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Reitz signs tender.


Dustin

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These same people continually defended starting McGlynn and Satele over other more capable players, citing "if they can't beat them out, obviously the coaches know something we don't.."

Well, now those same guys that "couldn't beat" these inept players out are still on the roster/slated to start while Satele and McGlynn are no longer with the team. That points directly to the incompetency of our staff if we had guys sitting on the bench who were better than our (then) starters (who struggled so bad they stuck out like a sore thumb every week)

I'm not convinced we'll have our best 5 on the field next season, even if we have the horses

 

Ya no kidding. 

 

I'm still baffled by the fact that Grigson is a former O-Lineman, and our Line was that bad last year. You'd think he would've stepped in and shuffled them around until he found the best scenario instead of letting McGlyyn and Satele stink up the joint. 

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Ya no kidding.

I'm still baffled by the fact that Grigson is a former O-Lineman, and our Line was that bad last year. You'd think he would've stepped in and shuffled them around until he found the best scenario instead of letting McGlyyn and Satele stink up the joint.

It's like they're so scared of ruining the continuity along the line that they just stick with it rather than attempt to shuffle it up to find a better combination. Very frustrating.

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Well.... if McGlynn really is bad, then it doesn't add up the Gruden -- who has familiarity with him -- would still want him.

You'd think he wouldn't want any part of him.

Michael Vick is garbage but I think he has "familiarity" with someone on the Jets coaching staff. Can't remember who though

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It's like they're so scared of ruining the continuity along the line that they just stick with it rather than attempt to shuffle it up to find a better combination. Very frustrating.

 

 

Agree. Unless Reitz really never fully recovered from that concussion , he should have started. On the bright side both those O lineman are now departed , so no more of that particular frustration.

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 Upgrade. Sure, by the smallest of margins. But that's still not good enough. 

 

Mediocrity is not acceptable in any form.

 

In response to the hyperbolic bolded statement, "mediocrity" (Reitz) is acceptable when the alternative is far below "mediocrity" (McGlynn) and your team consists of nothing but mediocre to below mediocre guards.

 

The coaches can't make chicken salad out of chicken % but they can at least do the best with what they are given. When it comes to the offensive line, they have failed, as far as I'm concerned.

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In response to the hyperbolic bolded statement, "mediocrity" (Reitz) is acceptable when the alternative is far below "mediocrity" (McGlynn) and your team consists of nothing but mediocre to below mediocre guards.

 

The coaches can't make chicken salad out of chicken % but they can at least do the best with what they are given. When it comes to the offensive line, they have failed, as far as I'm concerned.

 

You're missing the point. I don't care if Reitz is a little better or little less mediocre than McGlynn. Both should be gone and replaced with someone who's not mediocre. That all falls on Grigson. Yes, Reitz should have been played more compared to others, but that's not my point. All of the mediocre players, including Reitz, should be upgraded/replaced by quality ones.

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You're missing the point. I don't care if Reitz is a little better or little less mediocre than McGlynn. Both should be gone and replaced with someone who's not mediocre. That all falls on Grigson. Yes, Reitz should have been played more compared to others, but that's not my point. All of the mediocre players, including Reitz, should be upgraded/replaced by quality ones.

I'm on record in favor for selling out on the O line. Break the bank, over draft, I don't care as long as we get the best.

That being said, I realize this isn't Madden and there are a lot of factors involved, contracts, style, health, futures, etc.

So my response to your last statement isn't meant to be sarcastic, but if were that easy, wouldn't every team do it? Sometimes we just have to accept that a "mediocre" player is the best we're going to have if we want to keep our other toys.

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You're missing the point. I don't care if Reitz is a little better or little less mediocre than McGlynn. Both should be gone and replaced with someone who's not mediocre. That all falls on Grigson. Yes, Reitz should have been played more compared to others, but that's not my point. All of the mediocre players, including Reitz, should be upgraded/replaced by quality ones.

 

Your point is completely irrelevant to mine.

 

I, of course, agree we need better players on the offensive line, but I was solely speaking in regards to what we had to work with last season.

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Welcome to reality, Nancy Naive.

 

Reitz sat behind The (un)Talented Mr. McGlynn, Hugh Thorton, and Jeff Linkenbach all last year.

Because Reitz stinks too...plus he can't stay on the field for more than half a game.

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Because Reitz stinks too...plus he can't stay on the field for more than half a game.

 

Reitz is better than McGlynn, Link, and Thorton (for now).

 

His past injuries are irrelevant. Being worried a completely healthy player will get injured is irrational and no reason to keep him out of the lineup.

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Ya no kidding. 

 

I'm still baffled by the fact that Grigson is a former O-Lineman, and our Line was that bad last year. You'd think he would've stepped in and shuffled them around until he found the best scenario instead of letting McGlyyn and Satele stink up the joint. 

Honestly, to me, this kind of logic among fans is what is truly baffling.  The NFL, and its scoreboard, are the ultimate zone of "do your job" accountability.  To assume that any decisions about personnel were made outside of the interest of winning right now, is ludicrous.

 

McGlynn and Satele weren't good enough, but that doesn't mean that there was a "shuffle" that the coaching staff thought could immediately solve the problem - especially when history says that continuity among your O-line resources pays dividends over stand alone talent.

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Reitz is better than McGlynn, Link, and Thorton (for now).

 

His past injuries are irrelevant. Being worried a completely healthy player will get injured is irrational and no reason to keep him out of the lineup.

He can't prove himself because he can't stay healthy. He is better than MM....I didn't find him to be any better than Link.

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Yes. The interior OL is still a big question in my mind also. We still really don't know what we have in Thomas because we saw so little of him last year. Plus a player coming back off injury is always a question mark. I'm rooting for Thornton because of what he's gone through in his life. I hope he improves this year and becomes a nice addition to the line. As far as Center goes, I don't like it but I guess all we can do is wait and see.

It's not really a question for me.....I think it's going to be inconsistant...teams will pressure us up the middle and we will be inconsistant running the ball inside. Honestly, I think it will look not much different than last year. We really did nothing to address it, Thomas is coming off a two injuries that either one will likely cause him issues this year. Thornton and I imagine Hughes will likely still be green and make mistakes. I don't see our line improving. Unless we have one heck of OL coach (which I haven't seen a wif of before) it is going to look the same as last year. Had we brought in new starters I would say otherwise but we haven't...we stood pat (for better or worse) and I think it is safe to say it won't be better...likely the same (inconsistant), and possibly worse. To put % on it....15% chance better, 75% chance same, 10% chance worse. Nothing leads me to believe we will lead the league in rushing, sacks, or any type of blocking efficiency with this line. Against good fronts, we will struggle. I think we intend to use schemes, offensive ingenuity, and rely heavily on AL to offset that.

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Reitz is better than McGlynn, Link, and Thorton (for now).

 

His past injuries are irrelevant. Being worried a completely healthy player will get injured is irrational and no reason to keep him out of the lineup.

I don't think anyone could argue with your last sentence. I do think that Reitz's injuries have hampered his development. It's obvious the Colts like him, or at least his potential.

I also think he graded out about the same as Thorton, although that's subjective. We really can't grade them without knowing their assignments. We can only judge them on their actual blocks, if that makes sense.

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I don't think anyone could argue with your last sentence. I do think that Reitz's injuries have hampered his development. It's obvious the Colts like him, or at least his potential.

I also think he graded out about the same as Thorton, although that's subjective. We really can't grade them without knowing their assignments. We can only judge them on their actual blocks, if that makes sense.

According to PFF (I know people either love them or hate them), Reitz was +5.1 in just 149 snaps in 2013, which is pretty great for the limited snaps especially compared to pretty much any other play by a Colts guard in recent memory. That was good enough for 3rd best offensive lineman grade behind our two consensus best lineman, Gosder and Anthony. Whereas, Hugh Thorton was a -15.3 on 889 snaps.

As you said, they don't know the blocking assignments but still that is quite a disparity between the two even using educated guesses.

I know you like Kyle Rodriguez's player analysis. I'm not sure what his thoughts are but I know their are people at coltsauthority who do like Reitz.

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According to PFF (I know people either love them or hate them), Reitz was +5.1 in just 149 snaps in 2013, which is pretty great for the limited snaps especially compared to pretty much any other play by a Colts guard in recent memory. That was good enough for 3rd best offensive lineman grade behind our two consensus best lineman, Gosder and Anthony. Whereas, Hugh Thorton was a -15.3 on 889 snaps.

As you said, they don't know the blocking assignments but still that is quite a disparity between the two even using educated guesses.

I know you like Kyle Rodriguez's player analysis. I'm not sure what his thoughts are but I know their are people at coltsauthority who do like Reitz.

My bad, I may have confused Thorton's score with someone else. I was trying to check CA but they're down right now. They have a writer (Ben Gundy?) that analyzes the O linemen, every snap. It's still subjective, but it is a good measurement.

I like Reitz, I just wish he could stay healthy long enough to develop his skills.

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Here's Colts Authority's Ben Gundy's analysis for a seven game stretch:

Reitz

7-game totals

Run blocks: 14/21, 67%

Pass blocks: 56/58, 97%

Total: 70/79, 89%

Thorton

7-game totals

Run blocks: 82/122, 67%

Pass blocks: 270/302, 89%, two sacks

Total: 352/424, 83%

McGlynn

7-game totals

Run blocks: 73/102, 72%

Pass blocks: 194/229, 85%, two sacks

Total: 267/331, 81%

According to Gundy, Reitz was the best out of the three (in limited play). While none were very good run blockers, Reitz was the best at pass protection.

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My bad, I may have confused Thorton's score with someone else. I was trying to check CA but they're down right now. They have a writer (Ben Gundy?) that analyzes the O linemen, every snap. It's still subjective, but it is a good measurement.

I like Reitz, I just wish he could stay healthy long enough to develop his skills.

I agree that Reitz needs a break (err, no breaks?) in terms of the injuries but unless I'm wrong he was healthy at the start of the season last year and was still on the bench behind McGlynn. Week 2, Donald Thomas gets a season ending injury and a green Thorton gets the green light over a healthy Reitz. It seemed Reitz was literally their last guy behind Mcglynn, Thorton, and Link.

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I agree that Reitz needs to gain more luck in terms of the injuries but unless I'm wrong he was healthy at the start of the season last year and was still on the bench behind McGlynn. Week 2, Donald Thomas gets a season ending injury and a green Thorton gets the green light over a healthy Reitz. It seemed Reitz was literally their last guy behind Mcglynn, Thorton, and Link.

 

Yeah, I'm not sure what the problem was then.  I know he had several concussions the last couple years.  He obviously had more pro experience than Thorton at that time.

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It's not really a question for me.....I think it's going to be inconsistant...teams will pressure us up the middle and we will be inconsistant running the ball inside. Honestly, I think it will look not much different than last year. We really did nothing to address it, Thomas is coming off a two injuries that either one will likely cause him issues this year. Thornton and I imagine Hughes will likely still be green and make mistakes. I don't see our line improving. Unless we have one heck of OL coach (which I haven't seen a wif of before) it is going to look the same as last year. Had we brought in new starters I would say otherwise but we haven't...we stood pat (for better or worse) and I think it is safe to say it won't be better...likely the same (inconsistant), and possibly worse. To put % on it....15% chance better, 75% chance same, 10% chance worse. Nothing leads me to believe we will lead the league in rushing, sacks, or any type of blocking efficiency with this line. Against good fronts, we will struggle. I think we intend to use schemes, offensive ingenuity, and rely heavily on AL to offset that.

I see your point.  A degree of inconsistency, particularly from Holmes and Thornton might make some sense.  However, I think you are vastly overstating that inconsistency and significantly understating the likelihood of development from Holmes and Thornton.  Thornton was pretty darn good by the end of the year - he isn't much of a question mark in my book. That Grigs is projecting Holmes as a starter after seeing him in the program for a year, tells us that it is highly probable that Holmes is the talent he was projected to be coming out of college.  D. Thomas is going to be fine....and if not, Reitz/Nixon/Louis can be productive. 

 

There is every reason to think that this O-line will take a solid step forward.  Colts fans also need to adjust their frame of reference for what good O-line play looks like (not that we've had it), but it will never look like our better lines did for P. Manning.  A. Luck is never going to play QB in that same quick release style even if you call the same plays.  Luck is going to get dirty, in part, because he likes to play in the dirt.

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He can't prove himself because he can't stay healthy. He is better than MM....I didn't find him to be any better than Link.

He was much better than Link overall. Link was slightly better as a run blocker, which is why I think the coaches went with him over Reitz last year. Why they kept starting McGlynn, on the other hand? No idea. Still annoys me just thinking about it

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For the record, and I don't mean to nit-pick....

 

But the guy's name is Thornton....    not Thorton.

 

We're missing an "n" on some of these spellings......

 

Sorry....   I don't mean to be the grammar-Nazi....  and I misspell plenty myself....    Just sayin...

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For the record, and I don't mean to nit-pick....

 

But the guy's name is Thornton....    not Thorton.

 

We're missing an "n" on some of these spellings......

 

Sorry....   I don't mean to be the grammar-Nazi....  and I misspell plenty myself....    Just sayin...

Good catch ewColtsfa...

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It's not really a question for me.....I think it's going to be inconsistant...teams will pressure us up the middle and we will be inconsistant running the ball inside. Honestly, I think it will look not much different than last year. We really did nothing to address it, Thomas is coming off a two injuries that either one will likely cause him issues this year. Thornton and I imagine Hughes will likely still be green and make mistakes. I don't see our line improving. Unless we have one heck of OL coach (which I haven't seen a wif of before) it is going to look the same as last year. Had we brought in new starters I would say otherwise but we haven't...we stood pat (for better or worse) and I think it is safe to say it won't be better...likely the same (inconsistant), and possibly worse. To put % on it....15% chance better, 75% chance same, 10% chance worse. Nothing leads me to believe we will lead the league in rushing, sacks, or any type of blocking efficiency with this line. Against good fronts, we will struggle. I think we intend to use schemes, offensive ingenuity, and rely heavily on AL to offset that.

I think O-line coaching is one of the main problems, to be honest. Not a lot of development has been seen in our younger linemen who have been here a few years. Castonzo looks to be a marginally better than average left tackle. Our rookies forced into action didnt look ready to play at all, and some of the dumbest depth chart decisions I've seen on this team in awhile make me question the coaches on offense big time. I don't know who was fighting so hard for certain players to start (without merit) but whomever it is needs to go, because this unit will never develop to it's full potential if we can't even get the best combination on the field. I really do want to know who it was that forced Satele and McGlynn these past 2 years. That person is nothing but a hindrance to the offense, in my opinion

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It's not really a question for me.....I think it's going to be inconsistant...teams will pressure us up the middle and we will be inconsistant running the ball inside. Honestly, I think it will look not much different than last year. We really did nothing to address it, Thomas is coming off a two injuries that either one will likely cause him issues this year. Thornton and I imagine Hughes will likely still be green and make mistakes. I don't see our line improving. Unless we have one heck of OL coach (which I haven't seen a wif of before) it is going to look the same as last year. Had we brought in new starters I would say otherwise but we haven't...we stood pat (for better or worse) and I think it is safe to say it won't be better...likely the same (inconsistant), and possibly worse. To put % on it....15% chance better, 75% chance same, 10% chance worse. Nothing leads me to believe we will lead the league in rushing, sacks, or any type of blocking efficiency with this line. Against good fronts, we will struggle. I think we intend to use schemes, offensive ingenuity, and rely heavily on AL to offset that.

Pretty much agree with what you said. But, we do still have the draft and there is a possiblilty of drafting a decent interior linemen who could make a slight difference. Other than that we need to hope Thomas is 100% and plays great, Hughes doesn't play like a 2nd year player who never saw the field and that Thornton takes a big jump.

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These same people continually defended starting McGlynn and Satele over other more capable players, citing "if they can't beat them out, obviously the coaches know something we don't.."

Well, now those same guys that "couldn't beat" these inept players out are still on the roster/slated to start while Satele and McGlynn are no longer with the team. That points directly to the incompetency of our staff if we had guys sitting on the bench who were better than our (then) starters (who struggled so bad they stuck out like a sore thumb every week)

I'm not convinced we'll have our best 5 on the field next season, even if we have the horses

We have those back-ups still because they're either already under contract or we could have them back for cheap NOT because our coaches realized they're better than the backups. We brought in competition for the center spot (so obviously we don't feel confident Holmes is an upgrade yet), and let's face it... McGlynn was never a mainstay anyways we got him for a 6th round pick didn't we? Thorton is entering his second year and I think there's plenty of reason to be optimistic about him, and I don't feel too terrible about the depth behind him.

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Pretty much agree with what you said. But, we do still have the draft and there is a possiblilty of drafting a decent interior linemen who could make a slight difference. Other than that we need to hope Thomas is 100% and plays great, Hughes doesn't play like a 2nd year player who never saw the field and that Thornton takes a big jump.

That's asking a whole lot though. I think we would be LUCKY if even 1 of those 3 things happen....let alone all 3 and even that we likely have an avg line at that. Thomas had two injuries and either one could be career threatening depending on how he recovers. Hughes hasn't played 1 NFL game and typically the center calls out all the blocking assignments...thats a critical position for our interior and Thorton did play better towards the end of last season but was far from playing "good". I think he is the best bet for any improvement coming but like I said I don't see high ceilings for any of these guys...and I still think there will be plenty of inconsistancies from our youthful interior. I really doubt Thomas is ready by the start of the season...so it will be interesting to see who starts...probably Costa. If that is the case how confident would people be. If day 1 we have a center that hasn't played and a perceived backup at guard. It isn't like it would be catestrophic...but it isn't a sign of better things to come for Andrew...he will learn a quick release if its the last thing the Colts do...it's like they are training him for it by having a porous OL lol.

 

I'm not saying its all doom and gloom...but I worry for AL. One thing he has is good mobility...but if we keep asking him to take shots...at what point does he take an RGIII hit to the knee and then he becomes a statue the rest of his career.

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You're missing the point. I understand he was a cheap acquisition at a time when we had cap issues. What I'm saying is the coaches started him over more capable players, for reasons unknown.

And don't accuse me of not thinking clearly when you (admittedly) aren't even aware of the facts surrounding our acquiring and use of McGlynn when he was here. You can go look up old articles in the archives of the team's website for proof that Grigson brought him in to start. 2012 was excusable because of the lack of overall depth. Last year, however? I feel like McGlynn was given a starting spot that he did nothing the season prior to earn. And when he continued to underwhelm last year along with Satele, he wasn't benched until the team hit rock bottom and the owner called the team out to make changes. THAT is reality. Your denial does not change it

you would have a tad of credibility if you told the truth. mcglynn was benched for ONE game and for one reason only. money. sitting him for the one game along with the time he missed after breaking his thumb in the rams game prevented him from hitting the final escalator in his contract which was the 90% threshold of plays. the colts did that to a handful of other players also. when everyone was healthy come playoff time reitz and holmes were inactive.  the smart thing to do would have been to commit to mcglynn as the starting center in 2014 but they low-balled him and he walked. counting on Thomas is crazy. a history of injuries and now coming off his most serious one. costa ? don't make me laugh. reitz ? he'd get a concussion after a head on collision with a cotton ball. the only time the line played decent last year was with mcglynn at center and link at guard. anyone who thinks it's improved is fooling themselves.

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I know it looks like that, but all I'm really arguing is this....  

 

Players are rarely as bad as fans think they are.

 

Agreed.  He can provide depth at several positions.  And believe it or not, there are worse interior linemen in the league right now.

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These same people continually defended starting McGlynn and Satele over other more capable players, citing "if they can't beat them out, obviously the coaches know something we don't.."

Well, now those same guys that "couldn't beat" these inept players out are still on the roster/slated to start while Satele and McGlynn are no longer with the team. That points directly to the incompetency of our staff if we had guys sitting on the bench who were better than our (then) starters (who struggled so bad they stuck out like a sore thumb every week)

I'm not convinced we'll have our best 5 on the field next season, even if we have the horses

 

This. 

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you would have a tad of credibility if you told the truth. mcglynn was benched for ONE game and for one reason only. money. sitting him for the one game along with the time he missed after breaking his thumb in the rams game prevented him from hitting the final escalator in his contract which was the 90% threshold of plays. the colts did that to a handful of other players also. when everyone was healthy come playoff time reitz and holmes were inactive.  the smart thing to do would have been to commit to mcglynn as the starting center in 2014 but they low-balled him and he walked. counting on Thomas is crazy. a history of injuries and now coming off his most serious one. costa ? don't make me laugh. reitz ? he'd get a concussion after a head on collision with a cotton ball. the only time the line played decent last year was with mcglynn at center and link at guard. anyone who thinks it's improved is fooling themselves.

 

Hold on, Cowboy....

 

Showing up and start ripping people about their credibility and the truth is not a good way to start off here...

 

Look at what you've written that I put into bold....     Your writing this is the first time I've seen this anywhere.

 

You're going to have to back that up with some links to support it.   Otherwise,  it's just your hunch.    You obviously read this somewhere.....   well,  where are the links for this?

 

Wouldn't you think if the Colts were jacking around with players over money,  something like that would get out?   Wouldn't you think the locker-room would be poisoned over that?    That would be the normal reaction in most locker-rooms.   And yet, the Colts locker-room is considered one of the best.    So, something is not adding up.    There are pieces of the puzzle missing and you need to provide them..........

 

Otherwise,  it's YOUR credibility that's on the line.....

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