AFC South excuse lovers will love this

[DalTXColtsFan]

The Pats at 10-1 are #1 in the AFC.  The Bengals currently own the tiebreaker over Denver, so they are #2 and #3.

After NE, Cincy and Den there are 5 6-5 teams - KC, Indy, Hou, NYJ and Pit.

If you apply the wild-card tiebreakers to all 5 of those teams ignoring which divisions they're in, the next 3 seeds are KC at #4, Houston at #5 and Indy at #6.

Don't believe me? Work out the tiebreakers for yourself.  Surprising, isn't it?  Two teams in the top 6 from supposedly the worst division?

"Yeah, but Houston and Indy got to play Jacksonville and Tennessee".  Cry me a river.  KC got to play SD, Detroit and Chicago.  Pittsburgh got to play SF, StL, SD and Cle.  NYJ got to play Miami twice, Washington and Cleveland.

 

I'm not sure why I'm taking the time to type this.  People believe what they want to believe regardless of how many facts they're shown that they're wrong.

 

On a side note, Indy@Pitt and Hou@Indy are suddenly gigantic games for the playoff race.  Cincy@Den is likely to determine who gets the first-round bye.

[NewColtsFan]

I'm not sure how Houston is 5th and Indy is 6th?

Indy is in 1st place in the AFC South, and Houston is in 2nd,   so something seems not quite right.

And even though the division may have two teams in the playoffs now,  it doesn't make a difference.   This only means something if they're announcing the playoff teams this week -- which no one is.

When we put two teams in the playoffs at the end of the regular season, THEN -- and ONLY THEN -- will it mean something.     

Sorry,  didn't mean to burst your bubble,  but there it is....

 

[21isSuperman]

26 minutes ago, DalTXColtsFan said:

The Pats at 10-1 are #1 in the AFC.  The Bengals currently own the tiebreaker over Denver, so they are #2 and #3.

After NE, Cincy and Den there are 5 6-5 teams - KC, Indy, Hou, NYJ and Pit.

If you apply the wild-card tiebreakers to all 5 of those teams ignoring which divisions they're in, the next 3 seeds are KC at #4, Houston at #5 and Indy at #6.

Don't believe me? Work out the tiebreakers for yourself.  Surprising, isn't it?  Two teams in the top 6 from supposedly the worst division?

"Yeah, but Houston and Indy got to play Jacksonville and Tennessee".  Cry me a river.  KC got to play SD, Detroit and Chicago.  Pittsburgh got to play SF, StL, SD and Cle.  NYJ got to play Miami twice, Washington and Cleveland.

 

I'm not sure why I'm taking the time to type this.  People believe what they want to believe regardless of how many facts they're shown that they're wrong.

 

On a side note, Indy@Pitt and Hou@Indy are suddenly gigantic games for the playoff race.  Cincy@Den is likely to determine who gets the first-round bye.

I think you have the seedings off.  The division leaders always get the top 4 spots in the playoffs in order of their records.  Since Indy is atop the AFC South, they can't be in 5th or 6th; they're in 4th.  Not only that, but Indy is above Houston in terms of tiebreakers.  Current standings are:

1. New England

2. Cincinnati

3. Denver

4. Indianapolis

5. Kansas City

6. Houston

 

If the season ended today, we'd be hosting KC in a playoff game (those are always fun!) and Houston gets Denver.

[DalTXColtsFan]

What you're both missing is that I took divisions completely out of the picture.  If I would have put Indy at #4 everyone would say, "Well of course - they play in the crappy AFC South".

Look at the entire AFC as one single 16-team division.  In a single 16-team division NE is #1, Cincy #2, Den #3, KC #4, Hou #5 and Indy #6.

[Andrew Luck's Beard]

8 minutes ago, DalTXColtsFan said:

What you're both missing is that I took divisions completely out of the picture.  If I would have put Indy at #4 everyone would say, "Well of course - they play in the crappy AFC South".

Look at the entire AFC as one single 16-team division.  In a single 16-team division NE is #1, Cincy #2, Den #3, KC #4, Hou #5 and Indy #6.

Colts are #5 and Texans are #6 since they're both 6-5 and the Colts have the head-to-head win.

[braveheartcolt]

42 minutes ago, NewColtsFan said:

I'm not sure how Houston is 5th and Indy is 6th?

Indy is in 1st place in the AFC South, and Houston is in 2nd,   so something seems not quite right.

And even though the division may have two teams in the playoffs now,  it doesn't make a difference.   This only means something if they're announcing the playoff teams this week -- which no one is.

When we put two teams in the playoffs at the end of the regular season, THEN -- and ONLY THEN -- will it mean something.     

Sorry,  didn't mean to burst your bubble,  but there it is....

 

Works both ways. Let not people criticise the division until the season ends. 

[PuntersArePeopleToo]

25 minutes ago, Andrew Luck's Beard said:

Colts are #5 and Texans are #6 since they're both 6-5 and the Colts have the head-to-head win.

Now this is correct tie breakers the first is head to head

[Synthetic]

 

"AFC south excuse lovers"

Nice job with the persecution complex, that's lovely. Keep it up and you'll sound like religious fanatics, and that's always fun. Sports does share a lot of similarities with religion anyway. 

The AFC South finally had a tough year by having to play the oh so terrible NFC South, that everyone picked on and joked about last year, despite historically being a much more competitive division that comes down to the wire. And besides the NFC South, they had to play the AFC East; another poor division just cause New England wins it every year. What a shock that the NFC South and AFC East can give teams some tough games! 

 

We evil witch hunters don't tell you that your division is awful cause we want to burn you at the stake. Historically, the AFC South is trash and has been since it's existence. It's only produced one team since 2002 that's made it past the AFC Divisional round, and the Colts are that team.

I defend the NFC South, cause as bad as it looks, there is 2 Super Bowl winners, and 3 of the 4 teams have reached the Super Bowl, and counting the one that didn't, they did at least make it to the NFC title game. And it's been competitive in the sense, there was no repeat division winner up until Carolina last year. 

 

Don't worry though, it's OK. You're safe here. There might be some evil people in DA MEDIA that have similar opinions to mine, but you outnumber me 1 to 100, so rest well at night, I am not here to burn you at the stake. 

[southwest1]

I don't care what seed we get just concentrate on winning the division & once INDY finds out who we play probably the Chiefs like 21is Superman said.

All this talk of our ranking is meaningless. Just line up, move the guy across from you backwards, & make sure the Colts have no false starts or turnovers. Ranking are pointless to me even with a 1st round bye are of little value to me since it can mess up team rhythm & chemistry on the field. JMO.

I get the value in rest if your squad is heavily injured of course, but if a team's timing gets messed up with a week off, the result can be equally devastating in my estimation.

[Jules]

Why does this AFC South thing always get dragged out every so often?

I don't even want a race in it. I want Houston to lose out and for us to win out. I don't even care if we are considered a good division ever.

[Superman]

The point is pretty simple. Two teams in the AFC South have the fifth and sixth best records in the AFC, taking tie breakers into consideration.

[2006Coltsbestever]

11 minutes ago, Jules said:

Why does this AFC South thing always get dragged out every so often?

I don't even want a race in it. I want Houston to lose out and for us to win out. I don't even care if we are considered a good division ever.

I think Houston could lose this week playing in Buffalo. That game is 50/50. I also think the Patriots will beat the Texans. Texans have a rough schedule now coming up. Hey we aren't the worst Division anymore at least, the NFC East is.

[BOTT]

I don't know why you took the time to type that out either 

[2006Coltsbestever]

Finishing 4th is a good spot for us starting off. We own KC and I think if we draw the Jets again, we win that as well. They aren't beating us twice at home in the same season.

[Jules]

9 minutes ago, 2006Coltsbestever said:

Finishing 4th is a good spot for us starting off. We own KC and I think if we draw the Jets again, we win that as well. They aren't beating us twice at home in the same season.

I agree. It's going to be hard for the Jets to come here and win again. And we blew chunks in that game, bad. No offense in that game. I don't see that repeating regardless of our QB. And the Jets D was stronger earlier in the year.

KC we seem to always beat somehow and in someway. They are a slight concern though if they keep this hot streak thing up though and can be tough. But, I just don't often trust them with us.

It would be nice to somehow knock out the Steelers from the playoffs......even when we do get by them in some regular seasons they have been a lethal playoff foe for us. I hope we win this weekend bad just to help keep Pittsburgh out.

I guess any game will be tough though in the end.

The road to the AFC South title will come through Indy. Houston has to win here. If they do I will tip my hat off to them but until I see it happen I won't believe it. They beat up on some teams very well but somehow never can hold it together vs. the Colts.

 

[Jules]

On a side note this forum has a good new feature now. I had lost internet power for a second and replied at the same time. But, when I came back online my post was still here when I hit reply and didn't have to re-do it. Oh yeah.

[2006Coltsbestever]

6 minutes ago, Jules said:

I agree. It's going to be hard for the Jets to come here and win again. And we blew chunks in that game, bad. No offense in that game. I don't see that repeating regardless of our QB. And the Jets D was stronger earlier in the year.

KC we seem to always beat somehow and in someway. They are a slight concern though if they keep this hot streak thing up though and can be tough. But, I just don't often trust them with us.

It would be nice to somehow knock out the Steelers from the playoffs......even when we do get by them in some regular seasons they have been a lethal playoff foe for us. I hope we win this weekend bad just to help keep Pittsburgh out.

I guess any game will be tough though in the end.

The road to the AFC South title will come through Indy. Houston has to win here. If they do I will tip my hat off to them but until I see it happen I won't believe it. They beat up on some teams very well but somehow never can hold it together vs. the Colts.

 

I would love to draw the Steelers as a 4 vs 5. We owe them for 2005. I would get more satisfaction out of beating them over anyone except for the Pats of course. That 5th Spot is up in the air. We very well could lose this week but if we do it isn't the end of the world as long as the Texans lose 1 of the next 2 which I am sure they will. I wont panic if we lose Sunday as we still would be 6-6 and control our own destiny. If we sweep the Texans and run the table after this Sunday we still win the Division no matter what happens. If we win this Sunday somehow that would be huge!

[Jules]

Just now, 2006Coltsbestever said:

I would love to draw the Steelers as a 4 vs 5. We owe them for 2005. I would get more satisfaction out of beating them over anyone except for the Pats of course. That 5th Spot is up in the air. We very well could lose this week but if we do it isn't the end of the world as long as the Texans lose 1 of the next 2 which I am sure they will. I wont panic if we lose Sunday as we still would be 6-6 and control our own destiny. If sweep the Texans and run the table after this Sunday we still win the Division no matter what happens. If we win this Sunday somehow that would be huge!

We are overly due to beat the Steelers in the playoffs but man oh man can they be a load with Ben and those guys. Defensively though I think they can be had this time around. We drew them more often when they had MUCH stronger defenses.

This weekend actually might be our only time we can realistically lose a game if Houston has a strong run the rest of the year.

The Houston game is the game of the year perhaps. We are fortunate it is in Indy.

[2006Coltsbestever]

2 minutes ago, Jules said:

We are overly due to beat the Steelers in the playoffs but man oh man can they be a load with Ben and those guys. Defensively though I think they can be had this time around. We drew them more often when they had MUCH stronger defenses.

This weekend actually might be our only time we can realistically lose a game if Houston has a strong run the rest of the year.

The Houston game is the game of the year perhaps. We are fortunate it is in Indy.

Yeah I feel pretty good about the Texans game especially if Andrew and Dorsett are back. I still have faith in Hass as well being able to win that game unless he is just worn out by then. The only thing that scares me is they have never lost here, meaning they are due to win here. Having said that if we play our (A) game they wont beat us.

[NewColtsFan]

3 hours ago, braveheartcolt said:

Works both ways. Let not people criticise the division until the season ends. 

 

OK....   fine,  except what's the other argument?

That out of 8 divisions,  we're no longer number 8,  we're now number 7?

Not much of an argument......

Just sayin.....

 

 

[NewColtsFan]

57 minutes ago, Superman said:

The point is pretty simple. Two teams in the AFC South have the fifth and sixth best records in the AFC, taking tie breakers into consideration.

 

Yes,  the point is pretty simple.

But, it's also pretty irrelevant since no one cares about playoff standings today.    No one builds an argument on the quality of the division based on how teams stack up on Dec. 1.

So, again,  what's the OP's point?      Doesn't really feel like he has one.

Sorry,  not trying to be argumentative, but if the AFC South gets two teams in the playoffs after week 17,  THEN he's got a great point.    But until then,  I'm just not feeling it....

 

[crazycolt1]

Still too many games to play to make any of this seriously taken. A lot can change in the remaining games. The only thing I can say is as long as the Colts are knocking at the door we have a chance. Things have looked a lot better than this time 3 weeks ago so anyone's guess is as good as anyone else's.

[DalTXColtsFan]

1 hour ago, NewColtsFan said:

So, again,  what's the OP's point?

The point is that people who say that the Colts only make the playoffs every year because they play in the weak AFC South are wrong.

The FACTS show that the reason the Colts made the playoffs in 2012, 2013 and 2014 and will likely do so again in 2015 is because they were one of the 6 best teams in the AFC each of those 4 years.

But, as always, most people ignore facts and just latch on to facts that the media wants them to like.

[DalTXColtsFan]

Just as an FYI, if we look at the entire AFC as one 16-team division, the head-to-head tiebreaker which Indy owns over Houston does not come in to play because a 4-team tie is being broken.  5 teams are considered, of which KC has the best record in the AFC so KC is crowned #4 and removed.  Now 4 teams are being considered.  Head-to-head only applies if one team has beaten all 3 other teams which is not the case, so conference record is considered next where Houston and Indy tie for the highest, then common games (minimum of 4) between Hou and Indy is the next tie-breaker.  Hou owns this tiebreaker since they beat NYJ and NO.  So in my hypothetical world Hou would actually be #5 and Indy #6.

[NewColtsFan]

30 minutes ago, DalTXColtsFan said:

The point is that people who say that the Colts only make the playoffs every year because they play in the weak AFC South are wrong.

The FACTS show that the reason the Colts made the playoffs in 2012, 2013 and 2014 and will likely do so again in 2015 is because they were one of the 6 best teams in the AFC each of those 4 years.

But, as always, most people ignore facts and just latch on to facts that the media wants them to like.

 

I don't think what you've presented makes your case.

It will when the season is over and the division puts two teams in the playoffs.

But until that happens,   I don't think your point is made.

What you have now is a moment in time.     A snapshot.     

But when the season is over and the results are known to all,  then you may have a case....

 

[peytonmanning18]

The AFC South is pathetic.  Stop trying to make it seem like it's not.  

[NBColtsFanatic]

The NFC East is also worse than the AFC South

[DougDew]

7 hours ago, Bogie said:

 

"AFC south excuse lovers"

Nice job with the persecution complex, that's lovely. Keep it up and you'll sound like religious fanatics, and that's always fun. Sports does share a lot of similarities with religion anyway. 

The AFC South finally had a tough year by having to play the oh so terrible NFC South, that everyone picked on and joked about last year, despite historically being a much more competitive division that comes down to the wire. And besides the NFC South, they had to play the AFC East; another poor division just cause New England wins it every year. What a shock that the NFC South and AFC East can give teams some tough games! 

 

We evil witch hunters don't tell you that your division is awful cause we want to burn you at the stake. Historically, the AFC South is trash and has been since it's existence. It's only produced one team since 2002 that's made it past the AFC Divisional round, and the Colts are that team.

I defend the NFC South, cause as bad as it looks, there is 2 Super Bowl winners, and 3 of the 4 teams have reached the Super Bowl, and counting the one that didn't, they did at least make it to the NFC title game. And it's been competitive in the sense, there was no repeat division winner up until Carolina last year. 

 

Don't worry though, it's OK. You're safe here. There might be some evil people in DA MEDIA that have similar opinions to mine, but you outnumber me 1 to 100, so rest well at night, I am not here to burn you at the stake. 

Why did you pick 2002 as the year to start from?  Why not go back to the Steve McNair led era and consider TN?   And why pick the arbitrary criteria of "going past the divisional round" when evaluating whether or not a team is good.  HOU had some pretty strong teams even though they flubbed some playoff games.

Also, PM and the Colts were always one of the best teams in the AFC, and the AFC south teams had to play them twice each year, giving each of them 1 if not  2 more losses on their record than teams who didn't play in the AFC South all of those years.

Go ahead, pick the facts that support the conclusion you want.  That's ok, I won't burn you at the stake, that tactic is rampant these days.

[krunk]

I don't care about the division and whether people say it's good or not. I care about where we are at as a football team and I think the wise people on this forum know the Colts can play with and beat anybody.  I'm not wasting time talking about all the ifs and but scenarios.

[C0LT5]

10 hours ago, Bogie said:

 

the AFC South is trash and has been since it's existence.

You need to do a little research.....this is not even remotely true.

[ColtRider]

5 hours ago, peytonmanning18 said:

The AFC South is pathetic.  Stop trying to make it seem like it's not.  

Show me other divisions in football that do not include "pathetic" records every year. They're few and far between. There's usually one/two teams with losing records each year. That's 25-50% of that divisional record. To state across the board that the AFC South is "pathetic" is a misnomer. Besides, divisional opponents play better against each other year to year. Do they not?

btw ... Let's take a look at the top team in the AFC South for the last 15 years. Pathetic? No way. So, an unequivocal lateral statement about the AFC South is false.

[throwing BBZ]

14 hours ago, DalTXColtsFan said:

The Pats at 10-1 are #1 in the AFC.  The Bengals currently own the tiebreaker over Denver, so they are #2 and #3.

After NE, Cincy and Den there are 5 6-5 teams - KC, Indy, Hou, NYJ and Pit.

If you apply the wild-card tiebreakers to all 5 of those teams ignoring which divisions they're in, the next 3 seeds are KC at #4, Houston at #5 and Indy at #6.

Don't believe me? Work out the tiebreakers for yourself.  Surprising, isn't it?  Two teams in the top 6 from supposedly the worst division?

"Yeah, but Houston and Indy got to play Jacksonville and Tennessee".  Cry me a river.  KC got to play SD, Detroit and Chicago.  Pittsburgh got to play SF, StL, SD and Cle.  NYJ got to play Miami twice, Washington and Cleveland.

 

I'm not sure why I'm taking the time to type this.  People believe what they want to believe regardless of how many facts they're shown that they're wrong.

 

On a side note, Indy@Pitt and Hou@Indy are suddenly gigantic games for the playoff race.  Cincy@Den is likely to determine who gets the first-round bye.

 

 Really?  The Facts AND the reasoning are scewed.

[OffensivelyPC]

It still doesn't change the fact that the AFC S is the worst division in the AFC.  The number of AFC S wins?  18.  The rest of at least 21.  

[ColtRider]

39 minutes ago, OffensivelyPC said:

It still doesn't change the fact that the AFC S is the worst division in the AFC.  The number of AFC S wins?  18.  The rest of at least 21.  

I took exception to the word, "pathetic". Yes, the AFC South right now has the worst record in the Conference.

[DalTXColtsFan]

The point is not to argue whether or not the AFC South is the worst division in the AFC or the NFL.

The point is not even to argue whether or not the Colts BENEFIT from playing in the AFC south.

The point is, simply that this statement:

"The only reason the Colts made the playoffs in 2012, 2013 and 2014 and will likely make them in 2015 as well is they play in the AFC South"

is not only wrong but patently absurd.

 

[ColtRider]

4 minutes ago, DalTXColtsFan said:

The point is not to argue whether or not the AFC South is the worst division in the AFC or the NFL.

The point is to argue that THE ONLY REASON THE COLTS HAVE MADE AND LIKELY WILL MAKE THE PLAYOFFS is because they play in the AFC South.

THAT is what is simply not accurate.

That's right. It's not accurate. It's not the ONLY reason. Some people totally dismiss the fact that the Colts have been/are/will be a Playoff team not because of their division, but because of their play in that division and outside thereof. The Colts still have to win the games. It's that simple.

[Superman]

6 hours ago, DougDew said:

Why did you pick 2002 as the year to start from?  Why not go back to the Steve McNair led era and consider TN?   And why pick the arbitrary criteria of "going past the divisional round" when evaluating whether or not a team is good.  HOU had some pretty strong teams even though they flubbed some playoff games.

Also, PM and the Colts were always one of the best teams in the AFC, and the AFC south teams had to play them twice each year, giving each of them 1 if not  2 more losses on their record than teams who didn't play in the AFC South all of those years.

Go ahead, pick the facts that support the conclusion you want.  That's ok, I won't burn you at the stake, that tactic is rampant these days.

He picked 2002 because that's when the division was created.

[Superman]

12 hours ago, NewColtsFan said:

 

Yes,  the point is pretty simple.

But, it's also pretty irrelevant since no one cares about playoff standings today.    No one builds an argument on the quality of the division based on how teams stack up on Dec. 1.

So, again,  what's the OP's point?      Doesn't really feel like he has one.

Sorry,  not trying to be argumentative, but if the AFC South gets two teams in the playoffs after week 17,  THEN he's got a great point.    But until then,  I'm just not feeling it....

 

So we can call the division weak all offseason and throughout the year, but we can't acknowledge the records after 11 games? Using that criteria, no one would judge a division or a team until after the season, and we would all acknowledge that teams around the league get better and worse every year. 

I'm fine with that approach, but those clearly aren't the rules we play by. Not even close. Either we don't judge until we have final results -- which means calling the division good or bad is out of bounds until the season is over -- or we discuss as we go along. As of right now, two teams in the AFC South have good enough records to make the playoffs. That obviously can change over the next five weeks.

[NewColtsFan]

3 minutes ago, Superman said:

So we can call the division weak all offseason and throughout the year, but we can't acknowledge the records after 11 games? Using that criteria, no one would judge a division or a team until after the season, and we would all acknowledge that teams around the league get better and worse every year. 

I'm fine with that approach, but those clearly aren't the rules we play by. Not even close. Either we don't judge until we have final results -- which means calling the division good or bad is out of bounds until the season is over -- or we discuss as we go along. As of right now, two teams in the AFC South have good enough records to make the playoffs. That obviously can change over the next five weeks.

 

All I'm saying is..............

Don't read too much into week 11,  because the results could be totally different after week 17.

As I said in another post in this thread,  if you read too much into week 11,  what's our claim,   that now we're only the 7th best/worst division and not the 8th best/worst division?     Is that really much of a big deal?

 

[DougDew]

29 minutes ago, Superman said:

He picked 2002 because that's when the division was created.

Oh, I was thinking that our rivalry with good TN teams with McNair was when we were all in the AFC South.   I guess they were good but had most of their playoff success before the South was formed.

I still think saying its pathetic since its existence by citing only the Colts going beyond the divisional championship game is not a good way to look at it.