Trade Details: Reportedly the Colts get a.......

[JWF]

I was about to say. No team is crazy enough to trade a 4th round pick, conditional or not,  for a backup center.

[NewColtsFan]

The reports of the 4th round pick are simply too good to be true.

 

My bad for getting so worked up over the story.

 

I suspect the tweet in the thread of a 7th round pick contingent upon AQS making the team are much more accurate.

 

A 7 and not a 4.

 

Oh well......

[Tark The Shark]

Something is better than nothing.

 

I will certainly give Grigson some credit but knowing Ozzie, I bet he won't even make the team and we get jack squat. 

 

I don't agree with the trading of Shipley but one of the Centers were eventually getting cut so it makes sense that the one who costs the least gets shipped.

[jskinnz]

Your point would be right in yesterdays original trade thread - but today the only reason we are here is for the alleged confirmation of our conditional pick value.

 

Calling that meaningless is like striking out in tee ball.

My point is correct in both threads. To get something for him is damn near unbelievable. It is AQ Shipley for goodness sakes. He was a long shot at best to make the team and I would have been thrilled with a bag of donuts for him.

[Smonroe]

Something is better than nothing.

 

I will certainly give Grigson some credit but knowing Ozzie, I bet he won't even make the team and we get jack squat. 

 

I don't agree with the trading of Shipley but one of the Centers were eventually getting cut so it makes sense that the one who costs the least gets shipped.

He was a 7th round pick originally who was cut by two teams. We got him for nothing and traded him for something.

You're 100% correct, one of the three was going to be cut. Ship played okay, better than Satele in some people's estimation, but hardly a staple of the O line. Something for nothing is usually a pretty good deal in my book.

[#12]

The difference between a 7th rounder from the Ravens and an UDFA is negligible.  I'd rather go into camp with a little depth. 

[Tark The Shark]

He was a 7th round pick originally who was cut by two teams. We got him for nothing and traded him for something.

You're 100% correct, one of the three was going to be cut. Ship played okay, better than Satele in some people's estimation, but hardly a staple of the O line. Something for nothing is usually a pretty good deal in my book.

 

You could say that Grigson "flipped" Shipley's value.

 

The line as a whole did better with Shipley and I think that was mine, and most others estimation while Satele looked lost and of course injured most of the time.

 

Grigson is a wheeler and dealer. He likes trading for and away players, and Polian very seldom did that which I think is brilliant.

[Deathiltis]

This thread is a massive fail.

[Andy]

Yeah, just to confirm it is a 7th round pick if he makes the roster. Definitely not a 4th round pick.

[House]

I'm House, and I just wanted to jump in this thread and dump on OP because I'm perfect, and have never made an honest mistake in my life.

Enjoy.

[MAC]

It certainly looked like the aptly named yahoo "writer" scanned the Sun article too quickly. It mentions "4th round" draft picks" a couple of times in there, but obviously not in terms of the Colts compensation. Oh well, a 4th would have been wonderful.

 

I'm not getting upset about the trade one way or another. The line has been horrific for a long time now, and if management doesn't think that Shipley is part of the solution, I'm not going to argue with them. It's too early to condemn Grigson as if we KNOW it was a bad trade. This is just one of those little moments that you stick in the back of your head. If he turns into a foundation piece in Baltimore, than Newsome will be reconfirmed as a top GM and doubts about Grigson will become more prevalent. Realistically, however, it's more likely just a minor trade of a backup that's not seriously impacting either team. It's as silly to condemn Grigson now as it was to laud him as a genius in the firsts place. It's still years too early to have much of an idea about how good he is. I don't implicitly trust Grigson, I'm just watching and waiting.

[jshipp23]

Griswald is just the beneficiary of having the 1st pick when Luck was available.....nothing spectacular whatsoever in my opinion..thats y all this in grigson we trust crap is just ridiculous at the moment....

[Superman]

Why is Russell St. Report an authority? Everyone got the details wrong for the Justin Tryon deal in 2010. We heard as high as a 4th rounder, and it turned out to be a 7th. I think I'll just wait until an official source confirms what the terms are, and that probably won't be for a while.

 

By the way, it's probably a 7th, as we've said all along. I'm just not overly concerned about it.

[jshipp23]

It certainly looked like the aptly named yahoo "writer" scanned the Sun article too quickly. It mentions "4th round" draft picks" a couple of times in there, but obviously not in terms of the Colts compensation. Oh well, a 4th would have been wonderful.

 

I'm not getting upset about the trade one way or another. The line has been horrific for a long time now, and if management doesn't think that Shipley is part of the solution, I'm not going to argue with them. It's too early to condemn Grigson as if we KNOW it was a bad trade. This is just one of those little moments that you stick in the back of your head. If he turns into a foundation piece in Baltimore, than Newsome will be reconfirmed as a top GM and doubts about Grigson will become more prevalent. Realistically, however, it's more likely just a minor trade of a backup that's not seriously impacting either team. It's as silly to condemn Grigson now as it was to laud him as a genius in the firsts place. It's still years too early to have much of an idea about how good he is. I don't implicitly trust Grigson, I'm just watching and waiting.

Well said..

[Smonroe]

You could say that Grigson "flipped" Shipley's value.

 

The line as a whole did better with Shipley and I think that was mine, and most others estimation while Satele looked lost and of course injured most of the time.

 

Grigson is a wheeler and dealer. He likes trading for and away players, and Polian very seldom did that which I think is brilliant.

Right, and no matter what we think, or who we favor, I really think Grigson (and Irsay) are more concerned with team value than contract costs. If they really thought that Satele was not going to be as good as Ship, I doubt they would have kept him.

I'm not saying he was very good, but I think he's a lot better than what we saw last year. He had several good years with Oakland, and was a high draft pick so we know he can play. Maybe injuries, maybe a new system, maybe age, we don't know. But if Grigs has confidence in him to protect the franchise, I'm certainly going to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I'll leave it to .... writers(?) like Brad Well to call it a stupid move. Very premature, but coming from an immature guy, it's expected.

[Smonroe]

Griswald is just the beneficiary of having the 1st pick when Luck was available.....nothing spectacular whatsoever in my opinion..thats y all this in grigson we trust crap is just ridiculous at the moment....

Why do you insist on calling him 'Griswald'? Is it supposed to be demeaning or funny, or both? It's certainly doesn't do anything to endorse your opinion as far as I'm concerned.

[NewEra]

Griswald is just the beneficiary of having the 1st pick when Luck was available.....nothing spectacular whatsoever in my opinion..thats y all this in grigson we trust crap is just ridiculous at the moment....

Oh we'll how about that Polian crap? Same thing. At least Grigson is building our team the right way and not around a bunch of skill players and scrubs. We will be a much more rounded team. God forbid he went against your expert gm wishes and didn't draft a rb or wr. Cause we clearly see what that got us with Polian.

[Le Neon]

It's truly telling about Shipleys perceived value to the squad that we got so excited about getting a 4th round pick for him.  That would've been awesome, but a 7th rounder seems more fair.

[NewColtsFan]

Griswald is just the beneficiary of having the 1st pick when Luck was available.....nothing spectacular whatsoever in my opinion..thats y all this in grigson we trust crap is just ridiculous at the moment....

 

Yeah.....

 

After all,  all he did was build an 11-5 team with an $80 Million dollar payroll and $40 million in Dead Cap Space in one year, and for that got voted NFL Executive of the Year.

 

That's all he's done.

 

It's obvious why he hasn't earned your trust.......            

[Tark The Shark]

Right, and no matter what we think, or who we favor, I really think Grigson (and Irsay) are more concerned with team value than contract costs. If they really thought that Satele was not going to be as good as Ship, I doubt they would have kept him.

I'm not saying he was very good, but I think he's a lot better than what we saw last year. He had several good years with Oakland, and was a high draft pick so we know he can play. Maybe injuries, maybe a new system, maybe age, we don't know. But if Grigs has confidence in him to protect the franchise, I'm certainly going to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I'll leave it to .... writers(?) like Brad Well to call it a stupid move. Very premature, but coming from an immature guy, it's expected.

 

Yes, they think he can be very good for the next couple years. Plenty of guys come in and start slow but end up doing pretty good with more experience. I think Holmes could very well become the long-term center, if Satele keeps gets injured. 

 

I am certainly going to give Grigs the same kind of faith. Most teams it takes 3-5 years to rebuild an entire franchise. Grigson basically took one year to do it, with a rag-tag team filled with castoffs. Not many GMs can do things like that and he has proven to be an effective dealer with guys like Redding, Avery (even though he was only here a year, he was still effective in our offense), and Davis. 

 

People always want to doubt, but I learn that doubting your team is never a good way to show fan-ship. And Grigson made me eat my words when I said we would only win 4 games last year. Grigson certainly has my respect and attention.

[jshipp23]

Yeah.....

 

After all,  all he did was build an 11-5 team with an $80 Million dollar payroll and $40 million in Dead Cap Space in one year, and for that got voted NFL Executive of the Year.

 

That's all he's done.

 

It's obvious why he hasn't earned your trust.......            

Andrew Luck made everybody better and is the reason we were 11-5 much more than grigson!!! You will understand what we have and his greatness this year, Irsay himself could be G.M. himself next 15 years and we'd still be a perennial playoff team...I'm not saying Grigson is bad, I'm just not crowning him yet, the credit should go to Luck...period.

[PrincetonTiger]

Wow just wow

Enough said

[jskinnz]

Andrew Luck made everybody better and is the reason we were 11-5 much more than grigson!!! You will understand what we have and his greatness this year, Irsay himself could be G.M. himself next 15 years and we'd still be a perennial playoff team...I'm not saying Grigson is bad, I'm just not crowning him yet, the credit should go to Luck...period.

The world is very black and white to you, isn't it?

* Colts will take Eddie Lacey # 1 guarantee

* Colts will take Giovanni # 1, guaranteed

These are among your black & white statements with no room for other consideration. This Luck / Grigson rant is the same thing. I agree Luck will raise the level of all players around him because I think he is that good. But to minimize Grigson in the process is just foolish. He also happened to draft guys who look to be long-term solid contributors last year as well. Luck is the sole reason for their success.

[ztboiler]

Andrew Luck made everybody better and is the reason we were 11-5 much more than grigson!!! You will understand what we have and his greatness this year, Irsay himself could be G.M. himself next 15 years and we'd still be a perennial playoff team...I'm not saying Grigson is bad, I'm just not crowning him yet, the credit should go to Luck...period.

I'm hesitant to wade in here....but here goes.  Luck was fantastic for a rookie, no doubt and fantastic in the clutch for a QB of any experience.  But to diminish Grigson is to diminish the contributions of a complete team effort, and I enjoyed the authentic excellence of last year's total team effort too much to let you do that.  It was a special special year.  

[jshipp23]

I'm hesitant to wade in here....but here goes.  Luck was fantastic for a rookie, no doubt and fantastic in the clutch for a QB of any experience.  But to diminish Grigson is to diminish the contributions of a complete team effort, and I enjoyed the authentic excellence of last year's total team effort too much to let you do that.  It was a special special year.  

Just saying Grigson is getting too much credit...he went into the year with that line and almost got Luck killed..He hit on Allen and Hilton, Fleenor is still TBD...he missed on fugger, and he hit with freeman in FA...Im gonna wait until this years FA's and draft picks perform b4 I crown him though....He isn't Ozzie Newsome yet..Luck much like Manning can make average guys look very good and pulled out a lot of games with guys draped all over him on pure guts and ability....The same goes for Pagano, it's a great story and I love him as a man, but he's yet to prove anything that was Arians team and we let a heck of a coach go to Arizona and I know we didn't have a choice but it is what it is...I've also stated I would have took Werner over Lacy and bernard, but never thought Werner would be there and I love the pick...Bernard was the 1st back taken at 37 and i said if we could trade back and get him that would be great...Got criticized saying he was a 3rd round grade and the 5th best RB yet he was the 1st taken so I must have known something and he will be a stud and possible offensive rookie of the year...

[jshipp23]

The world is very black and white to you, isn't it?

* Colts will take Eddie Lacey # 1 guarantee

* Colts will take Giovanni # 1, guaranteed

These are among your black & white statements with no room for other consideration. This Luck / Grigson rant is the same thing. I agree Luck will raise the level of all players around him because I think he is that good. But to minimize Grigson in the process is just foolish. He also happened to draft guys who look to be long-term solid contributors last year as well. Luck is the sole reason for their success.

Meant to quote you...

[jshipp23]

The world is very black and white to you, isn't it?

* Colts will take Eddie Lacey # 1 guarantee

* Colts will take Giovanni # 1, guaranteed

These are among your black & white statements with no room for other consideration. This Luck / Grigson rant is the same thing. I agree Luck will raise the level of all players around him because I think he is that good. But to minimize Grigson in the process is just foolish. He also happened to draft guys who look to be long-term solid contributors last year as well. Luck is the sole reason for their success.

Also, would have much rather traded into the 2nd and got impact guard in Warford than reach on Thornton in the third when there was better players available..just sayin.

[CanuckColt]

Most football experts agree that Grigson SCREWED UP on this Shipley deal.

The worst thing is it is a triple screw-up....

1. We lose a promising YOUNG center for cheap (7th)

2. We now have to keep the lesser-ability, more expensive, older Satele.

3. We may have to keep the incompetent McGlynn as backup insurance for our center position.

 

As many in the media are saying..."dumb, dumb, dumb".

 

All we had to do was keep Shipley and ditch Satele before June 1...much better O-Line situation, much better team.

[Stoney]

this thread has got to be the biggest fail ive ever seen in my life.

[House]

this thread has got to be the biggest fail ive ever seen in my life.

This post has got to be the biggest fail I've ever seen in my life.

[Balzer40]

As of right now, it is conditional and not confirmed!!! Apparently, you trust the yahoo writer more than I do in taking his word.

 

It is not mentioned on nfl.com, colts.com or the Ravens site, the yahoo writer must know something no one else does???

 

 

Here is the condition:

@RussellStReport: Just to clarify A.Q. Shipley cost the Ravens a conditional 7th Rd Pk if he makes the team.

 

 

Nice find!!!

 

 

Wait a minute, One report says something you don't agree with and therefore it's crap, then a nobody that has absolutely ZERO to do with the Ravens, says something else on freakin twitter, and it's solid gold. Nice reasoning!!!

[NewColtsFan]

Andrew Luck made everybody better and is the reason we were 11-5 much more than grigson!!! You will understand what we have and his greatness this year, Irsay himself could be G.M. himself next 15 years and we'd still be a perennial playoff team...I'm not saying Grigson is bad, I'm just not crowning him yet, the credit should go to Luck...period.

 

I love how you tell me that I will understand Luck's true greatness this year and how wonderful the guy....

 

Please, feel free to take a look at my profile....   click on my name...    see what my favorite college program is....

 

I saw every game Luck played in college.   Every game,  every play.    Same with year #1 in the NFL.

 

If there's anyone here who knows how great Andrew Luck is,  respectfully, it's me.  

 

And knowing all that,  if you think Grigson played a small roll in what happened last year, then you're more clueless than I thought....

[Dustin]

Wait a minute, One report says something you don't agree with and therefore it's crap, then a nobody that has absolutely ZERO to do with the Ravens, says something else on freakin twitter, and it's solid gold. Nice reasoning!!!

 

Yeah that twitter account isn't affiliated with the Ravens at all. I doubt we got a 4th, but that tweet proves nothing.

[Superman]

Just saying Grigson is getting too much credit...he went into the year with that line and almost got Luck killed..He hit on Allen and Hilton, Fleenor is still TBD...he missed on fugger, and he hit with freeman in FA...Im gonna wait until this years FA's and draft picks perform b4 I crown him though....He isn't Ozzie Newsome yet..Luck much like Manning can make average guys look very good and pulled out a lot of games with guys draped all over him on pure guts and ability....The same goes for Pagano, it's a great story and I love him as a man, but he's yet to prove anything that was Arians team and we let a heck of a coach go to Arizona and I know we didn't have a choice but it is what it is...I've also stated I would have took Werner over Lacy and bernard, but never thought Werner would be there and I love the pick...Bernard was the 1st back taken at 37 and i said if we could trade back and get him that would be great...Got criticized saying he was a 3rd round grade and the 5th best RB yet he was the 1st taken so I must have known something and he will be a stud and possible offensive rookie of the year...

 

How do you miss on the 214th pick in the draft???

 

I agree that he's not Ozzie Newsome yet. Newsome has been doing it for a looooong time. Grigson is only in his second year. But he's been very strong so far, and that's despite some moves that I don't quite agree with.

[jshipp23]

I love how you tell me that I will understand Luck's true greatness this year and how wonderful the guy....

 

Please, feel free to take a look at my profile....   click on my name...    see what my favorite college program is....

 

I saw every game Luck played in college.   Every game,  every play.    Same with year #1 in the NFL.

 

If there's anyone here who knows how great Andrew Luck is,  respectfully, it's me.  

 

And knowing all that,  if you think Grigson played a small roll in what happened last year, then you're more clueless than I thought....

He played a much smaller role than Luck....We weren't 11-5 because of freeman, allen, and hilton...

[Superman]

Yeah that twitter account isn't affiliated with the Ravens at all. I doubt we got a 4th, but that tweet proves nothing.

 

That's what I was asking above. I don't know who or what Russell St. Report is, or why they'd be considered the authority on this matter. We've all assumed this was a 7th rounder all along, so that's probably accurate, but that tweet is not confirmation.

[LockeDown]

There is another thread about Holmes at USC that will make you guys forget about Shipley. Way more impressive, extremely, intelligent, a great leader, plays injured. He is the one you need to focus on.

[jshipp23]

How do you miss on the 214th pick in the draft???

 

I agree that he's not Ozzie Newsome yet. Newsome has been doing it for a looooong time. Grigson is only in his second year. But he's been very strong so far, and that's despite some moves that I don't quite agree with.

Never once said he was doing a bad job, I like some moves and disagree with others...I just disagree with all this blind faith acting like he was a genius when Luck would make a lot of G.M.'s look good...Newsome and Polian deserve that label...Polian is old and senile now, but in his day he was great and 6 Super Bowl appearances affirm that, and Newsome has built two different teams completely opposite and won both ways and they always contend, and this offseason was one of the best jobs I've ever witnessed...I thought they were done, now I can see them getting back...Grigson could very well be great and I hope he is, just don't crown him yet is all I'm saying..

[NewColtsFan]

Just saying Grigson is getting too much credit...he went into the year with that line and almost got Luck killed..He hit on Allen and Hilton, Fleenor is still TBD...he missed on fugger, and he hit with freeman in FA...Im gonna wait until this years FA's and draft picks perform b4 I crown him though....He isn't Ozzie Newsome yet..Luck much like Manning can make average guys look very good and pulled out a lot of games with guys draped all over him on pure guts and ability....The same goes for Pagano, it's a great story and I love him as a man, but he's yet to prove anything that was Arians team and we let a heck of a coach go to Arizona and I know we didn't have a choice but it is what it is...I've also stated I would have took Werner over Lacy and bernard, but never thought Werner would be there and I love the pick...Bernard was the 1st back taken at 37 and i said if we could trade back and get him that would be great...Got criticized saying he was a 3rd round grade and the 5th best RB yet he was the 1st taken so I must have known something and he will be a stud and possible offensive rookie of the year...

 

I'm late to the party....   did you really write this?    And were you clean and sober at the time??   (it would be better for you if you said 'no')

 

Guess you don't know the most 7th round picks don't even make the roster...  and the ones that do, don't contribute much.   They're the exceptions to the rule.

 

When you have to point to missing on a 7th round pick as proof of your point,  WOW, have you lost the argument!!

 

That's one for the archives...   for the JShipp record book....    that is a doozy!

 

Congratulations!     

[John Dee]

"missed on Fugger" . .   hehehee..    

 

 

Oh lordy..  ;)