"loyalty" To Peyton Manning

[theking213]

Do you feel that Colts fans (not saying it's the majority, but it's a loud percentage) are being disloyal to #18 by wanting the Colts to draft his future replacement in this years draft?

No one is expecting or hoping that whichever QB the Colts draft will replace Manning right away so is it wrong to look towards the future?

The big question is: how many players in this years draft can be impact players that can help the Colts win the Super Bowl within the next 5 years.

[Happy2BeHere]

I have my doubts that Manning will even make a return to the field. But even if he does...we are fans, there is no loyalty involved here except to the team you love...and if the team you love has got to do what it has to do for it's future drafting a replacement is a great thing for the true fan. However, I sure hope we don't spend a 1st round pick on a QB unless we know for sure Manning will NOT come back....

[Thewholefnshow28]

Looking to the future and wanting to plan for the inevitable is not disloyal. It would be negligent on the part of the fans and the front office not to think about Peyton's successor. You have to plan short term and long term and if we are given the opportunity to draft a franchise QB to learn from one of the greatest then you do it.

Wanting to draft Luck is not disloyal.

[Jason_]

Do you feel that Colts fans (not saying it's the majority, but it's a loud percentage) are being disloyal to #18 by wanting the Colts to draft his future replacement in this years draft?

No one is expecting or hoping that whichever QB the Colts draft will replace Manning right away so is it wrong to look towards the future?

The big question is: how many players in this years draft can be impact players that can help the Colts win the Super Bowl within the next 5 years.

No one, not the trade down people nor the draft Luck people are refusing to acknowledge the future. I do, however, think that if Manning does return (something they'll know before the draft) then I don't think they will take a QB #1 overall. I think, especially considering the contract they gave Manning that they'll do as much as they possibly can to help him and the rest of the veteran core win now. We can do that and still look to the future by drafting a QB later in the draft, and by later I simply mean not with the #1 pick.

[WoolMagnet]

Manning had me at hello..............

And no, I don't think it is being disloyal, it is being smart and planning for the future.

Possibly the NEAR future.

Edited October 18, 2011 by WoolMagnet

[HGRekks]

Loyal is so subjective in this matter. I don't think it's unloyal to draft one of the most talented college QBs to come through in sometime. Peyton is on the back 9 and is currently injured.

Personally, I'm not for it or against it. His injury has a supremely low re-injury risk, if I recall. Half a Peyton is still supremely useful. If Peyton says he wants to retire sooner now, that's a different story. I'm neutral on this matter.

Edited October 18, 2011 by RexallTheEnigma

[CMD918]

First let me say this I was a fan of Peyton first then a Colts fan, I became a fan of the Colts because of Peyton.

Now onto the question No I dont think its disloyal there is NOTHING wrong with planning for the future espically when he's had 3 kneck surgeries. 1 of the reason Im against taking Luck is because if the "experts" are right he needs to be on a team thats NEEDS A QB NOW, We should draft a QB who is good and isnt quite ready start right of the bat. Thats why they should draft Landry Jones QB OUhe's good("experts" say he's the 2nd best QB in the draft behind Luck) and probally could start but would be better learning for a few yrs.

P.S. Yes Im alittle biased towards Jones since Im from/living in Oklahoma and Im Sooner Born Sooner Bred

[ruksak]

Peyton isn't a snotty kid, he knows the biz.

As well, I doubt a college kid is going to be perceived by him as threatening. Even if Luck is better than advertised, it will take him years to be in position to compete with Manning. Meaning Manning is going to have to be 40+.

Manning would embrace it like a man, like Archie's son. The better question is, will Luck be willing to get behind Manning?

The best situation for Luck is Miami.

Edited October 18, 2011 by ruksak

[WoolMagnet]

First let me say this I was a fan of Peyton first then a Colts fan, I became a fan of the Colts because of Peyton.

Now onto the question No I dont think its disloyal there is NOTHING wrong with planning for the future espically when he's had 3 kneck surgeries. 1 of the reason Im against taking Luck is because if the "experts" are right he needs to be on a team thats NEEDS A QB NOW, We should draft a QB who is good and isnt quite ready start right of the bat. Thats why they should draft Landry Jones QB OUhe's good("experts" say he's the 2nd best QB in the draft behind Luck) and probally could start but would be better learning for a few yrs.

P.S. Yes Im alittle biased towards Jones since Im from/living in Oklahoma and Im Sooner Born Sooner Bred

Sorry but I don't agree.

If Luck "is ready now" you know what you have and there is a higher % that he will be successful now or in the future.

The statement about taking a QB "who isn't ready yet" makes you wonder if he ever will be. The % of success now or in the future drops.

What is wrong with a guy who is ready now waiting? NOTHING.

If you are banking on a QB especially to be "the guy" now or in the future, I feel you play the odds, IMO.

And everyone I've heard talk about the QBs says there is Luck, then all the rest. Everyone seems to think Luck is in a class by himself.

There is a reason Luck "is ready now". Its called talent. MORE talent.

[CMD918]

Sorry but I don't agree.

If Luck "is ready now" you know what you have and there is a higher % that he will be successful now or in the future.

The statement about taking a QB "who isn't ready yet" makes you wonder if he ever will be. The % of success now or in the future drops.

What is wrong with a guy who is ready now waiting? NOTHING.

If you are banking on a QB especially to be "the guy" now or in the future, I feel you play the odds, IMO.

And everyone I've heard talk about the QBs says there is Luck, then all the rest. Everyone seems to think Luck is in a class by himself.

There is a reason Luck "is ready now". Its called talent. MORE talent.

I didnt mean like that Jones is ready now what I meant was if you have the #1 pick and you take a QB your doing it cause you need a QB NOW. Look at the Lions in the 2009 Draft they needed a QB NOW so they drafted Stafford, Rams in the 2010 Draft they needed a QB NOW so they took Bradford. We dont need a QB NOW we need some1 is gonna sit behind Manning for a few yrs. and learn(NOT Saying Luck wouldnt).

And Sportscenter done a piece "Bradford vs. Jones" and they said(cant remember who I'll see if i can find the vid.) Jones is the Best QB in the Draft Behind Luck

And I disagree Jones has ALOT of Talent too your making Luck sound like a legend in the NFL when hasnt even took a snap

Edited October 18, 2011 by CMD918

[John Waylon]

This is what we've come to?

First of all, what if Manning, being loyal to the team, wants to draft a replacement and mentor him to take over to continue to make the team that has given him so much and earned his loyalty successful when he is gone? Obviously Manning is loyal to our organization and it's success because he's stuck around for as long as he has and carried it on his back the way he has. Maybe he wants that to continue when he's gone?

And it's not like the idea hasn't been discussed. Polian and Irsay both have stated it's something they would like to do, and why not? So Peyton can retire and we'll have to struggle at the QB position in his wake? That's a great idea... Turning a blind idea to the future isn't the way to win in the NFL. Just ask the redskins. If Manning didn't want to do it, he'd have let Irsay or Polian know, and it wouldn't have been discussed near as much as it has been.

Secondly, and more importantly, this is a business. If Manning comes back and his skills have greatly diminished and he isn't the god he used to be, a decision is going to have to be made. Loyalty and empty seats, lost revenue, diminished fanbase, and a decrease in quality of the franchise, or continued business success? If you even had to think about the answer, I implore you not attempt any form of entrepreneurship. Business and loyalty are bad bedfellows, GOAT or not.

On the same hand, if you think Peyton will play in 2014, you're delusional. Is there a chance? Yes, absolutely. But it's way under 50, and his recovery could diminish those chances. So if we've got two seasons after this one with Peyton, which is entirely logical, now is the time to give Manning a guy to teach. And as a QB entering the NFL, what better situation could you be put in? Any QB who doesn't hope to be drafted here to learn from the greatest of all time is absolutely nuts...

Third, and on a philosophical level, when Manning retires, he's going to be bombarded with coaching offers. Who knows if that's what he'll do with his post playing career or not? But if he does, you can bet, just like his time as a player, he's going to be nothing less than great at it. He's going to be more likely to come here with a great system, and plan put in place for the post-Manning era, and as we've learned these past couple years, a good coach is an invaluable tool.

There is nothing wrong with planning for the future...

[WoolMagnet]

I didnt mean like that Jones is ready now what I meant was if you take a #1 pick at QB your doing it cause you need a QB NOW Looka at the last 2yrs. Lions they needed a QB NOW so they drafted Stafford, Then Last yr. Rams they needed a QB NOW so they took Bradford. We dont need a QB NOW we need some1 is gonna sit behind Manning for a few yrs. and learn(NOT Saying Luck wouldnt).

And Sportscenter done a piece "Bradford vs. Jones" and they said(cant remember who I'll see if i can find the vid.) Jones is the Best QB in the Draft Behind Luck

And I disagree Jones has ALOT of Talent too your making Luck sound like a legend in the NFL when hasnt even took a snap

I have no idea how good Luck or Jones will be. No one does.

Jones might be the best behind Luck but the people I've heard say there is a sizeable gap behind Luck and "the other QBs".

I don't think Luck is a legend (even tho many experts say maybe the best since manning). And I didn't say Jones doesn't have talent. My point was most think there is a sizeable gap there.

We have seen what a "top" QB can do for a team. Why wouldn't you want "the best" you can get? I certainly would.

Who knows, maybe Jones will turn out better than Luck. Although I haven't heard ANYONE say he's in Luck's "class".

Just because you don't need a QB "now" doesn't mean you don't take the best one available. Especially when you have a player with question marks for the future like manning does.

And how do you know that next season we won't need one NOW. I'm not convinced Manning will ever be back 100%, if he's ever back at all.

Thank goodness you or i don't have that "weight" on us to make the determination.

And ps, I don't need proof of the Bradford vs Jones article. If you said you read it, I believe you.

Edited October 18, 2011 by WoolMagnet

[CMD918]

I have no idea how good Luck or Jones will be. No one does.

Jones might be the best behind Luck but the people I've heard say there is a sizeable gap behind Luck and "the other QBs".

I don't think Luck is a legend (even tho many experts say maybe the best since manning). And I didn't say Jones doesn't have talent. My point was most think there is a sizeable gap there.

We have seen what a "top" QB can do for a team. Why wouldn't you want "the best" you can get? I certainly would.

Who knows, maybe Jones will turn out better than Luck. Although I haven't heard ANYONE say he's in Luck's "class".

Just because you don't need a QB "now" doesn't mean you don't take the best one available.

And how do you know that next season we won't need one NOW. I'm not convinced Manning will ever be back 100%, if he's ever back at all.

Thankl goodness you or i don't have that "weight" on us to make the determination.

And ps, I don't need proof of the Bradford vs Jones article. If you said you read it, I believe you.

You know what bro lets just agree to disagree cause like you said theres no way tell who will be better at this point. Me personally thinks Jones will be but Im biased lol so agree to disagree

[bluebombers87]

In my opinion, if we get the number 1 pick, then we trade it away for other picks in that draft and future drafts. Luck will likely be good. And even if he is the second coming of PM, we will still have the same problems we've had before. Give Polians some real quality picks to shore up the holes and give Manning a good 3 years. Then, once Manning is gone and we have his replacement, we can survive teh few seasons where the QB learns the ropes.

[Smitto]

a

Do you feel that Colts fans (not saying it's the majority, but it's a loud percentage) are being disloyal to #18 by wanting the Colts to draft his future replacement in this years draft?

No one is expecting or hoping that whichever QB the Colts draft will replace Manning right away so is it wrong to look towards the future?

The big question is: how many players in this years draft can be impact players that can help the Colts win the Super Bowl within the next 5 years.

Do you feel that Colts fans (not saying it's the majority, but it's a loud percentage) are being disloyal to #18 by wanting the Colts to draft his future replacement in this years draft?

No one is expecting or hoping that whichever QB the Colts draft will replace Manning right away so is it wrong to look towards the future?

The big question is: how many players in this years draft can be impact players that can help the Colts win the Super Bowl within the next 5 years.

What? i know i am.. if the QB the colts drafted could replace manning that would be amazing but its less likely to happen.

[WoolMagnet]

You know what bro lets just agree to disagree cause like you said theres no way tell who will be better at this point. Me personally thinks Jones will be but Im biased lol so agree to disagree

Its a deal!

[mightisright]

I have my doubts that Manning will even make a return to the field. But even if he does...we are fans, there is no loyalty involved here except to the team you love...and if the team you love has got to do what it has to do for it's future drafting a replacement is a great thing for the true fan. However, I sure hope we don't spend a 1st round pick on a QB unless we know for sure Manning will NOT come back....

How an you say you're loyal to the team if you're not loyal to the ONE man that made this team great? I'm not saying make decisions that are good for him at the expense of the team. But he is what's good for this team. If he can play, he's our QB. I'm loyal. And if that makes me "nostalgic" then so be it.

[CantBeStopped]

Correct me if Im wrong but didnt many people thing Ryan Leaf was better than peyton manning? People fail to realize that Luck has the best line in college football. At least two of them are 1st round talents. The tackle for sure will be selected in the first round. What do we have? Two guards who are sub par. An aging center. A rookie LT whose missing alot of time and who knows where he'll be at next year. And a RT who shouldnt be in the NFL. You put Luck behind that line and he could turn into the next david carr. Wasnt he supposed to be a supreme talent? Where is he now? What about The 300 pounder jamarcus bust. NO pick is a sure thing and i would much rather get other talent on the d side to help us win a championship

[GoGoColts]

If Peyton needs to be traded, I am all for it. Peyton has been well compensated for his services and neither the fans nor the organization owe him anything other than gratitude and respect for his time with us. However, he will always be welcome in Indianapolis. He will always be one of my favorite athletes. Most importantly, Peyton will always be considered a Colt.

[Jason_]

There is a reason Luck "is ready now". Its called talent. MORE talent.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and the only part of your post that I want to address is the part I left in the quote....no, I don't believe that Luck is that much better because he's that much more talented. He's been better coached and has had a better team around him than the majority of other top QB's that will be available. I fully believe Jim Harbaugh had a great deal to do with Luck's success. Harbaugh installed a very QB friendly system with a big, strong Offensive line that both gives Luck an hour to throw and also gives them a very powerful running game. I'm not saying that Luck isn't overall more talented than the other QB's but I'm also not saying he is. I think there are a handful of QB's in the coming draft who have a ton of potential, especially when you consider that several of them don't have near the same level of talent around them that Luck does.

One look at San Francisco shows what effect the right coach can have on a QB and the team as a whole.

Add to that the fact the Colts clearly committed themselves to winning now with Manning and the other veteran core by resigning Manning to a $90 Mil contract. If they don't opt out or ask him to restructure then they're still financially committed to him. I don't see Peyton having any problem helping the Colts to play for the future, but at the same time he wants to win another ring or 2 before he calls it quits and so do Mathis, Wayne, Clark, Freeney, Saturday etc. For a team that builds through the draft to take Luck #1 overall imo is a clear indication they're not totally committed to helping these guys do what it takes to win before their window is shut.

IMO, if we know that Manning comes back for even one year then I would take a QB later down the draft and let Peyton and the QB coaches work with him to make sure that he's NFL-ready when the time comes that we need him to be. Then we can still utilize the full value of that #1 overall pick to bring in players that can help us win not only now but also in the future as we transition to the new QB.

Edited October 18, 2011 by Jason

[Coltsman1788]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and the only part of your post that I want to address is the part I left in the quote....no, I don't believe that Luck is that much better because he's that much more talented. He's been better coached and has had a better team around him than the majority of other top QB's that will be available. I fully believe Jim Harbaugh had a great deal to do with Luck's success. Harbaugh installed a very QB friendly system with a big, strong Offensive line that both gives Luck an hour to throw and also gives them a very powerful running game. I'm not saying that Luck isn't overall more talented than the other QB's but I'm also not saying he is. I think there are a handful of QB's in the coming draft who have a ton of potential, especially when you consider that several of them don't have near the same level of talent around them that Luck does.

One look at San Francisco shows what effect the right coach can have on a QB and the team as a whole.

Add to that the fact the Colts clearly committed themselves to winning now with Manning and the other veteran core by resigning Manning to a $90 Mil contract. If they don't opt out or ask him to restructure then they're still financially committed to him. I don't see Peyton having any problem helping the Colts to play for the future, but at the same time he wants to win another ring or 2 before he calls it quits and so do Mathis, Wayne, Clark, Freeney, Saturday etc. For a team that builds through the draft to take Luck #1 overall imo is a clear indication they're not totally committed to helping these guys do what it takes to win before their window is shut.

IMO, if we know that Manning comes back for even one year then I would take a QB later down the draft and let Peyton and the QB coaches work with him to make sure that he's NFL-ready when the time comes that we need him to be. Then we can still utilize the full value of that #1 overall pick to bring in players that can help us win not only now but also in the future as we transition to the new QB.

First off...Luck or bust if we got the very first pick. But if not then I am open to entertaining other options. That said...

We already have a quarterback who was taken further down in the draft. His name is Curtis Painter. Why draft "later down in the draft" another project type QB of similar ability when we already have a guy who has been in the system learning from Peyton for 3 years? Painter probably isn't the guy that many really desire to take over after Peyton retires but due to his experience he'd probably be a better fit than some project type QB drafted "later down in the draft".

Edited October 18, 2011 by Coltsman1788

[Jason_]

First off...Luck or bust if we got the very first pick. But if not then I am open to entertaining other options. That said...

We already have a quarterback who was taken further down in the draft. His name is Curtis Painter. Why draft "later down in the draft" another project type QB of similar ability when we already have a guy who has been in the system learning from Peyton for 3 years? Painter probably isn't the guy that many really desire to take over after Peyton retires but due to his experience he'd probably be a better fit than some project type QB drafted "later down in the draft".

I was very clear in specifying that by later down in the draft, I meant past the #1 pick. Aaron Rodgers was also taken "later down in the draft"

First off...Luck or bust if we got the very first pick. But if not then I am open to entertaining other options. That said...

We already have a quarterback who was taken further down in the draft. His name is Curtis Painter. Why draft "later down in the draft" another project type QB of similar ability when we already have a guy who has been in the system learning from Peyton for 3 years? Painter probably isn't the guy that many really desire to take over after Peyton retires but due to his experience he'd probably be a better fit than some project type QB drafted "later down in the draft".

That was my fault for not clarifying.....I had originally clarified that to mean later in the 1st round or in the 2nd round. It appears I deleted that part when I went back to edit...or something like that. lol

Anyway, yeah when I said "further down the draft" I meant a late first round or 2nd round pick...not wait until the end of the draft in the 6th/7th. So when you think of it that way, Aaron Rodgers was available "further down the draft". That was my fault though obviously for not including the clarification of what I meant. I don't want to take Joe Quarterback in the 7th round and pray he's the next Tom Brady. I want to clearly look at the top 5 or so prospects and take all things into consideration, what they do well and what they need work on. Then compare the weaknesses between them and take the one who has the best strengths and the most easily correctable weaknesses. I'm perfectly happy with, instead of the next Peyton Manning, getting the next Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Phillip Rivers, or even a Ben Roethlisberger, Matt Hasselbeck or Jay Cutler but also getting 6-8 extra draft picks to go on top of what we'll already have to build a much better, overall team around him.

I think we're all spoiled to some degree, I know I am, in that we've had the GOAT QB for the past decade and we want to continue to have that. I'm not saying Luck is going to be that but that's why some people want him...because they think he gives us the best chance to have the next "best QB in the game". But more teams win with good to great QB's than do with the GOAT.....this is clearly true because teams other than Indy and NE have won SB's in the past decade.

[GoGoColts]

Sorry but I don't agree.

If Luck "is ready now" you know what you have and there is a higher % that he will be successful now or in the future.

The statement about taking a QB "who isn't ready yet" makes you wonder if he ever will be. The % of success now or in the future drops.

What is wrong with a guy who is ready now waiting? NOTHING.

If you are banking on a QB especially to be "the guy" now or in the future, I feel you play the odds, IMO.

And everyone I've heard talk about the QBs says there is Luck, then all the rest. Everyone seems to think Luck is in a class by himself.

There is a reason Luck "is ready now". Its called talent. MORE talent.

Exactly, whether luck is ready now or not it really doesn't matter. If we draft him, he will sit on our bench and suck it up. All these people saying that Luck has to play because he is ready are out of their minds. He either has to beat out Peyton or Peyton retires. The reality of it is that no QB can come in and run our offense right off the bat. Luck would need at least a season if not two to command the offense.

[BOONE]

Short answer.... no for reasons above, its how the game works BUT if the colts were to do something crazy like draft Luck and trade Manning ( I dont see that going down) but if they did I would pull for the PATS before I would ever pull for the Colts again. He is 90% of the reason we have seen the greatness that we have been blessed with as Colts fans. He takes players that are OK and puts them on a different level ........call me crazy but even Marvin would not be a future HOF 'er if not for Manning. As for your "big question" We (the colts) have been a flop year after year with the draft and it will be a cold day in he11 before you see us pick up a good FA .....its almost like we never wanted to be all that we could be, the Colts have been good but we could have been a dynasty with the right calls. I look at are so called HC now and wonder what in the he11 im even doing pulling for this team and if not for Manning Im not sure I could take the nonsense anymore I just feel like we have wasted the best QB that has ever played the game. WE SHOULD have won no less than 4 Super Bowls with Manning IMO .......sorry for the rant just wish the colts would have been more like Manning and not settled for good when greatness was always within reach! ......Did I say short answer

[jackbutton96]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and the only part of your post that I want to address is the part I left in the quote....no, I don't believe that Luck is that much better because he's that much more talented. He's been better coached and has had a better team around him than the majority of other top QB's that will be available. I fully believe Jim Harbaugh had a great deal to do with Luck's success. Harbaugh installed a very QB friendly system with a big, strong Offensive line that both gives Luck an hour to throw and also gives them a very powerful running game. I'm not saying that Luck isn't overall more talented than the other QB's but I'm also not saying he is. I think there are a handful of QB's in the coming draft who have a ton of potential, especially when you consider that several of them don't have near the same level of talent around them that Luck does. One look at San Francisco shows what effect the right coach can have on a QB and the team as a whole. Add to that the fact the Colts clearly committed themselves to winning now with Manning and the other veteran core by resigning Manning to a $90 Mil contract. If they don't opt out or ask him to restructure then they're still financially committed to him. I don't see Peyton having any problem helping the Colts to play for the future, but at the same time he wants to win another ring or 2 before he calls it quits and so do Mathis, Wayne, Clark, Freeney, Saturday etc. For a team that builds through the draft to take Luck #1 overall imo is a clear indication they're not totally committed to helping these guys do what it takes to win before their window is shut. IMO, if we know that Manning comes back for even one year then I would take a QB later down the draft and let Peyton and the QB coaches work with him to make sure that he's NFL-ready when the time comes that we need him to be. Then we can still utilize the full value of that #1 overall pick to bring in players that can help us win not only now but also in the future as we transition to the new QB.

Ditto, I totally agree.

[Coltsman1788]

I was very clear in specifying that by later down in the draft, I meant past the #1 pick. Aaron Rodgers was also taken "later down in the draft"

That was my fault for not clarifying.....I had originally clarified that to mean later in the 1st round or in the 2nd round. It appears I deleted that part when I went back to edit...or something like that. lol

Anyway, yeah when I said "further down the draft" I meant a late first round or 2nd round pick...not wait until the end of the draft in the 6th/7th. So when you think of it that way, Aaron Rodgers was available "further down the draft". That was my fault though obviously for not including the clarification of what I meant. I don't want to take Joe Quarterback in the 7th round and pray he's the next Tom Brady. I want to clearly look at the top 5 or so prospects and take all things into consideration, what they do well and what they need work on. Then compare the weaknesses between them and take the one who has the best strengths and the most easily correctable weaknesses. I'm perfectly happy with, instead of the next Peyton Manning, getting the next Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, Phillip Rivers, or even a Ben Roethlisberger, Matt Hasselbeck or Jay Cutler but also getting 6-8 extra draft picks to go on top of what we'll already have to build a much better, overall team around him.

I think we're all spoiled to some degree, I know I am, in that we've had the GOAT QB for the past decade and we want to continue to have that. I'm not saying Luck is going to be that but that's why some people want him...because they think he gives us the best chance to have the next "best QB in the game". But more teams win with good to great QB's than do with the GOAT.....this is clearly true because teams other than Indy and NE have won SB's in the past decade.

It's all good man. I appreciate your clarification. That makes alot more sense than what I thought you were saying initially.

[Coltsman1788]

Double Post.

Mods can we get a delete button or something? lol

Edited October 19, 2011 by Coltsman1788