All Time Baltimore/Indy Colts Team

[jvan1973]

They don't care about their football heritage and history, but we do.

then you should have bought the team

[The Old Crow]

I love your posts Old Crow but I completely disagree about most the old Baltimore players wanting to be known only as Baltimore Colts. They had a 75 Colts reunion a few years ago and most all of them , including Curtis and Bert were there. There were a few like Johnny U, Laird, and Matte who were singing that song, but they all also live or lived in the Baltimore area. I really don't think most players from Baltimore care about the city of Baltimore that much, they didnt stay or come from there. I do agree however that this poll is silly because most the people on this board were either not alive or Bears fans when they moved. Us Baltimore/Indy fans are a minority of the fanbase , but there are still a lot of people I have met who followed them in both places.

Until very recently, very few Baltimore Colts visited Indy. I know a few of the 70's guys went there , but that was when Irsay owned the team. As far as I know, only Raymond Berry has gone there from the glory days, other than Shula, who was bitter with Baltimore after Rosenbloom had fired him for blowing Super Bowl 3. I know that Laird likes Jim Irsay, and I don't think there is much animosity against him from old Baltimore Colts. However, there will never be much good will about Bob Irsay. It is well documented that Irsay and Joe Thomas treated him very shabbily at the end, and Johnny never got over that.

I think you are wrong about some of the Colt players living in Baltimore. Sam Havrilak is a local dentist , Andy Nelson has a restaurant, Gino had Gino's restaurant, Johnny U had the Golden Arm, Artie Donovan had a liquor store , and on and on. These guys lived, raised their families, and played in Baltimore. They were Colts in Baltimore. Now Irsay, the NFL, and the Hall of Fame tells them they are Indianapolis Colts. Other than similar logos and uniforms , everything is completely different. These men are loyal to their city , friends, and fans who supported them in their careers, not the Irsay's, his franchise , or the logos he bought. It still may be called Colts, but it's not their Colts. To them, and most in Baltimore, it is two seperate entities and eras , with no disrespect to the current Indy Colts era. They have carved out their own successful history with homegrown Indy Colt players.

[jvan1973]

For being such a Colt's expert , you should know a lot of the answers to the questions you brought up. First , Irsay came in from Chicago knowing nothing about football, and almost immediately started to look to move the team. The Colts sold out every game from 1958- 1971 , and the Ravens have sold out every game since 1996. Irsay came in and immediately turned off the local politicians who might have built him a stadium, and totally alienated the fan base trading away Bert Jones, Rodger Carr , and John Dutton. He went into the locker room and raged at players, called plays from the owners box, and didnt even know the names of his own players. By the mid seventies, remember he bought them in 1972, he was already publicly visiting Jacksonville, Phoenix, Indy , and Nashville. Like Indianapolis 84-96 under Irsay rule , attendance after horrible season after horrible season caused attendance to slip in that city also. It is not just a Baltimore phenominum. As for the eminent domain, it was NEVER passed until AFTER the Colts left. The only reason it came about was as a last resort, as Baltimore officials had already heard the Colts were as good as gone. Remember , reporters were dogging Bob Irsay, Jim Irsay, and Mike Chernoff's every move. Also , Unitas stood on the Ravens sideline, and was totally with Baltimore. I'm sure he liked Manning because of Archie, but he was a Baltimore guy, no disrespect to Indy. For reading so much about the Colts, you left out a few gaps.

Not exactly the way you portray it.

http://www.examiner.com/article/eminent-domain-and-the-flight-of-the-colts

[The Old Crow]

then you should have bought the team

Rosenbloom pulled a franchise swap to bring in Irsay from LA to the Colts, as a tax dodge for him. Rosenbloom wasn't about to sell to local Baltimore people . The minute Irsay came in from Chicago, he was ready to move. He wasn't interested in selling. We would have loved to have local ownership like we had with the Orioles with the great Jerry Hoffberger. What we got, and didn't want, was a air conditioner salesman from Chicago, who was going to squeeze every dollar he could out of a city that was struggling. You guys forget how bad the economy was in the Northeast in the late 70's and early 80's. New York City declared bankruptcy!

[The Old Crow]

Not exactly the way you portray it.http://www.examiner.com/article/eminent-domain-and-the-flight-of-the-colts

Look, I lived this move and there is a lot this Newgent left out. First of all , he's not a sports writer but a conservative political commentator in Maryland. Better sources would be Baltimore Sports writers and reporters Scott Garceau, Vince Bagli, or John Patti, who were there at the time.

Newgent's comments essentially are a condemnation of Eminent Domain , which I actually agree with, but coming to a false conclusion about the use of it with the Colts. As I pointed out, it got back to Baltimore officials that the Colts were as good as gone to either Phoenix or Indy. Faced with this fait a compli, it led to the eminent domain bill as a last resort to get Irsay back to the bargaining table. Then Mayor Schaffer is on record as saying he would have never allowed the Colts to be seized from Irsay. He trusted Irsay unfortunately. This eminent domain stuff is the big lie, started by Mike Chernoff with the silly gun cocked to the head comment, to portray Irsay as a defenseless victim of a big bad city. Irsay was just finishing what he always wanted to do which was to move, and the move occurred before any Eminent Domain bill was ever signed. No one seems to take into account Irsay's state of mind at the time , which was not good. He sent Jimmy to Indy, then asked him why he was out there ! Things were not as they seemed, it was total chaos.

[ColtsHappy]

For being such a Colt's expert , you should know a lot of the answers to the questions you brought up. First , Irsay came in from Chicago knowing nothing about football, and almost immediately started to look to move the team. The Colts sold out every game from 1958- 1971 , and the Ravens have sold out every game since 1996. Irsay came in and immediately turned off the local politicians who might have built him a stadium, and totally alienated the fan base trading away Bert Jones, Rodger Carr , and John Dutton. He went into the locker room and raged at players, called plays from the owners box, and didnt even know the names of his own players. By the mid seventies, remember he bought them in 1972, he was already publicly visiting Jacksonville, Phoenix, Indy , and Nashville. Like Indianapolis 84-96 under Irsay rule , attendance after horrible season after horrible season caused attendance to slip in that city also. It is not just a Baltimore phenominum. As for the eminent domain, it was NEVER passed until AFTER the Colts left. The only reason it came about was as a last resort, as Baltimore officials had already heard the Colts were as good as gone. Remember , reporters were dogging Bob Irsay, Jim Irsay, and Mike Chernoff's every move. Also , Unitas stood on the Ravens sideline, and was totally with Baltimore. I'm sure he liked Manning because of Archie, but he was a Baltimore guy, no disrespect to Indy. For reading so much about the Colts, you left out a few gaps.

Never called myself an expert, just a COLTS fan through and through - and simply speaking my truth.

 

Wow, have you ever been drinking the Kool-Aid!  You should hang with my wife's family, you would get along famously with all your rationalizations.

 

As previously stated, the truth is the truth is the truth and that truth is - a HUGE percentage of Baltimore Colts fans abandoned the team at the stadium level and there is no denying that fact.  It doesn't matter why - if you are a true FAN you don't abandon your team. No amount of rationalization or crying over Irsay's behavior will ever excuse that simple fact.

 

Really that simple. Love how you cleverly skirted right around the heart of the matter and the core issue. But in reading your posts, I can see you are really good at that.

 

Enjoy your crab cakes, I do too every time I am in or near the lovely city of Baltimore. I like Gibby's on the outskirts of the beltway in Timonium personally. Broiled never fried big as a "C" cup - on a good day with the right chef big as a "D" cup. 

 

ColtsHappy

[ColtsHappy]

Not exactly the way you portray it.

http://www.examiner.com/article/eminent-domain-and-the-flight-of-the-colts

Great post - really good read.....

 

Actually SIX STRAIGHT losing seasons from 1978-1983.

 

Thanks for this.

 

ColtsHappy

[The Old Crow]

Never called myself an expert, just a COLTS fan through and through - and simply speaking my truth.

 

Wow, have you ever been drinking the Kool-Aid!  You should hang with my wife's family, you would get along famously with all your rationalizations.

 

As previously stated, the truth is the truth is the truth and that truth is - a HUGE percentage of Baltimore Colts fans abandoned the team at the stadium level and there is no denying that fact.  It doesn't matter why - if you are a true FAN you don't abandon your team. No amount of rationalization or crying over Irsay's behavior will ever excuse that simple fact.

 

Really that simple. Love how you cleverly skirted right around the heart of the matter and the core issue. But in reading your posts, I can see you are really good at that.

 

Enjoy your crab cakes, I do too every time I am in or near the lovely city of Baltimore. I like Gibby's on the outskirts of the beltway in Timonium personally. Broiled never fried big as a "C" cup - on a good day with the right chef big as a "D" cup. 

 

ColtsHappy

I understand where you are coming from, and although I was once like your relatives, after 30 years I see both sides of the story . Trust me, I know Baltimore officials goofed up, and we did many things to lose the Colts. I've admitted that in numerous posts. Usually, I have to straighten out some newer Colt fans who just blame our city, and give Bob Irsay a complete pass. This is when I challenge the revisionist history. The truth always lies somewhere in the middle.

I will , however , challenge your assertion that we abandoned the Colts, we didn't. Attendance was down like it is any other city when you are going 2-12, and 0-8-1 year after year. Elway was traded for basically nothing, morale was low, but the fans would have come back if Irsay gave them any signs of hope. You only have to look at the Orioles , and how the fans came back when blundering Angelos gave them some hope , after 14 losing seasons . Attendance also fell in Indy 84-96 when Irsay continued to mismanage the Colts, but nobody accused them of abandoning the team. The fans were temporarily down in the tooth like we were.

Can you imagine if Bob Irsay had lived, and Manning refused to come to Indy when he was drafted ? They may have well been in LA, as attendance would have been low, fan morale busted, and you guys would have been accused of abandoning your team. Fortunately for you guys, Jimmy took over the team and figured out how to run a team doing the opposite of what his father had done. The bottom line is I never abandoned the Colts, your relatives never abandoned them, and Baltimore never abandoned them. We love the Baltimore Colts to this day, and all the ex-players. It is true that most cities would have let all this go, but why should we , it was a great, fun , and proud history. I'm not taking away anything from the Indianapolis Colts, they have their own great history. It just seems contrived to compare the two eras. You see, our permanent past is the Baltimore Colts. We will never abandon the history, heritage , and players. 30 years later that history is still strong , and passed down to future generations . Soon we will have the Lenny Moore statue joining the Unitas statue outside the stadium. We have the Baltimore Colt Hall of Famers in the Ravens Ring of Honor, and a Sports legends museum that had a whole Baltimore Colts section, including the Super Bowl 5 trophy. 30 years later, this hardly seems like a community that abandoned the Baltimore Colts. The Baltimore Ravens are the present and future, and the link between the two is the Baltimore in front of the name. It is that simple.

Also try Timbucktoo and Gunnings near the airport for good crab cakes. I agree, broiled, with huge chunks of back fin. Gibby's is very good . You do know it's close the the old Johnny U Golden Arm Restaurant ? Good talking to you.

[Coltsince4]

Hey gang has anybody around here ever actually blamed the NFL for letting the Colts move like they did??? Betcha you can't pull

that sort of thing these days. Don't know the in's and out's on that story and why they didn't (NFL) make them turn around the van's so

first off the NFL messed this one up one way are another i'm guessing??...  

[The Old Crow]

Hey gang has anybody around here ever actually blamed the NFL for letting the Colts move like they did??? Betcha you can't pull

that sort of thing these days. Don't know the in's and out's on that story and why they didn't (NFL) make them turn around the van's so

first off the NFL messed this one up one way are another i'm guessing??...

As I told another guy in another thread, the NFL had their hands tied because of the Al Davis/ Oakland/LA litigation. They could have tried to stop the Colts, but didn't, because they already lost the Davis case .

[jvan1973]

Hey gang has anybody around here ever actually blamed the NFL for letting the Colts move like they did??? Betcha you can't pull

that sort of thing these days. Don't know the in's and out's on that story and why they didn't (NFL) make them turn around the van's so

first off the NFL messed this one up one way are another i'm guessing??...

They didn't stop the oilers or browns either

[Bravo]

Would take Adam V over "Vandershank" any day and everyday...

Vanderjagt took a lot of crap and for good reason...

[ColtsHappy]

I understand where you are coming from, and although I was once like your relatives, after 30 years I see both sides of the story . Trust me, I know Baltimore officials goofed up, and we did many things to lose the Colts. I've admitted that in numerous posts. Usually, I have to straighten out some newer Colt fans who just blame our city, and give Bob Irsay a complete pass. This is when I challenge the revisionist history. The truth always lies somewhere in the middle.

I will , however , challenge your assertion that we abandoned the Colts, we didn't. Attendance was down like it is any other city when you are going 2-12, and 0-8-1 year after year. Elway was traded for basically nothing, morale was low, but the fans would have come back if Irsay gave them any signs of hope. You only have to look at the Orioles , and how the fans came back when blundering Angelos gave them some hope , after 14 losing seasons . Attendance also fell in Indy 84-96 when Irsay continued to mismanage the Colts, but nobody accused them of abandoning the team. The fans were temporarily down in the tooth like we were.

Can you imagine if Bob Irsay had lived, and Manning refused to come to Indy when he was drafted ? They may have well been in LA, as attendance would have been low, fan morale busted, and you guys would have been accused of abandoning your team. Fortunately for you guys, Jimmy took over the team and figured out how to run a team doing the opposite of what his father had done. The bottom line is I never abandoned the Colts, your relatives never abandoned them, and Baltimore never abandoned them. We love the Baltimore Colts to this day, and all the ex-players. It is true that most cities would have let all this go, but why should we , it was a great, fun , and proud history. I'm not taking away anything from the Indianapolis Colts, they have their own great history. It just seems contrived to compare the two eras. You see, our permanent past is the Baltimore Colts. We will never abandon the history, heritage , and players. 30 years later that history is still strong , and passed down to future generations . Soon we will have the Lenny Moore statue joining the Unitas statue outside the stadium. We have the Baltimore Colt Hall of Famers in the Ravens Ring of Honor, and a Sports legends museum that had a whole Baltimore Colts section, including the Super Bowl 5 trophy. 30 years later, this hardly seems like a community that abandoned the Baltimore Colts. The Baltimore Ravens are the present and future, and the link between the two is the Baltimore in front of the name. It is that simple.

Also try Timbucktoo and Gunnings near the airport for good crab cakes. I agree, broiled, with huge chunks of back fin. Gibby's is very good . You do know it's close the the old Johnny U Golden Arm Restaurant ? Good talking to you.

I would say we will have to agree to disagree. I think you are smart enough to know that on a business level in the NFL nothing matters bottom line except butts in the seats - the rest is just conversation. Look at where Jacksonville are headed if they don't turn things around. (Can you spell LA?) The Baltimore fans DID abandon the Colts - like some bizarre hot and cold love affair - they didn't want them - but turns out they didn't want anyone else to have them either. The pending eminent domain seizure only accelerated everything, and provided an immediate clarity for Bob Irsay - but don't you EVER fool yourself - it was still about butts in the seats. To me, with the city of Baltimore it was a classic case of "You made your bed......"

 

Bob Irsay was no angel, he was a man with character flaws for sure - and he made a number of mistakes along the way - as we all know. But I admire him immensely for packing it in and moving it out. Many Baltimore fans thought it was an act of cowardice - a chicken**** thing to do, if you will.  But I respect and admire him for packing it in and leaving in the middle of the night. It took a really big PAIR to orchestrate what he orchestrated and of course - it left the city stunned, in some cases - probably still to this day!

 

As a side note, I don't know if you are aware, but John Unitas was available for lunch with fans that bothered to get in touch with him, and move him in some special way with a politely and properly worded letter. Of course, you had to buy at the Baltimore haunt of his choice - but he loved meeting people and chewing the fat - and talking about his beloved days as a Colt. I was in the process of applying and had actually sent off my letter when the news came of his untimely death. Would have given almost anything to have broken bread with him. Also nice to hear he defeated Montana in the NFL poll for the best quarterback of all time today. He certainly deserves it. I still can't believe Peyton didn't have the nerve to wear the black high tops as a tribute to him after his death. It was only a fine for a uniform violation (like he couldn't afford it) and having a glimpse of Peyton's character and sense of conviction, I couldn't believe he didn't go through with it. Other than the pick he threw in the Super Bowl against the Saints, it is the only time Peyton MAJORLY disappointed me as a Colt.

 

I used to be in Baltimore a LOT on business - not so much anymore -  but I will definitely try out your suggestions on crab cakes. Will have to go out of my way to get to the airport though, don't really get much in that direction. We have also been known to smack the large blue crabs with a hammer at Dave and Jane's in Fairfield.  Don't really recommend it for cakes, but they really know how to cook up the blues at pretty reasonable prices. I kind of avoid the inner harbor for cakes as they seemed really over-priced a few years back when I was there on a semi regular basis.

 

Don't take it to heart man, it is only football, remember we aren't saving lives here.....

 

ColtsHappy

[dudeski]

They could care less about Bob Irsay. They were the franchise and created all the history. All Bob Irsay did was rip down the image of the Colts. Bob Irsay always did what was best for Bob Irsay. Never forget that.

couldn't care less is the saying

The colts image is fine. Move on buddy. The colts did

[dudeski]

Let's put it this way, I was a Colt's fan long before you were a Colt's fan. As long as you guys bring up Baltimore stuff, I feel it is my obligation to comment on it.

its not

And you aren't a colts fan

[BlueShoe]

Would take Adam V over "Vandershank" any day and everyday...

Vanderjagt took a lot of crap and for good reason...

 

I agree. If I am looking for the best Kicker in Colts history then I will choose AV.

 

If I am choosing a drinking buddy, then it would be MV.

[The Old Crow]

its not

And you aren't a colts fan

I am a Baltimore Colts fan, and you are right , not an Indy Colts fan. I do respect the organization, though.

[The Old Crow]

couldn't care less is the saying

The colts image is fine. Move on buddy. The colts did

I have moved onto the Ravens. The Baltimore Colts is our proud past. What do you care about the Baltimore Colts, you weren't there ?Enjoy your Indy Colts.

[The Old Crow]

I would say we will have to agree to disagree. I think you are smart enough to know that on a business level in the NFL nothing matters bottom line except butts in the seats - the rest is just conversation. Look at where Jacksonville are headed if they don't turn things around. (Can you spell LA?) The Baltimore fans DID abandon the Colts - like some bizarre hot and cold love affair - they didn't want them - but turns out they didn't want anyone else to have them either. The pending eminent domain seizure only accelerated everything, and provided an immediate clarity for Bob Irsay - but don't you EVER fool yourself - it was still about butts in the seats. To me, with the city of Baltimore it was a classic case of "You made your bed......"

 

Bob Irsay was no angel, he was a man with character flaws for sure - and he made a number of mistakes along the way - as we all know. But I admire him immensely for packing it in and moving it out. Many Baltimore fans thought it was an act of cowardice - a chicken**** thing to do, if you will.  But I respect and admire him for packing it in and leaving in the middle of the night. It took a really big PAIR to orchestrate what he orchestrated and of course - it left the city stunned, in some cases - probably still to this day!

 

As a side note, I don't know if you are aware, but John Unitas was available for lunch with fans that bothered to get in touch with him, and move him in some special way with a politely and properly worded letter. Of course, you had to buy at the Baltimore haunt of his choice - but he loved meeting people and chewing the fat - and talking about his beloved days as a Colt. I was in the process of applying and had actually sent off my letter when the news came of his untimely death. Would have given almost anything to have broken bread with him. Also nice to hear he defeated Montana in the NFL poll for the best quarterback of all time today. He certainly deserves it. I still can't believe Peyton didn't have the nerve to wear the black high tops as a tribute to him after his death. It was only a fine for a uniform violation (like he couldn't afford it) and having a glimpse of Peyton's character and sense of conviction, I couldn't believe he didn't go through with it. Other than the pick he threw in the Super Bowl against the Saints, it is the only time Peyton MAJORLY disappointed me as a Colt.

 

I used to be in Baltimore a LOT on business - not so much anymore -  but I will definitely try out your suggestions on crab cakes. Will have to go out of my way to get to the airport though, don't really get much in that direction. We have also been known to smack the large blue crabs with a hammer at Dave and Jane's in Fairfield.  Don't really recommend it for cakes, but they really know how to cook up the blues at pretty reasonable prices. I kind of avoid the inner harbor for cakes as they seemed really over-priced a few years back when I was there on a semi regular basis.

 

Don't take it to heart man, it is only football, remember we aren't saving lives here.....

 

ColtsHappy

Trust me, I'm not taking it to heart. I am fully invested in the Ravens, but letting people know people in Baltimore still love the Colts . We will definately have to agree to disagree about Bob Irsay . He was a major factor in the low attendance by putting poor quality teams on the field , trading away good players to save money , trading Elway after a bender , and threatening to move the franchise almost his entire tenure. I don't know of too many fan bases that could survive that . What you will find in all cities, is that attendance drops when there is hopelessness, but they will come back to watch a good product. This would have probably happened in Indy, but Irsay passed away giving the team hope. So we will have to agree to disagree about the abandonment issue. I was one of the fans at that last game against the Oilers.

As far as Irsay being a good businessman, there is no doubt. Contrary to popular belief, he made quite a bit of money in Baltimore. Like his son with the current deal you gave him in Indy, he wanted more. Irsay took an air conditioner business, sucked all he could out of Baltimore, got a great deal moving to the Hoosier dome, and now the son has one of the best deals in the league at LOS. What is the Irsay family worth now, 1.6 billion ? So sure Bob was a great businessman, and so is Jim, but the Irsay family has produced only one Super Bowl win in 42 years between Baltimore and Indy. Great businessmen, so-so results on the football field. In fairness , Jim has plenty more time to add to his legacy, and I know he started in 1997, so we will see how it plays out. Contrast that with Rosenbloom with three NFL Championships and one Super Bowl from 1958- 1971, and the Ravens with two Super Bowls since 1996. The fans of Baltimore deserved more from Bob Irsay , but didn't get it. He was a distant, out of town owner, who never understood the city, and never had the experience of running a team. I think we were all fine with him moving, but we would have preferred the logos and history stay behind, and gotten an expansion team less that the twelve years we had to wait. I know logos are worth money, but an Indiana branded logo with Manning or Luck would have sold as many jerseys as the Colts logo .

That is where the NFL should have stepped in, and left the Colts logos and colors in Baltimore. Now 30 years have passed , and Indianapolis fans love the colors and logos. I get it, and nothing will ever change on that front. We now have the Ravens. I just think the old Baltimore Colt records should be retired to Baltimore, and I doubt there are many left that haven't been broken in Indy anyway. I would like to see the Baltimore Colt Championship banners flown in Baltimore, as they are ignored in Indy. I don't think the NFL will allow the Ravens to fly these. Finally , I would like to see our Hall of Famers under a seperate section , or with the Ravens. If Jim Irsay ever did that , he would be a hero to me, but I doubt it would ever happen. People who just like the Colts, could celebrate the history that occurred in Baltimore, and enjoy the present day Colts. As it is, you have people from other NFL cities roll their eyes when Johnny Unitas is talked about playing for the Indianapolis Colts. It's as ludicrous as Peyton Manning being a Baltimore Colt. They were two seperate teams in different cities, in different eras. They go together like oil and water. Just my opinion.

My dad lives in Hanover, PA, so I'm up there and go to Gettysburg often. I hit the Dobbin House Restaurant when I'm up there for soup and sandwitch. I honestly don't get that mad about this stuff, and I like most of the people on this forum. You're right, it just fun discussing football.

[dudeski]

I have moved onto the Ravens. The Baltimore Colts is our proud past. What do you care about the Baltimore Colts, you weren't there ?Enjoy your Indy Colts.

it's the colts team. Baltimore colts history is the Indy colts history.

[The Old Crow]

it's the colts team. Baltimore colts history is the Indy colts history.

Technically yes, historically no.

[jvan1973]

Technically yes, historically no.

factually and legally, yes

[The Old Crow]

factually and legally, yes

factually and legally, yes

And historically factual , no.

[jvan1973]

And historically factual , no.

the historic fact is the team that was once in Baltimore moved to Indy. The end

[The Old Crow]

the historic fact is the team that was once in Baltimore moved to Indy. The end

the historic fact is the team that was once in Baltimore moved to Indy. The end

That is a fact, but it's not the end.

[jvan1973]

That is a fact, but it's not the end.

i don't see how it isn't.

[Paulie Gualtieri]

That is a fact, but it's not the end.

 

i don't see how it isn't.

[The Old Crow]

 

Funny

[Paulie Gualtieri]

Funny

i know

[The Old Crow]

i know

Not sure how you guys want me to deny my past that I lived with the Baltimore Colts . I was there, you weren't.

[jvan1973]

Not sure how you guys want me to deny my past that I lived with the Baltimore Colts . I was there, you weren't.

you lived with the Baltimore colts? You should have hopped in the Mayflower truck

[The Old Crow]

you lived with the Baltimore colts? You should have hopped in the Mayflower truck

I should have stopped them that night !

[Paulie Gualtieri]

Not sure how you guys want me to deny my past that I lived with the Baltimore Colts . I was there, you weren't.

That past is over. You need to accept that and move on. You literally stated it was not over.

[The Old Crow]

That past is over. You need to accept that and move on. You literally stated it was not over.

What am I going to accept ? The Colts were my past, and the Ravens are my present and future. It's history like anything else . You guys need to move on with the present Indianapolis Colts , and leave the past history in Baltimore. Stop pretending you were part of the history. Indy didn't exist on the NFL until 1984. That is a fact.

[Paulie Gualtieri]

What am I going to accept ? The Colts were my past, and the Ravens are my present and future. It's history like anything else . You guys need to move on with the present Indianapolis Colts , and leave the past history in Baltimore. Stop pretending you were part of the history. Indy didn't exist on the NFL until 1984. That is a fact.

It is our history according to the NFL. You are just butthurt because you cant move on. I hope you realize as a grown man how ridiculous you sound telling an entire city how it is inappropriate to claim to be fans of their teams history, dont you?

 

Like I said, you need to realize Baltimore fans didnt care about the Colts (idc about your stupid excuses) the shady politicians tried to STEAL something that was not theirs and so the Colts moved to a different city. In that city they have had more success and fans who give a crap.

[The Old Crow]

It is our history according to the NFL. You are just butthurt because you cant move on. I hope you realize as a grown man how ridiculous you sound telling an entire city how it is inappropriate to claim to be fans of their teams history, dont you?

 

Like I said, you need to realize Baltimore fans didnt care about the Colts (idc about your stupid excuses) the shady politicians tried to STEAL something that was not theirs and so the Colts moved to a different city. In that city they have had more success and fans who give a crap.

 

I guess you're going to come on the forum with both guns blazing. I'm not upset or butthurt about anything. The Ravens recently won their second Super Bowl, I'm fine. I also enjoyed the four NFL Championships with the Baltimore, yes, Baltimore Colts. No matter how hard revisionists like you try to erase Baltimore from the equation, it never works. That is what aggravates people like you, because much as you would like to, you can't change history. Its not your history, it's Colts history, and Baltimore is part of that. As I've already explained in great detail, Baltimore did, and still does, care about the Baltimore Colts ,and it's ex-players. Lets see, you say they have had more success. One Championship versus four in Baltimore. I think you had better hit the history books. Check out Baltimore Colt attendance figures pre-Irsay, and after 1996 with the Ravens. I will expect a book report on it. 

 

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

 

It is our history according to the NFL. You are just butthurt because you cant move on. I hope you realize as a grown man how ridiculous you sound telling an entire city how it is inappropriate to claim to be fans of their teams history, dont you?

 

Like I said, you need to realize Baltimore fans didnt care about the Colts (idc about your stupid excuses) the shady politicians tried to STEAL something that was not theirs and so the Colts moved to a different city. In that city they have had more success and fans who give a crap.

 

I guess you're going to come on the forum with both guns blazing. I'm not upset or butthurt about anything. The Ravens recently won their second Super Bowl, I'm fine. I also enjoyed the four NFL Championships with the Baltimore, yes, Baltimore Colts. No matter how hard revisionists like you try to erase Baltimore from the equation, it never works. That is what aggravates people like you, because much as you would like to, you can't change history. Its not your history, it's Colts history, and Baltimore is part of that. As I've already explained in great detail, Baltimore did, and still does, care about the Baltimore Colts ,and it's ex-players. Lets see, you say they have had more success. One Championship versus four in Baltimore. I think you had better hit the history books. Check out Baltimore Colt attendance figures pre-Irsay, and after 1996 with the Ravens. I will expect a book report on it. 

 

 

 

It is dumb that you come to our forum for Colts fans and tell them what is and isnt their history. That is all. It is immature.

[The Old Crow]

It is dumb that you come to our forum for Colts fans and tell them what is and isnt their history. That is all. It is immature.

 

 

Our forum, I've had 2100 posts on here, what have you had , 40 ? I'm pretty fair and balanced on many issues. Colt's fans have a great history with the Indianapolis Colts. If they like the Baltimore Colts, that is fine also. I'm saying that the history occured in Baltimore, and no matter what the NFL and HOF says, Baltimore is part of that history. I reject the move on,been in Indy longer, and other arguments. I like the Baltimore Colts and the Baltimore Ravens. I respect the current Indianapolis Colts. Just don't tell me that the Baltimore Colts isn't my history when I attended games, met a lot of the players, and still see the ex-players at different functions. 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

I'm saying that the history occured in Baltimore, and no matter what the NFL and HOF says, Baltimore is part of that history. I reject the move on,been in Indy longer, and other arguments. I like the Baltimore Colts and the Baltimore Ravens. I respect the current Indianapolis Colts. Just don't tell me that the Baltimore Colts isn't my history when I attended games, met a lot of the players, and still see the ex-players at different functions. 

I have never said it wasn't your history.

[The Old Crow]

I have never said it wasn't your history.

 

 

It's like Spicolli said in Fast Times, " If its your history, and my history, doesn't it make it our history ! All joking aside, there are a lot of people that don't know the whole story of what went down during that move. I was in Baltimore at the time, and I am somewhat of a specialist on the subject. I have to correct people when they just throw out Eminent Domain for example, without explaining the details of how it came to that. To be fair, there was plenty of blame to go around from Baltimore officials and Irsay that caused the move. From an Indianapolis viewpoint, fans were just happy to have a team, and NFL football, and I fully understand that. Since you're new here, I didn't like the way Baltimore got the Browns either. Two wrongs don't make a right. That being said, Cleveland, Indy, and Baltimore all have NFL football, so the present and future is good.