Let's think about drafting an OT

[evilleseniorfan]

It appears there are a number of OT's projected in the 2nd, 3rd, & 4th rounds that have both OG & OT experience - Mewhort (Ohio St) & Schofield (Mi) and I'm sure there are others that the coaching staff could evaluate as legitimate OG candidates. 

 

The reason for proposing this is the possibility of drafting an OT who is capable of being a starting OG for the next three years, possibly serving as a back up OT and at some point, moving into the ROT position when the time comes.  Many of the OT's in this range are also faster that the draft-comparable OG's and adds a lot of flexibility. 

 

Third round maybe?

 

   

[NewColtsFan]

Since our problems on the o-line are Center and Guard and not so much at tackle,  I'd prefer a guard who can play center, or a center who can play guard.

 

And there are a number of them........

[Track Guy]

These are some of the guys that I like who played OT in college who could be a OG at the next level:

 

Joel Bitonio

Dakota Dozier

Billy Turner

Laurent Duvernay-Tardif

Brandon Thomas (ACL)

[akcolt]

I am predicting OG Trai Turner in the 3rd if he makes it that far Grigs has a thing for speed. I think we take an O Lineman really hope Grigs gets us a couple of extra picks in the 3/4 round range.

[throwing BBZ]

It appears there are a number of OT's projected in the 2nd, 3rd, & 4th rounds that have both OG & OT experience - Mewhort (Ohio St) & Schofield (Mi) and I'm sure there are others that the coaching staff could evaluate as legitimate OG candidates. 

 

The reason for proposing this is the possibility of drafting an OT who is capable of being a starting OG for the next three years, possibly serving as a back up OT and at some point, moving into the ROT position when the time comes.  Many of the OT's in this range are also faster that the draft-comparable OG's and adds a lot of flexibility. 

 

Third round maybe?

 

Until proven otherwise, that guy is already on the roster. And Nixon stepped in and played some Good Guard when asked too.

[BrentMc11]

Nixon and Reitz can play Right and Left tackle...

 

I am with NewColtsFan and akcolt!   !!

 

Reitz still needs to sign his tender however....

[Lef]

If front office isn't that big on Costanza, take his predecessor. Will save $ for next year to have 2nd year left tackle versus paying Costanza in free agency. I have no idea whether front office likes Costanza though but this could help when next year free agency comes around.

[21isSuperman]

I wouldn't mind us bringing in Seantrel Henderson from the U, if we can get him in the 5th or 6th.  If he's available in the 6th round, I say we take the chance.  He has all the physical tools, but has character concerns in the past.  If the leaders in our locker room and keep him in check, and he shows that he has matured, I think he could be a pretty solid OL.

[Defjamz26]

If front office isn't that big on Costanza, take his predecessor. Will save $ for next year to have 2nd year left tackle versus paying Costanza in free agency. I have no idea whether front office likes Costanza though but this could help when next year free agency comes around.

I say we give him the franchise tag next off season. Draft a developmental guy and see what happens. If he really shows he's a top tier LT, then pay him. If not we have a second year LT prospect we can play.

[CopenhagenColt]

If front office isn't that big on Costanza, take his predecessor. Will save $ for next year to have 2nd year left tackle versus paying Costanza in free agency. I have no idea whether front office likes Costanza though but this could help when next year free agency comes around.

Wait, what... We signede Costanza?

[Gavin]

I say we give him the franchise tag next off season. Draft a developmental guy and see what happens. If he really shows he's a top tier LT, then pay him. If not we have a second year LT prospect we can play.

I think we will be able to sign him to a longer term deal at a average cap hit per year less then what the Franchise tag will be

[theanarchist]

If front office isn't that big on Costanza, take his predecessor. Will save $ for next year to have 2nd year left tackle versus paying Costanza in free agency. I have no idea whether front office likes Costanza though but this could help when next year free agency comes around.

George is too short and doesn't have the foot speed to take on the speed rushers. He has good leverage but I'd rather we take Kramer in the 4th or 5th round, put some weight on him and I think he makes a better pass protector than George does. If we can't get Kramer then I say we bring David Puddy in as an undrafted free agent.

[CopenhagenColt]

George is too short and doesn't have the foot speed to take on the speed rushers. He has good leverage but I'd rather we take Kramer in the 4th or 5th round, put some weight on him and I think he makes a better pass protector than George does. If we can't get Kramer then I say we bring David Puddy in as an undrafted free agent.

I predict Newman in the 6th round

[Track Guy]

I predict Newman in the 6th round

I heard Newman's stock has been rising ever since his showing at his pro day. The other thing that also helps his stock that Mandelbaum went down with a back injury.

[theanarchist]

I heard Newman's stock has been rising ever since his showing at his pro day. The other thing that also helps his stock that Mandelbaum went down with a back injury.

Plus, he can climb like a ring-tailed Lemur

[BrentMc11]

I predict Newman in the 6th round

Hello...Newman....sticking to the Seinfeld theme of the post

 

[Jason_]

George is too short and doesn't have the foot speed to take on the speed rushers. He has good leverage but I'd rather we take Kramer in the 4th or 5th round, put some weight on him and I think he makes a better pass protector than George does. If we can't get Kramer then I say we bring David Puddy in as an undrafted free agent.

 

David Puddy as an UDFA?  You're nuts!!  He'll go late 1st-early 2nd.  Everyone knows that.

[theanarchist]

David Puddy as an UDFA?  You're nuts!!  He'll go late 1st-early 2nd.  Everyone knows that.

His stock is rising but his history of face painting is disturbing. His athleticism is not in question

[Manning1887]

I really like Joel Bitonio, but I don't see him lasting until pick 59.

 

Billy Turner is an intriguing option in the 3rd round.

 

A sleeper in the 5th (maybe not much of a sleeper as he may be gone by pick 166) is Laurent Duvernay Tardif from Canada.

 

With Castonzo set to be a free agent and Cherilus having past knee issues, not a bad idea to draft a tackle at some point.

[theanarchist]

I really like Joel Bitonio, but I don't see him lasting until pick 59.

 

Billy Turner is an intriguing option in the 3rd round.

 

A sleeper in the 5th (maybe not much of a sleeper as he may be gone by pick 166) is Laurent Duvernay Tardif from Canada.

 

With Castonzo set to be a free agent and Cherilus having past knee issues, not a bad idea to draft a tackle at some point.

I don't think the team has any plan of letting Castanzo walk. Honestly I think it's a waste at this point to invest a high draft pick in a tackle. And we know that good left tackles don't grow on trees. It's pretty rare you get a real good one beyond the first round. Castanzo isn't perfect but he does some things real well and some things he's pretty average at but I don't think he's going anywhere and if they want to draft for depth at the position later in the draft I'm ok with that but we don't have many pick this year and we still have plenty of needs elsewhere like defensive secondary, interior OL, WR and LB

[Valpo2004]

No need for an OT who can play guard.  Xavier Nixon is our backup at OT and he also can play guard.

 

We don't need anyone to develop to take over the OT position.  We have Cherilus on contract for 4 more years.  Costanzo we need to re-sign long term.   

 

We shouldn't even think about getting a new starter at OT for at least 2 if not 3 more years unless either Costanzo or Cherlius's play drops off significantly.  

[ztboiler]

No need for an OT who can play guard.  Xavier Nixon is our backup at OT and he also can play guard.

 

We don't need anyone to develop to take over the OT position.  We have Cherilus on contract for 4 more years.  Costanzo we need to re-sign long term.   

 

We shouldn't even think about getting a new starter at OT for at least 2 if not 3 more years unless either Costanzo or Cherlius's play drops off significantly.  

We should all be unconvinced that we'll have Cherilus beyond 2015 given the structure of his contract.  Castonzo looks likely to be re-signed on a long term deal, but that is far from certain.  Nixon and Reitz have talent and are versatile, but we know nothing of their long term fit on the team.  Drafting an OT in the 2nd or later as BPA makes all kinds of sense, especially if he is a smart, competitive fighter that can also play G.  You don't have to treat your 2nd round pick like a 1st rounder just because you don't have a 1st Rd. pick.  It is still pick 59 and it still just one player.  Get the best guy possible and move on to the next pick or trade move.

[Rhane19]

David Puddy as an UDFA?  You're nuts!!  He'll go late 1st-early 2nd.  Everyone knows that.

 

High Five!

[evilleseniorfan]

Thanks ZTBOILER. You've brought the conversation back to its' original intent and restated my

intent very well, with the same conclusion.

Please vett the two names I originally proposed.

[GwinnettColt]

Wait, what... We signede Costanza?

Love it.   Can't Stand Ya!  Can't Stand Ya!

 

On a Colts-note, I think we go after a starting tackle next year or two.  We'll replace the RT and then the LT.

[KVerdana]

We need to have a consistent OLine for the next few years. Texans are probably going to get Clowney, and Jaguar's DLine is starting to look scary with the FA pickups.

 

According to ProDraftAnalysis.com, this year's draft is thin at C. But the T and G positions don't look so bad.

[John Dee]

???   GC is a bargain as far as T's in the NFL go.    His cap number from here on out is around 4m...      very friendly.

We should all be unconvinced that we'll have Cherilus beyond 2015 given the structure of his contract.  Castonzo looks likely to be re-signed on a long term deal, but that is far from certain.  Nixon and Reitz have talent and are versatile, but we know nothing of their long term fit on the team.  Drafting an OT in the 2nd or later as BPA makes all kinds of sense, especially if he is a smart, competitive fighter that can also play G.  You don't have to treat your 2nd round pick like a 1st rounder just because you don't have a 1st Rd. pick.  It is still pick 59 and it still just one player.  Get the best guy possible and move on to the next pick or trade move.

[ztboiler]

???   GC is a bargain as far as T's in the NFL go.    His cap number from here on out is around 4m...      very friendly.

Nah - there was an accounting snafu that has kept his # artificially low due to a higher prorated signing bonus than intended, but his base salary ramps up to 7M in 2016 and 7.5 in 2017.  Big cap hits in those years, and he'll have to be playing lights out or take a pay cut to see the end of his contract.

[Dustin]

???   GC is a bargain as far as T's in the NFL go

 

Not really. H'es the highest paid RT in NFL history. His cap hit goes up to near $10M in 2015. 

[NewColtsFan]

Not really. H'es the highest paid RT in NFL history. His cap hit goes up to near $10M in 2015. 

 

 

Don't you think there's better than a reasonable chance that number is going to be negotiated downward?

 

I'd say there's a 100% certainty.

[ztboiler]

Don't you think there's better than a reasonable chance that number is going to be negotiated downward?

 

I'd say there's a 100% certainty.

As a result of the increased bonus proration, it isn't 100% certainty for 2016, but I'd agree that it is for 2017.  With $5.8M dead for 2016 and a cap delta of $4.1M, the Colts don't have great leverage to cut his salary unless his play declines.  If that happens, a pay cut may be less likely than replacement by an ascending player.

[NewColtsFan]

As a result of the increased bonus proration, it isn't 100% certainty for 2016, but I'd agree that it is for 2017.  With $5.8M dead for 2016 and a cap delta of $4.1M, the Colts don't have great leverage to cut his salary unless his play declines.  If that happens, a pay cut may be less likely than replacement by an ascending player.

 

ZT....

 

When a contract is negotiated and a right tackle has a $10M cap hit in year 3 of a 5-year deal,  everyone knows this deal will get re-worked.     It's a given.    The player knows it.    The agent for the player knows it.    The team knows it.     It's going to get re-worked.   

 

No chance in the world the Colts carry a right tackle with a $10 Mill cap hit.   

 

It would be General Manager malpractice if Grigson did such a thing...........

[ztboiler]

ZT....

 

When a contract is negotiated and a right tackle has a $10M cap hit in year 3 of a 5-year deal,  everyone knows this deal will get re-worked.     It's a given.    The player knows it.    The agent for the player knows it.    The team knows it.     It's going to get re-worked.   

 

No chance in the world the Colts carry a right tackle with a $10 Mill cap hit.   

 

It would be General Manager malpractice if Grigson did such a thing...........

As stated by you, I'd agree, but in full context it looks much different.

 

From OvertheCap:

http://overthecap.com/cap.php?Name=Gosder%20Cherilus&Position=RT&Team=Colts

 

No issue until yr. 4 and the dead money hit puts the leverage clearly in Cherilus's favor.  He only has to play well enough for the staff to believe he is worth 4.1M in 2016.  When orginally signed, it looked unlikely that Cherilus would see yr. 4 of the deal w/o a renegotiation, but the accounting snafu changed that.  If he is playing as well as he is right now going into 2016, he has all the leverage to command his 7M base and 9.9M cap hit.  2017, however is a very different story, and he may choose to renegotiate a year early to have a greater likelihood of being on the roster in 2017.

[NewColtsFan]

As stated by you, I'd agree, but in full context it looks much different.

 

From OvertheCap:

http://overthecap.com/cap.php?Name=Gosder%20Cherilus&Position=RT&Team=Colts

 

No issue until yr. 4 and the dead money hit puts the leverage clearly in Cherilus's favor.  He only has to play well enough for the staff to believe he is worth 4.1M in 2016.  When orginally signed, it looked unlikely that Cherilus would see yr. 4 of the deal w/o a renegotiation, but the accounting snafu changed that.  If he is playing as well as he is right now going into 2016, he has all the leverage to command his 7M base and 9.9M cap hit.  2017, however is a very different story, and he may choose to renegotiate a year early to have a greater likelihood of being on the roster in 2017.

 

The first thing that jumps out at me is this....

 

The $10M cap hit is in 2016,  and NOT 2015 as originally stated in Dustin's post.

 

So,  the re-do will be two years from now,  not one year from now.

 

But, when that happens,  I'm confident it will get re-worked.    I don't know how technically that gets done.   Move salary into a signing bonus?    Not sure.    Only that it's done pretty commonly, so there's no reason to think it won't get done here -- that's assuming Cherilus is sitll playing at a high level. 

 

If his play has fallen off after 2015,  then we can say goodbye....   of course, there's a good sized cap hit involved,  so there's incentive on both sides to restructure.....

[ztboiler]

The first thing that jumps out at me is this....

 

The $10M cap hit is in 2016,  and NOT 2015 as originally stated in Dustin's post.

 

So,  the re-do will be two years from now,  not one year from now.

 

But, when that happens,  I'm confident it will get re-worked.    I don't know how technically that gets done.   Move salary into a signing bonus?    Not sure.    Only that it's done pretty commonly, so there's no reason to think it won't get done here -- that's assuming Cherilus is sitll playing at a high level. 

 

If his play has fallen off after 2015,  then we can say goodbye....   of course, there's a good sized cap hit involved,  so there's incentive on both sides to restructure.....

Unfortunately, we won't have a lot of options beyond reducing the base or cutting him if we plan to renegotiate going into 2016.  it will make little sense to convert anything to a signinng bonus near the end of his shelf-life. The league's adjustment/conversion to unintended signing bonus really put Grigs behind the eight ball in yr. 4 compared to how he intended for it to look.  Yr. 2 (2014) was supposed to carry a much larger cap hit originally.  It's just money, and it all carrys over, so if he is disciplined, and counts the deferred portion as dead today, then he has his leverage back in 2016 as intended.

 

The value in cap carryover is more about soaking your dead money back up than it is having space to overspend by signing or re-signing players.

[evilleseniorfan]

Does anyone remember this post in mid-April?

Sorry I missed the round. FYI: Schofield was picked up by Denver. Sorry we missed him.

[NewColtsFan]

Does anyone remember this post in mid-April?

Sorry I missed the round. FYI: Schofield was picked up by Denver. Sorry we missed him.

 

 

We didn't draft Mewhort to play tackle.

 

When the announcement was made at the draft in New York,  Mewhort was announced as...................    a guard.

[throwing BBZ]

???   GC is a bargain as far as T's in the NFL go.    His cap number from here on out is around 4m...      very friendly.

 

 check it on spotrac

His Cap is $6.9M in 2015 and $9.9M in 2016 & 2017.

His dead $ is so high he is ours through 2016. 

[throwing BBZ]

We didn't draft Mewhort to play tackle.

 

When the announcement was made at the draft in New York,  Mewhort was announced as...................    a guard.

 

 uh huh! A LT/G in college, Projected to be a Guard because everyone thinks we needed one, who may be our starting center if Holmes isn`t ready. ;)

 Just wonder, do you think this Rookie will be trained to be the backup RT/LT, learn some C, AND compete at Guard?  

 i do understand his footwork is considered weak enough it is thought by many he isn`t suited to be a RT, so inside is where he needs to be even though they project at G he will struggle with bull and speed rushers in the NFL, it still looks to be his best position.

  Starting RT is what i see/HOPE he can attain Long Term considering his height, and lack of lower girth (POWER) for G/C.

 I see them as not comfortable with only Nixon for the LINK () 4 position guy, and they Liked Jack. He should be as good or better than Reitz as a backup LT in another year, so I trust/like they are planning ahead. Go Jack Go!

[NewColtsFan]

 uh huh! A LT/G in college, Projected to be a Guard because everyone thinks we needed one, who may be our starting center if Holmes isn`t ready. ;)

 Just wonder, do you think this Rookie will be trained to be the backup RT/LT, learn some C, AND compete at Guard?  

 i do understand his footwork is considered weak enough it is thought by many he isn`t suited to be a RT, so inside is where he needs to be even though they project at G he will struggle with bull and speed rushers in the NFL, it still looks to be his best position.

  Starting RT is what i see/HOPE he can attain Long Term considering his height, and lack of lower girth (POWER) for G/C.

 I see them as not comfortable with only Nixon for the LINK ( ) 4 position guy, and they Liked Jack. He should be as good or better than Reitz as a backup LT in another year, so I trust/like they are planning ahead. Go Jack Go!

 

Someone else here suggested that in 2 or 3 years Mewhort might take over from Cherilous.   And I wouldn't rule that out.

 

I do think Mewhort is targeted to play guard at the start,  but his versatility to literally play anywhere on the line is an incredibly attractive quality.

 

I don't see him being a starting center someday, though I suppose he could.

 

But that's because I believe Holmes will be what Grigson thinks he'll be.   Once Holmes is set at center,  guys like Mewhort or Thomas or someone else can be the back-up.