My take on the management of the team

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Yes I'm taking a jab at the management in this post. Throughout the Manning year's and now early on in

Luck's young career, they are more worried about a high flying passing attack than a strong running game

and controlling the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball.

 

Luck is an awesome talent and I believe he could do more with a strong running game that would open

up the play action pass, and a solid line to pass protect and blow open running lanes to allow the play

action pass to take effect.

During the run of the XLI playoff's, the Colts ran the ball well with Dom Rhodes and the defense had

a tough run defense that held their own during most of the playoffs. Why not go back to THAT blueprint?

 

In the off season, they went out and spent even more cap space on the receiving corp with the addition

of an aging Johnson, instead of focusing on the running game. `save Gore, speaking about the lines here'

 

In closing, my concern is that Luck has potential to be a multiple SB winning QB and I don't want his career

to be wasted away with the old philosophy of soft, aerial assault style of play, that crumbles in the playoffs

against teams that run the ball, stop the run and control the lines.

 

If we keep doing what we are doing then expect to keep getting what we are getting, soft football that 

loses in the playoffs. I needed to get that off of my chest. 

[pacolts56]

Yes I'm taking a jab at the management in this post. Throughout the Manning year's and now early on in

Luck's young career, they are more worried about a high flying passing attack than a strong running game

and controlling the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball.

 

Luck is an awesome talent and I believe he could do more with a strong running game that would open

up the play action pass, and a solid line to pass protect and blow open running lanes to allow the play

action pass to take effect.

During the run of the XLI playoff's, the Colts ran the ball well with Dom Rhodes and the defense had

a tough run defense that held their own during most of the playoffs. Why not go back to THAT blueprint?

 

In the off season, they went out and spent even more cap space on the receiving corp with the addition

of an aging Johnson, instead of focusing on the running game. `save Gore, speaking about the lines here'

 

In closing, my concern is that Luck has potential to be a multiple SB winning QB and I don't want his career

to be wasted away with the old philosophy of soft, aerial assault style of play, that crumbles in the playoffs

against teams that run the ball, stop the run and control the lines.

 

If we keep doing what we are doing then expect to keep getting what we are getting, soft football that 

loses in the playoffs. I needed to get that off of my chest. 

All I can say to that is Amen.

[coltsfanmilyman]

Okay,

 

I get your point but I believe you have mislead yourself regarding your disdain/aggravation.  In 2006 if you remember correctly before the playoffs MJD and co gashed us for an ungodly amount of yds on the ground.  Yes our Defense won us the championship sans AFCCG but the defense wasn't world beaters then.  I'm with you that we need to retool the trenches but if boom and others were making positive gains, I think some of the onus on our weak RB game was lack of talent at the position.  So far in the offseason, he (grigs) has worked on those issue.  Better running game with Gore, Herramans was signed, not to mention some of the development prospects that he's drafted.  Defensivly our biggest problems have somewhat been addressed in FA and will continue to be in the draft.

 

 

As to them leaving that formula, they haven't, they just don't have the right type of players yet for the system.  We saw flashes of our dominating D last year.  Be patient grasshopper!

[Gavin]

Feel better?

[ColtRider]

Like your philosophy, Grigs build the lines plz.. IMO, I believe that is the full intention of the Colts with this year's draft where building both lines are concerned. I'm going to wait and see what happens in a couple days before I can fully form an opinion with regards to these wide-gapping holes on DL. OL needs one more good-to-great plug as well. ILB and S are front-runners after the lines. We'll see soon.

[coltsfanmilyman]

Hey Gavin, Is your Avatar Freeman asking Colts Management what gives on the new contract?

[21isSuperman]

Do you realize that the management was different during the Manning years than now?

[Gavin]

Hey Gavin, Is your Avatar Freeman asking Colts Management what gives on the new contract?

No, He is saying Im here boss, don't start the season without me

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Do you realize that the management was different during the Manning years than now?

Yes I do 21, but they continue the same "style" of football regardless of who is running the program.

Pass first and run the ball......meh. Teams that win it all are generally strong up front, until we fix

this problem then we will continue to be pretenders in the playoffs.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Feel better?

Yes I do. I just don't want to waste Luck's career like Manning's with this way of thinking.

[Everyone]

Yes I do 21, but they continue the same "style" of football regardless of who is running the program.

Pass first and run the ball......meh. Teams that win it all are generally strong up front, until we fix

this problem then we will continue to be pretenders in the playoffs.

You act as though they haven't tried to fix the run game.

[coltsfanmilyman]

Yes I do. I just don't want to waste Luck's career like Manning's with this way of thinking.

Irsay has said himself he will not allow that again and I believe he's shown that.  He will continue to do so as well, he like all of us want more rings and he knows that he has to protect Luck and upgrade defensively.  Thats why the HC and DC are who they are and he figured what better way to foster Andrew than by bringing in his old OC.  I personally think its a heck of alot better than the Polian years.  So much more excitment, intrigue,speculation.  It makes it SOOO much MORE enjoyable to be a fan our the Shoe          

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

 

You act as though they haven't tried to fix the run game.

 

You act as though they haven't tried to fix the run game.

If Herramins pans out then yes, if not, then we are gambling on the young guys taking the next step forward.

I'm not totally sold on an aging Gore like most posters on here but I am hoping he does well.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Irsay has said himself he will not allow that again and I believe he's shown that.  He will continue to do so as well, he like all of us want more rings and he knows that he has to protect Luck and upgrade defensively.  Thats why the HC and DC are who they are and he figured what better way to foster Andrew than by bringing in his old OC.  I personally think its a heck of alot better than the Polian years.  So much more excitment, intrigue,speculation.  It makes it SOOO much MORE enjoyable to be a fan our the Shoe          

We will see if they are serious about what they say with the first pick in the draft. If it's not a lineman or safety then I'm gonna

be disappointed in thinking they are truly wanting to steer from their old philosophy. We are making gains in the playoffs, but the

running game on both sides of the ball are stopping us from getting over the hump.

 

You're right, it's good to be a Colts fan. We may be spoiled but we have a QB that can win multiples if they get the right blueprint.

[Smonroe]

Yes I do. I just don't want to waste Luck's career like Manning's with this way of thinking.

Not every great QB wins multiple SBs. Aaron Rodgers is considered the best QB in the league, right? Why don't we hear about Packer management wasting his talent?

And the current 'soft' team has gotten further every year.

But I like your avatar!

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Not every great QB wins multiple SBs. Aaron Rodgers is considered the best QB in the league, right? Why don't we hear about Packer management wasting his talent?

And the current 'soft' team has gotten further every year.

But I like your avatar! 

The Pack kinda rely on a strong passing attack as we do. Sometimes a blind squirrel gets a nut with this style, but i would prefer

more of smash mouth style of play and allow Luck to work with more in the running game and less weapons in

the receiving corp, as Brady has done with over the years.

 

And yes, My avatar is a nice little break from the others. 

[21isSuperman]

Yes I do 21, but they continue the same "style" of football regardless of who is running the program.

Pass first and run the ball......meh. Teams that win it all are generally strong up front, until we fix

this problem then we will continue to be pretenders in the playoffs.

The problem is you can't please everyone.  If you surround Luck with a lot of good defensive talent like the Seahawks have with Wilson, then you have people who say we aren't using all of Luck's potential because we aren't surrounding him with stars.  If you give Luck a lot of weapons, you have people who say we aren't building to team to have a strong defense and running game and we're relying too much on Luck.

 

For what it's worth, I agree with your sentiment.  I would rather see us spend for defensive free agents and invest more on the defensive side of the ball.  A QB like Luck can make average receivers look pretty good.  Not only that, but a lot of players want the opportunity to play with Luck, so they might be willing to take smaller deals to play here.

 

To be fair, Grigson has tried.  He's been looking for talent all over the place and he's been aggressive in bringing talent in.  Guys like Arthur Jones, Langford, Trent Cole, Redding, RJF, etc. were all brought in to help the defense.  Some haven't panned out, but he has certainly tried.  With that said, this isn't an effort-based business.  It's great to try, but he needs his signings and draft picks to make more of an impact.

[Gavin]

Yes I do. I just don't want to waste Luck's career like Manning's with this way of thinking.

Completely understand that and I agree 100%. My thing is this though, When it comes to the draft ya go BPA unless BPA and need grades are basically the same THEN you go with the need, you address your needs through FA with proven players....If they are not there then so be it, ya cant be drafting for need otherwise because that's how you end up with a much less talented guy, Example: Im not passing up on a Phillip Dorsett or a Dorial Green Beckham (If he is even on the Colts board) for a Michael Bennett or even a Carl Davis

[crazycolt1]

Yes I do 21, but they continue the same "style" of football regardless of who is running the program.

Pass first and run the ball......meh. Teams that win it all are generally strong up front, until we fix

this problem then we will continue to be pretenders in the playoffs.

Pretenders? I would say at this point that making the AFC championship game is a little better than just pretenders. Just three years into a total rebuild and IMO are already real close to being the #1 or #2 seed in the AFC. If my memory serves me the Colts were running the football a lot more and just was a couple of players away from doing that. We did have serious RB injuries to deal with and that played a part. Having 12 different starting lineups on the offensive line was the main reason we struggled in the run game along with the injuries. I do not believe the Colts style is to throw the football the bigger part of the time. It become what we had to do to win and not by choice.

[akcolt]

We will see if they are serious about what they say with the first pick in the draft. If it's not a lineman or safety then I'm gonna

be disappointed in thinking they are truly wanting to steer from their old philosophy. We are making gains in the playoffs, but the

running game on both sides of the ball are stopping us from getting over the hump.

You're right, it's good to be a Colts fan. We may be spoiled but we have a QB that can win multiples if they get the right blueprint.

I think Grig's has tried to give Luck a running game. He has spent picks on the O Line and the Richardson trade.

Trent back fired and set us back but it was a clear desire to pair Luck with a power running game. Trent was by nearly all accountants a can't miss RB.

He has tried and been more successful at stopping the run on D save NE.

It takes time things are close to coming together. We have 9 picks in the draft lets see what we look like in a week

[ponyboy]

@Grigs build the line

 

Your posts are so hard to read.  I read about 3 or 4 words and then my eyes shift back to the left and up for some reason   Just your posts though --  it's hard to explain.

[NewColtsFan]

Yes I'm taking a jab at the management in this post. Throughout the Manning year's and now early on in

Luck's young career, they are more worried about a high flying passing attack than a strong running game

and controlling the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball.

 

Luck is an awesome talent and I believe he could do more with a strong running game that would open

up the play action pass, and a solid line to pass protect and blow open running lanes to allow the play

action pass to take effect.

During the run of the XLI playoff's, the Colts ran the ball well with Dom Rhodes and the defense had

a tough run defense that held their own during most of the playoffs. Why not go back to THAT blueprint?

 

In the off season, they went out and spent even more cap space on the receiving corp with the addition

of an aging Johnson, instead of focusing on the running game. `save Gore, speaking about the lines here'

 

In closing, my concern is that Luck has potential to be a multiple SB winning QB and I don't want his career

to be wasted away with the old philosophy of soft, aerial assault style of play, that crumbles in the playoffs

against teams that run the ball, stop the run and control the lines.

 

If we keep doing what we are doing then expect to keep getting what we are getting, soft football that 

loses in the playoffs. I needed to get that off of my chest. 

 

 

I don't know why it was on your chest in the first place.    Perhaps where you live you can't see Colts games on TV?

 

In his first three years,  Grigson has attempted to build a power running game....

 

Traded a #1 for Trent.

Drafted Mewhort in the 2nd

Drafted Thornton in the 3rd

Drafted Holmes in the 4th

Signed Cherilous to a huge contract

Signed Thomas to a good contract

Signed Bradshaw twice

Drafted Ballard

 

 

The efforts have not paid off.   But you write as if the Colts/Grigson have done nothing to try and establish a ground game to take pressure off of Luck.    Nothing could be further from the truth.

 

Grigson has openly talked about protecting Luck, about getting him weapons. about giving him a running game,  and about building a solid defense.

 

But he's only had three years.    You can't build a complete team as fast as fans want.

 

You may not know this,  but Grigson has positioned the Colts to be the only playoff team to have big $$$ to spend each free agent period.

 

Grigson has done a very good job and the proof is in the results.

 

He's made mistakes.   The jury is in on some... (Trent and LeRon most notable)   But guys like Werner, Thornton, Holmes and Hughes can all get better and I expect them to this year.    If they don't, some of them could soon be gone as well.

 

But to write that the new regime is making the same mistakes as the old one completely misses what our front office has tried to do....

[Superman]

Good heavens...

[NewColtsFan]

Good heavens...

 

Yeah...   that's what I was trying to say....

 

You were a little more succinct!     

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Pretenders? I would say at this point that making the AFC championship game is a little better than just pretenders. Just three years into a total rebuild and IMO are already real close to being the #1 or #2 seed in the AFC. If my memory serves me the Colts were running the football a lot more and just was a couple of players away from doing that. We did have serious RB injuries to deal with and that played a part. Having 12 different starting lineups on the offensive line was the main reason we struggled in the run game along with the injuries. I do not believe the Colts style is to throw the football the bigger part of the time. It become what we had to do to win and not by choice.

Until we do something about the run game on both sides of the ball, I guess we can pretend that we can win

a Superbowl. The often injured RB situation took a toll on the program for sure, can't argue with your post at all.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

I think Grig's has tried to give Luck a running game. He has spent picks on the O Line and the Richardson trade.

Trent back fired and set us back but it was a clear desire to pair Luck with a power running game. Trent was by nearly all accountants a can't miss RB.

He has tried and been more successful at stopping the run on D save NE.

It takes time things are close to coming together. We have 9 picks in the draft lets see what we look like in a week

The Trent trade set us back more than most people realize, myself included. 

[Colts_Fan12]

I'd be more worried about the D then our run game

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

I don't know why it was on your chest in the first place.    Perhaps where you live you can't see Colts games on TV?

 

In his first three years,  Grigson has attempted to build a power running game....

 

Traded a #1 for Trent.

Drafted Mewhort in the 2nd

Drafted Thornton in the 3rd

Drafted Holmes in the 4th

Signed Cherilous to a huge contract

Signed Thomas to a good contract

Signed Bradshaw twice

Drafted Ballard

 

 

The efforts have not paid off.   But you write as if the Colts/Grigson have done nothing to try and establish a ground game to take pressure off of Luck.    Nothing could be further from the truth.

 

Grigson has openly talked about protecting Luck, about getting him weapons. about giving him a running game,  and about building a solid defense.

 

But he's only had three years.    You can't build a complete team as fast as fans want.

 

You may not know this,  but Grigson has positioned the Colts to be the only playoff team to have big $$$ to spend each free agent period.

 

Grigson has done a very good job and the proof is in the results.

 

He's made mistakes.   The jury is in on some... (Trent and LeRon most notable)   But guys like Werner, Thornton, Holmes and Hughes can all get better and I expect them to this year.    If they don't, some of them could soon be gone as well.

 

But to write that the new regime is making the same mistakes as the old one completely misses what our front office has tried to do....

Good post newcolts but the proof is in the pudding, we are a finesse franchise and have been for the past

two decades until proven otherwise. Grigs is doing his best and maybe he needs a few more years to line it 

out, but it sure appears like the same blueprint of old.

 

For the record, I like Grig's and wasn't calling for his head. I would just like to see more power up front is all.

[ColtRider]

Yeah...   that's what I was trying to say....

 

You were a little more succinct!     

Well, yeah, I guess so. I think what our over-zealous (I'm that way also at times: who isn't ?) fellow ColtsFan is trying to accomplish here is the fact that he truly wants the powers-that-be to not change their (he :JI) position about the lines regarding the draft. I believe that throwing this topic up and pouring out his true gutted feelings, he'll have a better chance of again emphasizing that very thing to ensure it's accomplished in his mind. Could be I'm way off base here, but it just seems that way to me. Learning the ropes of ascension ladders around here can be difficult at times.

[NewColtsFan]

Good post newcolts but the proof is in the pudding, we are a finesse franchise and have been for the past

two decades until proven otherwise. Grigs is doing his best and maybe he needs a few more years to line it 

out, but it sure appears like the same blueprint of old.

 

For the record, I like Grig's and wasn't calling for his head. I would just like to see more power up front is all.

 

 

Not only do I agree with you,  so does Grigson and Pagano and Irsay.

 

They want the Colts to be more powerful up front.

 

A better OL and a better DL as well.     Irsay recently said he wants a defense that can stop the run in January.   That's why I'm pulling for a guy like Eddie Goldman.    Not much pass rush,  but plenty of run stopping.

 

To be clear,  the efforts have not paid off.   At least,  not yet.   Hopefully we all see improvement in guys like Holmes, Thornton,  Cherilus (if healthy)   Thomas (if healthy)   Herremans,  Reitz, Heenan,   Harrison....    am I leaving anyone out?

 

We simply have to get better up front on both sides of the ball.....   Have to if we're to get better.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Not only do I agree with you,  so does Grigson and Pagano and Irsay.

 

They want the Colts to be more powerful up front.

 

A better OL and a better DL as well.     Irsay recently said he wants a defense that can stop the run in January.   That's why I'm pulling for a guy like Eddie Goldman.    Not much pass rush,  but plenty of run stopping.

 

To be clear,  the efforts have not paid off.   At least,  not yet.   Hopefully we all see improvement in guys like Holmes, Thornton,  Cherilus (if healthy)   Thomas (if healthy)   Herremans,  Reitz, Heenan,   Harrison....    am I leaving anyone out?

 

We simply have to get better up front on both sides of the ball.....   Have to if we're to get better.

If the injury bug would cut us some slack and the young guys grow some hair on their n*ts and mature, then maybe

this season could be different. We still need a strong pass rush also.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Well, yeah, I guess so. I think what our over-zealous (I'm that way also at times: who isn't ?) fellow ColtsFan is trying to accomplish here is the fact that he truly wants the powers-that-be to not change their (he :JI) position about the lines regarding the draft. I believe that throwing this topic up and pouring out his true gutted feelings, he'll have a better chance of again emphasizing that very thing to ensure it's accomplished in his mind. Could be I'm way off base here, but it just seems that way to me. Learning the ropes of ascension ladders around here can be difficult at times.

If that was directed at me then yes, "you got me,you got the tater" (Ron White) My location on the left concurs with you.

[ColtRider]

If that was directed at me then yes, "you got me,you got the tater" (Ron White) My location on the left concurs with you.

Kinda directed at everyone to see. Just used NewColtsFan post/Superman's comment -- well, because they're respectable guys IMO.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Kinda directed at everyone to see. Just used NewColtsFan post/Superman's comment -- well, because they're respectable guys IMO.

Are you saying I'm not respectable??? Where is that middle finger emoticon? 

[Indianapolis-Colts-Fan]

I believe we wasted Peyton's career here by not focusing the future in the trenches. But honestly Grigson is not Polian and I like the changes that have been made in the off-seasons. Granted not a lot of online/dline studs have been picked up by us (actually none so far) but the draft isn't even here yet, we picked up proven talent at WR which was a need having let Reggie go, and we needed a RB seeing as how Trent didn't work out boom is somewhat unproven and Tipton is honestly a question mark.

I think this is a little bit premature

[TKnight24]

I just don't care for our coaches, but Grigson is fine by me

[braveheartcolt]

Wanting to do something, versus being being able to achieve it, certainly in the NFL is not like writing a Christmas List. There is no Grid Iron Santa Clause with a sack full of pro-bowlers at every position.

Something like the NFL salary cap 'n draft process, which it makes a little tricky. Stamping your feet and having a tantrum will not change that or make it easier.

[Grigs build the lines plz.]

Wanting to do something, versus being being able to achieve it, certainly in the NFL is not like writing a Christmas List. There is no Grid Iron Santa Clause with a sack full of pro-bowlers at every position.

Something like the NFL salary cap 'n draft process, which it makes a little tricky. Stamping your feet and having a tantrum will not change that or make it easier.

Belichick doesn't have a problem building teams with strong lines and defenses. The Colts could win multiple titles

if they focus more on the ugly positions instead of the glitz and glamour ones. The Pats ran all over us in the first

game with a 3rd string RB. 

 

Signing aging stars like Gore and Johnson is a band aid and not a long term fix IMO.

[amfootball]

As an outside perspective, I have always gotten the sense that the Colts are in no man's land with their football philosophy. When Irsay released Manning and fired Polian and his staff, he was bent on winning a different way by building this monster of a run game and smash mouth defense. The problem is he drafted Luck who is a prolific QB and can sling it with the best of them. When they ask Luck to drop back and just throw it then it appears they are abandoning the new Irsay philosophy. When they are more conservative and run and try to play good defense but lose than they are scolded for not letting Luck loose.

 

I have never understood why Irsay was so staunch on doing things differently. I get the fact that he feels like Indy should have won more titles with Polian and Manning but a smart owner and GM understand where the strength of the team is and build around that. Now, I am not suggesting that they go back to just surrounding the QB with gobs of talent but I think maybe the mindset has to change and there needs to be balance in the approach. If they feel like they have to win a certain way versus just winning then that can cause problems from the very top down in terms of how they build their team and how they coach it in terms of scheme and play calls.

 

One other thing to consider. Dome teams traditionally have never been smash mouth. They have always been finesse, track teams. I think playing in a controlled environment has an effect on the psyche versus playing outdoors especially outdoors in a cold weather environment. In other words, a dome team in Indy is not going to morph into the mindset of an eastern team like the Ravens, Steelers or Pats. And I don't think they should either. I think there are benefits to both as dome teams have had great success doing things their way while outdoor teams have had success their way. I think what I am getting at is the Colts are trying to fit a square peg into a round hole in their approach. That is my view anyways the last three years ...

[ColtRider]

"the Colts are trying to fit a square peg into a round hole in their approach ... the last three years"...

I beg to differ with some of your points, amfootball. The Colts are _trying_ to build smash-mouth football. The last three years have been building the team offensively around Luck. Most of that, not all, has been accomplished. Defense? Yeah, that's a work in progress. I agree with you. Building both lines and surrounding an NFL team with an all-pro QB & RBs is the name of the game.

New England has done this on a consistent (2-TWA ... there's that word again) basis year in and year out. It's about schematics. It's about fit. It _IS_ about putting that square peg into a round hole and making it fit sometimes.

The Patriots have used systematic & scheming football for a long time now. They have learned (Bill Belichick & Co.) that massive lines that surround Brady and stop the run are the absolute keys to winning Super Bowls. The Indianapolis Colts are well on their way to fixating on that very thing.

Don't think for one minute they are not. That's how the Patriots' opponents have thought over the last decade or so. They all end up getting burned!