Ray Rice says "Peyton should be MVP'

[oldunclemark]

of course.....Baltimore's not playing Minnesota this week....

Ray Rice would vote for Peyton Manning over Adrian Peterson for Comeback Player of the Year

Ravens running back impressed by Peterson's rebound from torn ACL, but even more impressed by Manning's comeback from neck surgery

By Edward Lee

4:36 p.m. EST, December 12, 2012

This season, there are two very worthy candidates for the NFL’s Comeback Player of the Year award.

Minnesota Vikings running back Adrian Peterson, who tore the anterior cruciate ligament in his left knee on Dec. 24 against the Washington Redskins, leads the league in rushing (1,600) and has scored 10 touchdowns. Denver Broncos quarterback Peyton Manning, who sat out last season after undergoing neck surgery, ranks second in the NFL in completion percentage (68.3) and touchdowns (30).

The Ravens’ Ray Rice has a certain affinity for his peers, especially those who plays the same position as he does. But at the risk of angering a fellow running back, Rice said if he had to vote for either Peterson or Manning, he would vote for the latter.

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-12-12/sports/bal-ray-rice-would-vote-for-peyton-manning-over-adrian-peterson-for-comeback-player-of-the-year-20121212_1_ray-rice-adrian-peterson-neck-surgery

Edited December 14, 2012 by shecolt
excessive quote/link added

[Snowglobe]

title says mvp

article says comeback player of the year??

[chad72]

Comeback player of year not same as MVP, oldunclemark!!!

I have always said the one thing that separates what Peyton did is the change of scenario and having to get his O-line, coaches and WRs on the same page to get the offense going. Peterson had less variables, just a monstrous physical rehab while maintaining same O-line, and coaches.

Objectively looking:

Brady - MVP

Peyton/AP - Co-comeback players of the year

AP - offensive player of the year and rushing title

J.J.Watt/Von Miller - defensive player of the year

[oldunclemark]

Comeback player of year not same as MVP, oldunclemark!!!

I have always said the one thing that separates what Peyton did is the change of scenario and having to get his O-line, coaches and WRs on the same page to get the offense going. Peterson had less variables, just a monstrous physical rehab while maintaining same O-line, and coaches.

sorry..my mistake......

But isnt the arguement the same???

[GoPats]

sorry..my mistake......

But isnt the arguement the same???

Prior-year injuries would not play into the MVP selection. Rice is praising Manning's recovery from what could have been a career-ending injury. But he's not even talking about the MVP here, he's talking about the comeback player of the year. He probably thinks HE'S the league MVP anyway. ;)

[oldunclemark]

Prior-year injuries would not play into the MVP selection. Rice is praising Manning's recovery from what could have been a career-ending injury. But he's not even talking about the MVP here, he's talking about the comeback player of the year. He probably thinks HE'S the league MVP anyway. ;)

what about your man Brady....?

He came back from Giselle's pregnancy, right?

[subvet]

Comeback player-yes, look where he was last year. He missed an entire season, Peterson missed a few games.

MVP-yes, he took a mediocre team to championship level. Brady wouldn't be nearly as effective without Belichick.

[Moose Of Woe]

Comeback player-yes, look where he was last year. He missed an entire season, Peterson missed a few games.

MVP-yes, he took a mediocre team to championship level. Brady wouldn't be nearly as effective without Belichick.

Not only Belichick, but the Patriots are the closest thing to a complete team in football. AGAIN. (Although that goes hand in hand with BB.)

Top coach.

Top slot receiver. (With plenty of other talented receivers minus the IR'd Edelmann)

Good ground game.

Two of the top three TE's in all of football, one of whom is THE BEST.

Best overall O-line in football

D that generates a crapton of turnovers. And for heaven's sake WILFORK.

Solid special teams/field position battle.

With all of that, there's really no reason they SHOULDN'T be the favorite to win it all. Again. That's not even factoring in Brady who is unquestionably a top 1-3 QB regardless of what one thinks of him. Unfortunately for Brady it's hard to stand out as the MVP of the NFL when your entire team consists of many of the best in the league.

[oldunclemark]

Not only Belichick, but the Patriots are the closest thing to a complete team in football. AGAIN. (Although that goes hand in hand with BB.)

Top coach.

Top slot receiver. (With plenty of other talented receivers minus the IR'd Edelmann)

Good ground game.

Two of the top three TE's in all of football, one of whom is THE BEST.

Best overall O-line in football

D that generates a crapton of turnovers. And for heaven's sake WILFORK.

Solid special teams/field position battle.

With all of that, there's really no reason they SHOULDN'T be the favorite to win it all. Again. That's not even factoring in Brady who is unquestionably a top 1-3 QB regardless of what one thinks of him.

2 of the top 10 tight ends on football including one who likes to party

..one of the top 32 secondaries in football...no question

defense that wins 100% of the time when the offense scored 40 or more

[Moose Of Woe]

2 of the top 10 tight ends on football including one who likes to party

..one of the top 32 secondaries in football...no question

defense that wins 100% of the time when the offense scored 40 or more

The secondary gets plenty of INTs to make up for whatever they give up yardage wise.

What TE's would you put over Hernandez? I can only name one.

What NFL team is more complete than New England?

Baltimore? No serious QB threat.

Houston? Overrated D, QB who is rattled easily.

Denver? ZERO run game to speak of and inconsistent receivers. Manning helps, but that D is doing most of the heavy lifting and keeping Denver in games.

San Fran? Who is their QB this week?

Pittsburgh? Maybe. They're all over the place, and their O-line can't pass block for poop. Good thing their main QB is like trying to drag down a titan.

Giants? Well, they're just the Patriots' kryptonite for whatever reason. (*Cough pass rush*)

[oldunclemark]

Jimmy Graham (New Orleans Convicts) 64 catches, 710 yards

Hernandez, 35 catches, 354 yards

...agreed?

[oldunclemark]

The secondary gets plenty of INTs to make up for whatever they give up yardage wise.

What TE's would you put over Hernandez? I can only name one.

What NFL team is more complete than New England?

Baltimore? No serious QB threat.

Houston? Overrated D, QB who is rattled easily.

Denver? ZERO run game to speak of and inconsistent receivers. Manning helps, but that D is doing most of the heavy lifting and keeping Denver in games.

San Fran? Who is their QB this week?

Pittsburgh? Maybe. They're all over the place, and their O-line can't pass block for poop. Good thing their main QB is like trying to drag down a titan.

Giants? Well, they're just the Patriots' kryptonite for whatever reason. (*Cough pass rush*)

Pats have allowed 275 pass yards a game and 41% third down efficiency....fro m NFL stats

[Moose Of Woe]

Jimmy Graham (New Orleans Convicts) 64 catches, 710 yards

Hernandez, 35 catches, 354 yards

...agreed?

Yes. That's the one I'd put over Hernandez. I said TE's. With a S S S SSSss.

[hawkeyes]

Manning CBPOY Peterson MVP

[Moose Of Woe]

Pats have allowed 275 pass yards a game and 41% third down efficiency....fro m NFL stats

Aaand...lead the league in turnover differential.

You still didn't answer what team is more rounded than they are. Their secondary is shaky to put it kindly... but what else?

Every other team has more than one glaring issue. Or at the very least one - in which case it's almost always the QB. (The worst possible thing for your team to be BAD at)

Moreover, no other team comes close to the amount of outstanding players per position the Patriots have that help offset whatever their weaknesses may be.

For starters:

Brady - Best in the eyes of many.

Gronk -Best TE

Welker - Best slot receiver of the decade

Hernandez - top 3

Logan Mankins - Top 3

The O-line overall - Best.

That's insane. INSANE. And that's just the OFFENSE! And guess what? They have some solid receivers not listed there as well.

BB, Wilfork you can make a case as being the best at what they do. The D is filled to the brim with above average to good players outside the secondary.

Again, what team even comes close to the Patriots? They have a shaky secondary? BOO HOO! I'll take a shoddy secondary in exchange for being absurdly good at every other facet of the game.

[jahsoul]

MVP-yes, he took a mediocre team to championship level.

This same mediocre team won the AFC West last year and won a playoff team. I would feel a little better with Manning after the Ravens game but if I had to pick MVP, I would give it to AP. To deny that he IS the offense would be crazy but if a QB must win it, I would say Brady. No matter how you feel about the system, the guy his playing lights out.

[ViriLudant]

Comeback player-yes, look where he was last year. He missed an entire season, Peterson missed a few games.

MVP-yes, he took a mediocre team to championship level. Brady wouldn't be nearly as effective without Belichick.

Oh, please.

The Broncos went to the playoffs last year, and even advanced to the divisional round, for crying out loud.

That Broncos' defense was greatly improved last year (well, except against Brady and the Patriots), and it's only gotten better this year.

The Broncos are a gift for any solid QB.

[ViriLudant]

By the way, folks, the Broncos have not beaten ONE good team this season.

The Patriots have beaten both the Texans and the Broncos, and have the opportunity to beat the 49ers this weekend.

[Moose Of Woe]

The Broncos are a gift for any solid QB.

Pass protection wise, yes. Running game wise, absolutely not. The former is more important than the latter, but having a running threat is still extremely important. The Broncos have none. (At least not until the fourth once the opposing D is gassed) The last time Manning was on a team with a GOOD run game was 2006.

The receiving corps leave something to be desired as well. They're ok, but not exactly stellar.

They're far from a bad team, in fact they're pretty solid outside the run blocking/running backs and lack of pass rush outside Von Miller. That and the fact they're turnover machines. (Giving them, not getting them)

They're not exactly a QB's dream. *Cough NE*

Regarding not beating one good team, they did beat Pittsburgh. HOU and ATL were a defensive stop away. NE was a long shot but still possible before McGahee coughed it up.

On the AFC side, Denver will have a hard time getting past the Patriots and Houston without a run game.

Edited December 14, 2012 by shecolt

[oldunclemark]

By the way, folks, the Broncos have not beaten ONE good team this season.

The Patriots have beaten both the Texans and the Broncos, and have the opportunity to beat the 49ers this weekend.

Pittsburgh and Cincinnatti are not good teams...? Odd thinking

[GoPats]

what about your man Brady....?

He came back from Giselle's pregnancy, right?

Not yet. He's still all bloated his * are sensitive.

[bayone]

Prior-year injuries would not play into the MVP selection. Rice is praising Manning's recovery from what could have been a career-ending injury. But he's not even talking about the MVP here, he's talking about the comeback player of the year. He probably thinks HE'S the league MVP anyway. ;)

Thats all i read, Great houston game will help garner him votes, at least it should, sometime no reason at all I can follow to why someone wins an award

[BOTT]

Oh, please.

The Broncos went to the playoffs last year, and even advanced to the divisional round, for crying out loud.

That Broncos' defense was greatly improved last year (well, except against Brady and the Patriots), and it's only gotten better this year.

The Broncos are a gift for any solid QB.

please.....denver had talent last year, but they were a crap team. everything fell their way at the end of the season....and then they get a crippled steelers team in the first round...much to the delight of patriot fans everywhere.

but i agree that denver was a good spot for manning to land

[GoColts8818]

my Awards:

MVP: Tom Brady

Rookie of the Year: Andrew Luck

Comeback Player of the Year: Peyton Manning

Offensive Player of the Year: AP

Defensive Player of the Year: JJ Watt

Coach of the Year: Arians/Pagano

GM of the Year: Grigson

[BOTT]

By the way, folks, the Broncos have not beaten ONE good team this season.

The Patriots have beaten both the Texans and the Broncos, and have the opportunity to beat the 49ers this weekend.

well, last year the patriots managed to get to the super bowl by not beating one good team unit the afc championship game....which they were fortunate to win to say the least.

[PrincetonTiger]

interesting

[JerodMayo51]

MVP-yes, he took a mediocre team to championship level.

lol what? The Broncos made it to the divisional round of the playoffs last year with TIM TEBOW at Quarterback.. he completed 2 passes one game and they still won! For people to suggest that Manning went to a mediocre team and turned it around is LUDICROUS! They were a playoff caliber team and they were just missing a traditional style, good quarterback. Matt Ryan, Matt Stafford, Tom Brady, Eli Manning... Those are just a few of the QBs that could have gone to the Broncos this year and performed well.

Also, when talking about the MVP, past injuries and things like that are irrelevant, this isnt a Walt Disney movie we're talking about, its the NFL MVP and nobody is playing better than Brady is right now.

[JerodMayo51]

They're not exactly a QB's dream. *Cough NE*

I love how people make random arugments up.. New England? A QBs dream? Brady has had revolving door at the WR position his entire career, Welker being the only exception. Welker is a small target, but it is Brady's quickness and accuracy that elevate Welker's game to the point that its at... He wasn't putting up those kinds of years in Miami or San Diego, then he goes to the Patriots and is the most productive receiver every single year...

The Patriots have gone through a slew of offensive coordinators and have completely changed their philosophy year to year, and it never phases Brady, he adapts and runs the offense to perfection. He is leading the second highest scoring offense in NFL history this year, with only 4 interceptions on the entire season and just dominated the top AFC team that most people have favored to go the Super Bowl... and then you come to the Colts forum and its "Hes having an alright year, Brady is alright.. Its more that the Patriots are just good" and completely ignore that Brady has literally carried this team on his shoulders for years and years. The young defensive is finally starting to show signs of gelling and improving so that is going to help.. The offensive line has been RAVAGED with injuries this year, they have had to sub people in and out all year long, yet everyone is like "ohh the Patriots oline is so good, any QB could sit back there for 10 seconds and complete a pass" but that is not the case.. maybe on a few plays a game the oline buys him incredible amounts of time, but that can be said about ANY qb in the league.

Brady is like having an O coordinator out on the field, he knows everything there is to know about his offense and constantly puts them all in a position to succeed. He gets the ball out insanely fast and can pick apart a defense, even an elite one, and make it look average.

His numbers are better than Manning, his turnovers are WAYYYY less than Manning, and he has BEAT Manning heads up this year.. In fact, the Broncos have lost to every good team they have played all year.. So Manning has just been beating up on weak teams in his weak division and losing to talented teams.. Reminds me of the 2008 Patriots actually..

Coming back from an injury is irrelevant in the MVP discussion, that is what the comeback player of the year is for.. Brady is the clear MVP out of all of the QBs right now, he is clearly playing the highest level of football and anyone outside of people who just seem to hate him and the Patriots, would agree. Its funny, every single year there are people on this board that modify the criteria for what it means to be the MVP that year, depending on what kind of year Manning has. Every year, they always use criteria that matches or favors Manning ha..

"He came back from Neck surgery!" = Irrelevant in MVP discussions.

"He has the Broncos in the playoffs!!" = So did Tim Tebow last year, one of the WORST Qbs in the entire league that is literally backing up Mark Sanchez was able to take the Broncos to the 2nd round of the playoffs last year... So if Manning couldn't do that, then he would be a FAILURE!

"He has no talent around him!" = *... He has D. Thomas, a 1st round talent and a big, legitimate deep threat. He has Eric Decker, a big and physical possession receiver.. He has a very talented Oline... In fact, the Broncos lead the league in rushing last year, so that shows right there that the Oline and their run game were outstanding...

Did anyone even watch the end of the Texans game? Mallet came in to replace Brady, and 5 plays into their drive he throws an interception... Brady is playing at an incredible level this year... He is leading the 2nd highest scoring offense IN THE HISTORY OF THE LEAGUE! He has been without a major piece of his offense all year long, he has had injuries all year long across the Oline.. and hes had to compensate for a horrendous defense that is just finally showing signs of improvement after they traded for Talib and moved McCourty over to FS.

Manning is having a great year, but Brady is having an amazing year. And if the Bronco's didnt think Manning could come back from his neck surgery at an elite level, they would have never gave him a contract worth $20 million a year... Continuing to refer to his neck injury in MVP discussions is just trying to add dramatization and "disneyesque" feelings to it all.

[DILLIGAFER]

I love how people make random arugments up.. New England? A QBs dream? Brady has had revolving door at the WR position his entire career, Welker being the only exception. Welker is a small target, but it is Brady's quickness and accuracy that elevate Welker's game to the point that its at... He wasn't putting up those kinds of years in Miami or San Diego, then he goes to the Patriots and is the most productive receiver every single year...

The Patriots have gone through a slew of offensive coordinators and have completely changed their philosophy year to year, and it never phases Brady, he adapts and runs the offense to perfection. He is leading the second highest scoring offense in NFL history this year, with only 4 interceptions on the entire season and just dominated the top AFC team that most people have favored to go the Super Bowl... and then you come to the Colts forum and its "Hes having an alright year, Brady is alright.. Its more that the Patriots are just good" and completely ignore that Brady has literally carried this team on his shoulders for years and years. The young defensive is finally starting to show signs of gelling and improving so that is going to help.. The offensive line has been RAVAGED with injuries this year, they have had to sub people in and out all year long, yet everyone is like "ohh the Patriots oline is so good, any QB could sit back there for 10 seconds and complete a pass" but that is not the case.. maybe on a few plays a game the oline buys him incredible amounts of time, but that can be said about ANY qb in the league.

Brady is like having an O coordinator out on the field, he knows everything there is to know about his offense and constantly puts them all in a position to succeed. He gets the ball out insanely fast and can pick apart a defense, even an elite one, and make it look average.

His numbers are better than Manning, his turnovers are WAYYYY less than Manning, and he has BEAT Manning heads up this year.. In fact, the Broncos have lost to every good team they have played all year.. So Manning has just been beating up on weak teams in his weak division and losing to talented teams.. Reminds me of the 2008 Patriots actually..

Coming back from an injury is irrelevant in the MVP discussion, that is what the comeback player of the year is for.. Brady is the clear MVP out of all of the QBs right now, he is clearly playing the highest level of football and anyone outside of people who just seem to hate him and the Patriots, would agree. Its funny, every single year there are people on this board that modify the criteria for what it means to be the MVP that year, depending on what kind of year Manning has. Every year, they always use criteria that matches or favors Manning ha..

"He came back from Neck surgery!" = Irrelevant in MVP discussions.

"He has the Broncos in the playoffs!!" = So did Tim Tebow last year, one of the WORST Qbs in the entire league that is literally backing up Mark Sanchez was able to take the Broncos to the 2nd round of the playoffs last year... So if Manning couldn't do that, then he would be a FAILURE!

"He has no talent around him!" = *... He has D. Thomas, a 1st round talent and a big, legitimate deep threat. He has Eric Decker, a big and physical possession receiver.. He has a very talented Oline... In fact, the Broncos lead the league in rushing last year, so that shows right there that the Oline and their run game were outstanding...

Did anyone even watch the end of the Texans game? Mallet came in to replace Brady, and 5 plays into their drive he throws an interception... Brady is playing at an incredible level this year... He is leading the 2nd highest scoring offense IN THE HISTORY OF THE LEAGUE! He has been without a major piece of his offense all year long, he has had injuries all year long across the Oline.. and hes had to compensate for a horrendous defense that is just finally showing signs of improvement after they traded for Talib and moved McCourty over to FS.

Manning is having a great year, but Brady is having an amazing year. And if the Bronco's didnt think Manning could come back from his neck surgery at an elite level, they would have never gave him a contract worth $20 million a year... Continuing to refer to his neck injury in MVP discussions is just trying to add dramatization and "disneyesque" feelings to it all.

So with all thats lets recap.. you love Brady.. dislike Manning.. feel you need to defened Brady to COLTS FANS.. not sure why.. and feel Peytons accomplishments are less than impressive..

I'll add, I think your wrong.

[Dustin]

I love how almost all of your points contradict themselves.

"Peyton coming back from injury shouldn't factor into the MV discusssion"

OK then why should how many yards Denver rush for last year be relevant? Why should Tebow bringing them into the playoffs be relevant? Why should the receivers Brady played with over the course of his career be relevant to this season?

"Denver has lost to good teams"

Ok and New England lost in Foxborough to the Cardinals. Lost to the Seahawks and lost to the Ravens. Now I don't know about you, but I think I have alittle more sympathy for a team who's losses come to teams with a combined record of 32-7 then I do to a team who's losses are to teams with a combined record of 20-19.

"Peyton has turned the ballover a lot more than Brady"

And yet still his passer rating is almost identical. Let me put this more into perspective, the guy who's thrown 12 interceptions has the same passer rating than the guy who has thrown 4.

"He's leading the second highest scoring offense in the history of the league."

Cool lets count the number of touchdowns he has thrown in the 4th quarter with his team up by 20-30 points. Not only that, but lets compare rushing statistics. New Engand currently has the leagues 7th best rushing attack and about 20 rushing TD's. Denver currently sits at 20th and had 7 rush tds. This brings me back to the turnovers. It's much easier to throw the pass when your running game is opening up the play action game for your QB then it is when you rb averages 3.4 yards a carry.

"Beating up bad teams in his bad division"

Coming from a guy who's team is in the AFC East. Brady's best game this season have been against the Rams(6-6), Jets (6-6), and Colts (9-4). Peytons best games have been against Pittsburgh (7-6), New Orleans (5-7 I think), and San Diego (5-7) Staged a 24-0 comeback in the second half). Lets look at the score differential of these games.

Peyton: Pittsburgh 31-19-------SD 35-24-------NO 34-14.

Brady: Rams 45-7-----------Colts 59-24-------Jets 49-19.

Thats an average win differential of their best 3 games of 14.33 for Peyton and 34.33 for Brady. So yea I guess Peyton is the one that boosts his stats on scrub teams though.

Most of your other logic is either easily dispute or pointless in the long run so I'm not gonna bother even refuting them but I guess my main point is that the MVP race is closer than you would make it seem.

[Moose Of Woe]

I love how people make random arugments up.. New England? A QBs dream?

Considering it's THE BEST TEAM IN FOOTBALL, I'm thinking....YES.

Coach? Best.

WR/TE'S? Best overall, and two of them are the best in the NFL at their position.

O-line? Best.

Run game? PRETTY DARN GOOD.

Not even counting the defense. It gets slammed because of the secondary, but it's a lot better overall than people give it credit for. Guys like Wilfork and your namesake are why.

[subvet]

Oh, please.

The Broncos went to the playoffs last year, and even advanced to the divisional round, for crying out loud..

The Broncos are a gift for any solid QB.

I don't argue that but at 8-8 it almost looked like a hand from the heavens guided things their way...it even made Tebow look good. They shot their wads and wouldn't gone anywhere this year unless a quarterback like Manning was acquired, IMHO.

[subvet]

lol what? The Broncos made it to the divisional round of the playoffs last year with TIM TEBOW at Quarterback.. he completed 2 passes one game and they still won! For people to suggest that Manning went to a mediocre team and turned it around is LUDICROUS! They were a playoff caliber team and they were just missing a traditional style, good quarterback. Matt Ryan, Matt Stafford, Tom Brady, Eli Manning... Those are just a few of the QBs that could have gone to the Broncos this year and performed well.

Also, when talking about the MVP, past injuries and things like that are irrelevant, this isnt a Walt Disney movie we're talking about, its the NFL MVP and nobody is playing better than Brady is right now.

If 8-8 isn't mediocre what is? They were an also ran, medium level team without a first quality quarterback but I won't argue other qbs could have performed well because they would. They just would have taken a lot longer to get to the level Manning has them playing at now....but the point is moot as no one will ever know for sure. Just my opinion.

[Yehoodi]

Comeback player-yes, look where he was last year. He missed an entire season, Peterson missed a few games.

MVP-yes, he took a mediocre team to championship level. Brady wouldn't be nearly as effective without Belichick.

[Yehoodi]

Comeback player-yes, look where he was last year. He missed an entire season, Peterson missed a few games.

MVP-yes, he took a mediocre team to championship level. Brady wouldn't be nearly as effective without Belichick.