Player compensations- multiple questions

[Coltman51]

With the extension of Mathis this morning and some of the other moves this week,  a few questions came to my mind that I don't know the answers to.  Don't necessarily have an opinion yet but would appreciate some input from the "experts" here.

 

1.  When a player goes onto the IR due to an injury and misses most or all of the season,  does his compensation get reduced based on wording or rules in the contract.   Or do they continue to receive their full contract value?   Workmans comp?

 

2.  If a player is cut from the active roster and placed on the practice squad is that players pay reduced,  and on the flip side if a player is activated from the practice squad to the active roster does their pay increase?

 

3.  I believe that players that are suspended lose their paychecks for duration of the suspension.  True or false.?

 

These popped into my head this morning and any enlightenment would be appreciated.  Have a great day to all on the forum.

[Valpo2004]

With the extension of Mathis this morning and some of the other moves this week,  a few questions came to my mind that I don't know the answers to.  Don't necessarily have an opinion yet but would appreciate some input from the "experts" here.

 

1.  When a player goes onto the IR due to an injury and misses most or all of the season,  does his compensation get reduced based on wording or rules in the contract.   Or do they continue to receive their full contract value?   Workmans comp?

 

2.  If a player is cut from the active roster and placed on the practice squad is that players pay reduced,  and on the flip side if a player is activated from the practice squad to the active roster does their pay increase?

 

3.  I believe that players that are suspended lose their paychecks for duration of the suspension.  True or false.?

 

These popped into my head this morning and any enlightenment would be appreciated.  Have a great day to all on the forum.

 

1. I believe it is covered in the wording of the contract, but most vets and high pick rookies I'm pretty sure demand their full pay.  I think low pick rookies can see their pay reduced if they go on IR based on the terms of the contract.

 

It must be noted though that Mathis is a bit different.  He was injured outside of practice or game.  Therefore since it's a "non football injury" the Colts are not actually required to pay him anything.  However they are choosing to pay him in exchange for the 2016 option year.

 

There is a separate list between players injured while in service to their club (practice/game) and players who are injured outside of this setting.  IR is for players injured in service to their club.  However there is a non-football injury list that players injured outside of the team setting are put on.  

 

2. Yes the min salary for a rookie player on the active roster is somewhere around $400,000 (over 16 games) while a practice squad player its somewhere around $100,000 (over 16 games).  They are paid on a per game basis.  So yes their pay certainly changes between active roster and practice squad.  

 

3. Yes if they are suspended by the league they lose their paychecks.  However I don't believe the team can suspend them without pay, it has to be a decision of the league.

 

Edit: I want to clarify the numbers on the salary.  $400,000 and $100,000 for the entire year and it's split into 16 games.  For example if you make $400,000 then you get a gross check of $25,000 for each game.  For Practice squad it's more like $6250  Of course there are taxes and all that jazz that go with that.  So you can see that going onto the active roster gets you a lot more money then sitting on the practice squad.  

[Superman]

1) The short answer is no, a player's compensation doesn't get reduced if he's on IR. However, if he has incentives in his contract that are tied to performance or availability, he obviously doesn't earn those.  As a protection to players who are injured while performing duties for their team, a player can't be released while he's injured, unless he reaches a settlement with the team.

 

2) If a player is released from the active roster, he only receives pay if he has future pay guaranteed. Any player who is released while he's still eligible for the practice squad probably doesn't have any future guarantees. The practice squad pay is far less than the active roster pay, even for a rookie making minimum pay. And on the other hand, if a player gets signed to the active roster from the practice squad, he gets an increase, at least for the weeks he's on the active roster. I believe he has to stay on the active roster for at least three weeks.

 

3) Players suspended are typically suspended without pay. That's true of drug suspensions, conduct suspensions, etc. There are exceptions, like the exempt status that's being used for Adrian Peterson, Greg Hardy and Jonathan Dwyer.

[Valpo2004]

1) The short answer is no, a player's compensation doesn't get reduced if he's on IR. However, if he has incentives in his contract that are tied to performance or availability, he obviously doesn't earn those.  As a protection to players who are injured while performing duties for their team, a player can't be released while he's injured, unless he reaches a settlement with the team.

 

2) If a player is released from the active roster, he only receives pay if he has future pay guaranteed. Any player who is released while he's still eligible for the practice squad probably doesn't have any future guarantees. The practice squad pay is far less than the active roster pay, even for a rookie making minimum pay. And on the other hand, if a player gets signed to the active roster from the practice squad, he gets an increase, at least for the weeks he's on the active roster. I believe he has to stay on the active roster for at least three weeks.

 

3) Players suspended are typically suspended without pay. That's true of drug suspensions, conduct suspensions, etc. There are exceptions, like the exempt status that's being used for Adrian Peterson, Greg Hardy and Jonathan Dwyer.

 

1. You are off here. . . the late round rookies and UDFA's can have split salaries written into their contracts.  Of course high pick players and vets usually get the full amount.

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Injured-Reserve-rules-need-an-overhaul.html

 

 

http://www.wisegeek.org/in-football-what-is-injured-reserve.htm

 

2. I havn't heard the rule about being on the roster for 3 weeks before.  Is that true for anyone we sign during the season.

[Superman]

1. You are off here. . . the low round rookies and UDFA's can have split salaries written into their contracts.  Of course high pick players and vets usually get the full amount.

 

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Injured-Reserve-rules-need-an-overhaul.html

 

 

http://www.wisegeek.org/in-football-what-is-injured-reserve.htm

 

2. I havn't heard the rule about being on the roster for 3 weeks before.  Is that true for anyone we sign during the season.

 

1) I'm not sure what we're disagreeing on there.

 

2) I believe if you sign a player from the practice squad, you have to keep him on your active roster for three weeks. I should look it up because I'm stating that from memory; there might be some variables I'm not remembering.

[Valpo2004]

1) I'm not sure what we're disagreeing on there.

 

2) I believe if you sign a player from the practice squad, you have to keep him on your active roster for three weeks. I should look it up because I'm stating that from memory; there might be some variables I'm not remembering.

 

On one you failed to include that possibility and only said that they get their full salary.  I believe Vick Ballard right now is getting a split salary due to his low round status.

[Coltman51]

thanks one and all,  I appreciate the prompt feedback and the information.

[Superman]

On one you failed to include that possibility and only said that they get their full salary. I believe Vick Ballard right now is getting a split salary due to his low round status.

You're right, some young players, typically late round draft picks and UDFAs have split salaries where their compensation gets reduced if they aren't on the roster for a certain number of weeks. In Ballard's case, his 2013 and 2014 salaries were reduced after his injury last year, and I bet his 2015 salary is reduced after this year's injury.

However, I wasn't intending for my answer to be comprehensive. In the majority of cases, split salaries aren't an issue. And in the context of Mathis' injury and contract, it's not relevant.

[southwest1]

1) The short answer is no, a player's compensation doesn't get reduced if he's on IR. However, if he has incentives in his contract that are tied to performance or availability, he obviously doesn't earn those.  As a protection to players who are injured while performing duties for their team, a player can't be released while he's injured, unless he reaches a settlement with the team.

 

2) If a player is released from the active roster, he only receives pay if he has future pay guaranteed. Any player who is released while he's still eligible for the practice squad probably doesn't have any future guarantees. The practice squad pay is far less than the active roster pay, even for a rookie making minimum pay. And on the other hand, if a player gets signed to the active roster from the practice squad, he gets an increase, at least for the weeks he's on the active roster. I believe he has to stay on the active roster for at least three weeks.

 

3) Players suspended are typically suspended without pay. That's true of drug suspensions, conduct suspensions, etc. There are exceptions, like the exempt status that's being used for Adrian Peterson, Greg Hardy and Jonathan Dwyer.

A nice concise response that covers all the necessary ground there in CM51's original question Superman. I always wonder though with this exemption status rule how many unknown or less publicized rules exist in the Commissioner's arena of power that can pulled or utilized at a moments notice? I have no idea & I don't go around making myself familiar with CBA amendments or disciplinary powers of Roger Goodell either. I just get suspicious when Roger applies a rule that even the owners who he works for had no clue that such a protocol even existed.

 

The exemption rule just feels like a temperance society enforcing a 1919 Prohibition Law in 2014 to me. Roger has the authority to do it naturally; I just feel uneasy about a little known rule being dusted off & kicked in now just to take some intense heat of Goodell's backside I guess. If I was in Roger's shoes myself with this much player domestic violence backlash at my doorstep, I'd probably do the same exist thing, but it screams of defensive damage control vs pro active responsibility. JMO. 

 

Nice to see CM51 posting a thread too. I can't really answer your question, but Superman covered all the bylaw bases for you my friend. ;)  

[NFLfan]

2. I havn't heard the rule about being on the roster for 3 weeks before. Is that true for anyone we sign during the season.

I think the player is guaranteed 3 game checks even if the team releases him after 1 or 2 games.

[southwest1]

1. I believe it is covered in the wording of the contract, but most vets and high pick rookies I'm pretty sure demand their full pay.  I think low pick rookies can see their pay reduced if they go on IR based on the terms of the contract.

 

It must be noted though that Mathis is a bit different.  He was injured outside of practice or game.  Therefore since it's a "non football injury" the Colts are not actually required to pay him anything.  However they are choosing to pay him in exchange for the 2016 option year.

 

There is a separate list between players injured while in service to their club (practice/game) and players who are injured outside of this setting.  IR is for players injured in service to their club.  However there is a non-football injury list that players injured outside of the team setting are put on.  

 

2. Yes the min salary for a rookie player on the active roster is somewhere around $400,000 (over 16 games) while a practice squad player its somewhere around $100,000 (over 16 games).  They are paid on a per game basis.  So yes their pay certainly changes between active roster and practice squad.  

 

3. Yes if they are suspended by the league they lose their paychecks.  However I don't believe the team can suspend them without pay, it has to be a decision of the league.

 

Edit: I want to clarify the numbers on the salary.  $400,000 and $100,000 for the entire year and it's split into 16 games.  For example if you make $400,000 then you get a gross check of $25,000 for each game.  For Practice squad it's more like $6250  Of course there are taxes and all that jazz that go with that.  So you can see that going onto the active roster gets you a lot more money then sitting on the practice squad.  

A lot of good info there v-2004 with a decent financial breakdown numbers wise. Maybe you already answered this & I missed it, but if a player goes from say the practice squad to the active starting lineup, does their salary automatically go up or are they typically locked into their practice based salary for that calendar year no matter what? I've always wondered that. Math & fiscal numbers have never been my strong suit.  

 

I will admit my scenario would be extremely rare, but if a team gets snake bit with injures at a crucial spot with insufficient roster depth at a critical juncture during the season it could happen out of sheer necessity with no other options. 

[Valpo2004]

A lot of good info there v-2004 with a decent financial breakdown numbers wise. Maybe you already answered this & I missed it, but if a player goes from say the practice squad to the active starting lineup, does their salary automatically go up or are they typically locked into their practice based salary for that calendar year no matter what? I've always wondered that. Math & fiscal numbers have never been my strong suit.  

 

No, they get paid the amount based on where they are at the time of the game.

 

So say you have a player who's on a practice squad for week 1. . . He's elevated for weeks 2,3 and 4 to the active roster and then in week 5 he's back on the practice squad.

 

So his gross checks would look like this.

 

Week 1: $6250

Week 2: $25,000

Week 3: $25,000

Week 4: $25,000

Week 5: $6250

 

The 400k and the 100k are figured based on what you would make if you stayed at that position the whole year.  But that certainly doesn't mean that's your income for the whole year if you get moved around.  

[southwest1]

No, they get paid the amount based on where they are at the time of the game.

 

So say you have a player who's on a practice squad for week 1. . . He's elevated for weeks 2,3 and 4 to the active roster and then in week 5 he's back on the practice squad.

 

So his gross checks would look like this.

 

Week 1: $6250

Week 2: $25,000

Week 3: $25,000

Week 4: $25,000

Week 5: $6250

 

The 400k and the 100k are figured based on what you would make if you stayed at that position the whole year.  But that certainly doesn't mean that's your income for the whole year if you get moved around.  

Thank you for answering my question V-2004. So, if your performance on the field warrants an upgrade, your salary as a player automatically proliferates accordingly. Or declines accordingly based on your playbook application inadequacies on game day. Got it.

 

It makes sense when you remember that the only guaranteed in the NFL if it is offered to you is a signing bonus & that's it. Well, there are workout incentives that kick in too typically as well if you are still on a team's roster. Any contract can be restructured at any time. 

 

That's the only thing I really respect about the sport of baseball: The signed player contracts for your superstar players is guaranteed money no matter what. A sweet deal there. 

[Valpo2004]

Thank you for answering my question V-2004. So, if your performance on the field warrants an upgrade, your salary as a player automatically proliferates accordingly. Or declines accordingly based on your playbook application inadequacies on game day. Got it.

 

It makes sense when you remember that the only guaranteed in the NFL if it is offered to you is a signing bonus & that's it. Well, there are workout incentives that kick in too typically as well if you are still on a team's roster. Any contract can be restructured at any time. 

 

Well if your performance warrants you to be upgraded to the active roster it does.  But beyond that, it's all based on contracts.  

 

Contract restructuring isn't what many people think it is.  The only thing they can do is move non-guaranteed money into guaranteed money to be counted against the cap at a later date.  That's it.  Once the contract is signed they can't raise or decrease your salary.  They can only release you.  (Which is technically what they do if they drop you from active roster to practice squad.  You are released, you go through waivers, if you clear waivers you can then be signed to the practice squad.)

[southwest1]

Well if your performance warrants you to be upgraded to the active roster it does.  But beyond that, it's all based on contracts.  

 

Contract restructuring isn't what many people think it is.  The only thing they can do is move non-guaranteed money into guaranteed money to be counted against the cap at a later date.  That's it.  Once the contract is signed they can't raise or decrease your salary.  They can only release you.  (Which is technically what they do if they drop you from active roster to practice squad.  You are released, you go through waivers, if you clear waivers you can then be signed to the practice squad.)

Off topic slightly, are practice squad guys covered if they get hurt on the field or in the weight room & require surgery? Does the team pay for it via the CBA as a worked related football injury or is the player forced to pay for the procedure on their own through their own insurance? 

[Valpo2004]

Off topic slightly, are practice squad guys covered if they get hurt on the field or in the weight room & require surgery? Does the team pay for it via the CBA as a worked related football injury or is the player forced to pay for the procedure on their own through their own insurance? 

 

I can't say for certain but I'm pretty sure if a practice squad player gets hurt in practice that the team covers them.  But I'm not sure.  

[southwest1]

I can't say for certain but I'm pretty sure if a practice squad player gets hurt in practice that the team covers them.  But I'm not sure.  

My apologies for bombarding you with my odd questions v-2004. I appreciate you indulging me here. It's not fair of me to do that to you. I just refuse to read CBA jargon because it's like reading terms & conditions fine print on a credit card. 1. It puts you to sleep & 2. Nothing in fine print is ever good news. LOL! 

 

Anyway, thanks for playing along. I will leave you alone & shut up now. Ha! Ha! 

[Superman]

Off topic slightly, are practice squad guys covered if they get hurt on the field or in the weight room & require surgery? Does the team pay for it via the CBA as a worked related football injury or is the player forced to pay for the procedure on their own through their own insurance? 

 

Pretty sure the player winds up getting an injury settlement and released from the roster. There's no reserve list for injured practice squad players, so you have to free up the roster spot. But if they get hurt working for you, they're still entitled to pay and coverage.