borderline top-10 RT last year.  If I had to guess, I’d say he begins TC as the starting RT, with Good as his main competition.  Haeg and Clark would be long-shots here too.  There will be serious competition at this position.  There’s also the possibility that Philbin likes him as an OG.  The roster has him listed as a G, but I’m not sure that has changed at all the last few years. 

 

Good – Definitely doesn’t seem like a ZBS OG, but we’re likely to incorporate ZBS concepts without becoming a stereotypical ZBS system.  That is, we’ll be moving to a hybrid system that uses ZBS and traditional concepts to make the most of our personnel.  So, I think he stays at OT, but he could possibly move to OG to get our best five on the field.  This’ll be an interesting year for Denzelle.

 

Harrison and Holmes – Time has probably run out for these guys.  When you are primary depth after the 1st round center, and then the team drafts three more OL, you can’t feel good about the coaching staff’s plans for your future.  They better show some versatility in TC…

 

The Depth Chart heading into TC:

 

LT: Costanzo, Clark, Graf

LG: Mewhort, Harrison, Cage (UCFA)

C: Kelly, Holmes, Blythe

RG: Thornton, Haeg, O’Brien

RT: Reitz, Good, Van Dyk

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is early, but I disagree with some of the original post in this thread.

 

I think Le'Raven Clark is starting day-one at RT.

 

LT - Anthony Castonzo, Joe Haeg

LG - Jack Mewhort

C - Ryan Kelly, Austin Blythe

RG - Hugh Thornton, Joe Reitz

RT - Le'Raven Clark, Denzelle Good

 

Good and Reitz will challenge Thornton for the starting RG spot. I believe Thornton is a better fit for zone blocking, and he will finally reach his full potential.

 

It is possible we could keep one more player on the O-line (53), but I don't think we need to. Last year we carried 10 O-Linemen on the final 53, but this year we have much more talent, so I can see us carrying 9 on the final 53. We would be better served to utilize the practice squad.

 

With that said; gone are Khaled Holmes and Jonotthan Harrison. We have no need for them. I expect that we will give them a mercy cut, and they could be gone before training camp even starts. We have done this in the past for players we knew we were not keeping. This will give them a chance to move on and make another teams training camp, and it's a clean break for us too.

 

We could sign a few practice squad players out of this bunch:

 

Isiah Cage, G, UDFA 2016
Jamelle Naff, G, UDFA 2016
Kitt O'Brien, G, UDFA 2015
Mitchell Van Dyk, OT, 7th 2014
Davante Harris, OT, UDFA 2016
Adam Redmon, OT, UDFA 2016
Kevin Graf, OT, UDFA 2014

 

Also, we usually bring someone in from Canada, or some place else around the world. Maybe this year we try the Australian continent. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I see things pretty similarly to Archer. I think that LT, LG, and C are pretty much locks barring injury: Costanzo - Mewhort - Kelly. Personally I'd start Reitz at RT this season, as I think Reitz is a decent RT and is probably our best option for 2016. Le'Raven Clark needs a lot of coaching on his mechanics and Joe Haeg needs to develop his strength - I'm really pleased we have these guys both as depth for this year and as options to start 2017 and beyond. The best shot they have to start as rookies (barring injury) imo, is RG. But there are a lot of options competing for that spot. Between Good, Thornton, Clark, and Haeg someone will emerge as the best option. Injuries happen and most likely there will be some games where one of the guys that start off on the bench have to fill in. The dynamic duo of Holmes and Harrison? I think Harrison is probably on his way out, and Holmes will be competing with Blythe for the backup center spot. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Archer said:

A lot to digest with the OL.  Which players are keepers at which positions?  Who are the starters?  Which ones are dead men walking at this point?  Here are some of my thoughts:

 

Kelly – Instant starter at center.  He could play OG at a high level, but I’d expect that Kelly stays at C his whole career.

 

Clark – I think he’ll be a pure OT from the start.  He has LT ability, length, and athletic traits, but comes from a system that is nothing like a pro system.  He has a lot of development necessary before he can be a pro OT.  For that reason, I doubt he gets moved around a lot in his rookie year.  He should get work on both sides and then settle down as Costanzo’s back-up on the left side during the season.

 

Haeg – When I was looking for middle round ZBS OGs who could also be a swing OT (position flex, as Grigson puts it), Haeg was the one I fell in love with.  We don’t know for sure how our system will change this year, but Philbin has apparently been associated with ZBS in the past.  I think Haeg will start TC as the back-up RG and we’ll see what happens.  Unlike Clark, I think the pro-ready Haeg will be tried everywhere but center during TC.

 

Blythe – One of a group of players vying for the back-up center duties.  Harrison, Holmes, and Blythe will all be trying to show they can be the versatile interior back-up by playing both guard spots and center.  With the ZBS emphasis, I’m not so sure that Blythe’s small size puts him at a huge disadvantage over the others, as ZBS concepts usually entail smaller, quicker interior linemen.  Blythe is no lock to make the roster, and he may end up being waived and hopefully added to the PS.

 

Thornton – Will start TC as the starting RG.  This will remain his until someone beats him out for the starting role, which may or may not happen.   

 

Reitz – Impossible to know what Philbin thinks of him.  To me, he was quietly a borderline top-10 RT last year.  If I had to guess, I’d say he begins TC as the starting RT, with Good as his main competition.  Haeg and Clark would be long-shots here too.  There will be serious competition at this position.  There’s also the possibility that Philbin likes him as an OG.  The roster has him listed as a G, but I’m not sure that has changed at all the last few years. 

 

Good – Definitely doesn’t seem like a ZBS OG, but we’re likely to incorporate ZBS concepts without becoming a stereotypical ZBS system.  That is, we’ll be moving to a hybrid system that uses ZBS and traditional concepts to make the most of our personnel.  So, I think he stays at OT, but he could possibly move to OG to get our best five on the field.  This’ll be an interesting year for Denzelle.

 

Harrison and Holmes – Time has probably run out for these guys.  When you are primary depth after the 1st round center, and then the team drafts three more OL, you can’t feel good about the coaching staff’s plans for your future.  They better show some versatility in TC…

 

The Depth Chart heading into TC:

 

LT: Costanzo, Clark, Graf

LG: Mewhort, Harrison, Cage (UCFA)

C: Kelly, Holmes, Blythe

RG: Thornton, Haeg, O’Brien

RT: Reitz, Good, Van Dyk

 

 

 

 

A couple things. . . 

 

Does system affect what the OL does that much?  In terms of blocking my understanding was there was 2 types, man and zone and that's the same no matter what system the rest of the team is running.

 

At C. . . I think Harrison is kind of out of the running here.  He's big and strong but slow.  Not a good fit for ZBS.  

 

I don't know about how athletic Holmes is, but I can tell you Blythe comes from a ZBS in college.  

 

Also some people are discounting it, but I wouldn't completely sleep on Mewhort being the starting RT either.  I think the reason they abandoned that idea last year is due more to the inabilities of the guys they had at guard before more then Mewhort's inability to play RT.  

 

That said, Clark is also a guy that could be looked at to take over at RT.   

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Defjamz26 said:

I thought what they were doing with the line was obvious. Clark at RG and Haeg at RT in the future. Blythe is the backup center to Kelly.

 

See, I was thinking the other way. Haeg at RG and Clark at RT (eventually). Grigs was enamored by his arm length which is put to best use on the outside, forcing rushers to go around and allowing Luck to step up. Then again I'm not sure what's being said of Haeg as a G prospect, but I feel like Clark would be best served on the outside once he has time to clean things up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think clark and kelly will start day one its just my opinion I don't think we drafted clark to sit on the

sidelines .. I have a feeling its out with old in with new I just think were gonna give these lineman a real shot to work together day one I don't think thorton has any advantage right now I just think everyone minus Reitz is fighting for there job as a backup 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, BlueShoe said:

Also, we usually bring someone in from Canada, or some place else around the world. Maybe this year we try the Australian continent. 

This section of your post is true. Grigs does have a knack for finding solid LBs & defensive work horses in Canada courtesy of the CFL. Ryan must have dual citizenship by now. 

 

Usually, guys from "Down Under" are special team gunners & FG kickers. Think rugby & cricket. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't think it is likely, but there might be an outside chance that Kelly ends up at RG with Blythe starting at C... 

 

Reitz is valuable as a backup, but at some point you have to put your best 5 out there... He is our second best lineman, at this point, whether he lines up at G or T.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think Clark will slide to RT next year, but much like Tarik Glenn, he will start at RG this year.  This will be good considering the system he was in.  Haeg looks like he would be very, very good at G.  I can see him backup Clark this year, and start at G when Clark slides to RT.  I'm not sure why everyone was so high on Whitehair.  Haeg could be a very good G down the road.  He and Thornton are going to be a fun battle to watch.

 

Castonzo, Reitz

Mewhort., Thornton

Kelly, Blythe

Clark, Haeg

Reitz, Goode

 

It is going to be fun seeing the competition.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Coltscrazy said:

I think Clark will slide to RT next year, but much like Tarik Glenn, he will start at RG this year.  This will be good considering the system he was in.  Haeg looks like he would be very, very good at G.  I can see him backup Clark this year, and start at G when Clark slides to RT.  I'm not sure why everyone was so high on Whitehair.  Haeg could be a very good G down the road.  He and Thornton are going to be a fun battle to watch.

 

Castonzo, Reitz

Mewhort., Thornton

Kelly, Blythe

Clark, Haeg

Reitz, Goode

 

It is going to be fun seeing the competition.

 

That's an interesting take on the rookies at RG.  I've kinda felt that Clark is going to have so much to learn to be a pro OT that I want him at that position full-time to make him as ready as possible to play RT next year.  However, I know that he could be a very effective RG much earlier.  So, maybe getting him on the field in any capacity is the best thing for him, and we'll worry about next year's RT competition next year...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On Monday, May 02, 2016 at 7:55 AM, Archer said:

 

The Depth Chart heading into TC:

 

LT: Costanzo, Clark, Graf

LG: Mewhort, Harrison, Cage (UCFA)

C: Kelly, Holmes, Blythe

RG: Thornton, Haeg, O’Brien

RT: Reitz, Good, Van Dyk

 

 

 

Why wouldn't you try Clark at RT? His strength and wing span look good for that. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/2/2016 at 8:55 AM, Archer said:

A lot to digest with the OL.  Which players are keepers at which positions?  Who are the starters?  Which ones are dead men walking at this point?  Here are some of my thoughts:

 

Kelly – Instant starter at center.  He could play OG at a high level, but I’d expect that Kelly stays at C his whole career.

 

Clark – I think he’ll be a pure OT from the start.  He has LT ability, length, and athletic traits, but comes from a system that is nothing like a pro system.  He has a lot of development necessary before he can be a pro OT.  For that reason, I doubt he gets moved around a lot in his rookie year.  He should get work on both sides and then settle down as Costanzo’s back-up on the left side during the season.

 

Haeg – When I was looking for middle round ZBS OGs who could also be a swing OT (position flex, as Grigson puts it), Haeg was the one I fell in love with.  We don’t know for sure how our system will change this year, but Philbin has apparently been associated with ZBS in the past.  I think Haeg will start TC as the back-up RG and we’ll see what happens.  Unlike Clark, I think the pro-ready Haeg will be tried everywhere but center during TC.

 

Blythe – One of a group of players vying for the back-up center duties.  Harrison, Holmes, and Blythe will all be trying to show they can be the versatile interior back-up by playing both guard spots and center.  With the ZBS emphasis, I’m not so sure that Blythe’s small size puts him at a huge disadvantage over the others, as ZBS concepts usually entail smaller, quicker interior linemen.  Blythe is no lock to make the roster, and he may end up being waived and hopefully added to the PS.

 

Thornton – Will start TC as the starting RG.  This will remain his until someone beats him out for the starting role, which may or may not happen.   

 

Reitz – Impossible to know what Philbin thinks of him.  To me, he was quietly a borderline top-10 RT last year.  If I had to guess, I’d say he begins TC as the starting RT, with Good as his main competition.  Haeg and Clark would be long-shots here too.  There will be serious competition at this position.  There’s also the possibility that Philbin likes him as an OG.  The roster has him listed as a G, but I’m not sure that has changed at all the last few years. 

 

Good – Definitely doesn’t seem like a ZBS OG, but we’re likely to incorporate ZBS concepts without becoming a stereotypical ZBS system.  That is, we’ll be moving to a hybrid system that uses ZBS and traditional concepts to make the most of our personnel.  So, I think he stays at OT, but he could possibly move to OG to get our best five on the field.  This’ll be an interesting year for Denzelle.

 

Harrison and Holmes – Time has probably run out for these guys.  When you are primary depth after the 1st round center, and then the team drafts three more OL, you can’t feel good about the coaching staff’s plans for your future.  They better show some versatility in TC…

 

The Depth Chart heading into TC:

 

LT: Costanzo, Clark, Graf

LG: Mewhort, Harrison, Cage (UCFA)

C: Kelly, Holmes, Blythe

RG: Thornton, Haeg, O’Brien

RT: Reitz, Good, Van Dyk

 

 

 

Holmes has been released

Link to comment
Share on other sites

When have any of you seen Grigson start a rookie at right tackle from day one?  Never, and I don't see it this year either.  Especially a rookie like Clark who has never been in a 3 point stance and needs a good level of coaching.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, Track Guy said:

I see things pretty similarly to Archer. I think that LT, LG, and C are pretty much locks barring injury: Costanzo - Mewhort - Kelly. Personally I'd start Reitz at RT this season, as I think Reitz is a decent RT and is probably our best option for 2016. Le'Raven Clark needs a lot of coaching on his mechanics and Joe Haeg needs to develop his strength - I'm really pleased we have these guys both as depth for this year and as options to start 2017 and beyond. The best shot they have to start as rookies (barring injury) imo, is RG. But there are a lot of options competing for that spot. Between Good, Thornton, Clark, and Haeg someone will emerge as the best option. Injuries happen and most likely there will be some games where one of the guys that start off on the bench have to fill in. The dynamic duo of Holmes and Harrison? I think Harrison is probably on his way out, and Holmes will be competing with Blythe for the backup center spot. 

I agree track guy, I think it will start off with Castonzo, Mewhort, Kelly, Thornton and Reitz and right now those should be the starters while the remaining rookies back them up in whatever combination they earn in camp.  With Holmes already gone, it remains to be seen if they truly think Harrison is better than one of their new draftees.  I sure hope that's not the case, or they blew the pick that falls behind Harrison.  I strongly dislike that guy and feel he was the worst lineman who played significant time last year.  No excuse for him to still be around unless the blew the draft picks again.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Left tackle AC left guard Mewhort at center Kelly, this is set in stone.

weighting in at 340 pounds is the main reason I would like to see Denzel

Good at Right Guard not tackle, that's pretty heavy for tackle.  I like to see Clark take over the starting job at right tackle when the coaches think he is ready.   For Blythe, Haeg and Reintz  swingmen

Link to comment
Share on other sites

34 minutes ago, John Dee said:

Don't be shocked to see Blythe at G... 

 

It would make the most sense to have him listed as a guard, and also as a backup center. He certainly would not be the first player to be listed as a C/G.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Narcosys said:

Why wouldn't you try Clark at RT? His strength and wing span look good for that. 

 

I would try him on both sides, but I doubt his ability to start at RT his rookie year due to the amount of development he'll need after being in that Texas Tech system.  The real competition should be between Reitz and Good IMHO...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...