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USAFHoosier

Could there be a tie for ROY between Luck and RG3

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RG is a great player ,love watching him but if the draft was tomorrow IMO we still take Luck hands down and dont even question it,thats how good this kid is :thmsup:

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Here is how im trying to formulate this in my head.

RG3- Veteran receivers, decent Oline, Great running game, playbook suited for his style.

Wilson- Good Oline, Great running game, top 10 defense

Luck- No oline, Reggie, weak running game, Full playbook that our line cant pass block for on the long routes

Many ways to look at it. These are just one way im looking at it.

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Here is how im trying to formulate this in my head.

RG3- Veteran receivers, decent Oline, Great running game, playbook suited for his style.

Wilson- Good Oline, Great running game, top 10 defense

Luck- No oline, Reggie, weak running game, Full playbook that our line cant pass block for on the long routes

Many ways to look at it. These are just one way im looking at it.

This is the only way of looking at it IMO.

To be completely objective, this stuff needs to be taken into account.

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RG3 only has Garcon and Moss as established receivers.

Wilson, spot on

Luck has a decent running game and his O Line is just as bad as the Skins O-Line.

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RG3 only has Garcon and Moss as established receivers.

Wilson, spot on

Luck has a decent running game and his O Line is just as bad as the Skins O-Line.

Decent running game compared to what? An absent running game? Lol we are awful when it comes to running the ball. Which is also a symptom of our porous O-Line.

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RG3 only has Garcon and Moss as established receivers.

Wilson, spot on

Luck has a decent running game and his O Line is just as bad as the Skins O-Line.

Well, this just proves that you haven't watched any Colts games. The Skins line is no where even close to being as bad as the Colts line. This is common knowledge of anybody that has seen both teams play. These 2 lines are not even in the same zip code as far as who is better. It's undoubtedly the Skins, there is no question about it.

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Well, this just proves that you haven't watched any Colts games. The Skins line is no where even close to being as bad as the Colts line. This is common knowledge of anybody that has seen both teams play. These 2 lines are not even in the same zip code as far as who is better. It's undoubtedly the Skins, there is no question about it.

What are you basing this on?

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Correction the skins have the best running game in the league. Seattle is fourth. The Colts are 22nd. The NFL has the Seahawks have the 7th best Oline, Skins 17th, Colts 24th. All three QB's are having great years.

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I could see a tie happening but ties are just disappointing.

One player should have it, not two.

I wouldn't be surprised if RG3 didn't play, which he probably shouldn't so he can rest his sprain.

I think people are going to look at our win total as opposed to the actual stats and that is why Luck will probably win ROTY

That did not happen last year for ROTY. When it came down to it, it was all about the stats. If it was about the wins, Andy Dalton would have won the award since he led his team to the playoffs.

Andy Dalton = Wins/playoffs

Cam Newton = Numbers

Cam Newton won.

The funny thing about it is that Dalton had some VERY good numbers for a rookie, but Cam had better numbers on a loosing team.

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What are you basing this on?

Common sense, and seeing both teams in action. There are gaping holes in the Skins line for both Morris and RG3 consistently. I'll admit their pass blocking leaves something to be desired, but their run blocking capabilities is leaps and bounds above the Colts.

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You could have Doug Martin steal a vote here and there, and the 3 quarterbacks could each have votes... It will be interesting and I'm sure this board will critique it either way.

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Doug Martin should also be in this conversation. He has put up some big #'s.

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rofl u trollin

still mad manning left huh?

#butthurt

Was never 'mad' that Manning left and he certainly has nothing at all to do with Luck and this Colts team. I'm just looking at things with an open mind and seeing that a lot of those posting in this thread are the epitome of homer!

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Common sense, and seeing both teams in action. There are gaping holes in the Skins line for both Morris and RG3 consistently. I'll admit their pass blocking leaves something to be desired, but their run blocking capabilities is leaps and bounds above the Colts.

Just adding 3.4 cents into this. A lot of that is scheme, the zone blocking that Shanahan has utilized for years. It works better with a competent quarterback as a threat than it would with an incompetent quarterback behind center, which helps explain why the skins running game wasn't that great during Shanahan's first couple of years in Washington. Morris is one of a long line of backs to have success in that scheme whether it's in Denver, Houston or in Washington. Atlanta had a heck of a running game when they had Alex Gibbs using the zone blocking scheme down in GA.

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RG3 wont play this week.....Shanahan is saying 'day-to-day' so as not to tip off the other team as to who to prepare for...

RGIII is out......for at least one game.

I wouldn't put money on that. Griffin is an unusually tough (and stubborn) quarterback. At Baylor he tore his ACL on the opening drive of a game and still finished out the half. He threw 3 TDs in that game before he was forced out and then went under the knife to end his sophomore season.

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Being as objective as possible, taking into account other weapons on the team, O-line, scheme etc, I still give Griffin OROY. He's just been better. Luck has made too many mistakes, especially these last three or four weeks, whereas Griffin has not.

Don't get me wrong, I love Luck and if we drafted again tomorrow I'd still want to take him, I just think Griffin has had a better year.

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Just adding 3.4 cents into this. A lot of that is scheme, the zone blocking that Shanahan has utilized for years. It works better with a competent quarterback as a threat than it would with an incompetent quarterback behind center, which helps explain why the skins running game wasn't that great during Shanahan's first couple of years in Washington. Morris is one of a long line of backs to have success in that scheme whether it's in Denver, Houston or in Washington. Atlanta had a heck of a running game when they had Alex Gibbs using the zone blocking scheme down in GA.

Yes, I agree. I just found it comical that he said the Skins line is just as bad as the Colts line. Whether or not it's scheme related is irrelevant really. The point is no one that has watched both teams could honestly say that the skins don't have a distinct advantage with their ability to run the ball.

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Redskins fans here.

I don't mean to destroy your hopes, but RG3 will win rookie of the year, hands down. It's not even close. I know it, the experts know it, and deep down inside you guys know it.

He is sitting at a QBR rating of 104.2. That not only leads all rookies, but it leads THE ENTIRE NFL. Yes, ahead of Tom Brady, ahead of Peyton Manning, ahead of Aaron Rodgers. Maybe if it was after 3 weeks, some would say that's a fluke, but its Week 14 of the NFL, with 3 games left. That means he has been playing GREAT football, week-in week-out on a CONSISTENT basis.

It seems to me the only argument you have is "but Luck has Colts in the playoffs". Andy Dalton got into the playoffs last year. So what? Getting into the playoffs doesn't mean squat. You have to win it all to get respect. Ask Andy Reid. Maybe if you guys won the division title and had a first round bye, that would be a MUCH more impressive resume for Luck's rookie year. But as a wild-card, with a cupcake schedule? Please.

Your other argument is, "but he has X amount of game-winning drives". Those are situations he PUT HIMSELF in with all those INTs. Again, with those cupcake teams you've played, you've handed them the game and they STILL let you guys comeback. If Luck throws 3-4 INTs against NFC East teams, I guarantee he will be BURIED with no hope of a comeback. Again, I re-iterate, he has had a CUPCAKE SCHEDULE and STILL throws 18 interceptions? That's not RoY material.

I understand RoY doesn't make one's career, but Year 1 goes to RG3, not Andrew Luck. Sorry.

Oh yea, throw in RG3's 720 rushing yards and 6 TDs for good measure.

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That like saying could there be a tie between Obama and Romney. It was a foregone conclusion who was going to win Rookie Of The Year when, after the first game, John Madden proclaimed RG3 as "the best player in the NFL". The media wants him to win, he is in a very QB friendly offense, and therefore has put up very good numbers. No way they give it to Luck.

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Redskins fans here.

I don't mean to destroy your hopes, but RG3 will win rookie of the year, hands down. It's not even close. I know it, the experts know it, and deep down inside you guys know it.

He is sitting at a QBR rating of 104.2. That not only leads all rookies, but it leads THE ENTIRE NFL. Yes, ahead of Tom Brady, ahead of Peyton Manning, ahead of Aaron Rodgers. Maybe if it was after 3 weeks, some would say that's a fluke, but its Week 14 of the NFL, with 3 games left. That means he has been playing GREAT football, week-in week-out on a CONSISTENT basis.

It seems to me the only argument you have is "but Luck has Colts in the playoffs". Andy Dalton got into the playoffs last year. So what? Getting into the playoffs doesn't mean squat. You have to win it all to get respect. Ask Andy Reid. Maybe if you guys won the division title and had a first round bye, that would be a MUCH more impressive resume for Luck's rookie year. But as a wild-card, with a cupcake schedule? Please.

Your other argument is, "but he has X amount of game-winning drives". Those are situations he PUT HIMSELF in with all those INTs. Again, with those cupcake teams you've played, you've handed them the game and they STILL let you guys comeback. If Luck throws 3-4 INTs against NFC East teams, I guarantee he will be BURIED with no hope of a comeback. Again, I re-iterate, he has had a CUPCAKE SCHEDULE and STILL throws 18 interceptions? That's not RoY material.

I understand RoY doesn't make one's career, but Year 1 goes to RG3, not Andrew Luck. Sorry.

Are you not getting a little ahead of yourself?

I can see another 23-pages of postings! My Christmas wish is that no more RG3 threads be posted. Here we go again!

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Redskins fans here.

I don't mean to destroy your hopes, but RG3 will win rookie of the year, hands down. It's not even close. I know it, the experts know it, and deep down inside you guys know it.

He is sitting at a QBR rating of 104.2. That not only leads all rookies, but it leads THE ENTIRE NFL. Yes, ahead of Tom Brady, ahead of Peyton Manning, ahead of Aaron Rodgers. Maybe if it was after 3 weeks, some would say that's a fluke, but its Week 14 of the NFL, with 3 games left. That means he has been playing GREAT football, week-in week-out on a CONSISTENT basis.

It seems to me the only argument you have is "but Luck has Colts in the playoffs". Andy Dalton got into the playoffs last year. So what? Getting into the playoffs doesn't mean squat. You have to win it all to get respect. Ask Andy Reid. Maybe if you guys won the division title and had a first round bye, that would be a MUCH more impressive resume for Luck's rookie year. But as a wild-card, with a cupcake schedule? Please.

Your other argument is, "but he has X amount of game-winning drives". Those are situations he PUT HIMSELF in with all those INTs. Again, with those cupcake teams you've played, you've handed them the game and they STILL let you guys comeback. If Luck throws 3-4 INTs against NFC East teams, I guarantee he will be BURIED with no hope of a comeback. Again, I re-iterate, he has had a CUPCAKE SCHEDULE and STILL throws 18 interceptions? That's not RoY material.

I understand RoY doesn't make one's career, but Year 1 goes to RG3, not Andrew Luck. Sorry.

Oh yea, throw in RG3's 720 rushing yards and 6 TDs for good measure.

Alex Smith also has a very high QB rating, and he isn't even playing. You have to consider the system. Most QBs will look good when they have the #1 rushing offense in the NFL and throw checkdowns most of the day.

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Redskins fans here.

I don't mean to destroy your hopes, but RG3 will win rookie of the year, hands down. It's not even close. I know it, the experts know it, and deep down inside you guys know it.

He is sitting at a QBR rating of 104.2. That not only leads all rookies, but it leads THE ENTIRE NFL. Yes, ahead of Tom Brady, ahead of Peyton Manning, ahead of Aaron Rodgers. Maybe if it was after 3 weeks, some would say that's a fluke, but its Week 14 of the NFL, with 3 games left. That means he has been playing GREAT football, week-in week-out on a CONSISTENT basis.

It seems to me the only argument you have is "but Luck has Colts in the playoffs". Andy Dalton got into the playoffs last year. So what? Getting into the playoffs doesn't mean squat. You have to win it all to get respect. Ask Andy Reid. Maybe if you guys won the division title and had a first round bye, that would be a MUCH more impressive resume for Luck's rookie year. But as a wild-card, with a cupcake schedule? Please.

Your other argument is, "but he has X amount of game-winning drives". Those are situations he PUT HIMSELF in with all those INTs. Again, with those cupcake teams you've played, you've handed them the game and they STILL let you guys comeback. If Luck throws 3-4 INTs against NFC East teams, I guarantee he will be BURIED with no hope of a comeback. Again, I re-iterate, he has had a CUPCAKE SCHEDULE and STILL throws 18 interceptions? That's not RoY material.

I understand RoY doesn't make one's career, but Year 1 goes to RG3, not Andrew Luck. Sorry.

Oh yea, throw in RG3's 720 rushing yards and 6 TDs for good measure.

RG3 doesn't even have the highest QBR on your team.

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Redskins fans here.

I don't mean to destroy your hopes, but RG3 will win rookie of the year, hands down. It's not even close. I know it, the experts know it, and deep down inside you guys know it.

He is sitting at a QBR rating of 104.2. That not only leads all rookies, but it leads THE ENTIRE NFL. Yes, ahead of Tom Brady, ahead of Peyton Manning, ahead of Aaron Rodgers. Maybe if it was after 3 weeks, some would say that's a fluke, but its Week 14 of the NFL, with 3 games left. That means he has been playing GREAT football, week-in week-out on a CONSISTENT basis.

It seems to me the only argument you have is "but Luck has Colts in the playoffs". Andy Dalton got into the playoffs last year. So what? Getting into the playoffs doesn't mean squat. You have to win it all to get respect. Ask Andy Reid. Maybe if you guys won the division title and had a first round bye, that would be a MUCH more impressive resume for Luck's rookie year. But as a wild-card, with a cupcake schedule? Please.

Your other argument is, "but he has X amount of game-winning drives". Those are situations he PUT HIMSELF in with all those INTs. Again, with those cupcake teams you've played, you've handed them the game and they STILL let you guys comeback. If Luck throws 3-4 INTs against NFC East teams, I guarantee he will be BURIED with no hope of a comeback. Again, I re-iterate, he has had a CUPCAKE SCHEDULE and STILL throws 18 interceptions? That's not RoY material.

I understand RoY doesn't make one's career, but Year 1 goes to RG3, not Andrew Luck. Sorry.

Oh yea, throw in RG3's 720 rushing yards and 6 TDs for good measure.

The rest of your Redskin co-horts have been repeating this tired old nonsense for awhile now. BTW, most here have already said that RG3 has ROTY locked up, but that has more to do with geography than it does anything else. So you can move on to the Seahawks forum and tout your guy there because most here already knows how this is gonna go down.

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That like saying could there be a tie between Obama and Romney. It was a foregone conclusion who was going to win Rookie Of The Year when, after the first game, John Madden proclaimed RG3 as "the best player in the NFL". The media wants him to win, he is in a very QB friendly offense, and therefore has put up very good numbers. No way they give it to Luck.

There you right-wingers go with some sort of "Media Conspiracy". RG3 is playing better football. That's why he will win, not cause John Madden said so

You guys are trying your HARDEST to minimize RG3's accomplishment. "He's putting up good numbers cause he's in a QB friendly offense". There is no such thing as QB friendly offenses. NFL teams will still try to stop you, and that fact that RG3 has only throw 4 INT is a testament to his own decisions and precision. Truth.

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Yes, I agree. I just found it comical that he said the Skins line is just as bad as the Colts line. Whether or not it's scheme related is irrelevant really. The point is no one that has watched both teams could honestly say that the skins don't have a distinct advantage with their ability to run the ball.

I think the Skins line would look much worse than it does if Grossman was the quarterback. Just like I believe the Colts current OL would look exponentially better if they were running a WCO. Yeah they run the ball better.. I think Ballard or Brown would look better than they do here with that zone blocking scheme. Just like I think Luck would have better "numbers", if he were in hybrid WCO that Washington is running even if you eliminated the designed runs.

I think scheme has a lot to do with it. Neither line to me is head and shoulders above the other from a man for man perspective. I do however think that one coaching staff is putting their players in better spots to succeed. So I can't discount the scheme comparison. I would say that this group of lineman would produce a much better running game if they had the zone blocking scheme installed with Ballard & Brown, or if you brought Morris into this scheme his #'s wouldn't be a high as they are. Again, scheme related.

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Redskins fans here.

None of what you've just said is new to anyone here or particularly informative.

nfNeT7YvTozx0cv7ze3mplZpo1_500.gif

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Im not here to troll.

I'm actually a big Andrew Luck fan. I think he's gonna be one of the best. I just think RG3 deserves it over Luck IMO. Throw out the records, throw out what their teammates are doing, just go off their own individual performances thus far. RG3 should win.

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Im not here to troll.

I'm actually a big Andrew Luck fan. I think he's gonna be one of the best. I just think RG3 deserves it over Luck IMO. Throw out the records, throw out what their teammates are doing, just go off their own individual performances thus far. RG3 should win.

da heck you sayin rg3 has the highest qbr, you blind? my boy brady is also at 104.2

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da heck you sayin rg3 has the highest qbr, you blind? my boy brady is also at 104.2

so they are both tied at #1 for the HIGHEST in the NFL, with a future HoF'er, and he's a ROOKIE. Still impressive for RG3.

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Luck has a decent running game and his O Line is just as bad as the Skins O-Line.

Not sure i would consider the 22nd ranked rushing unit as decent. That's worse then middle of the pack. As for your O line comment, thanks for the laugh!

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I think the Skins line would look much worse than it does if Grossman was the quarterback. Just like I believe the Colts current OL would look exponentially better if they were running a WCO. Yeah they run the ball better.. I think Ballard or Brown would look better than they do here with that zone blocking scheme. Just like I think Luck would have better "numbers", if he were in hybrid WCO that Washington is running even if you eliminated the designed runs.

I think scheme has a lot to do with it. Neither line to me is head and shoulders above the other from a man for man perspective. I do however think that one coaching staff is putting their players in better spots to succeed. So I can't discount the scheme comparison. I would say that this group of lineman would produce a much better running game if they had the zone blocking scheme installed with Ballard & Brown, or if you brought Morris into this scheme his #'s wouldn't be a high as they are. Again, scheme related.

I think were basically agreeing, but I'm just pointing out that RG3 has a big advantage with the running game. I'm really not trying to knock RG3 off his gigantic pedestal the media has put him on(yes, thats a little sarcastic), but I'm just kind of tired of some people not recognizing the obvious reasons why Luck has made some of the mistakes he's made this yr..

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There you right-wingers go with some sort of "Media Conspiracy". RG3 is playing better football. That's why he will win, not cause John Madden said so

You guys are trying your HARDEST to minimize RG3's accomplishment. "He's putting up good numbers cause he's in a QB friendly offense". There is no such thing as QB friendly offenses. NFL teams will still try to stop you, and that fact that RG3 has only throw 4 INT is a testament to his own decisions and precision. Truth.

lol I totally disagree with you there The system has EVERYTHING to do with QBs numbers. I remember back in 1995 Jim Harbaugh lead the league in QB rating. I don't think anyone would have rated him as a top 10 QB that year. But he played on a team that had a very good running game, he threw short passes, and they played good run defense. Sound familiar? You cannot base how good a QB is by his numbers. John Elway NEVER had a good passing rating. Ken Anderson ALWAYS did. Who do you think was better?

But here is how it will be resolved. If the Redskins start Kirk Cousins this weekend, I would expect similar numbers to what RG3 did. Not as many running yards but more passing yards. And that will prove that it is not that RG3 is such a great QB. Either that or Cousins should be co-ROY. Do you think if Andrew Luck went out, Drew Stanton could accomplish the same?

Luck is asked to do WAY more than any other rookie QB. He often throws twice as many passes as RG3.

But these RG3 things get old. Cant you just go post that stuff on the Redskins board?

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RG goes out of the game and a rookie backup scores easily and even runs in a 2 point conversion. That coupled with RG missing a game when there are only a few left, should tremendously hurt his chances for ROY.

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That did not happen last year for ROTY. When it came down to it, it was all about the stats. If it was about the wins, Andy Dalton would have won the award since he led his team to the playoffs.

Andy Dalton = Wins/playoffs

Cam Newton = Numbers

Cam Newton won.

The funny thing about it is that Dalton had some VERY good numbers for a rookie, but Cam had better numbers on a loosing team.

Well yes, if they are looking at passing yards and wins, it will go to Luck. If they are looking at TDs/INT ratio and overall offense, they will go RG3. Honestly, Wilson will take some votes for ROTY as well and will take away votes for RG3 and Luck.

As long as RG3 is healthy, I see him winning ROTY. Although if Luck has strong showings against the Texans, I can see Luck taking it.

Although Wilson should get more credit than he does because he is playing really well for a 3rd round QB.

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Can we add this script to the forum?

if(post.String.Contains("RG3")&&post.String.Contains("Rookie Of Year")

{

post.delete();

}

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Luck has six comebacks in 4th quarter or overtime despite being the most hit qb in nfl

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I think were basically agreeing, but I'm just pointing out that RG3 has a big advantage with the running game. I'm really not trying to knock RG3 off his gigantic pedestal the media has put him on(yes, thats a little sarcastic), but I'm just kind of tired of some people not recognizing the obvious reasons why Luck has made some of the mistakes he's made this yr..

Of course the running game helps him. It just seems some want to discredit him for improving their running game. I still doubt that the skins have the running success with Grossman at quarterback.

Well, I think the media has both of them up on a pedestal.

Some will Look at Luck's co-league leading interceptions and his league leading turnovers and say it's all on him and that would just be ignorant. He's made some bad choices, but I put as much blame on the scheme as I would Luck as an individual quarterback. Any QB in the league would have more int's in this system than say the WCO. It's set up to gamble with a higher risk/reward built into it than most systems. Sometimes you come up big, some times you don't. Some would have more int's than Luck some would have less, but that I guess is an entirely different bullet point.

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I'd be really careful about playing RGiii after that knee injury. Still plenty of time to see how he's doing by Friday. That hit was vicious to his knee and it would suck to see a hobbled RGiii come back and get hurt again. Might as well be safe than sorry but if they feel he's ready to go they will play him.

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