Championship Game is set (Average Joe's)

[Dustin]

A battle of underdogs as the 6th seed (your's truly ;)) takes on he 5th seeded Us and Them.

Both teams were heavy underdogs entering the post-season, with Us and Them at 7-7 and I at 6-8.

The match is set. There can only be one. Who will come out on top of this battle of David vs David? Who is the team of destiny?

[Andy]

Well because you guys are the top 2, you will both be moving up to the Elite league next season. Congrats, and congrats to the winner.

 

Winner gets to choose which team he takes over and what keeper he keeps. 

[chad72]

Well because you guys are the top 2, you will both be moving up to the Elite league next season. Congrats, and congrats to the winner.

 

Winner gets to choose which team he takes over and what keeper he keeps. 

 

Is the keeper based on your latest roster? I'm assuming just 1 keeper, right?

 

So, do the bottom two in the elite league go to the Average Joe's league?

[pacolts56]

A battle of underdogs as the 6th seed (your's truly ;)) takes on he 5th seeded Us and Them.

Both teams were heavy underdogs entering the post-season, with Us and Them at 7-7 and I at 6-8.

The match is set. There can only be one. Who will come out on top of this battle of David vs David? Who is the team of destiny?

Yep....we got the late season mojo going and face off next week.

 

Should be some fun games to watch our guys play too with plenty of real-life playoff berths on the line.

 

Good luck Dustin!

[T Y Goodbye]

Is the keeper based on your latest roster? I'm assuming just 1 keeper, right?

 

So, do the bottom two in the elite league go to the Average Joe's league?

 

From what I understand, the bottom 2 from your league go to the Joe's...and last I heard, it was 2 keepers (I'm the co-commish of the Joe's league)

[Andy]

Is the keeper based on your latest roster? I'm assuming just 1 keeper, right?

 

So, do the bottom two in the elite league go to the Average Joe's league?

 

How it works is that the bottom 2 from the Elite league switch places with the top 2 of the Joe's league. The higher seed (#1 and #11) will have first choice at what team they want and from there they'll pick the 2 keepers.

[chad72]

How it works is that the bottom 2 from the Elite league switch places with the top 2 of the Joe's league. The higher seed (#1 and #11) will have first choice at what team they want and from there they'll pick the 2 keepers.

 

What if I do not want 2 keepers? Just curious. Will I get to draft 1 round more than those who keep 2?

[Andy]

What if I do not want 2 keepers? Just curious. Will I get to draft 1 round more than those who keep 2?

 

I'll have to look more into that, but I don't really see the big advantage of that. 

[chad72]

I'll have to look more into that, but I don't really see the big advantage of that. 

 

The advantage is that you have 1 extra round over others who have 2 keepers to choose from the list of players not kept. If you have a whole slew of mediocre players and just 1 stud, it makes sense to keep that stud and shop for a better than average player from the ones dropped/not kept.

 

I think the whole keeper idea is something I resent because if someone gets 2 top notch players in the draft by virtue of good draft position and keeps them, he does not lose much even if his draft position is terrible the next time. Then, a person with a whole slew of mediocre players can continue to be mediocre because most of those studs that he could get in a FRESH draft are not available anymore.

 

A fresh draft every single time involves more strategy and thinking than just being able to do retain some studs that worked out for you. I remember a guy in my church league holding on to 2 out of the 3 - Ryan Grant, Adrian Peterson and Maurice Jones Drew during the years 2006-2009 and he won 3 out of 4 championships during those keeper league years. Then, I came into my church league, insisted on a fresh draft, we had a fresh draft and he has won 1 in the last 4 years since then and I have won 2. It is all about a level playing field and just because everyone gets 2 keepers, it is not the same as a level playing field, no matter how much you'd like to think it is.

 

I'd think we should just have 1 keeper, Andy, if you are insistent on a keeper league.

[pacolts56]

A battle of underdogs as the 6th seed (your's truly ;)) takes on he 5th seeded Us and Them.

Both teams were heavy underdogs entering the post-season, with Us and Them at 7-7 and I at 6-8.

The match is set. There can only be one. Who will come out on top of this battle of David vs David? Who is the team of destiny?

Congratulations Dustin on a great win!

[Dustin]

Congratulations Dustin on a great win!

 

Thanks. I can't believe I actually won that game. I thought for sure I was done at the start of the 4th quarter.

 

Great game man. I'l see you in the elite league next season!

[chad72]

Congratulations Dustin on a great win!

 

PAColts56, both teams led by Nick Foles (yours and mine) finished as runner-up in both leagues, the irony!!!

 

Good to see you back in the elite league. The elite league is REAL competitive, a whole slew of teams finished 7-7 including me, and I went to the championship game as a wild card (#6). I was hoping for a 2005 Steelers (beating #3, #1, and #2 in a row) like run but it ended in a 2008 Ravens like run (beating #3, #1, but lost to #2).

[pacolts56]

PAColts56, both teams led by Nick Foles (yours and mine) finished as runner-up in both leagues, the irony!!!

 

Good to see you back in the elite league. The elite league is REAL competitive, a whole slew of teams finished 7-7 including me, and I went to the championship game as a wild card (#6). I was hoping for a 2005 Steelers (beating #3, #1, and #2 in a row) like run but it ended in a 2008 Ravens like run (beating #3, #1, but lost to #2).

Well....Foles gave us a good run at it, I was like 2-7 or something when I picked him up. Dustin struck gold with Legarrett Blount though so he earned it.

 

Looking forward to joining the Elite league next year!

[T Y Goodbye]

PAColts56, both teams led by Nick Foles (yours and mine) finished as runner-up in both leagues, the irony!!!

 

Good to see you back in the elite league. The elite league is REAL competitive, a whole slew of teams finished 7-7 including me, and I went to the championship game as a wild card (#6). I was hoping for a 2005 Steelers (beating #3, #1, and #2 in a row) like run but it ended in a 2008 Ravens like run (beating #3, #1, but lost to #2).

 

Silent and I had Brees and ended up third...Our league was very competitive as well..Dustin won from the 6th seed with a 6-8 record, and pacolts was 7-7. Most of the teams were at 6-8 and we had the top 4 teams at 10-4.

 

Grats Dustin and pacolts..it ended up a little more than a 2 point difference for the championship...Good luck in the Elite league next year, kick some butt and show them what the Joe's are made of..

 

Honestly, though I would like to play against the Elite teams, I really had fun this year with our group and am kinda glad I'm staying...you both will be missed next year.

 

Hey chad, or someone, who are the owners of the 2 teams coming to our league next year?..Just curious

[chad72]

Silent and I had Brees and ended up third...Our league was very competitive as well..Dustin won from the 6th seed with a 6-8 record, and pacolts was 7-7. Most of the teams were at 6-8 and we had the top 4 teams at 10-4.

 

Grats Dustin and pacolts..it ended up a little more than a 2 point difference for the championship...Good luck in the Elite league next year, kick some butt and show them what the Joe's are made of..

 

Honestly, though I would like to play against the Elite teams, I really had fun this year with our group and am kinda glad I'm staying...you both will be missed next year.

 

Hey chad, or someone, who are the owners of the 2 teams coming to our league next year?..Just curious

 

Ser Pounce (goes by HOFClipboardholder, I think) and Fx Stryker (same username on colts forum) are the 11th and 12th in the elite league. Ser Pounce in fact has a terrific team but had some real bad luck in his games. With Adrian Peterson and Jimmy Graham on his roster, need I tell you who to keep?

 

Besides, I am not really sure the 2 keepers is a good idea. What do you guys think? I really don't think it gives a level playing field, have never been a fan of keepers, period. I outlined the reasons above in a post. Just wondering what others think.

[T Y Goodbye]

Ser Pounce (goes by HOFClipboardholder, I think) and Fx Stryker (same username on colts forum) are the 11th and 12th in the elite league. Ser Pounce in fact has a terrific team but had some real bad luck in his games. With Adrian Peterson and Jimmy Graham on his roster, need I tell you who to keep?

 

Besides, I am not really sure the 2 keepers is a good idea. What do you guys think? I really don't think it gives a level playing field, have never been a fan of keepers, period. I outlined the reasons above in a post. Just wondering what others think.

 

I have never played in a keeper league..so I really have no opinion. For me, I'd love it, because i had some bad luck as well, and my team is so deep, that I'm not keeping Adrian Peterson next year..if it is a keeper and 2 players kept. (yeah I know you think i'm foolish, but I have a reason behind my madness)

 

I'm willing to try anything once...every team in out league basically has at least 2 stud players..I actually have 5, which could be 7, if not for injuries and splitting time ..but one retired..Best wishes Tony G...have a nice retirement!...

 

I'll go with the flow...whatever Andy decides...

[chad72]

I have never played in a keeper league..so I really have no opinion. For me, I'd love it, because i had some bad luck as well, and my team is so deep, that I'm not keeping Adrian Peterson next year..if it is a keeper and 2 players kept. (yeah I know you think i'm foolish, but I have a reason behind my madness)

 

I'm willing to try anything once...every team in out league basically has at least 2 stud players..I actually have 5, which could be 7, if not for injuries and splitting time ..but one retired..Best wishes Tony G...have a nice retirement!...

 

I'll go with the flow...whatever Andy decides...

 

What Andy needs to be ready for is this, exactly:

 

If a player that is #10 in the standings does not wish to have ANY keepers, he should NOT be forced to keep 2 out of his mediocre players that got him to #10 in the first place.

 

So, what that means is this scenario needs to be considered: 

 

Lets say 3 players have no keepers that finished at #7, #8, and #10; AND 2 players have 1 keeper that finished at #6 and #11.

 

Draft order for round 1 will be for those that have no keepers - i.e. #10, #8 and #7

 

Draft order for round 2 will be for those that have 1 keeper - i.e. #11, #10, #8, #7, #6

 

Then the yahoo established drafting order will resume starting round 3 now that everyone has 2 players, that goes without saying.

 

That is how keeper leagues that I have known have been implemented with choice to keep or not to keep. Anything else would not be fair. If Andy does not want to deal with his hassle, then we should just go with a fresh draft.

[buccolts]

First, congrats to Dustin. Well played.

 

Regarding 'keepers': I've never played in a keeper league either, but don't mind giving it a go.

Does a keeper league effect the draft order?

Meaning, will it be in inverse order of prior year finish, or still random?

[Andy]

What Andy needs to be ready for is this, exactly:

 

If a player that is #10 in the standings does not wish to have ANY keepers, he should NOT be forced to keep 2 out of his mediocre players that got him to #10 in the first place.

 

So, what that means is this scenario needs to be considered: 

 

Lets say 3 players have no keepers that finished at #7, #8, and #10; AND 2 players have 1 keeper that finished at #6 and #11.

 

Draft order for round 1 will be for those that have no keepers - i.e. #10, #8 and #7

 

Draft order for round 2 will be for those that have 1 keeper - i.e. #11, #10, #8, #7, #6

 

Then the yahoo established drafting order will resume starting round 3 now that everyone has 2 players, that goes without saying.

 

That is how keeper leagues that I have known have been implemented with choice to keep or not to keep. Anything else would not be fair. If Andy does not want to deal with his hassle, then we should just go with a fresh draft.

 

There is still plenty of time before next season, so I'll have to think it over. Here are the options I'm considering now:

 

Option 1 -- Keep 2 players and you must keep those 2 players.

 

Option 2 -- Keep 2 players, but you have to option to keep 1 and 1 only.

 

Option 3 -- Keep 2 players, but you have to option to keep no players or 1 player.

 

Option 4 -- Keep 1 player and one player only.

 

Option 5 -- Keep 1 player, but you have the option to keep nobody.

 

Option 6 -- Fresh draft.

 

Right now, Option 1 and Option 3 are the ones with the best chance of happening, but I have to think. 

[Andy]

First, congrats to Dustin. Well played.

 

Regarding 'keepers': I've never played in a keeper league either, but don't mind giving it a go.

Does a keeper league effect the draft order?

Meaning, will it be in inverse order of prior year finish, or still random?

Keepers or not, it's still worst team gets first, best gets last and so on.

[T Y Goodbye]

There is still plenty of time before next season, so I'll have to think it over. Here are the options I'm considering now:

 

Option 1 -- Keep 2 players and you must keep those 2 players.

 

Option 2 -- Keep 2 players, but you have to option to keep 1 and 1 only.

 

Option 3 -- Keep 2 players, but you have to option to keep no players or 1 player.

 

Option 4 -- Keep 1 player and one player only.

 

Option 5 -- Keep 1 player, but you have the option to keep nobody.

 

Option 6 -- Fresh draft.

 

Right now, Option 1 and Option 3 are the ones with the best chance of happening, but I have to think. 

 

One thing that needs to be considered, is that I don't know how long that the rosters will be kept online by Yahoo..Someone has to make sure that all team's rosters are kept, in case of it still being a keeper league. I already know who I want to keep, unless of course they get injured before the season, but by the time the season rolls around next year, people might forget who all they have...Just a thought.

[buccolts]

There is still plenty of time before next season, so I'll have to think it over. Here are the options I'm considering now:

 

Option 1 -- Keep 2 players and you must keep those 2 players.

 

Option 2 -- Keep 2 players, but you have to option to keep 1 and 1 only.

 

Option 3 -- Keep 2 players, but you have to option to keep no players or 1 player.

 

Option 4 -- Keep 1 player and one player only.

 

Option 5 -- Keep 1 player, but you have the option to keep nobody.

 

Option 6 -- Fresh draft.

 

Right now, Option 1 and Option 3 are the ones with the best chance of happening, but I have to think. 

 

Thanks Andy.

I'd always be open to #6, but in considering 'keeper' options, if I had a vote, it'd be #3 then #1.

And I say that not reviewing my roster for who I'd consider to keep. I'm just thinking the flexibility of #3 is attractive.

[buccolts]

Keepers or not, it's still worst team gets first, best gets last and so on.

Thanks for the clarification.

[pacolts56]

There is still plenty of time before next season, so I'll have to think it over. Here are the options I'm considering now:

 

Option 1 -- Keep 2 players and you must keep those 2 players.

 

Option 2 -- Keep 2 players, but you have to option to keep 1 and 1 only.

 

Option 3 -- Keep 2 players, but you have to option to keep no players or 1 player.

 

Option 4 -- Keep 1 player and one player only.

 

Option 5 -- Keep 1 player, but you have the option to keep nobody.

 

Option 6 -- Fresh draft.

 

Right now, Option 1 and Option 3 are the ones with the best chance of happening, but I have to think. 

Andy, I'll go with whatever the consensus is....but don't Options 2, 3 and 5 make things a little complicated?

 

I've never commished a league but it seems like the same format across the board might make things easier for all of us to keep track of.

 

And can we also give some consideration to PPR scoring next season?

[chad72]

Thanks Andy.

I'd always be open to #6, but in considering 'keeper' options, if I had a vote, it'd be #3 then #1.

And I say that not reviewing my roster for who I'd consider to keep. I'm just thinking the flexibility of #3 is attractive.

 

I'd go with option #3 too.

 

Of course, I'm the biggest proponent of FRESH draft, option #6. Let everyone try to earn it again and not coattail on last year's roster strengths.

 

Option #1 would be terrible, forcing folks to keep 2 players would be a gross injustice to most of the bottom feeder teams. The upper echeleon teams would not mind it because it helps keep the status quo by forcing bottom feeder teams to keep 2 mediocre players and not have access to a 3rd or 4th player on a very good team's roster that would be better than the 2 mediocre players that the bottom feeder teams were forced to keep. It would be a case of rich staying rich if you force 2 keepers.

 

Too much tinkering with scoring can be a good thing but can have its downsides too. I like how the elite league is scored but the only change I want to the scoring is give defense and special teams 1 point for every 50 yards of returns. So, a team that accumulates 150-200 yards of returns over the course of a game can have an additional 3-4 points that can help make a difference, IMO.

[Andy]

One thing that needs to be considered, is that I don't know how long that the rosters will be kept online by Yahoo..Someone has to make sure that all team's rosters are kept, in case of it still being a keeper league. I already know who I want to keep, unless of course they get injured before the season, but by the time the season rolls around next year, people might forget who all they have...Just a thought.

 

You can access your team throughout the offseason.

 

 

Andy, I'll go with whatever the consensus is....but don't Options 2, 3 and 5 make things a little complicated?

 

I've never commished a league but it seems like the same format across the board might make things easier for all of us to keep track of.

 

And can we also give some consideration to PPR scoring next season?

 

It wouldn't be too hard. Yahoo does a lot of the dirty work. I've seen it in action before. 

 

 

 

I'd go with option #3 too.

 

Of course, I'm the biggest proponent of FRESH draft, option #6. Let everyone try to earn it again and not coattail on last year's roster strengths.

 

Option #1 would be terrible, forcing folks to keep 2 players would be a gross injustice to most of the bottom feeder teams. The upper echeleon teams would not mind it because it helps keep the status quo by forcing bottom feeder teams to keep 2 mediocre players and not have access to a 3rd or 4th player on a very good team's roster that would be better than the 2 mediocre players that the bottom feeder teams were forced to keep. It would be a case of rich staying rich if you force 2 keepers.

 

Too much tinkering with scoring can be a good thing but can have its downsides too. I like how the elite league is scored but the only change I want to the scoring is give defense and special teams 1 point for every 50 yards of returns. So, a team that accumulates 150-200 yards of returns over the course of a game can have an additional 3-4 points that can help make a difference, IMO.

 

This is what I'll do, It'll be either Option 1,3, or 6. I'll look at each team extensively and see if they have 2 very good keeper players. If I cannot come to that conclusion and I see an imbalance and some unfair situations, I will not go through with Option 1. 

 

I dont know about the return yard points. I wouldn't count on it, I've never seen it, ever. 

 

 

 

 

It's not even January, we'll figure this stuff out. 

[chad72]

 

 

This is what I'll do, It'll be either Option 1,3, or 6. I'll look at each team extensively and see if they have 2 very good keeper players. If I cannot come to that conclusion and I see an imbalance and some unfair situations, I will not go through with Option 1. 

 

I dont know about the return yard points. I wouldn't count on it, I've never seen it, ever. 

 

 

Don't go based on how well they did for a few games, every team will have a set of 2 players that might put together a good streak, that does not mean the owner wants to keep them.

 

Take my example for instance - I busted on Steven Jackson, had to trade away LeSean McCoy for Eric Decker and Ryan Mathews who had their streaks at the right time for me but I had players like Reggie Wayne and Randall Cobb go on IR and essentially, my first 6 picks - McCoy, SJax, Cobb, Wayne, Nicks, Owen Daniels all were not on my final roster for various reasons.

 

The fact that you are making that determination for my roster, whether I have 2 players worthy of keeping, does not sit well with me. If I feel I can get a better player than Foles, Decker or Mathews, I should be allowed to play the free agent market without keepers, deal with the consequences and not be pigeon holed by my commish, period. I should be responsible for my entire roster.

 

That is what I have been saying all along, just gave examples with my own roster.

[SilentHill]

I'm keeping McCoy if we do keepers lol

[chad72]

I'm keeping McCoy if we do keepers lol

 

That is perfectly fine , Brees and McCoy is what I am expecting as your keepers if we do 2. The key element I am striving for is that managers of teams should have the choice whether to keep or not to keep, whether it is 0, 1, or 2 if 2 is the maximum allowed. You probably have played in keeper leagues before and that is normally how they roll.

[SilentHill]

That is perfectly fine , Brees and McCoy is what I am expecting as your keepers if we do 2. The key element I am striving for is that managers of teams should have the choice whether to keep or not to keep, whether it is 0, 1, or 2 if 2 is the maximum allowed. You probably have played in keeper leagues before and that is normally how they roll.

 

There is still time, trade fresh for jamaal charles ;)

[SilentHill]

That is perfectly fine , Brees and McCoy is what I am expecting as your keepers if we do 2. The key element I am striving for is that managers of teams should have the choice whether to keep or not to keep, whether it is 0, 1, or 2 if 2 is the maximum allowed. You probably have played in keeper leagues before and that is normally how they roll.

 

My problem with a keeper league is that they are all done different, I want to know who's keeping what before I decide who i'm keeping.

 

We should probably set a date to have your keeper(s) in by and then give one week to make changes, then it's locked in. This date would be around draft time though, as you don't want to be stuck with someone who gets hurt during the off-season.

[chad72]

There is still time, trade fresh for jamaal charles ;)

 

I would be shocked if Fresh4Life did not have him in his keepers list.

 

We will see how things roll when the next FF season starts.

 

Plus, everyone has decisions to make based on free agency. Eric Decker, Knowshon Moreno are both free agents, and so on...

[chad72]

My problem with a keeper league is that they are all done different, I want to know who's keeping what before I decide who i'm keeping.

 

We should probably set a date to have your keeper(s) in by and then give one week to make changes, then it's locked in. This date would be around draft time though, as you don't want to be stuck with someone who gets hurt during the off-season.

 

I totally agree with this. I just need the option to not keep any if I didn't want to. I probably won't keep any because I like to start things fresh every season but that is just me.

[buccolts]

If #1 were the verdict, I'd be O.K. with it, as I don't there's a guarantee anyone is a lock in any round.

All positions are subject to injury, down seasons, etc.

It's really a crap shoot anyway.

 

But, I do prefer #3 to #1. Just for flexibility's sake.

Either/any way, I'm in.

[Dustin]

I'd also like to recommend that we move the playoffs up a week so we don't have to worry about guys resting. 

[Andy]

I will make some decisions over hte next few days.

 

As for the schedule, I will make it finish one week earlier, but it means that you won't play one team next year. 

[Andy]

Ok, I've made my decision, here it is:

 

We will go with Option 3, where you will have the option of choosing 2 keepers, but will not be forced to. You could choose one or none if you want.

 

I always want what's fair and I think doing this will keep the league exciting and at the same time, no one will have an advtantage. Being forced to keep 2 players will cause some unfairness in the league, and doing the draft from scratch is not fun either because it completely eliminates last season. I want last season to count for a little bit going forward. 

 

Either way, so it's 2 keepers, with the option of keeping 1 or none. How does that sound? 

[T Y Goodbye]

Ok, I've made my decision, here it is:

 

We will go with Option 3, where you will have the option of choosing 2 keepers, but will not be forced to. You could choose one or none if you want.

 

I always want what's fair and I think doing this will keep the league exciting and at the same time, no one will have an advtantage. Being forced to keep 2 players will cause some unfairness in the league, and doing the draft from scratch is not fun either because it completely eliminates last season. I want last season to count for a little bit going forward. 

 

Either way, so it's 2 keepers, with the option of keeping 1 or none. How does that sound? 

 

Sounds good to me.I'm ok with whatever is decided..

[chad72]

Ok, I've made my decision, here it is:

 

We will go with Option 3, where you will have the option of choosing 2 keepers, but will not be forced to. You could choose one or none if you want.

 

I always want what's fair and I think doing this will keep the league exciting and at the same time, no one will have an advtantage. Being forced to keep 2 players will cause some unfairness in the league, and doing the draft from scratch is not fun either because it completely eliminates last season. I want last season to count for a little bit going forward. 

 

Either way, so it's 2 keepers, with the option of keeping 1 or none. How does that sound? 

 

Sounds great, Andy. It is perfect.

 

You can let the GMs let you know their keepers in a finalized fashion at least 1 week before the draft and that list will be made known to everyone else so that they can plan their draft.

 

Can we have the draft this time after the 3rd pre-season game for all teams? That would be great.

[Andy]

Sounds great, Andy. It is perfect.

 

You can let the GMs let you know their keepers in a finalized fashion at least 1 week before the draft and that list will be made known to everyone else so that they can plan their draft.

 

Can we have the draft this time after the 3rd pre-season game for all teams? That would be great.

 

Lol, we'll figure that out when next season opens. I'm not committing myself to anything now.