44 replies to this topic

[pacolts56]

I had this idea a few weeks back regarding Steelers Restricted Free Agent Mike Wallace (hold the dead reporter jokes, please)....

The scenario is that if we can find a partner, trade Freeney.... who I put a 3rd round pick trade value on.... plus the #34 overall pick to someone in the #17 - #23 range, with particular focus on Cincinnati.

This adds up if we use the NFL trade value chart, and it clears 14M in cap space plus it gives us the extra 1st round pick compensation that Wallace's RFA situation would require for us to sign him with. And I'd be particularly interested in how much the Bengals.... who are said to be eyeing a DE or CB at #17 or #21.... would like to see Wallace depart the AFC North division.

The Bengals would move down from one of those spots to #34, where plenty of DE or CB (Janoris Jenkins?) value will still be available.

From a pure talent standpoint, Wallace is a proven commodity and no rookie WR in this class has me sold on equal potential.... in addition to the fact that pairing Wallace with Reggie would be a pretty deadly turnkey set of WRs for Luck to break in with. Add a TE, an OG and a mid-round WR prospect to groom with Collie on board in the slot.... and we'd have the offense pretty close to set for a good part of Luck's first 2-3 years. Bruce Arians' familiarity with Wallace is an added factor.

The biggest impediment to all this and the likely show-stopper to this kind of move is Wallace's true $$$ value vs his vision of that very issue. Obviously, this would need to be coordinated ahead of time.

While he's possibly the most dangerous deep-threat in the NFL, I still rate him below Fitzgerald and certainly Calvin Johnson when it comes to a high-dollar contract. On the positive side of that is the fact that the Steelers are really up against a very tough cap situation.... so they could probably be outbid fairly easily, much like we were when Edgerrin James departed.... for those who remember that.

I'd would at least explore this move and I would do it, if we could pull it off and if Wallace could be had for a number somewhere south of Fitz and CJs contracts. Yes, Wallace would come at a high price...... but he wouldn't "break the bank" if we could land him at a lower price relative to Fitzgerald and Johnson.... especially considering the cap $$$ recaptured with Freeney traded plus next year's expanded cap space.

Let the stoning begin.....

[oldunclemark]

I had this idea a few weeks back regarding Steelers Restricted Free Agent Mike Wallace (hold the dead reporter jokes, please)....

The scenario is that if we can find a partner, trade Freeney.... who I put a 3rd round pick trade value on.... plus the #34 overall pick to someone in the #17 - #23 range, with particular focus on Cincinnati.

This adds up if we use the NFL trade value chart, and it clears 14M in cap space plus it gives us the extra 1st round pick compensation that Wallace's RFA situation would require for us to sign him with. And I'd be particularly interested in how much the Bengals.... who are said to be eyeing a DE or CB at #17 or #21.... would like to see Wallace depart the AFC North division.

The Bengals would move down from one of those spots to #34, where plenty of DE or CB (Janoris Jenkins?) value will still be available.

From a pure talent standpoint, Wallace is a proven commodity and no rookie WR in this class has me sold on equal potential.... in addition to the fact that pairing Wallace with Reggie would be a pretty deadly turnkey set of WRs for Luck to break in with. Add a TE, an OG and a mid-round WR prospect to groom with Collie on board in the slot.... and we'd have the offense pretty close to set for a good part of Luck's first 2-3 years. Bruce Arians' familiarity with Wallace is an added factor.

The biggest impediment to all this and the likely show-stopper to this kind of move is Wallace's true $$$ value vs his vision of that very issue. Obviously, this would need to be coordinated ahead of time.

While he's possibly the most dangerous deep-threat in the NFL, I still rate him below Fitzgerald and certainly Calvin Johnson when it comes to a high-dollar contract. On the positive side of that is the fact that the Steelers are really up against a very tough cap situation.... so they could probably be outbid fairly easily, much like we were when Edgerrin James departed.... for those who remember that.

I'd would at least explore this move and I would do it, if we could pull it off and if Wallace could be had for a number somewhere south of Fitz and CJs contracts. Yes, Wallace would come at a high price...... but he wouldn't "break the bank" if we could land him at a lower price relative to Fitzgerald and Johnson.... especially considering the cap $$$ recaptured with Freeney traded plus next year's expanded cap space.

Let the stoning begin.....

That ship has sailed..
Avery is our Mike Wallace...

[MFT5]

no thanks...can Andrew be given a possible game changer over 6ft, a luxury Peyton never had b4 we start given out millions 2 Mike Wallace who I actually like.

The defense needs 2 be addressed and the offense aside from a TE looks fairly decent 4 Andrew's(if they pick him lol) 1st year.

[schwamm]

no thanks...can Andrew be given a possible game changer over 6ft, a luxury Peyton never had b4 we start given out millions 2 Mike Wallace who I actually like.

The defense needs 2 be addressed and the offense aside from a TE looks fairly decent 4 Andrew's(if they pick him lol) 1st year.

I have no doubt TE will be addressed in the draft, but please Grigson: don't over-reach for Fleener, and PLEASE don't go trading back into the 1st round just for him.

As for the OP, I have no issue with the concept, but I'm not sure I would do it specifically for Wallace. He shows signs of special talent, no doubt. What concerns me is that the Steelers were trying to make the passing game a bigger emphasis, but his numbers didn't jump drastically as a result. I was expecting him to crack the top 5 receivers both of the last 2 years, and had him high on my fantasy draft boards, but was shocked both years to discover I didn't miss out on much when other teams beat me to him.

[Brian Casserly]

I had this idea a few weeks back regarding Steelers Restricted Free Agent Mike Wallace (hold the dead reporter jokes, please)....The scenario is that if we can find a partner, trade Freeney....Let the stoning begin.....

No joking but I'm wondering if it is even about the 1st round tender. Instead, is it that nobody is making a move for Wallace because no GM or Owner wants to pay him (or most veterans) a blockbuster deal? It seems that instead of taking money from old rookie bank breaker signings and giving it over to veterans, most owners are just gonna let veterans who want monster money, walk or hang out there (w/the obvious exceptions being for can't miss game makers like Manning).

...just thinking out loud like everyone else.

[haseo15]

You Do that your paying 10 Million a Year for Wallace to run Deep.

[CashMoney]

The flaw here is that you cant give up comp picks or picks acquired from trades to sign RFAs. If we signed wallace, we would have to give up the 1 overall. No thanks. The only way this would work is if Pitt agrees to a trade him, which does not seem likely.

[Coltsman1788]

The flaw here is that you cant give up comp picks or picks acquired from trades to sign RFAs. If we signed wallace, we would have to give up the 1 overall. No thanks. The only way this would work is if Pitt agrees to a trade him, which does not seem likely.

Yes...this. End of thread.

[mvbighead]

Uh, no and no... and no.

The whole SOP this offseason has been to balance the roster. We don't do that by going out and trading a butt load to bring in Wallace. Not only that, but while the guy is fast, he isn't some monster talent like Fitz or Calvin Johnson. He warrants a shade above Pierre Garcon money, tops. He's looking for Fitz/Johnson money. There is no way he is worth that, not at this time.

I would much rather see this team do things the Patriot way. A handful of talented guys at WR of which none are superstars aside from Welker. Take that money and build your defense, and eventually lockup some of your talented linemen and QB on offense. Unless we could get our hands on a Calvin Johnson type, which I don't see happening, there is just no sense in putting all your eggs into one WR.

[mvbighead]

The flaw here is that you cant give up comp picks or picks acquired from trades to sign RFAs. If we signed wallace, we would have to give up the 1 overall. No thanks. The only way this would work is if Pitt agrees to a trade him, which does not seem likely.

The whole scenario here is based on a trade. I wouldn't make a trade for any of our picks, simply based on the fact that we are basically a very young team that will need a few years to get back into SB challenging mode.

Plain and simple the team doesn't need to risk spending a ton of money to bring in a guy like that. And I'd much rather see us pick up a young guy to develop into the offense who doesn't cost a fortune now.

[pacolts56]

The flaw here is that you cant give up comp picks or picks acquired from trades to sign RFAs. If we signed wallace, we would have to give up the 1 overall. No thanks. The only way this would work is if Pitt agrees to a trade him, which does not seem likely.

Yes...this. End of thread.

Not so fast.

That can be worked around thru a trade.... and if the Steelers don't figure out long-term what they're gonna do with him, he becomes an Unrestricted Free Agent next spring at the very moment when Antonio Brown becomes a RFA.

They can't and won't be able to do both.

This scenario is a choice between trading Freeney... whose cap number EXCEEDS what Wallace's would this season.... plus our #34 pick, which guarantees nothing close to the immediate impact that Wallace would.

And our cap space next year easily absorbs what a reasonable price tag for Wallace would be and leaves plenty for defensive additions.

Keep in mind, we are projected to have in the neighborhood of 40M + of cap space next year. And while we are in need of an injection of youth.... adding a 25 year-old proven Pro Bowl WR isn't against that grain.

[pacolts56]

Uh, no and no... and no.

The whole SOP this offseason has been to balance the roster. We don't do that by going out and trading a butt load to bring in Wallace. Not only that, but while the guy is fast, he isn't some monster talent like Fitz or Calvin Johnson. He warrants a shade above Pierre Garcon money, tops. He's looking for Fitz/Johnson money. There is no way he is worth that, not at this time.

I would much rather see this team do things the Patriot way. A handful of talented guys at WR of which none are superstars aside from Welker. Take that money and build your defense, and eventually lockup some of your talented linemen and QB on offense. Unless we could get our hands on a Calvin Johnson type, which I don't see happening, there is just no sense in putting all your eggs into one WR.

A butt load meaning our #34 pick and a 32 year-old Dwight Freeney?

And as opposed to committing 19 million in cap space to Freeney?

If Dwight re-does his deal and lowers his cap hit.... which darn well needs to happen.... then I'm fine with keeping him.

But in this scenario, as things stand today, we'd essentially be trading up 12 spots, and swapping roughly 10M of the 14M in freed up cap space to a 25 year-old Pro Bowl WR who I clearly stated was a rung below Fitz and Johnson, and is probably in the process of understanding his true market value as we speak. Although I don't believe Calvin Johnson is worth 130M either... I think the Lions are nuts, which they'll find out when Suh and Stafford's contracts come up.

And the "Patriot way" that a lot of folks are enamored with has gotten them a defense with plenty of holes left to fill.

IMO... Bill Belichick has been too clever by half with a lot of these Draft Day trade downs. The results they've expected have simply not panned out. Heck.... even WE scored well against them last season!

[NorCalColt]

I'm confused by the proposal... Why would we need Cincinnati? The only way the first round tender on the RFA goes away is a functional sign and trade, which has to start with Pittsburgh. And at that point, we don't need a third party. Or are you suggesting that Cincinnati give up their first rounder and sign Wallace and then trade him to us for the 34th pick and Freeney? So the Bengals give up 17 and Wallace for 34 and Freeney? They won't do that. So would the Steelers sign Wallace and trade him to the Colts for 34 and Freeney? I don't think so. Freeney is as big a question mark in their 3-4 as ours, plus age, plus cost. I just don't think anyone is going to touch Freeney simply because of money. Teams would trade for him if he was affordable. And the Steelers have no money. And the Bengals never spend money, so those two trade partners won't work, I don't think.

Or are you saying the Colts trade 34 and Feeeney for 17, and we use that to sign Wallace? I don't think they can do that. I think you have to use your own pick. Need a draft expert...

I do agree that Wallace is of greater value than the 34th pick. I don't know if Wallace is worth more than 34 and Freeney, let alone 34, Freeney, and additional picks though. I like Wallace, but I think speed and deep threats can be found nearly every draft, and for less than Wallace will demand financially.

[bavanlan]

Mike Wallace wants to be paid more than Larry Fitzgerald.

Mike Wallace is not worth more than Larry Fitzgerald.

/thread

[Flash777]

Uh, no and no... and no.

The whole SOP this offseason has been to balance the roster. We don't do that by going out and trading a butt load to bring in Wallace. Not only that, but while the guy is fast, he isn't some monster talent like Fitz or Calvin Johnson. He warrants a shade above Pierre Garcon money, tops. He's looking for Fitz/Johnson money. There is no way he is worth that, not at this time.

I would much rather see this team do things the Patriot way. A handful of talented guys at WR of which none are superstars aside from Welker. Take that money and build your defense, and eventually lockup some of your talented linemen and QB on offense. Unless we could get our hands on a Calvin Johnson type, which I don't see happening, there is just no sense in putting all your eggs into one WR.

I think this term originated as "Boat Load" and over time has become butt load. I don't think we'd want a butt load of anything.

[pacolts56]

I'm confused by the proposal... Why would we need Cincinnati? The only way the first round tender on the RFA goes away is a functional sign and trade, which has to start with Pittsburgh. And at that point, we don't need a third party. Or are you suggesting that Cincinnati give up their first rounder and sign Wallace and then trade him to us for the 34th pick and Freeney? So the Bengals give up 17 and Wallace for 34 and Freeney? They won't do that. So would the Steelers sign Wallace and trade him to the Colts for 34 and Freeney? I don't think so. Freeney is as big a question mark in their 3-4 as ours, plus age, plus cost. I just don't think anyone is going to touch Freeney simply because of money. Teams would trade for him if he was affordable. And the Steelers have no money. And the Bengals never spend money, so those two trade partners won't work, I don't think.

I do agree that Wallace is of greater value than the 34th pick. I don't know if Wallace is worth more than 34 and Freeney, let alone 34, Freeney, and additional picks though. I like Wallace, but I think speed and deep threats can be found nearly every draft, and for less than Wallace will demand financially.

No.... the initial proposal assumed, wrongly I'm told, that we could surrender a 1st round pick acquired thru a trade as the required compensation for signing a RFA. I used the Bengals as a player due to their having 2 first rounders and the factor of helping weaken a division rival.

If that is in fact not allowed under league rules than the deal can't be done in that manner.

I know that compensatory picks cannot be traded.... but I wasn't aware that picks acquired thru a trade cannot be used as RFA compensation, but they can definitely be re-traded which happens fairly often.

It was an unlikely scenario to begin with... but IMO a worth while one if the traded pick worked under league rules.

As far as Wallace's salary expectations.... he will soon to realize that Fitzgerald and Johnson warrant higher contracts, even though those teams badly overpaid IMO, and will feel the bite very badly.... and he is just not going to command the same $$$ in Pittsburgh or anywhere else.

The whole idea was basically to unload Freeney's exorbitant cap hit and get an high-quality, immediate impact player in the process. This scenario may not work, but we can't address needs with only rookie talent.... we need young proven talent if its available to be had.

[jvan1973]

That ship has sailed..
Avery is our Mike Wallace...

Talk about a poor mans Mike Wallace..

[Thewholefnshow28]

Talk about a poor mans Mike Wallace..

I almost spit my water out after reading that. Wallace is three times the WR Avery is.

The guy is a very good WR and deserves to be paid well above someone like Garcon. He actually is a consistent player out there compared to Garcon.

Now he wants to get paid like Fitz and he cannot hold a candle to Fitz so there is no more need to argue this. You are not going to Wallace that kind of money.

[jvan1973]

I almost spit my water out after reading that. Wallace is three times the WR Avery is.

The guy is a very good WR and deserves to be paid well above someone like Garcon. He actually is a consistent player out there compared to Garcon.

Now he wants to get paid like Fitz and he cannot hold a candle to Fitz so there is no more need to argue this. You are not going to Wallace that kind of money.

I agree, Mike Wallace isnt Fitz. I dont want to trade for him either.. But to put Avery and Wallace in the same stratosphere is a bit of a stretch to say the least.. lol

[mvbighead]

A butt load meaning our #34 pick and a 32 year-old Dwight Freeney?

And as opposed to committing 19 million in cap space to Freeney?

If Dwight re-does his deal and lowers his cap hit.... which darn well needs to happen.... then I'm fine with keeping him.

But in this scenario, as things stand today, we'd essentially be trading up 12 spots, and swapping roughly 10M of the 14M in freed up cap space to a 25 year-old Pro Bowl WR who I clearly stated was a rung below Fitz and Johnson, and is probably in the process of understanding his true market value as we speak. Although I don't believe Calvin Johnson is worth 130M either... I think the Lions are nuts, which they'll find out when Suh and Stafford's contracts come up.

And the "Patriot way" that a lot of folks are enamored with has gotten them a defense with plenty of holes left to fill.

IMO... Bill Belichick has been too clever by half with a lot of these Draft Day trade downs. The results they've expected have simply not panned out. Heck.... even WE scored well against them last season!

I was referring to the Patriot offense. I don't think you can argue with Brady's numbers or success there. They've been to plenty of superbowls. But they have little to no money tied up in WRs or RBs. If Pagano can give us a defense, and we can get some decent production out of a squad of healthy WRs, the Patriot way works. They've made it to plenty of SBs.

[coltsfanatic24]

if we just had to give up our 2nd round i would do it. also bruce arians was his offensive coordinator so it wouldn't surprise me if he was a colt

[betheafan41]

sorry but that is not worth doing at all. the colts need all the draft picks they can get right now. they have to shore up that defense, and add another offensive linemen. and could use a draft pick to get a WR. maybe trade freeney and their 34th pick to cinci for their first or second draft pick in the first round and try to nab Michael Floyd or Fleener and that would make up for the 2nd round pick of the colts and give them a big guy for luck to throw to. although it wont happen but imagine floyd and wayne on opposite sides of each other. you got a big guy in floyd who can go up and get the ball pretty much over anyone, and could be perfect for 3rd and 5 plays for a first down. but again will never happen and its only a dream lol. my only hard pick will be the second round pick. what if Fleener and Jenkins are both available lol. who do you go with? colts need both a TE and a CB. especially ones who can make a big impact right away. and both of those guys definentely can especially if jenkins can fix his off field issues.

[pacolts56]

I was referring to the Patriot offense. I don't think you can argue with Brady's numbers or success there. They've been to plenty of superbowls. But they have little to no money tied up in WRs or RBs. If Pagano can give us a defense, and we can get some decent production out of a squad of healthy WRs, the Patriot way works. They've made it to plenty of SBs.

Those are good points and I can't argue with the Pats offensive approach... and their dual-threat TE offense is probably a trend that is going to take hold. Of course Tom Brady has a lot to do with that success. And their defense is another story.

But whatever approach we take will, at some point, probably have to involve some proven free agent additions, and pairing Wallace and Reggie... who agreed to return at a very reasonable price is an attractive idea and fast-tracks a passing attack that will otherwise require the development of a WR prospect, which gets tricky once you're beyond Top 10 bluechippers.

I would contend that Wallace.... at a price somewhere between Fitzgerald/Johnson and Garcon, who is nowhere in his class.... wouldn't be a bad move at all, and would benefit Reggie in a big way, not to mention Luck.

Primarily.... the Freeney contract, as it stands, is a source of aggravation for me because his cap hit has stood in the way of a major upgrade at any number of need positions.... whether it's a RFA Mike Wallace at WR or what could have been a top flight OG or CB, if we wanted to go defense.

All I know is that for 19 million bucks.... if his deal isn't re-done and we keep him.... Dwight better absorb this new defense fast and turn the clock back 3 years on his production because his cap number is roughly that of Mario Williams' cap hit in the first two years of his new Buffalo contract and Calvin Johnson's cap hit in the first two years of the monster deal CJ got from the Lions.

http://www.spotrac.c...mario-williams/

http://www.spotrac.c...calvin-johnson/

Short of a return to dominant Pro Bowl form.... 19 million bucks is a very bad deal for us. I would explore any and all possible ways to extract Freeney's trade value.... and this Wallace scenario was only one idea.

Why remain stuck in a situation where an aging DE is gobbling up a cap number far beyond his long-term value to the team as we rebuilding franchise?

[jemack]

Mike Wallace is dead. Let the man rest in pease for God's sake.
http://www.mydesert....Wallace-dead-93

[21isSuperman]

Mike Wallace wants to be paid more than Larry Fitzgerald.

Mike Wallace is not worth more than Larry Fitzgerald.

/thread

I was going to say the same thing. I thought (but couldn't remember for sure) that he said he wanted to be paid like Fitz or Calvin. He is good, no question, but he isn't consistent enough and is nowhere near as good as Fitz or Calvin

[Holden89]

Mike Wallace...meh...Especially considering the Steelers want to keep him, and we would have to give up our #1 overall for him...yeah, no. Even if we COULD get him Mike Wallace is NOT an elite receiver. He's good, yes, and super fast but...that's it. He's not the type of receiver who can just take over a game like Fitz or Megatron. I'd honestly rather have Reggie than Wallace (probably a bit of bias going into that, though...)

[GAColt]

Any trade involving Freeney won't happen. No one is trading a 1st round pick to only have Freeney for one year. In addition, we would still have the $14m cap hit this year. That is the pro-rated portion of his signing bonus. We would only get relief on his $5m salary.

[John Dee]

Mike Wallace wants to be paid more than Larry Fitzgerald.

Mike Wallace is not worth more than Larry Fitzgerald.

/thread

He is not the best receiver on his team. Antonio Brown is... (thank me mid season fantasy football geeks.) And Big Ben was looking to Brown A LOT at the end of last season. a Wallace is a "deep threat" and that's it. Go long or nothing. Brown is a Greg Jennings clone. He is a great rout runner. And he is fast too.

A Brandt talked about this the other night on ESPN radio and stated he was "very surprised" that Wallace has not been offered. Teams have until April 20 to put in offers to RFA's and NOBODY has put one in for Wallace. Brandt states "if anyone puts in an offer around 15m first year cap number, that the Steelers CANNOT MATCH PERIOD.

So, if someone wants him ... they WILL get him according to AB.

I'd pass........ He's just a road runner... I'd rather have Antonio Brown,... as Pitt would.

[pacolts56]

Any trade involving Freeney won't happen. No one is trading a 1st round pick to only have Freeney for one year. In addition, we would still have the $14m cap hit this year. That is the pro-rated portion of his signing bonus. We would only get relief on his $5m salary.

I believe you have that backwards.... if we trade or release Freeney we're "only" on the hook for 5 million.

His base salary is 14 million..... http://www.spotrac.c...dwight-freeney/

[pacolts56]

He is not the best receiver on his team. Antonio Brown is... (thank me mid season fantasy football geeks.) And Big Ben was looking to Brown A LOT at the end of last season. a Wallace is a "deep threat" and that's it. Go long or nothing. Brown is a Greg Jennings clone. He is a great rout runner. And he is fast too.

A Brandt talked about this the other night on ESPN radio and stated he was "very surprised" that Wallace has not been offered. Teams have until April 20 to put in offers to RFA's and NOBODY has put one in for Wallace. Brandt states "if anyone puts in an offer around 15m first year cap number, that the Steelers CANNOT MATCH PERIOD.

So, if someone wants him ... they WILL get him according to AB.

I'd pass........ He's just a road runner... I'd rather have Antonio Brown,... as Pitt would.

Antonio Brown is a good WR too, but he clearly benefits from having Wallace on the other side. If Wallace leaves I guarantee you Brown would have a serious dropoff in production.

That's the whole point of getting an experienced, established deep threat into our WR corps and pairing him with Reggie.

Its highly unlikely a rookie WR is going to have that kind of immediate impact.

[John Dee]

Antonio Brown is a good WR too, but he clearly benefits from having Wallace on the other side. If Wallace leaves I guarantee you Brown would have a serious dropoff in production.

That's the whole point of getting an experienced, established deep threat into our WR corps and pairing him with Reggie.

Its highly unlikely a rookie WR is going to have that kind of immediate impact.

Pitt's OL was has been more than sad the last couple of years. Going long.... no, Pitt needed receivers to RUN ROUTES.

Look at the target info from last season.... Wallace was a NO SHOW the second half of the season.

[John Dee]

Antonio Brown is a good WR too, but he clearly benefits from having Wallace on the other side. If Wallace leaves I guarantee you Brown would have a serious dropoff in production.

That's the whole point of getting an experienced, established deep threat into our WR corps and pairing him with Reggie.

Its highly unlikely a rookie WR is going to have that kind of immediate impact.

A fast WR guarantees a Team/QB NOTHING

I'll take Reggie Wayne over Mike Wallace every day of the week.


Unless your team has a "bulldozer" for an OL

I will take the WR who will 'be where his is supposed to be" instead of the "take off bro" WR.

JMO

[pacolts56]

Pitt's OL was has been more than sad the last couple of years. Going long.... no, Pitt needed receivers to RUN ROUTES.

Look at the target info from last season.... Wallace was a NO SHOW the second half of the season.

Exactly..... Pittsburgh's deplorable pass blocking doesn't erase Wallace's talent, John.... it simply negates the Steelers ability to maximize it.

Antonio Brown not only benfitted from Wallace commanding the opposition's top CB and Safety help.... he also benefitted from Big Ben's constant need to run for his life and check down due to that lousy pass blocking. Our O-line darn well better perform better than the Steelers did last season.

Either way.... we can't automatically translate Wallace's problems in Pittsburgh to what he'd have in the Colts offense. I think him and Reggie would be a great WR tandem.

A fast WR guarantees a Team/QB NOTHING

I'll take Reggie Wayne over Mike Wallace every day of the week.


Unless your team has a "bulldozer" for an OL

I will take the WR who will 'be where his is supposed to be" instead of the "take off bro" WR.

JMO

Again.... a good passing attack has both... and they compliment each other. And if Wallace has nothing but speed to offer as a WR.... why can't every 4.3-4.4 guy in the NFL amass the production he has?

I realize this trade scenario had a lot of moving parts.... but IMO it's that and not a lack of talent on Mike Wallace's part that would make it a no-go.

And I maintain that Dwight Freeney's cap hit is unacceptable and he should be moved in whatever way benefits us the most.

IMO.... Mike Wallace at WR, for the right price, not Larry Fitz money.... is preferable to one final year of Dwight Freeney at 19 million bucks. And that was the premise of the idea.

[John Dee]

So you would give M Wallace "the MAX" when no other team in the NFL wants to?

Like I said... on another player ...

BUYER BEWARE.

Wallace is fast ... that's it.

[CjMcGirt23]

You could get Wallace for the 34th pick alone, you don't need a first. (Straight trade, not signing)

[dgambill]

Wallace is worth the 34th pick and everything you were suggesting giving...however no body is going to give you him for what your asking. Wallace isn't worth the money he is asking either. People have to realize the market price is just going to continue to go up for proven talent. With the cap going up in the next few years that is why so many players signed 1 and 2 year deals. The thing is that Cincy is looking for a wr in the first round this year themselves. Why would they not just sign him themselves? They have some cap space. The issue is they don't want to pay what he is asking (nobody does). There are teams like Cleveland, NE, Cincy with 2 first round picks that could afford to give up a 1st rounder for him since they have 2 and 1 being late but none of them have tried. Pittsburg is stuck with him and will have to keep cutting guys to get under the cap and sign him and everyone will just wait til next year when he isn't restricted. 10-12 million isn't too much for the guy...but that and a first rounder is.

[pacolts56]

Wallace is worth the 34th pick and everything you were suggesting giving...however no body is going to give you him for what your asking. Wallace isn't worth the money he is asking either. People have to realize the market price is just going to continue to go up for proven talent. With the cap going up in the next few years that is why so many players signed 1 and 2 year deals. The thing is that Cincy is looking for a wr in the first round this year themselves. Why would they not just sign him themselves? They have some cap space. The issue is they don't want to pay what he is asking (nobody does). There are teams like Cleveland, NE, Cincy with 2 first round picks that could afford to give up a 1st rounder for him since they have 2 and 1 being late but none of them have tried. Pittsburg is stuck with him and will have to keep cutting guys to get under the cap and sign him and everyone will just wait til next year when he isn't restricted. 10-12 million isn't too much for the guy...but that and a first rounder is.

I agree he's not worth what he is asking... meaning Larry Fitzgerald or Calvin Johnson money or "the max" or whatever anyone wants to call it..... and I've said as much in several of my posts including my original post. At no time was I suggesting our #1 overall ever be considered in this.... that would be crazy.

The motivation is that Dwight Freeney's contract will fork him over 19 million dollars.... 14 million of which is salary and the portion of which we'd be relieved of off our salary cap.

IMO.... acquiring Wallace at his true market value, which is somewhere in the vast expanse between Garcon and Fitzgerald, instead of having Freeney for one more year with that insane cap number is a no-brainer. And I'm guessing that Wallace and his agent are probably realizing at this very moment that his salary expectations are out of reach. From Pittsburgh or anyone else.

And next year.... Wallace becomes an Unrestricted Free Agent while Antonio Brown and Emmanuel Sanders become RFA's. So I don't think the Steelers would be as close-minded to a deal as some suggest.

The mechanics of making it happen are difficult but IMO would be worth it. Again.... at the right price.

[dgambill]

My thinking is that while his salary expectations may be out of reach for teams this year.....that won't be the case next year if he has another good season. Next year the cap goes up and he would be one of the premier receivers on the market. He would get 10-12 million easily. Someone will pay that. No one is going to pay that AND a first round pick. Those picks are too valuable now that the new pay structure limits how much rookies can receive. To me draft picks are WAY more valuable then they ever have been because they are CHEAP and a lifeblood of new talent. Ask me if I want to pay 7 to 8 million (before the new cba)for an unproven rookie wr or 10-12 million for Wallace and it is NO COMPETITION. Ask me to pay say only 3-4 million for a 1st round WR and you see the difference. It no longer is as much a risk and a handicap if they don't work out. See basically over the 4 years you would pay Wallace 48 million lets say and the new rookie 16 million...that is 32 million in savings. That is a huge difference. It isn't paying Wallace's salary...it is giving up that draft pick! Let Pitts figure out how to pay him (and pay Brown) this year and into the future. We can wait til they become available next year and pay them and keep our picks!

I would love to upgrade OLB/DE and move Freeney but at his contract that isn't possible. We just play him and hope to get a discount next year or move on. I hate paying Freeney all that money but if we can't get any value in a draft pick (say 2nd or early 3rd) it is pointless to move him. He will give us more than his value in production next year and a compensatoy pick in FA then just cutting him.

[pacolts56]

My thinking is that while his salary expectations may be out of reach for teams this year.....that won't be the case next year if he has another good season. Next year the cap goes up and he would be one of the premier receivers on the market. He would get 10-12 million easily. Someone will pay that. No one is going to pay that AND a first round pick. Those picks are too valuable now that the new pay structure limits how much rookies can receive. To me draft picks are WAY more valuable then they ever have been because they are CHEAP and a lifeblood of new talent. Ask me if I want to pay 7 to 8 million (before the new cba)for an unproven rookie wr or 10-12 million for Wallace and it is NO COMPETITION. Ask me to pay say only 3-4 million for a 1st round WR and you see the difference. It no longer is as much a risk and a handicap if they don't work out. See basically over the 4 years you would pay Wallace 48 million lets say and the new rookie 16 million...that is 32 million in savings. That is a huge difference. It isn't paying Wallace's salary...it is giving up that draft pick! Let Pitts figure out how to pay him (and pay Brown) this year and into the future. We can wait til they become available next year and pay them and keep our picks!

I would love to upgrade OLB/DE and move Freeney but at his contract that isn't possible. We just play him and hope to get a discount next year or move on. I hate paying Freeney all that money but if we can't get any value in a draft pick (say 2nd or early 3rd) it is pointless to move him. He will give us more than his value in production next year and a compensatoy pick in FA then just cutting him.

You make good points on the current CBA vs the CBA of yesteryear regarding WRs. We'll have a shot at some promising rookie WR talent... hopefully Stephen Hill at #34 if Grigs wants to go with a WR.

And I guess that Freeney having a great year for that pile of money he's getting paid is the best we can hope for.... but let this be a lesson to us about backloaded contracts and better cap management.

[dgambill]

You make good points on the current CBA vs the CBA of yesteryear regarding WRs. We'll have a shot at some promising rookie WR talent... hopefully Stephen Hill at #34 if Grigs wants to go with a WR.

And I guess that Freeney having a great year for that pile of money he's getting paid is the best we can hope for.... but let this be a lesson to us about backloaded contracts and better cap management.

I agree. Typically you cut a guy when he gets to that point or you restructure. Problem with Freeney is he is still productive and valuable yet we are changing systems and rebuilding. You don't typically have to rebuild very often so this is just one of those weird circumstances...and yes I imagine we eat it...use him..and move on as we transition the defense. We will have plenty of money next summer to make a run at Wallace or Brown or another FA if we want.

Rome wasn't built in a day and we aren't going to rebuild in ONE offseason. We get pieces in the next few years and I think that by year 3 Luck should be progressed and the new schemes progressed enough to see if these new coaches/gm are doing their job right. If we aren't competing for the playoffs by then we have a problem. We aren't going to fix ALL our needs this draft.