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Walden getting ejected today was ridiculous. Rule or no rule, bring back some common sense. This official should never be allowed back on a football field, for fear that he might be touched. The total lack of common sense is damaging to the game of football. If a lame call like this would have been a game changer, that would have been sad. It is always sad no matter who is playing, when an official alters the outcome of the game by something so petty. If there was intent to injure the official, that's different. (Common sense)

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No he didn't. The ref touched him and he pushed the refs arm off of him. That's the same reaction I would have if some dude put his hand on my shoulder, boss, random dude on the street etc...

 

The rule needs to be tweaked like how there is incidental contact and roughing the kicker. If Walden picked him up by his collar and said "I'm going to kill you" then yeah throw him out. The ref touched him, Walden pushed his hand off of his shoulder, and probably said "don't *explicative* touch me *explicative*!" The ref wanted him thrown out because he got scared and he's a coward. Don't think he's a coward? Look at that limp wrist flag throw.

 

And before someone brings it up, it wasn't bullying either. Refs have no right what-so-ever to touch a player. Refs should get tossed for touching players.

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No, he clearly had no idea who was hanging all over him, and assumed it was an opposing player. Thats how I'd react. If the ref doesn't want to be touched he shouldn't grab players from behind.

The Walden thing was ridiculous too. Power trip.

I agree 100%. I think the rule should go the other way too, so none of this happens again. If a ref touches a player, fine him, downgrade him, whatever.

 

EDIT: After reading the full thread it looks like hawkeyes posted almost the exact some thing I did. A smart forum member that hawkeyes    :thmup:

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He was engaging an opposing player after the play was over. That will have refs getting between them physically every time. Walden is known for his extracurricular activities. 

 

Walden deserved what he got. I'm happy, excited actually, that he got tossed. Hopefully this may prevent a more serious penalty in the late/post season. 

 

I don't necessarily agree with the call, but from the replay I've only been able to see the tail end of this so don't know if something happened earlier.  My biggest beef with it is on Walden here and I agree with you -- we are lucky the Bengals didn't capitalize on this or gain momentum from it.  We would have probably held them without a first down in the first half if not for this penalty (they got the first down on the penalty then another 1st down on this drive, which were their 2 first-downs in the first half).  We got lucky the Bengals didn't capitalize on our fumbles or this penalty in this game, but these stupid mistakes need to be fixed before we hit the playoffs -- sometimes opening a window of opportunity for someone like Peyton Manning by doing something stupid like getting involved in an altercation after the whistle is all he needs to turn the game around.  I was very worried after they got another first down on this drive that they were going to gain momentum and put points on the board before half time.

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Ego trip by the ref.

It's the same crap in baseball. If you remotely show up these "authority figures" they just toss you.

If a ref is touching you, there's no reason why you shouldn't be allowed to remove them from you. Bad rule.

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He touched a ref so by the rule he has to be ejected however I do not agree with the rule and think it should be amended.

 

IMO the players are not supposed to touch refs and it should be the other way around too .... refs should NOT be allowed to touch players!   IF they do, then the resulting contact should be excused if its not excessive!

 

As it is now, he should know better and never put himself into those situations.

 

I think I know the point you are trying to make, but that can't be a rule.  There would never be a ruling about fumble recovery in a pile if that were so.  Refs pull and touch players all of the time.  Recent;y, I learned they touch\tap players to move them so there is no penalty.  The refs aren't there to hit and cause pain, their touching is to reduce chances of escalations and such. They have no pads, nor practiced that week.  The rules is their protection, and every team and players know this.

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My only objection to this is that if you look close the Bengals player has his hand on the ref as well or so it appears. In my opinion, both players should have been ejected or none of them. It also appears the Bengals player was taunting Walden. We all know Walden has a short fuse and I'm by no means excusing Waldens behavior but it was a two player incident involving the ref. Gotta eject both in that situation

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I would think it was ALL about what Walden said. The push was simply demonstrative.

 

I hope it comes out, but whatever the circumstances and words exchanged - you can bet it was more than likely warranted.

 

We know Walden is a hot head.

 

ColtsHappy

 

I'm inclined to agree, and here are the relevant rules pertaining to the whole event-

 

**************************************************************

Unsportsmanlike Conduct-  (some items snipped for clarity)

 

( b) The use of abusive, threatening, or insulting language or gestures to opponents, teammates, officials, or representatives of the League.

TAUNTING

( c) The use of baiting or taunting acts or words that engender ill will between teams.

(  g) Unnecessary physical contact with a game official.

Note 1: Under no condition is an official to allow a player to shove, push, or strike him in an offensive, disrespectful, or unsportsmanlike manner. Any such action must be reported to the Commissioner.

Note 2: Violations of ( b) or ( c) (above), which occur before or during the game may result in disqualification in addition to the yardage penalty. Any violations at the game site on the day of the game, including post game, may result in discipline by the Commissioner. Any violation of (g) (above) may result in disqualification and also will include discipline by the Commissioner. An official must see the entire action for a player to be disqualified

***************************************************************************************************

 

Wladen and Kuechly will have the film reviewed, and either/both could get a suspension on top of it.  We'll see what Goodell thinks...

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Walden getting ejected today was ridiculous. Rule or no rule, bring back some common sense. This official should never be allowed back on a football field, for fear that he might be touched. The total lack of common sense is damaging to the game of football. If a lame call like this would have been a game changer, that would have been sad. It is always sad no matter who is playing, when an official alters the outcome of the game by something so petty. If there was intent to injure the official, that's different. (Common sense)

 

How do you k now for sure it was the unsportsmanlike touching of the ref the got him disqualified?  There is a brand new rule that might have done it, just before the 'ref touching incident-

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Unsportsmanlike Conduct-  (many items snipped for clarity)

 

( b) The use of abusive, threatening, or insulting language or gestures to opponents, teammates, officials, or representatives of the League.

TAUNTING

( c) The use of baiting or taunting acts or words that engender ill will between teams.

Note 2: Violations of ( b) or ( c) (above), which occur before or during the game may result in disqualification in addition to the yardage penalty. Any violations at the game site on the day of the game, including post game, may result in discipline by the Commissioner.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

So the altercation with the Bengals player might have violated these terms, and Walden might have verbally accosted the official too, which gets you kicked as well.  Then came the touching.  No matter what, Goodell will know because the incident has to be reported in detail, so further punishment can be determined, if necessary.

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Those were two of the worst ejections I've seen called. That rule will have to be looked at in the off-season. Both were clearly un-intentional. Refs need to remember that this is a men with grown, PASSIONATE men. They play hard. You can't expect them not to get a little chippy every now and then. It's one thing to look at a ref, and purposely push/shove him, but you can't be ejecting guys because you accidentally got touched in the heat of the moment.

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Those were two of the worst ejections I've seen called. That rule will have to be looked at in the off-season. Both were clearly un-intentional. Refs need to remember that this is a men with grown, PASSIONATE men. They play hard. You can't expect them not to get a little chippy every now and then. It's one thing to look at a ref, and purposely push/shove him, but you can't be ejecting guys because you accidentally got touched in the heat of the moment.

You can't open the door to letting players touch the refs.  Stokley got tossed years ago for something very close to this and it was the right call.  You MUST protect the officials.  With that said, the guy from the Bengals who was carrying on like a small child when Walden was tossed should have been flagged for taunting.

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You can't open the door to letting players touch the refs.  Stokley got tossed years ago for something very close to this and it was the right call.  You MUST protect the officials.  With that said, the guy from the Bengals who was carrying on like a small child when Walden was tossed should have been flagged for taunting.

 

I'm not saying let them touch them, but don't flag them unless it was deliberate contact. I doubt NFL players really think about trying to "cheap shot" refs. You may try and get away with a little extra contact on players, but not the refs. The refs play a dangerous game and they need to realize that there are risks. If anything that power needs to be taken out of the refs hands. Maybe let the head of officiating decide something like that.

 

Besides, Steve Smith and some guy got into a fight and he wasn't ejected.

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I'm not saying let them touch them, but don't flag them unless it was deliberate contact. I doubt NFL players really think about trying to "cheap shot" refs. You may try and get away with a little extra contact on players, but not the refs. The refs play a dangerous game and they need to realize that there are risks. If anything that power needs to be taken out of the refs hands. Maybe let the head of officiating decide something like that.

 

Besides, Steve Smith and some guy got into a fight and he wasn't ejected.

and they need to be protected because their jobs are dangerous.  They are not pro-athletes who spend countless hours in the weight room every week.  A NFL player could do real damage to an official if he truly wanted too which is why you can't open the door to contact against an official being okay if it's done in an aggressive manner.  They are also the NFL's version of law and order on the field.  You can't let players start challenging them by putting their hands on them either, even if it's minor.  If the offical says stop you have to have the discipline to stop and let it go and walk away.  This isn't the first time Walden has done something dumb because he lost his temper it's something he clearly needs to work on.

 

It's sorta like if you get into a shoving match with one of your friends people are going to separate you and that will probably be the end of it.  If you do that with a police officer you are going to get arrested because of who the police officer is.  Officials are the NFL's version of police officers they are going to be protected. 

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and they need to be protected because their jobs are dangerous.  They are not pro-athletes who spend countless hours in the weight room every week.  A NFL player could do real damage to an official if he truly wanted too which is why you can't open the door to contact against an official being okay if it's done in an aggressive manner.  They are also the NFL's version of law and order on the field.  You can't let players start challenging them by putting their hands on them either, even if it's minor.  If the offical says stop you have to have the discipline to stop and let it go and walk away.  This isn't the first time Walden has done something dumb because he lost his temper it's something he clearly needs to work on.

 

It's sorta like if you get into a shoving match with one of your friends people are going to separate you and that will probably be the end of it.  If you do that with a police officer you are going to get arrested because of who the police officer is.  Officials are the NFL's version of police officers they are going to be protected. 

But you have to be able to distinguish between intentional and unintentional contact. If not, guys are going to get thrown out left and right because the officials want to flex their muscles. With Keuchly, he was getting pulled on by players and he got up and started shrugging off without looking thinking it was a player and the official throws a flag.

 

Similar with Walden. It looked like he tried to shove the Bengals player (who I think was Jermaine Gresham now) and got the ref instead.

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That rule won't be changed, so get used to it.  A good portion of that just went into affect (the language part)  If you try to shove an opponent and miss and get the ref, you deserve to get disqualified along with your 15 yard Unsportsmanlike penalty.  Likewise, is you start swinging at the air and angrily  brushing off people without looking to see who it is, you also deserve your disqualification if you connect with a ref. in scrums, I always see a ref grab and pull away what appears to be the instigator, or angriest person to defuse the situation.

 

Ignorance or unknowing is not an excuse.  If you make a turn on Red after stopping at the light, and get pulled over, don't be mad at the cop because you did something you do all the time without penalty, but didn't see that this time there was a sign posted that said  "No Turn On Red" near it.  Not knowing it was a ref and not another player is no excuse.

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NO neither Walden or Kuechly deserved to be ejected. If the ref's are deemed "untouchable" then take a couple steps back and don't try to manhandle the players. This is a grown mans game with big guys and lots of testosterone. If you're going to jump in the middle and put your hands on them in the heat of the moment, then don't cry if you accidentally get pushed or shrugged off. It's a completely different story if a player intentionally goes after a ref but that was not the case in either situation. POOR CALLS!

Football being a big guy's game is not an excuse to be out of control.

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Football being a big guy's game is not an excuse to be out of control.

 

In fact, that is the whole point of the refs- to maintain or regain control of the game and all participants, and administer the penalties for infractions of the rules. To NOT let big angry guys full of testosterone get out of control.

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Complete garbage. 

 

nmotouchref.0.gif

 

Walden was pushing Gresham. 

 

Gresham should get a flag for taunting, and the ref should get ejected for not being able to even throw the flag. 

I agree Greshaim should have received a taunting flag.  Plus it's kind of embarrassing for a grown man to be dancing around like that.

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Unless something was said it didn't warrant an ejection

 

I have a good feeling it was, and maybe the first offense (that I am aware of) against the "Language" used in taunting an opponent. 

 

( b) The use of abusive, threatening, or insulting language or gestures to opponents, teammates, officials, or representatives of the League

 

Believe it or not, that can get a disqualification too. Evidently, the official heard every word, and got in between the players and Walden tried to push off Gresham but got the ref too.  That is a no no also.  Either of those infractions can warrant a disqualification, but it appeared to me the ref was going  to defuse the situation and then let it ride. Until the push off that touched the ref too.  I'll bet there was a (some) more vulgar language used right then as well using any/all of those nasty racial slur words the league has said no more to, and that probably was the straw that broke the camels back and caused the Ref to disqualify Walden.

 

The story will be a good one, I'm sure, because the whole incident must be reported in full detail to Roger Goodell. After reading the report, Goodell can institute further punishment on top of the ejection; including fines and/or suspension. I'm not sure the league will tell us, but they explain it to Pagano/Grigson in due time.  Especially if Walden gets a suspension out of it.

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I have no problem with it because the rule is black and white. Touch the ref like that and you are gone. This was not the situation Kuechly was in where the ref was in a blind spot of his and came up. The ref was standing right in front of Walden and he knows the rules.

I do think Gresham should have been flagged for the taunting though.

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But you have to be able to distinguish between intentional and unintentional contact. If not, guys are going to get thrown out left and right because the officials want to flex their muscles. With Keuchly, he was getting pulled on by players and he got up and started shrugging off without looking thinking it was a player and the official throws a flag.

 

Similar with Walden. It looked like he tried to shove the Bengals player (who I think was Jermaine Gresham now) and got the ref instead.

this rule has been around for a long time and guys don't get thrown out all the time so I think you are worrying about nothing on that end.

Bottom line you can't put your hands on an official in aggressive manner. If you do you are going to be tossed, this is taught in all sports at the peewee level. Walden has to control his temper there.

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In fact, that is the whole point of the refs- to maintain or regain control of the game and all participants, and administer the penalties for infractions of the rules. To NOT let big angry guys full of testosterone get out of control.

exactly which is why you can't open the door to letting these guys put their hands on them even if it's minor.
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So is Walden likely suspended for the next game?

 

I didn't get to see the contact, I just listened on the radio and the play by play guy didn't like the call.

i doubt it. He might get a fine. The NFL will look at the video and see this is one of those by the letter of the law the official had to throw the flag and do what he did but clearly Walden wasn't trying to harm the guy so I doubt a suspension will come from this.
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To echo what others have said, my guess is that it was more of a verbal attack than physical.  If it was simply the (very) minor push, I think it was ticky-tack.  While the "letter of the law" reads any contact, it is not enforced that way.  I believe on the first fumble one of the Bengals players pushed a ref away while they were unpiling - it was a strong enough shove that I noticed it when it happened.

 

What's a Colts-Bengals game without some controversial officiating (remembering last year....)?

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i doubt it. He might get a fine. The NFL will look at the video and see this is one of those by the letter of the law the official had to throw the flag and do what he did but clearly Walden wasn't trying to harm the guy so I doubt a suspension will come from this.

 

Hope so. 

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You cant argue with the rule book.  Walden deserved to be tossed (if you take the rule literally).  However, what happens if a player merely taps the ref on the back and says great job?  EJECTED?  Of course he wouldn't get tossed!!  Refs touching Walden was the primary factor of Walden touching the ref, so to be fair suspend the referee.  That would be justice!  Furthermore Gresham dancing like a clown and ridiculing Walden didn't deserve a penalty?  I don't care if the referee or the rulebook states it, call everything fairly.  Which never happens.  Every game refs have "make up calls" for blowing it on previous plays...  That's also injust.  I realize they're only human too, but don't make petty calls because you're butt hurt that Walden stood up to you.  The ref had no business putting his hand on Walden, therefore he should not have been thrown out. 

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Good to know the NFL will review these on a case by case basis for additional fines and suspension being negated as well.  I'm sure no official will get bad marks for disqualifying a player(s) the has touched him, as he might not have seen the whole incident nor can always determine intent (or lack of) instantaneously.  The NFL will continue to operate on the side of safety, for officials and players.

 

My hope is Walden will no receive more than a fine.  But he was out a game in 2012 with the Pack and two games with us last year. Will Goodell make it a Trifecta?

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