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I'll do it. The Official Kirk Cousins is better than RGIII Thread.


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#41 southwest1

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Posted 21 December 2012 - 10:57 PM

Flea flicker is almost never used except by dumb coaches (and the Redskins once this year :P)

I personally think Ballard is a very good runningback and more talented than Alfred Morris, but he's heavily underutilized by your coaches.
Tom Brady used it against the 49ers recently...Is Bill Belicheck & #12 an fool....Ah, Hades no. Thank you very much Matugi.
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#42 QwizBoy

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 12:31 AM

Numbers are skewed. An example is Luck; Luck hasn't made the wrong decisions on some of his interceptions, the receiver just tipped it to a defender. Griffin's bad passing choices will come back to bite him. This is the NFL. If you make stupid throws you WILL get punished.

  What bad passing choices are you speaking of? Lol


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#43 southwest1

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 02:10 AM

Flea flicker is almost never used except by dumb coaches (and the Redskins once this year :P)

I personally think Ballard is a very good runningback and more talented than Alfred Morris, but he's heavily underutilized by your coaches.

 

 

Tom Brady used it against the 49ers recently...Is Bill Belicheck & #12 an fool....Ah, Hades no. Thank you very much Matugi.

In viewing my comment a 2nd time, I came across as abrasive Matugi. My apologies for that. I just think that a flea flicker utilized at the perfect time is a beautiful weapon of attack.  Vick Ballard is a good RB not quite on the same level as ALfred Morris though...At least not quite yet, but he will match or even surpass Morris eventually I think in a couple seasons. 


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#44 SilentHill

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 09:24 AM

Foles is better than Cousins and by a significant margin.

 

What is that based on?


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#45 smittywerb

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 02:45 PM

I think it's more of Shanahan being able to adapt to both of his young QB's (grated Cousins played the Browns) and the fact that the Redskins have a good team around them.  With the team biting on the running game, Cousins could pull off the PA all day long.  Both QB's have what they need to succeed; a running game, a defense, some weapons, and the skills.  All they need to do is not turn the ball over and make the right throws. 

 

Think Mark Sanchez his rookie year.  He had the #1 defense AND running game.  Only thing he had to do was make the right throws.  Sorry to compare Cousins/RG3 with Mark Sanchez but I am comparing the situations each QB were given.


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#46 Matugi

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Posted 22 December 2012 - 05:59 PM

Redskins' defense is still terrible, but they've been decent at making half-time adjustments the past three games, granted two of those games were against Joe Flacco and Brandon Weeden...

#47 thecardiacrll

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 06:14 AM

Lomas Brown on ESPN "First Take" did make a valid point today for Andrew Luck as Rookie Of The Year. Luck's offensive line isn't the greatest, his running backs aren't the best either which eliminates the reliability of the play action pass or flee flicker, and Luck is carrying his team to victory in at least 6 comeback games this season. A compelling argument IMHO. Plus, Luck is following a HOF QB legend in Peyton Manning & handling the pressure exceptionally well. 

You and Lomas make great points. But IMO you can't give Luck ROY with 18+ picks and 4 pick 6's only completing 54% of his passes. And I agree some of the stats are due to bad O-line play and Arians play calling but with the way RG3 and R. Wilson are playing and not making many mistakes It should be just a 2 horse race.A few weeks ago everyone said Luck because he was winning and leading the Colts to the playoffs and that gave him an edge. Now the edge is gone all 3 QB's are leading there teams to the playoffs and winning games. So how can you even consider giving Luck the ROY award?



#48 RGIII

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Posted 23 December 2012 - 08:14 AM

Numbers are skewed. An example is Luck; Luck hasn't made the wrong decisions on some of his interceptions, the receiver just tipped it to a defender. Griffin's bad passing choices will come back to bite him. This is the NFL. If you make stupid throws you WILL get punished.

 

It might be fair to say that Griffin has thrown about twice as many bad passes as he has interceptions.  That's still not very many bad passes at all, though, and it would be a stretch to say he's made much more than that.  His accuracy and ability to protect the ball as a passer has been amazing.

 

The same thing applies to Luck, too.  He's made some bad throws that weren't picked off but should have been that at the very least make up for the obvious mishandles made by his receivers.



#49 No 1 Manning Fan

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 11:21 PM

You and Lomas make great points. But IMO you can't give Luck ROY with 18+ picks and 4 pick 6's only completing 54% of his passes. And I agree some of the stats are due to bad O-line play and Arians play calling but with the way RG3 and R. Wilson are playing and not making many mistakes It should be just a 2 horse race.A few weeks ago everyone said Luck because he was winning and leading the Colts to the playoffs and that gave him an edge. Now the edge is gone all 3 QB's are leading there teams to the playoffs and winning games. So how can you even consider giving Luck the ROY award?

I'll second that. I love the potential that Luck has and I still believe that he should have been the #1 pick. I believe that he will be the greatest QB of his draft, but his performance overall, based on numbers and the eye test, has not been better than RG3 or Russell Wilson. The fan in me still wants him to get ROY, but I don't think he has outperformed the other two guys.

#50 SupermanLuck12

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:34 PM

The guy played one game..
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#51 Jay Kirk

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 07:47 PM

In viewing my comment a 2nd time, I came across as abrasive Matugi. My apologies for that. I just think that a flea flicker utilized at the perfect time is a beautiful weapon of attack.  Vick Ballard is a good RB not quite on the same level as ALfred Morris though...At least not quite yet, but he will match or even surpass Morris eventually I think in a couple seasons. 

If we beef up our OL   IMO Ballard will be really good,although he has growing to do on his pass protection,as well as his route running.I really believe he has the talent with a good line in front of him,lets face it he gets hit 2 and 3 yards deep in backfield,thru no fault of his own far to often



#52 jahsoul

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 07:58 PM

If we beef up our OL   IMO Ballard will be really good,although he has growing to do on his pass protection,as well as his route running.I really believe he has the talent with a good line in front of him,lets face it he gets hit 2 and 3 yards deep in backfield,thru no fault of his own far to often

Actually, it has less to do with the OL personnel per se and more so scheme and execution. This was the same OL from last year when the Redskins were one of the worst running teams in the NFL. What has changed is QB & RB.


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#53 Jay Kirk

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 08:02 PM

Actually, it has less to do with the OL personnel per se and more so scheme and execution. This was the same OL from last year when the Redskins were one of the worst running teams in the NFL. What has changed is QB & RB.

I will agree with you on the redskins but not on the colts line,they are dismal at times,any time ive seen them open a hole ,Ballard hits it realy well,as far as washington they had a decent line to start with IMO



#54 Pombi9

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 08:40 PM

Can someone find out who Silent Hill is....   find out where he lives and send paramedics to his house.
 
I think he's suffered a stroke!
 
Kirk Cousins maybe very good.   Maybe he's a good starting QB in this league.   But based on one good game you've ready to proclaim he's better than RG3?!?!?
 
Quick!   Someone get professional help to Silent Hill --- and STAT!!!     :panic:

That is pretty much the same body of work Matt Schaub had before the Texans traded for him. Also a few pre-season games under his belt.

#55 No 1 Manning Fan

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 10:02 PM

It might be fair to say that Griffin has thrown about twice as many bad passes as he has interceptions. That's still not very many bad passes at all, though, and it would be a stretch to say he's made much more than that. His accuracy and ability to protect the ball as a passer has been amazing.

The same thing applies to Luck, too. He's made some bad throws that weren't picked off but should have been that at the very least make up for the obvious mishandles made by his receivers.
I don't think anybody is disputing the fact that RG3 has taken better care of the ball. He has thrown INTs on 1% of his passing attempts compared to 3% for Luck. RG3 is the real deal. You've gotten yourselves a good one in Washington.

#56 Matugi

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 10:43 PM

I don't think anybody is disputing the fact that RG3 has taken better care of the ball

Well, not in the previously quoted post, at that moment, in this topic, at least :P

#57 NewColtsFan

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 01:45 AM

That is pretty much the same body of work Matt Schaub had before the Texans traded for him. Also a few pre-season games under his belt.

 

Actually,  it's not the same body of work that Schaub had before Houston traded for him...

 

Here's his NFL bio...   if it doesn't come up on his Career Stats, just click over to that and you'll see...

 

http://www.nfl.com/p...982/careerstats



#58 Pombi9

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 06:55 PM

Actually,  it's not the same body of work that Schaub had before Houston traded for him...
 
Here's his NFL bio...   if it doesn't come up on his Career Stats, just click over to that and you'll see...
 
http://www.nfl.com/p...982/careerstats

According to your stats in 3 years with the Falcons he had 84 Completions. And 5 Td's. (Kik has 4 Td's)

Like I said Basically the same body of work as Cousins.... Not even 100 completions in 3 years? That is even less then I thought when I posted that. Thank you for posting stats to back me up.

#59 NewColtsFan

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 06:58 PM

According to your stats in 3 years with the Falcons he had 84 Completions.

Like I said Basically the same body of work as Cousins.... Not even 100 completions in 3 years? That is even less then I thought when I posted that. Thank you for posting stats to back me up.

 

That's cute.

 

You cited one game in a players rookie year.

 

I cited a player with 3 years.

 

You say it's the same.     If you think so,  if you think my stats back you up,  so be it.    We'll just agree to disagree.

 

Cute.     



#60 Pombi9

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 06:59 PM

That's cute.
 
You cited one game in a players rookie year.
 
I cited a player with 3 years.
 
You say it's the same.     If you think so,  if you think my stats back you up,  so be it.    We'll just agree to disagree.
 
Cute.     

They basically had the same body of work all your stats show this. Kirk has 4 tds' Schaub had 5.

Just because it is over 3 years for Schaub how does that make it so different in your mind?

Picking Schaub or Cousins is a risk no matter how you look at it. Schaub is not the safer choice cause he did it over 3 years. I don't know why you are arguing this.

#61 NewColtsFan

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 07:08 PM

They basically had the same body of work all your stats show this. Kirk has 4 tds' Schaub had 5.

Just because it is over 3 years for Schaub how does that make it so different in your mind?

Picking Schaub or Cousins is a risk no matter how you look at it. Schaub is not the safer choice cause he did it over 3 years. I don't know why you are arguing this.

 

I think one player having 3 years experience and one player having one year experience is a very big difference.

 

You obviously disagree.     OK. 

 

We agree to disagree.



#62 Pombi9

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 07:13 PM

I think one player having 3 years experience and one player having one year experience is a very big difference.
 
You obviously disagree.     OK. 
 
We agree to disagree.

If they have thrown the same amount of Passes than how does 3 years make a "very" big difference. I would be more scared of a QB that hasnt thrown 100 completions yet 3 years remove from college than a hotshot rookie who has done that in, well as you pointed out... 1 Game. See my point?

#63 NewColtsFan

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 07:38 PM

If they have thrown the same amount of Passes than how does 3 years make a "very" big difference. I would be more scared of a QB that hasnt thrown 100 completions yet 3 years remove from college than a hotshot rookie who has done that in, well as you pointed out... 1 Game. See my point?

 

Well....    they haven't thrown the same amount of passes.     I don't know why you think they have.

 

One has thrown about 40, the other has thrown about 160 or so.

 

But, more to the point, I think those 3 years help a player get acclimated to everything a young QB has to learn about the NFL.  I think those 3 years were a great help to Aaron Rodgers.   I think those years were a great help to Steve McNair.   3 years of practice.    3 years of pre-season games.    3 years of off-season programs.    I think that time allows for great things to happen. And I think they helped Matt Schaub who I think is a very good QB.

 

But, the new, modern NFL doesn't really allow that anymore, so it rarely happens.  You get drafted,  you get thrown into the fire pretty quickly.    I hope Cousins gets traded sooner for his sake.   Maybe something good will happen.   I think he's a talented kid.

 

This all goes back to the OP...   who claimed that Cousins is better than RG3.    I think that's the kind of stuff that makes for a good fairytale.



#64 Pombi9

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 07:40 PM

Well....    they haven't thrown the same amount of passes.     I don't know why you think they have.
 
One has thrown about 40, the other has thrown about 160 or so.
 
But, more to the point, I think those 3 years help a player get acclimated to everything a young QB has to learn about the NFL.  I think those 3 years were a great help to Aaron Rodgers.   I think those years were a great help to Steve McNair.   3 years of practice.    3 years of pre-season games.    3 years of off-season programs.    I think that time allows for great things to happen. And I think they helped Matt Schaub who I think is a very good QB.
 
But, the new, modern NFL doesn't really allow that anymore, so it rarely happens.  You get drafted,  you get thrown into the fire pretty quickly.    I hope Cousins gets traded sooner for his sake.   Maybe something good will happen.   I think he's a talented kid.
 
This all goes back to the OP...   who claimed that Cousins is better than RG3.    I think that's the kind of stuff that makes for a good fairytale.

Well at least we can agree on that last sentence.

#65 Jules

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:34 PM

So is Matt Flynn better then Aaron Rodgers based on the final game of last season?

 

No.



#66 Jason_S

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 09:35 PM

What is that based on?

All of the games i watched last year of each qb.

They say you can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar, but does anyone know what the final tally was?  And why didn't they try manure?  And if they did, how would that have changed the saying?  Would it be, "you can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar, but you'll catch the most if you're full of crap?"  


#67 Chris_21

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Posted 29 December 2012 - 10:42 AM

It will be interesting to see if Cousins is traded or not. I could see the case for keeping him but say a team offers a first round pick

#68 GrizzColt

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Posted 30 December 2012 - 01:24 AM

This thread does bring up an important point.  Every QB that gets drafted was a pretty darn college QB.  If they land on a team with a good system or coaches who are good at teaching QB's, they have a chance of being productive, assuming they ever get playing time.  The key to the NFL is to get playing time (high draft picks get these and low picks wait their turn) first and then be very consistent every time you are on the field.  My point is that lots of these QB's can look good for a few games and even some for almost an entire year (Scott Mitchell to the Lions...big payday).  But most of these guys aren't able to be consistent and they eventually retire or live life out as a backup.  The great ones shine on year after year because of their on and off the field regimen,  even if they aren't the most talented.  This current crop of rookie and sophomore QB's look like the best ever right now, but let it all shake out next year or the next and we'll see who is going to shine on.   








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